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Siselmo posted:Folding Ideas actually did a video of End of Evangelion that's about this. It's pretty good. Thanks for linking this - I was itching to do it but *phoneposting* Even if you have little to no idea about NGE or the ending shitstorms I'd still recommend giving this a watch. In fact - watch everything by Foldable.
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Mar 27, 2015 17:12
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DStecks posted:Keep in mind that the fan reaction to Evangelion, specifically how fans sexualized Rei and shipped her with her kinda-sorta-clone-son, basically drove Hideaki Anno into a major depressive episode, and the result was End of Evangelion. The series is about dealing with anxiety and depression (the literal apocalypse serving as an apt metaphor for the sense of pervasive dread these engender); and End of Evangelion is about how lovely otaku are. If I recall right, he was depressed through at least the last third of the show, if not the whole production.
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Mar 27, 2015 17:33
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The show's drawn out intentional pointlessness was pretty clearly an expression of depression the whole way through rather than a constructed attempt to evoke it, so yes I'd wage he was depressed the entire time. It's like the Reese's blending anime and Kafka with the bad and the good of both.
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Mar 27, 2015 17:42
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I've never watched NGE because the hype around it sort of puts me off. I liked Martian Successor Nadesico, which was popular at the same time but approached the same genre from completely the opposite direction. I'm not much into anime, but Martian Successor Nadesico and Slayers (disclaimer: haven't seen Revolution or Evolution-R, but nor have I heard good thing about them) are both good series. They're probably my favourites.
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Mar 27, 2015 17:54
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That's just a fan theory that became popular because people love talking about depression when they don't have it. EoE has been in development long before the funding was cut from the show because of a combination of corporate pull-out and possible embezzlement from the company president.Wheat Loaf posted:I've never watched NGE because the hype around it sort of puts me off. I liked Martian Successor Nadesico, which was popular at the same time but approached the same genre from completely the opposite direction. You mean the show that arguably ended more grim than Evangelion?
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Mar 27, 2015 17:54
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I really can't make myself shed tears for Anno here given that he crept on Asuka's Voice actress to the point that she didn't want to have to do with the project. This is not a "He's imperfect therefore he can't criticize", but more that he was more upset about the treatment of a fictional girl than of a fellow co-worker.
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Mar 27, 2015 17:54
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I do enjoy how the Rebuild movies teased people with a more upbeat and grounded version of the show before pulling the rug out from under them and going head first into what the gently caress territory. Anno is a master troll to his audience.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:06
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[quote="Tae" post=""44329"] You mean the show that arguably ended more grim than Evangelion? [/quote] The movie did. The show itself has a happy ending. The creators tried for years to get a second series that would continue after the movie but it never happened. To the point they consider the plot lines of the super robot wars crossover games as having canon Nadesico endings.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:06
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It's not really a troll IMO, and the western fan base has built some really wierd myths around its production.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:12
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Kunster posted:I really can't make myself shed tears for Anno here given that he crept on Asuka's Voice actress to the point that she didn't want to have to do with the project. This is not a "He's imperfect therefore he can't criticize", but more that he was more upset about the treatment of a fictional girl than of a fellow co-worker. Like, FYI, this is pretty much nonsense from people reading poorly translated interviews.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:20
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Tae posted:You mean the show that arguably ended more grim than Evangelion? Mokinokaro posted:The movie did. The show itself has a happy ending. Ah, I've not seen the movie. That's the one where Ruri is the main character, isn't it?
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Mar 27, 2015 18:23
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A Gnarlacious Bro posted:It's not really a troll IMO, and the western fan base has built some really wierd myths around its production. Yeah, we do know some things but there's just as much misinformation and out of context quotes reinforcing whatever viewpoint you subscribe to than any actual, hard evidence of what really happened, and the fact that most interviews he's quoted from are originally in Japanese exaggerates things further. But then the same thing happens with western entertainment all the time, gossip and second hand stories become facts and trivia for basically any movie or TV show you can think of. Lot of people put the story in their head as factual before reading up on anything that could be considered true. Look at The Hobbit as one example, dozens of hours of behind the scenes footage and you'll still get people saying Peter Jackson is a hack who did CGI everything because he's lazy when that's not even remotely true.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:23
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Wheat Loaf posted:Ah, I've not seen the movie. That's the one where Ruri is the main character, isn't it? Yeah it is. It's somewhat enjoyable but ends on a very bittersweet note with most of the fun of the series sucked out of it as a whole. It's also pretty confusing on first watch because there are a ton of events that occur between it and the series that are covered in a Japan-only videogame. It's hard to really recommend. Mokinokaro fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Mar 27, 2015 |
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Mar 27, 2015 18:31
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MonsieurChoc posted:I'd like to see more GENDUM. Or maybe Eureka Seven.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:36
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I'd love to see Chuck cover The 8th MS Team. His review on War in the Pocket was really good and drat depressing. Gotta love a show that rips apart the toy driven Gundam Franchise like that. I get that Gundam is primarily about how War tears people apart, but I find it ironic that a show focusing so much on military horrors makes most of its money selling model kits to children. War in the Pocket poo poo all over that entire notion and I loved it.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:45
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achillesforever6 posted:Eureka 7 would be a fun show to discuss, probably my favorite anime other than Hellsing Ultimate and DBZ Abridged Eva abridged was only 4 episodes but a good watch if you haven't seen it.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:51
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Anno reminds me a lot of Andrew Hussie, making a lot of profit and success off fans he's treats like trash.Arcsquad12 posted:War in the Pocket poo poo all over that entire notion and I loved it. War in the Pocket is one of the best shows of all time, ever, certainly the best Gundam.
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Mar 27, 2015 18:54
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I have way more respect for War In The Pocket for pulling that even if they also sold figures of that as well.A Gnarlacious Bro posted:Like, FYI, this is pretty much nonsense from people reading poorly translated interviews. A friend of mine who hung out with coworkers of his confirmed some of this poo poo tho. It didn't help that after the interview folk outted the voice actress's adult video past as well. Kunster fucked around with this message at 19:57 on Mar 27, 2015 |
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Mar 27, 2015 19:09
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What does that have to do with anything?
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Mar 27, 2015 20:25
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That the fans felt she had crossed a line being outspoken about it and punished her by smearing her with it? ... Yeah I shouldn't have mentioned it.
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Mar 27, 2015 21:37
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I'd actually like to hear more about it.
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Mar 27, 2015 21:58
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WickedHate posted:Anno reminds me a lot of Andrew Hussie, making a lot of profit and success off fans he's treats like trash. That is good, because fans are trash.
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Mar 27, 2015 22:00
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Like, not in a pointed way or anything, that just sounds like actual first hand knowledge rather than 20 years of dorks on forums making up stuff about the show "trolling" people.
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Mar 27, 2015 22:00
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Tracula posted:Despite having watched NGE all the way through twice and hating it and End of Evangelion as well I can't help but recommend it to people. I get the vibe that the show was supposed to piss me off and that I wasn't actually supposed to enjoy it, especially the end of the series. Do you mind if I ask why you don't like the show? Just curious. If it's because Shinji is a whiny baby who does nothing, well it's because of that why he is one of my favorite... I won't say hero cause what's a hero. Shinji Asuka and Rei all suffer from depression and try and deal with it in different ways. (And fail) Shinji ultimately is a huge mess because he hates himself and has no sense of who he is as a person. I always interpreted the final two episodes as Shinji realizing that if he ever wants a healthy relationship with anyone he has to learn to love himself first. Plus It's never to late to change. Even in the face of the apocalypse. I always found comfort in that 
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Mar 27, 2015 23:02
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A Gnarlacious Bro posted:I'd actually like to hear more about it. Yeah, from what I gathered Anno and his peers (Physical violence towards con staff + mentions of not just Asuka's VA being the target of nonsense comes to mind here) seemed to be somewhat aggressive or otherwise creepy to lady voice actors / staff in general during the production. The interview with her being followed with 2chan recovering "old adult video footage" and popping on Sankaku Project as "She was no angel" made this a bit worse, and somewhat doesn't give me much faith for "The english version of said interview was badly translated" ordeal you were talking about. Kunster fucked around with this message at 23:19 on Mar 27, 2015 |
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Mar 27, 2015 23:10
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The one story I've always heard about the End of Eva, and Anno's relationship to Miyamura, is about how they got the read on Asuka's final line. Quoting from Wikipedia:quote:"Concerning the final line we adopted, I'm not sure whether I should say about it in fact. At last Anno asked me 'Miyamura, just imagine you are sleeping in your bed and a stranger sneaks into your room. He can rape you anytime as you are asleep but he doesn't. Instead, he masturbates looking at you, when you wake up and know what he did to you. What do you think you would say?' I had been thinking he was a strange man, but at that moment I felt disgusting. So I told him that I thought 'Disgusting.' And then he sighed and said, 'I thought as much.'" Is this what we're talking about, or are we referring to something way worse?
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Mar 27, 2015 23:11
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There's that, but from what I gather there wasn't as much as an attempt to make the employment period any less awkward after that. I can understand, on some hosed up logic, getting that sort of feedback, but not afterwards to make sure that one cleans up the poo poo the golden child pulled.
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Mar 27, 2015 23:22
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Kunster posted:Yeah, from what I gathered Anno and his peers (Physical violence towards con staff + mentions of not just Asuka's VA being the target of nonsense comes to mind here) seemed to be somewhat aggressive or otherwise creepy to lady voice actors / staff in general during the production. The interview with her being followed with 2chan recovering "old adult video footage" and popping on Sankaku Project as "She was no angel" made this a bit worse, and somewhat doesn't give me much faith for "The english version of said interview was badly translated" ordeal you were talking about. Sorry I didn't really mean to imply that it was "poorly translated", I kind of mean that it's very easy to misrepresent information of another country through a lens of translation and gossip. And in particular the anime fandom seems to get particularly obsessive about myth constructing around stuff. But I totally didn't really know much about any of that sort of gross tabloid backlash poo poo. With the amount of lovely working conditions and TMZ style poo poo we have here it doesn't really surprise me, but getting hassled by Sankaku sounds like the worst thing ever. I feel like working in japan is really. . . stressful.
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Mar 28, 2015 00:04
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It was Sankaku reporting on a 2ch thread. I won't link it here, but they were oddly "neutral" about it. I observed this sort of nonsense in general on US and Japan studios tho! I wouldn't say this sort of poo poo is exclusive to anime production. I won't blame ya for considering it to be somewhat exaggerated tho!
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Mar 28, 2015 00:42
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Isn't sankaku that pedophile site
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Mar 28, 2015 01:30
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Yah
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Mar 28, 2015 01:43
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Tae posted:Isn't sankaku that pedophile site I used to check in on it sometimes because it had a lot of weird news cases from Japan, but it's nothing but porn and anime porn now.
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Mar 28, 2015 01:50
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achillesforever6 posted:Eureka 7 would be a fun show to discuss, probably my favorite anime other than Hellsing Ultimate and DBZ Abridged Go watch Hellsing Ultimate: Abridged. It's amazing  . The only real shame is Team FourStar only do a single OVA of it every Halloween.
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Mar 28, 2015 03:21
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Mokinokaro posted:Yeah it is. It's somewhat enjoyable but ends on a very bittersweet note with most of the fun of the series sucked out of it as a whole. My understanding was that the Nadesico movie was supposed to be the first of three, but it was so dour that the rest never materialized.
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Mar 28, 2015 05:37
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Ross' Game Dungeon has a new episode. Ross has thought https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnkqdMS1LkE
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Mar 28, 2015 06:42
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Wheat Loaf posted:I've never watched NGE because the hype around it sort of puts me off. I liked Martian Successor Nadesico, which was popular at the same time but approached the same genre from completely the opposite direction. I did the same thing until a friend of mine basically forced me to watch NGE and I ended up loving it and thinking it was the best anime I'd ever seen at the time. I also started thinking a vast majority of its fans like it for the wrong reasons. It's a pretty great study of mental illness, anxiety, and depression, within the framework of a shonen super robot show. Some of the most realistically written characters I've seen in an anime. It does a lot of presenting characters and situations that you're sort of conditioned to reflexively form opinions on based on stereotypes of the genre originated by go nagai and tomino and stuff, the giant semi-mystical robot, the silent mysterious magic girl, etc, and subverts them from the very beginning. Nadesico is much more about the super robot genre than EVA is. EVA is pretty much a psychological drama using the framework of a super robot series to sell it to audiences, it doesn't actually do much metanarrative about the genre, it's more about people's coping skills and attempts at escapism and self actualization with a bunch of cool robot vs monster fights to break up the pace and keep things fresh and to use as metaphor or reflections of the internal and external conflicts of the characters. Under the vegetable fucked around with this message at 07:32 on Mar 28, 2015 |
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Mar 28, 2015 07:28
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Arcsquad12 posted:I do enjoy how the Rebuild movies teased people with a more upbeat and grounded version of the show before pulling the rug out from under them and going head first into what the gently caress territory. Anno is a master troll to his audience. I also really love the Rebuild movies. It's even more overt criticism of the audience and an illustration of how the personality traits that are glorified and revered in this style of media and by the audience of such are actually incredibly harmful and destructive. I also really like all the Leiji Matsumoto homage stuff in 3.
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Mar 28, 2015 07:34
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WickedHate posted:Anno reminds me a lot of Andrew Hussie, making a lot of profit and success off fans he's treats like trash. It's weird but I really don't get the impression he expected to have the fanbase he has. Most of the people I've spoken to who love EVA seem to almost entirely miss the point of the series and are full of criticism like "Shinji is a pussy" or "why is Asuka such a bitch" or the usual dumb stuff like that, and only like it because of the cool fights and angel designs, and how "crazy" it gets.
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Mar 28, 2015 07:38
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Rebuild manages to be better at saying the same thing by being much more concise and entertaining while saying it. The original is downright Gantzian in it's unpleasantness. How someone could consider themselves a fan for the fights is beyond me, as they're barely in most of the show. It'd be like claiming to football fan because you REALLY like the Super Bowl half-time commercials.
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Mar 28, 2015 07:52
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A surprising amount of people watch the Super Bowl every year and learn about the teams involved enough to fake conversation for that very reason.
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Mar 28, 2015 08:00
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