|
Squalid posted:Well for one thing it's a a lot harder to beat someone up or fire them or even have a coherent opinion about them when a person lives thousands of miles away. Sort of reduces the impact Is that a yes to my question?
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 05:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 13:08 |
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Is that a yes to my question? The answer to your question is yes. The cultural (and physical) distance blunts the impact of exoticizing parts of a far east culture due to the relative lack of contact these gestures have with the appropriated culture. A white dude getting a tattoo of "mao tsetung" is a more neutral gesture than getting a tattoo of, say, Malcolm X
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 05:48
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:So racism is OK as long as the object of it is separated by the Pacific Ocean? Why are Asians living in America any different from Asians living in Asia? No the racism is assuming that people of Asian decent are just like Asian people who live in Asia because of their appearance, being interested by the fact that people who live in China have a different culture then the United States is not racism. This is not hard Also yes, if you missed that, "why are Asians living in America any different then Asians living in Asia?" is racist as gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 05:57
|
|
|
Ghost of Reagan Past posted:It's just a quick example of some other way beyond something being symbolically important that it could be problematic. It can be insensitive because it's taking someone's language and turning it into a fashion statement (you probably wouldn't get the word 'water' tattooed on you in this case, would you?). It's not meant to be the worst case of appropriation, it's just the first obvious case that occurred to me. Plenty of people use gothic-style or calligraphy letters in their tattoos because it's more aesthetically pleasing to them than fixed-width sans serif font. Saying "well, you wouldn't have gotten that tattoo if the artist was only willing to do it in some console font" is kind of obvious.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 06:19
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:No the racism is assuming that people of Asian decent are just like Asian people who live in Asia because of their appearance, being interested by the fact that people who live in China have a different culture then the United States is not racism. Literally "NO YOUR RACIST" Are you saying that Asian-Americans have no connection to actual Asian-Asian culture, and aren't impacted at all by racism against Asian-Asians, which apparently is harmless according to you? Grotesque racial caricatures would somehow be A-OK because the Chinese in China are an ocean away, but somehow Chinese-Americans don't get to complain about it because reasons. Best I can tell, what you're saying is that Asian-Americans forfeited their right to that culture when they set foot on American soil. Somehow icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 07:21
|
|
|
icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 07:28 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 07:25
|
|
|
So I don't see "cultural appropriation" as an evil in and of itself. That's the typically shallow thinking that a lot of less-informed social justice people fall into: they'll attack the symptom, not the cause*. However, reducing a culture to a few trinkets, glyphs, or traits, makes it easier to handle, to write off, and to eventually exploit that group: Guiness and St. Patrick's Day => the Irish are drunks => they can't rule themselves. Guns and rap => the Blacks are violent => they should be incarcerated. Different writing system and unfamiliar culture => the Asians are odd and mystical => they are easy to colonize (20th century option: they are the inscrutable foreign rivals). The issue, maybe, is that some people view this as A => B => C (artifact => stereotype => exploitation) and others as B => A => C, where the stereotype exists, and confirmation bias finds a matching artifact--"the Asians are so odd, look at their writing system!" It can also be C => A/B: stereotypes have often been used as contemporary and ex post facto justifications of exploitation, as were anthropology and physiognomy in the 19th and 20th century. It's unfortunately very clear that A, B, and C all tend to happen together historically. So I see "cultural appropriation" as a symptom or part of a much greater set of chauvinist beliefs. No, in a vacuum getting a Chinese tattoo isn't racist: but seriously, this is a level of discourse equal to that kid in 8th grade who insisted that he thinks the sky is green, not blue. Yes, somebody could appropriate an item from white American culture: but it's not as harmful, because it doesn't reflect/result in exploitation or violence. * Naturally some cultures might see the appropriation of e.g. sacred symbols as highly offensive and harmful. In that case, we don't need to have a debate: internet bickering aside, common courtesy and ethics would clearly dictate that you knock it off.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 08:06
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Literally "NO YOUR RACIST" Yes, literally, you're racist, or at least what you're saying is, putting it in scare quotes and caps does not make it suddenly invalid. Also neither does throwing up a whole bunch of strawmen. Actual Asian culture is (although diminishingly so) somewhat exotic to many Americans who don't live in more cosmopolitan areas, and them having an attraction to it based on novelty is not the same as racist caricature. The actual potential harm from that is them treating Steve from Ohio who's a 3rd generation Chinese immigrant as a an exotic other. You claiming Asian Americans are exactly the same as actual people living in Asia just because its their ethnic background is pretty much the same exact thing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 08:13
|
|
|
deptstoremook posted:
This isn't the 19th century, China is arguably the second most powerful country in the world and the shrinking inequality of cultural diffusion has more to do with a more unidirectional immigration pattern then it has anything to do with colonialism. Again, this "poor little China is too weak to have an even keeled cultural exchange" seems more of a troubling attitude to me then the jackass who has Chinese characters as a tattoo.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 08:22
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Literally "NO YOUR RACIST" Are you saying Asian-Americans have no cultural agency of their own and need right-thinking people to protect them from wrong-thinking people? Because that's what it seems like you're saying. And anyway, grotesque racial caricatures are never A-OK because they're grotesque racial caricatures. That's enough to make them wrong (I'm ignoring edge cases like displaying Nazi anti-Semitic propaganda at the Holocaust Museum in case anyone tries to use them as a gotcha). Vincent Van Goatse fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 09:02
|
|
|
ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:Are you saying Asian-Americans have no cultural agency of their own and need right-thinking people to protect them from wrong-thinking people? Because that's what it seems like you're saying. Asian-Americans are the ones making the complaints about kimonos and kanji tattoos and poo poo. Asian-Asians don't give a poo poo. So explain to me how those things are fine and dandy unless you completely disregard the Asian-American perspective. It's hilarious you're accusing me of denying them agency when you're denying them ownership of their own heritage. I'm not the one who decided that kimonos and kanji are part of their heritage, they are ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:And anyway, grotesque racial caricatures are never A-OK because they're grotesque racial caricatures. That's enough to make them wrong (I'm ignoring edge cases like displaying Nazi anti-Semitic propaganda at the Holocaust Museum in case anyone tries to use them as a gotcha). How is it different than kimonos and kanji tattoos? Symbols don't mean anything without interpretation, and Asian-Americans have determined that those things are close enough to gross racial caricatures to complain. The definition of 'gross racial caricature' is entirely subjective. Jarmak posted:Yes, literally, you're racist, or at least what you're saying is, putting it in scare quotes and caps does not make it suddenly invalid. The Edward Said definition of Orientalism is "a way of seeing that imagines, emphasizes, exaggerates and distorts differences of non-Western peoples and cultures as compared to those of the West". Basically exociticing them. This is pretty commonly considered a bad thing. But apparantly it's SJW nonsense and political correctness gone mad? icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 09:26 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 09:21
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Asian-Americans are the ones making the complaints about kimonos and kanji tattoos and poo poo. Asian-Asians don't give a poo poo. So explain to me how those things are fine and dandy unless you completely disregard the Asian-American perspective. It's hilarious you're accusing me of denying them agency when you're denying them ownership of their own heritage. I'm not the one who decided that kimonos and kanji are part of their heritage, they are I am "completely disregarding the Asian-American perspective" if that perspective holds white girls wearing Kimonos as racist. As you said Asians-Asians don't give a poo poo, and they're perspective is better informed and more valuable then some 16-year old girl from Cupertino whining on Tumblr about Katy Perry. icantfindaname posted:How is it different than kimonos and kanji tattoos? Symbols don't mean anything without interpretation, and Asian-Americans have determined that those things are close enough to gross racial caricatures to complain. The definition of 'gross racial caricature' is entirely subjective. Just because a something is subjective doesn't mean that people can't speak, listen, and come to a rough understanding, nor does it mean we have to declare all perspectives equally valid. icantfindaname posted:The Edward Said definition of Orientalism is "a way of seeing that imagines, emphasizes, exaggerates and distorts differences of non-Western peoples and cultures as compared to those of the West". Basically exociticing them. This is pretty commonly considered a bad thing. But apparantly it's SJW nonsense and political correctness gone mad? Orientalism is a bad thing, but a bro with "explosive diarrhea" tattooed in Hanzi is not orientalism any more than the "gently caress This World" shirt I mentioned earlier is Occidentalism. Trying to hold up a mere writing systems as a sacred object of a foreign culture that must be protected from barbarians...that's Orientalism.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 10:17
|
|
|
deptstoremook posted:* Naturally some cultures might see the appropriation of e.g. sacred symbols as highly offensive and harmful. In that case, we don't need to have a debate: internet bickering aside, common courtesy and ethics would clearly dictate that you knock it off. Hanzi aren't sacred symbols anymore than the letter A is sacred.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 10:18
|
|
|
I'm psyched for cultural appropriation being a thing if it means more lovely CEO's get canned or racist fraternities disbanded. In America, outside of foreign/ethnic enclaves, it's difficult to pass down even a shred of culture to children that doesn't fit into the national mono-culture. Taking CA on the flipside, if this means a sort of ceasefire on Americans trying to convert everyone who isn't One of Us and instead going, "you're doing your own thing and I don't have to engage you like it's something I need to resolve, on my end or yours," that'd be nice. In regards to art, if anything, I think American culture still ignores too much when it comes to taking influences from other cultures and it's silly to think CA would somehow make things worse. Conservative artists who want to "stay pure" won't give a poo poo about CA and I'm sure the market will take care of any who do.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 10:36
|
|
|
Okay, so what I've learned from this thread is that minorities don't get to decide what their own culture and heritage is, that racism and orientalism are cool as long as the objects of them are far away (but if some of them are actually living in the US they don't count) and white people have decided it's fine, and that things like 'language' and 'writing' are not elements of culture that are important or worth protecting
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 12:05
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Okay, so what I've learned from this thread is that minorities don't get to decide what their own culture and heritage is, that racism and orientalism are cool as long as the objects of them are far away (but if some of them are actually living in the US they don't count) and white people have decided it's fine, and that things like 'language' and 'writing' are not elements of culture that are important or worth protecting If you're going to buy into some dehumanizing set of ideas that views "minorities" as monolithic entities that speak in one voice instead of human beings with a variety of experiences and viewpoints that change depending on context, then yes, your views on this thread are correct. By your logic, I as a minority in the nation I live, get to decide what's racist and have zero responsibility to back-up my ideas and can use the mere existence of a challenge to my claim as further evidence of racism. Let us English fucked around with this message at 12:38 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 12:31
|
|
|
Can we apply a "reasonable person" standard? Like, say, while a reasonable person might be offended if sacrilegious use of some important symbol were made, no reasonable person would be offended by a black or white girl wearing a kimono or doing geisha makeup because she thought it was pretty, or somone getting a chinese character tattoo because he thought it looked cool, or was fascinated by the idea that in chinese, a beautiful symbol can stand for a word or idea? If this kimono and tattoo thing is the crux of "cultural appropriation," then I'm afraid it's a dog that don't hunt, and that surely in this wide world we can all find something a little bit more actually important and worthy of our human dignity to think about.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 15:41
|
|
|
Pyzza Rouge posted:
The main point of contention is that minorities still aren't passing down their culture to their children; white people are taking some aspects of that culture and selling it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 15:42
|
|
|
Let us English posted:If you're going to buy into some dehumanizing set of ideas that views "minorities" as monolithic entities that speak in one voice instead of human beings with a variety of experiences and viewpoints that change depending on context, then yes, your views on this thread are correct. Do you live in China? During the years I lived in China I was a minority. Sometimes it was tough because I would see people wearing trousers and button up shirts and the kind of shoes that are of a style created and valued by my people. I would even see women carrying around purses and handbags. I even saw many men with purses.men aren't meant to carry purses, that's a big deal in my culture. These chinese men were appropriating part of traditional western female culture and they didn't even care. They'd probably never ever stopped to think about it. My mother has a purse. My father and I bought it for her one year for Christmas. They don't even celebrate Christmas in China. Don't even get me started. Sure, they decorate things for it, but they don't understand its significance. They don't understand my fond memories of the smell of Christmas trees and the thrill of opening presents or driving around looking at Christmas lights. Here I was stuck in China for Christmas, and they were mocking my culture and my feelings for home and they didn't even know it or care. I am a victim of cultural appropriation 
hakimashou fucked around with this message at 15:48 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 15:43
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:This isn't the 19th century, China is arguably the second most powerful country in the world and the shrinking inequality of cultural diffusion has more to do with a more unidirectional immigration pattern then it has anything to do with colonialism. deptstoremook posted:Different writing system and unfamiliar culture => the Asians are odd and mystical => they are easy to colonize (20th century option: they are the inscrutable foreign rivals). Read the post before you respond. I'm not talking about cultural exchange. Let us English posted:Hanzi aren't sacred symbols anymore than the letter A is sacred. Then my exception wouldn't apply, I think.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 15:58
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:The Edward Said definition of Orientalism is "a way of seeing that imagines, emphasizes, exaggerates and distorts differences of non-Western peoples and cultures as compared to those of the West". Basically exociticing them. This is pretty commonly considered a bad thing. But apparantly it's SJW nonsense and political correctness gone mad? e. I get that "Orientalism" refers to a specific historical phenomenon but I doubt the psychology that motivates it is unique to the West. unlimited shrimp fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 16:12
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Asian-Americans are the ones making the complaints about kimonos and kanji tattoos and poo poo. Asian-Asians don't give a poo poo. So explain to me how those things are fine and dandy unless you completely disregard the Asian-American perspective. It's hilarious you're accusing me of denying them agency when you're denying them ownership of their own heritage. I'm not the one who decided that kimonos and kanji are part of their heritage, they are That's pretty much SJW.txt - the notion that a guy whose grandparents immigrated to the States from Osaka, doesn't speak Japanese and has never been in Asia, somehow gets more right to decide who can use kanji than a person born and raised in Japan.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 17:31
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Asian-Americans are the ones making the complaints about kimonos and kanji tattoos and poo poo. Asian-Asians don't give a poo poo. So explain to me how those things are fine and dandy unless you completely disregard the Asian-American perspective. It's hilarious you're accusing me of denying them agency when you're denying them ownership of their own heritage. I'm not the one who decided that kimonos and kanji are part of their heritage, they are Really? This is what you were getting at? No, some 2nd and 3rd generation kids who are a minority within their own minority group do not get dictatorial powers over what people are allowed to appropriate from a culture they never actually lived in. Also trying to tie diffusion of the culture of immigrant groups to stuff like the destruction of the Native American culture through the label of "cultural appropriation" would be offensive if it wasn't so laughably stupid. Also Asian-American's haven't determined poo poo, and I'd be willing to bet more of them would find you talking for them as some sort of homogeneous hive mind to be a gross racial caricature then would be upset about a white girl wearing a kimono. But even if all the Asian Americans did decide at their secret club meeting that kimono's were bad on white girls, if their reasoning is maintaining the racial purity of their cultural symbols I'm going to feel about as moved by that as by the Catholic church bitching about gay people being allowed to get married. Which really brings me around to my original point, if a particular instance of cultural appropriation is a bad thing its because there is some characteristic that can be independently identified and argued is troubling. Cultural appropriation is not some sort of "I win" label to be slapped down which makes something inherently bad. deptstoremook posted:Read the post before you respond. I'm not talking about cultural exchange. And? I wasn't talking to you, why are you quoting my conversation with someone else and telling me I didn't read because I wasn't addressing your framework? I read, I chose not to respond. Jarmak fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 17:49
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:Really? This is what you were getting at? No, some 2nd and 3rd generation kids who are a minority within their own minority group do not get dictatorial powers over what people are allowed to appropriate from a culture they never actually lived in. Also trying to tie diffusion of the culture of immigrant groups to stuff like the destruction of the Native American culture through the label of "cultural appropriation" would be offensive if it wasn't so laughably stupid. The best thing is that this mindset fits the definition of cultural appropriation like a glove. You have a group who is relatively privileged by speaking a more popular language and being able to disseminate their ideas faster. They took an element of the culture which they don't participate in and redefined its meaning to their needs. The whole reason they are able to be angry at white dudes getting kanji tattoos is because they took an alphabet commonly used by an entire nation and presented it as a set of sacred and mysterious symbols which only people of Asian descent can use. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 18:57
|
|
|
FWIW, none of any the Asian Americans I've ever known, myself included, thinks white people getting Chinese or Japanese tattoos is offensive. Funny and maybe a little pathetic, but not really offensive. But Asian Americans all over the internet seem to think it's a big deal so maybe I'm out of touch.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 19:06
|
|
|
Either way I'm struggling to think of how cultural appropriation would piss of your average resident of Nanking more than the insinuation that thier culture can in any way be lumped together with the Japanese. But I suspect cultural appropriation only really effectively works as a morally neutral term whose good or ill depends largely on the context. Like appropriating the Swatstika to use as a symbol of a genocidal regime is bad but if it was used as a symbol of some sort of equal rights movement or something it wouldn't be bad, even though in both cases you basically just yank out a cultural symbol and use it to represent a political movement. That's an easy example too, I don't know how the hell you'd classify something like Black America adapting elements of Islam as part of a social movement willing to use the threat of violence to protect themselves from oppression (fwiw in my view the threat of violence was totes justified, I'm more just pretty ignorant of the history of how that whole shebang went down and may have already said something real stupid about it).
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 19:28
|
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:Either way I'm struggling to think of how cultural appropriation would piss of your average resident of Nanking more than the insinuation that thier culture can in any way be lumped together with the Japanese. Using the Wades-Giles romanization would be one step. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 19:30
|
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:Either way I'm struggling to think of how cultural appropriation would piss of your average resident of Nanking more than the insinuation that thier culture can in any way be lumped together with the Japanese. unlimited shrimp fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 19:46
|
|
|
Squinty posted:FWIW, none of any the Asian Americans I've ever known, myself included, thinks white people getting Chinese or Japanese tattoos is offensive. Funny and maybe a little pathetic, but not really offensive. But Asian Americans all over the internet seem to think it's a big deal so maybe I'm out of touch. Just remember the Internet is for people who don't count because they can't hack it in real life, and it will all start to make perfect sense. Just remember that real life and the Internet are seperate, and it's all so clear.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 19:56
|
|
I can't decide whether the D'Souzaing or the guy who said Japanese-American culture is inauthentic is the funniest part of this thread.hakimashou posted:Just remember the Internet is for people who don't count because they can't hack it in real life, and it will all start to make perfect sense. Nah, it's this.
|
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 20:32
|
|
|
hakimashou posted:Can we apply a "reasonable person" standard? Somehow, I agree with the guy who wants to genocide all Russians. What the hell is happening to me, am I going to start nodding along to Rush Limbaugh now? icantfindaname posted:Okay, so what I've learned from this thread is that minorities don't get to decide what their own culture and heritage is, that racism and orientalism are cool as long as the objects of them are far away (but if some of them are actually living in the US they don't count) and white people have decided it's fine, and that things like 'language' and 'writing' are not elements of culture that are important or worth protecting Is there any kind of standard for how few members of this minority care about something and how consequential it is? A lot of black people get offended at blackface, and those stereotypes actually do a huge amount of harm so ignoring them and doing it anyway is lovely. But if a few Asian-American guys don't like my tattoo, am I a jackass if I don't care? I'm living abroad right now and learning Chinese, but if I wanted to get a tattoo saying something in my new language, that's bad because someone in LA might not like it? I like languages. I like learning languages. Treating the writing system of my fourth language (Chinese) as something sacred and holy, but see my second or third languages as an ordinary writing system that it's okay to tattoo seems way more orientalist to me. I probably wouldn't get an Afrikaans tattoo because it's not particularly pretty, so I guess I'm stuck appropriating someone else's culture. VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 20:33
|
|
|
This is pretty simple. You're actually learning Chinese. So it's not appropriation. Most of the problems people have in this thread with the concept of cultural appropriation (But isn't it just racism? Yes, it often is. So what? Am I appropriating if I become a professor of Chinese and name my house something in Chinese? No, you didn't appropriate, you participated) would be solved by thinking about it for five seconds before posting. The tattoo thing is trivial. It's a trivial annoyance. it's still an annoyance. A very mildly racist thing is still racist. Nobody is saying that any bit of cultural appropriation is just as wrong as some huge gigantic bit of it. The person who said that it doesn't matter because people are far away is still my favorite, that poo poo was hilarious. And who used 'but the Japanese appropriate culture so it must be okay', that was also a knee-slapper.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:03
|
|
|
I guess then I'm not sure of the usefulness of the term "cultural appropriation." It seems to lump a lot of good, neutral, and bad things together. And the bad things already have terms to describe them like "bigotry" or "mockery" or "desecration" or "erasure", so I don't really see what a kind of umbrella term is good for other than creating confusion. Humans are imitators and social creatures, if we see a good idea, we're going to imitate it. If we want to talk about how cultures and ideas and traditions get spread when we talk about appropriation, sure. But making the basic, basic phenomenon of humans copying other humans into a pejorative, well, like I said we already have pejoratives for the bad ways of imitating others.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:20
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:I guess then I'm not sure of the usefulness of the term "cultural appropriation." Why are you evaluating it for 'usefulness'? Is 'racism' a useful term? I haven't seen any objections, at all, to 'cultural appropriation' that couldn't be levelled at 'racism'. You seem to be evaluating language like it's some kind of magic. quote:It seems to lump a lot of good, neutral, and bad things together. It doesn't lump anything good together with anything, no. Can you come up with something that's cultural appropriation and is 'good'? I don't mean good for the person doing it. quote:And the bad things already have terms to describe them like "bigotry" or "mockery" or "desecration" or "erasure", so I don't really see what a kind of umbrella term is good for other than creating confusion. Because it describes a systematic and common way that those things happen, often in concert. Again, it feels like this is a problem you could have resolved for yourself by thinking about it for five seconds. quote:But making the basic, basic phenomenon of humans copying other humans into a pejorative, well, like I said we already have pejoratives for the bad ways of imitating others. That's not what cultural appropriation is. It's inauthentic, misjudged, disrespectful, out-of-context imitation. I think the term isn't making sense to you because you're determined to not understand it. Do you get why someone who went to China and learned Chinese getting a Chinese tattoo wouldn't be cultural appropriation? You didn't respond in any meaningful way to my explanation.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:27
|
|
|
unlimited shrimp posted:Hitler's use of the swastika isn't even an example of cultural appropriation. He didn't choose the symbol because he was enraptured with an exoticized Hinduism, he chose it because of its connection to the mythological Aryan race via ancient German pottery shards and what was found in the excavation of Troy. and washington redskins fans aren't big enthusiasts of Sitting Bull either Obdicut posted:I think the term isn't making sense to you because you're determined to not understand it. this thread stopped being about explanations a dozen pages ago, now it's a thread to watch dumb posters pretend to be dumber than they are to make bad arguments about who can be the most tired of political correctness and other strawmen boner confessor fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Mar 29, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:30
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:I guess then I'm not sure of the usefulness of the term "cultural appropriation." This is exactly my point Obdicut posted:This is pretty simple. You're actually learning Chinese. So it's not appropriation. Did you think about that post for 5 seconds? Because "hey guys if you just think about it for a second this completely arbitrary line I just drew here will be super clear" is pretty dumb. This stuff is extra dumb if people want to start talking about Japanese culture specifically since much of its current levels of popularity is due to the fact they've been actively exporting it for decades.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:30
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:
I didn't draw a line anywhere. I have no idea what you mean by " This stuff is extra dumb if people want to start talking about Japanese culture specifically since much of its current levels of popularity is due to the fact they've been actively exporting it for decades." What 'stuff'?
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:32
|
|
|
Obdicut posted:I didn't draw a line anywhere. I have no idea what you mean by " This stuff is extra dumb if people want to start talking about Japanese culture specifically since much of its current levels of popularity is due to the fact they've been actively exporting it for decades." What 'stuff'? Between participation and appropriation. And by "stuff" I meant bitching about people getting tattoos, wearing kimonos, etc edit: I see we're back to the definition being "cultural exchange that I don't like"
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:35
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:Between participation and appropriation. You think that discerning between 'actually learning the language' and 'not speaking the language at all' is an arbitrary line? Is there any line that isn't arbitrary, by that understanding? quote:And by "stuff" I meant bitching about people getting tattoos, wearing kimonos, etc. I think maybe you need to read what I said again because I'm not in any way talking about people bitching about wearing kimonos when I referenced how silly it is to defend cultural appropriation by saying that the Japanese do it. quote:edit: I see we're back to the definition being "cultural exchange that I don't like" Nope. It's not an exchange, and it's not about what I like.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 13:08 |
|
|
*looks up from D&D rulebook* I'm sorry, but I can't believe in cultural distinction unless they can be objectively defined and rolled against
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2015 21:37
|
|