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In 50 years, long after the decimation of the world's population in the Water Wars, a small band of wasteland travelers is crossing the desolated plain where once stood Los Angeles. Suddenly, an unfamiliar crunch is heard under the bootheel of Ungric the Foul. He stoops down, brushes aside some dirt, and digs out a Blu-Ray of Forrest Gump. He considers it for several seconds before lowering it and looking to his followers. "This.... is problematic."
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Mar 31, 2015 20:04
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Any movie made in the US about location outside the US and about a culture different than the film producers, cast, and crew will be problematic for cultural appropriation.
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Mar 31, 2015 20:17
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Len posted:Any movie made in the US about location outside the US and about a culture different than the film producers, cast, and crew will be problematic for cultural appropriation. That's an issue today though. I'm getting real sick of old American dudes with beards playing Russian villains. Whitewashing is even worse. Prince of Persia was Jake Gyllenhaal?  I don't need 20 years for that to be cringe.
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Mar 31, 2015 20:19
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Zaphod42 posted:Whitewashing Guaranteed that whitewashing will be the Big One for our generation's films. Like you touched on, it's already cringeworthy and it's happening right now. Imagine in 20-30 years when one of our kids asks why a Japanese actor is playing Chinese, Koreans, etc. or any other combination thereof. Or why anyone gave the slightest of shits that Nick Fury/maybe Spiderman/any movie character wasn't white. Etc. etc.
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Mar 31, 2015 20:28
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Zaphod42 posted:That's an issue today though. I'm getting real sick of old American dudes with beards playing Russian villains. Whitewashing is even worse. I meant more like "Those Hollywood people made a movie about non-US culture and made millions?! I am trembling with rage!" Whitewashing is lovely and would be great if it would stop being a thing. But until someone in Hollywood decides to attempt something different we're stuck with then casting Sir Kingsley as everything.
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Mar 31, 2015 20:37
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Don't blame Hollywood for whitewashing, blame the movie viewing public who consistently indicate through test audiences and ticket purchases they're uncomfortable with leads that aren't traditionally "western." Not saying it's right, but Hollywood doesn't do things in a vacuum. If it were one studio it would be one thing, this is an industry wide trend and didn't come from one or two racist executives.
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Mar 31, 2015 21:01
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Pook Good Mook posted:Don't blame Hollywood for whitewashing, blame the movie viewing public who consistently indicate through test audiences and ticket purchases they're uncomfortable with leads that aren't traditionally "western." On the other hand though its a self-fulfilling prophecy. When people are used to that, showing them things they aren't used to turns them off. If one studio were doing it people would have choices, but when every film available is like that you don't have any choice and you just accept it. Then it gets parroted around Hollywood over and over for awhile, and people can hold onto it or even go looking for evidence to support it when it isn't necessarily the reason anymore. Its a chicken and egg problem sorta. You're right though that society is complicit.
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Mar 31, 2015 21:05
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Zaphod42 posted:On the other hand though its a self-fulfilling prophecy. When people are used to that, showing them things they aren't used to turns them off. If one studio were doing it people would have choices, but when every film available is like that you don't have any choice and you just accept it. Then it gets parroted around Hollywood over and over for awhile, and people can hold onto it or even go looking for evidence to support it when it isn't necessarily the reason anymore. I think you're right. My guess is that the continued growth in popularity of foreign films or films by foreign directors, particularly at major award shows, will inevitably change things. Hell it's still better then it was even 20 years ago. Now Prince of Persia is a noteworthy standout in offensiveness, no one would have bat an eye about it a few decades ago.
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Mar 31, 2015 21:10
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Pook Good Mook posted:Don't blame Hollywood for whitewashing, blame the movie viewing public Or do like I do, and blame both. Also what Zaphod42 said. edit: while it's not a movie, I don't wanna be overly negative in this thread, so I def wanna point out Fresh Off the Boat as an amazing example of nonwhite casting that also happens to be a great show. I can't think of any movies off the top of my head right now to throw into the Good Examples pile. Actually wait, Pacific Rim was pretty great for that imo.
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Mar 31, 2015 21:10
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Two male leads walk into a place. Male lead: Hello. Person in place: You two make a great couple. Male leads: Wha- wha- no, of course not- I mean, we would never- we're not- we're not gay or- you're misunderstanding, we- no- we just- bluhbluhbluhhhhh??? Test audiences: rate 5 stars, then buy 10 tickets to mail to their friends
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Mar 31, 2015 21:17
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theironjef posted:Coming to terms with how much I cringe watching old Robin Williams movies. Both Patch Adams and Good Morning Vietnam would be interesting stories, but they add a female lead subplot in the exact same way. It's "Extremely busy, already in difficult times woman repeatedly and very clearly refuses his advances, which he responds to by just following them around doing even louder schtick til they sort of cave." Toss in that in both cases the female lead is chosen by Robin because she's the first woman he sees wherever he happens to be. I can't even get to that point in either of them, since both of them have the same failing to me: they're movies about real people, that sensationalize the real goings-on to the point where the person they're supposed to be about is an unflattering caricature of themselves, and yet they're presenting these people as the good guys. I mean, it's one thing to argue about book vs movie in fiction, but when you're calling out real people by name I think there should be a bit more fidelity and a little less...Robin Williams.
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Mar 31, 2015 21:31
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I'm starting to find some of these posts very problematic.
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Mar 31, 2015 22:20
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KozmoNaut posted:If Ozzy can rhyme "masses" with "masses", anything is possible The demo version or something has "bodies burning in red ashes" instead and it's so much better.
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Mar 31, 2015 22:28
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Kugyou no Tenshi posted:I can't even get to that point in either of them, since both of them have the same failing to me: they're movies about real people, that sensationalize the real goings-on to the point where the person they're supposed to be about is an unflattering caricature of themselves, and yet they're presenting these people as the good guys. I mean, it's one thing to argue about book vs movie in fiction, but when you're calling out real people by name I think there should be a bit more fidelity and a little less...Robin Williams. In Patch Adams, the character his romantic interest is based off (A)wasn't his romantic interest and (B)wasn't even a girl. The real Patch Adams was also less, well, Robin Williams. That movie was loving garbage and a real black mark on the the real dude's reputation considering how bad it made him look.
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Mar 31, 2015 22:36
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So how useful are Test audiences anyway? Most examples I read they're LCD stuff, but that one Deep Blue Sea example is one good example(which I assume is rare).
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Mar 31, 2015 22:49
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PhazonLink posted:So how useful are Test audiences anyway? Most examples I read they're LCD stuff, but that one Deep Blue Sea example is one good example(which I assume is rare). Often the people who work on movie get a kind of tunnel vision, they might not always be able to recognize parts that aren't working or don't see big picture issues that may have nothing to do with the competency of the work they're doing. In cases like that test audiences are essential, especially if they're composed of people with no skin in the game. Anyone can recognize a movie that makes no sense. On the other hand studios will almost always err on pleasing as many people as they can, proportional to how much money they've got tied up in the film. Even if there's a valid artistic choice to be made they will pick the version that will better appeal to the mass market, the safer choice. This is when test audience value is mixed. No one wants to watch an arthouse film when they were promised Michael Bay, but then you also get things like the altered ending to I am Legend.
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Mar 31, 2015 22:59
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Zaphod42 posted:Anything involving technology. Yeah, in Lethal Weapon Mel yells at Danny Glover "What are you, a fag!?" as a throw away joke while Glover is falling over him from an explosion. Also some other film I watched recently that did a similar thing.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:04
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Actually speaking of that, I already normally find Tina Fey to be incredibly unfunny and a subpar comedic writer, but the gay jokes in Unbreakable Jimmy Schmidt are downright ancient. Seriously? Gay jokes about a dude who pretends he likes Nascar and man stuff to appear straight but is outted when he knows more about furniture than any straight man should? In 2015?
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Mar 31, 2015 23:06
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Parasol Prophet posted:Whenever I think about Revenge of the Nerds and other problematic 80s comedies, I wonder which plot elements/movies in general will seem okay to us as they're being released now, but be absolutely cringeworthy in 30 or 40 years. I was watching Trading Places the other day and it was just as great as I remembered. Then they get to the train scene and Dan Akroyd walks in wearing black face 
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Mar 31, 2015 23:39
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Len posted:I meant more like "Those Hollywood people made a movie about non-US culture and made millions?! I am trembling with rage!"
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Apr 1, 2015 00:57
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One complaint I have with Prince Of Persia, besides the whitewashing, is that the identity of the villain is supposed to be a surprise yet they casted Ben Kingsley. I Now Pronounce You Chuck And Larry is probably the most homophobic (the gay characters are all flaming sexual predators) movie that came out in the past 10 years. Then again, it's a Sandler movie and it also has Rob Schneider in yellowface.
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Apr 1, 2015 01:00
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Len posted:I meant more like "Those Hollywood people made a movie about non-US culture and made millions?! I am trembling with rage!" In fairness, Ben Kingsley is half-Indian, so it's slightly less terrible that he keeps getting cast as "vaugely Eastern" characters. Or is that what you were saying - that Kingsley is the maximum level of non-whiteness that audiences will accept? Lottery of Babylon posted:Two male leads walk into a place. Ah yes - as seen in every other episode of Supernatural!
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Apr 1, 2015 01:18
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Jerusalem posted:I was watching Trading Places the other day and it was just as great as I remembered. Then they get to the train scene and Dan Akroyd walks in wearing black face To be fair, the joke is supposed to be how dumb the disguise is, and isn't meant to be an insult toward black people. It's less "lol them blacks, right?" and more "are you loving kidding me, Akroyd?" It bothered me a bit at first, but then my buddy suggested it was probably Murphy's idea in the first place.
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Apr 1, 2015 01:38
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Celery Face posted:I Now Pronounce You Chuck And Larry is probably the most homophobic (the gay characters are all flaming sexual predators) movie that came out in the past 10 years. Then again, it's a Sandler movie and it also has Rob Schneider in yellowface. Since Rob Schneider is half Filipino, can you really call that stereotype "yellowface?" Don't get me wrong. I Now Pronounce You Chuck & Larry is still a bad movie, and Rob Schneider is a bad actor.
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Apr 1, 2015 01:45
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cheerfullydrab posted:Apu on the Simpsons being played by somebody doing a comic accent gets more into Speedy Gonzales territory every year. He's not a caricature, he's been given real depth as a character, but come on, think about it for a second, a white guy doing an exaggerated "Indian" accent. On the subject of it apparently bring really hard to not hire white guys: Short Circuit.
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Apr 1, 2015 02:12
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I don't know how so many of you are able to watch movies without literally shaking. Jesus loving Christ.
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Apr 1, 2015 02:33
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Non Serviam posted:I don't know how so many of you are able to watch movies without literally shaking. sorry not everyone is a political cartoon character, i'll get to work on making some labels
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Apr 1, 2015 02:37
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Android Bicyclist posted:Since Rob Schneider is half Filipino, can you really call that stereotype "yellowface?" Have you seen what he looks like in that movie?
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Apr 1, 2015 02:48
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Android Bicyclist posted:Since Rob Schneider is half Filipino, can you really call that stereotype "yellowface?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdja5DSb2O8
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Apr 1, 2015 03:23
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This is a general complaint that covers movies AND TV. I've started watching Blue Bloods on Netflix (it's a fun little police procedural show). I really can't stand how Internal Affairs officers are always portrayed as hyper evil douchebags who love going after ~good cops~ Every single show, be it Law and Order, Blue Bloods, CSI or most films about cops, will paint Internal Affairs as cackling monsters who get together to plan how to tar and feather the reputation of any cop who drops a piece of gum on the ground or something. OldTennisCourt has a new favorite as of 03:38 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 03:24
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Almost every single cop show is propaganda for a police state so it's not super surprising that any instance of internal policing would be portrayed as a horrible thing.
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Apr 1, 2015 03:26
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Android Bicyclist posted:Since Rob Schneider is half Filipino, can you really call that stereotype "yellowface?" Yes, you moron. edit: this is actually pretty relevant now--a pretty interesting top 25 list of Hollywood yellowface performances: http://www.asianweek.com/top-25-yellow-face-performance-25to21/ Son of Thunderbeast has a new favorite as of 03:49 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 03:46
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Is Adam Sandler intentionally making awful movies these days? You could not pay me money to watch Jack and Jill.  Never saw Chuck and Larry and didn't realize it was that ... uggh. Rob Schneider in yellowface and the elementary school dollars / doll hairs joke goes on forever. I need to re-watch Happy Gilmore to see how well it holds up now that I'm an adult.
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Apr 1, 2015 03:58
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OldTennisCourt posted:This is a general complaint that covers movies AND TV. I've started watching Blue Bloods on Netflix (it's a fun little police procedural show). I really can't stand how Internal Affairs officers are always portrayed as hyper evil douchebags who love going after ~good cops~ The other is fights over jurisdiction. Cops show up to a crime scene but then some FBI/DEA guys in suits also show up and try to use ~~*rules*~~ to steal their case - dickwaving and douchebaggery ensues.
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Apr 1, 2015 04:12
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Anosmoman posted:The other is fights over jurisdiction. Cops show up to a crime scene but then some FBI/DEA guys in suits also show up and try to use ~~*rules*~~ to steal their case - dickwaving and douchebaggery ensues. There's a wonderful scene in The Wire mocking this whole thing. The FBI gets involved in a major smuggling investigation at the port, and when they show up they square off with the cops and they all glare daggers at each other... then laugh and shake hands and eagerly join forces, because the FBI has a shitton of resources and the police have already done all the legwork so it's a win-win situation for both of them.
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Apr 1, 2015 04:58
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Jerusalem posted:There's a wonderful scene in The Wire mocking this whole thing. The FBI gets involved in a major smuggling investigation at the port, and when they show up they square off with the cops and they all glare daggers at each other... then laugh and shake hands and eagerly join forces, because the FBI has a shitton of resources and the police have already done all the legwork so it's a win-win situation for both of them. The fact that the FBI's priorities in the case don't exactly align with the BPD's priorities in the case is definitely a plot point later on.
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Apr 1, 2015 05:30
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Zaphod42 posted:Is Adam Sandler intentionally making awful movies these days?
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Apr 1, 2015 06:10
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OldTennisCourt posted:This is a general complaint that covers movies AND TV. I've started watching Blue Bloods on Netflix (it's a fun little police procedural show). I really can't stand how Internal Affairs officers are always portrayed as hyper evil douchebags who love going after ~good cops~ I seem to recall Daybreak treating IA fairly well, but that's because Daybreak was an amazing show.
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Apr 1, 2015 06:29
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Zaphod42 posted:Is Adam Sandler intentionally making awful movies these days? Happy Gilmore and Billy Madison are the only Adam Sandler movies that exist to me. All the newer stuff he has been making has been pretty universally terrible. Click was OK I guess though despite the extreme heavy-handed way it bashed you over the head with the "this is where we want you to cry evry tiem" scenes. It's up there with the beginning of "Up" on my list of scenes i'm irrationally irritated about when people gush about how amazing they are.
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Apr 1, 2015 06:48
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Zaphod42 posted:Is Adam Sandler intentionally making awful movies these days? i watched grown ups 2 for the gently caress of it because it was on the 300s and it was amazingly bad. Like, the scene transitions and scene-to-scene relations are unbelievably loving terrible to the point of it not even being a movie. In one, they do this bad Nick Swardson-is-a-drugged-up-school-bus-driver stealing weekend at bernies gimmick, then the next one is them loving around in K-Mart, with camera pans that say "we were sponsored by K-Mart". The scene is just that. loving around in a K-mart.
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Apr 1, 2015 06:49
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