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Relentlessboredomm posted:Also, I found it interesting that Miami is the location in FL instead of Key West which would've been my first guess. Key West has Parrothead boomers who think drinking maragaritas while lounging on your boat and making sure there's never a whiff of progress so you can continue being a lovely 55-year old account manager wearing a Guy Harvey shirt and not think about how awful it must be not to be white, male and middle-aged. 
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Apr 9, 2015 20:43
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Popular Thug Drink posted:Even if the guy is a horrible murderer it's a lovely thing to cut off the murder's wife's health insurance in the final weeks of her pregnancy. Yes it is, though it's important to be mindful of what would have happened had the killer been a regular civilian. You think that person's employer would care in the least about a wife in that case? People shouldn't get special treatment because their family members happen to be police.
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Apr 9, 2015 20:48
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Unzip and Attack posted:Yes it is, though it's important to be mindful of what would have happened had the killer been a regular civilian. You think that person's employer would care in the least about a wife in that case? People shouldn't get special treatment because their family members happen to be police. If there was a union it'd be their job to care so maybe.
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Apr 9, 2015 20:49
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Unzip and Attack posted:Yes it is, though it's important to be mindful of what would have happened had the killer been a regular civilian. You think that person's employer care in the least about a wife in that case? People shouldn't get special treatment because their family members happen to be police. If there was a personal relationship there, I don't see why not. My job broke rules for me when my wife was pregnant 
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Apr 9, 2015 20:50
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Only 11% of working Americans are unionized.Popular Thug Drink posted:If there was a personal relationship there, I don't see why not. My job broke rules for me when my wife was pregnant Again, you're lucky to have this but the vast majority of Americans don't have this sort of fall back.
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Apr 9, 2015 20:52
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His wife and child having health insurance until the child is born is the least of my concerns with this story, in fact I'm glad they still have coverage. They didn't murder anyone.
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Apr 9, 2015 20:52
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Popular Thug Drink posted:Even if the guy is a horrible murderer it's a lovely thing to cut off the murder's wife's health insurance in the final weeks of her pregnancy. Why? Or should I say, when it comes to all of the situations under which Americans can lose their healthcare due to no fault of their own, why should this situation come up any higher than a position that needs to be described with scientific notation?
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Apr 9, 2015 20:53
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Everblight posted:Miami has gays and minorities. You might want to look closer at some of those clubs in Key West down on main street if you think it's just Parrotheads there.
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Apr 9, 2015 20:53
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Radbot posted:Why? It's bad when anyone loses their insurance at a critical time through no fault of their own, which is why we should advocate for this to happen less often and not more often. I mean if we just want to  POLICE then go nuts but I don't see why we have to use a pregnant individual to vent about ACABSome serious crab bucket arguments going on ITT
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Apr 9, 2015 20:55
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Popular Thug Drink posted:It's bad when anyone loses their insurance at a critical time through no fault of their own, which is why we should advocate for this to happen less often and not more often. Like I said, this happens to people and families that don't involve murderers. Why is this relevant to this particular situation? Perhaps you should start a thread about COBRA? Are we going to talk about the eligibility of his family for student loans post-innocent man murdering? What the gently caress is this stupid derail about?
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Apr 9, 2015 20:58
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Don't worry, she worked hard to get that insurance*. * - This is what a fiancee of a friend of mine who became a cop actually believes. She isn't smart enough to realize that she's literally saying she's whoring herself out for government benefits. Of course, she rails about the LAZY WELFARES all the time.** ** - Our friendship has become strained of late.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:05
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Radbot posted:Like I said, this happens to people and families that don't involve murderers. Why is this relevant to this particular situation? Perhaps you should start a thread about COBRA? It's relevant because someone pointed out that the reason the cop hasnt been fired yet (which is a valid thing to be concerned about) is because they're intentionally not firing him because it would cut his pregnant wife off from their healthcare
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Apr 9, 2015 21:07
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I think the burden of proof is on those who argue that this particular woman should be given a benefit that very few other working Americans would get just for being laid off in a normal fashion, much less because their spouse was arrested and charged with murder. I mean if your argument is "everyone should have insurance all the time no matter what!" that's fine, but that's not a real-world argument. I definitely feel personally for the woman and don't want to see her lose her insurance (as stated, her and the child are completely innocent in this) but it's not a "crab bucket" thought process to question this. It's an obvious double standard and it's unjust.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:10
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Radbot posted:Are we going to talk about the eligibility of his family for student loans post-innocent man murdering? What the gently caress is this stupid derail about? I don't know, since you're the one that started it? Exactly what point were you trying to make with that post?
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Apr 9, 2015 21:10
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:It's relevant because someone pointed out that the reason the cop hasnt been fired yet (which is a valid thing to be concerned about) is because they're intentionally not firing him because it would cut his pregnant wife off from their healthcare I'm glad you caught on to why we're talking about this at all. My concern was the white-knighting of the poor murderer's family, when the poster in question hasn't said poo poo about people being laid off keeping THEIR health insurance in other threads.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:10
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You know you to fire a government employee for negligence you have to go through due process right. Unions jobs also usually require as a part of their contract some sort of process for firing someone for gross misconduct. I'm kinda surprised that this of all forums is where people are whining about due process rights jesus loving christ.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:17
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As a progressive who advocates for the poor, I think in the interest of fairness we need to place an extreme financial burden on the cop's family at a delicate moment in their lives.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:18
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The statement read that they are actually waiting to fire him until after the baby is born. That isn't "due process" as much as "we're going to give this family a consideration that no other profession would get when caught on tape committing murder".
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Apr 9, 2015 21:20
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hobbesmaster posted:You know you to fire a government employee for negligence you have to go through due process right. Unions jobs also usually require as a part of their contract some sort of process for firing someone for gross misconduct. I'm kinda surprised that this of all forums is where people are whining about due process rights jesus loving christ. There is a big difference between using due process and what people are complaining about. edit: if a steamfitter beat a man to death with a wrench, wouldn't you expect the same??? 
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Apr 9, 2015 21:20
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Popular Thug Drink posted:As a progressive who advocates for the poor, I think in the interest of fairness we need to place an extreme financial burden on the cop's family at a delicate moment in their lives.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:20
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Unzip and Attack posted:The statement read that they are actually waiting to fire him until after the baby is born. That isn't "due process" as much as "we're going to give this family a consideration that no other profession would get when caught on tape committing murder". And this is different from all other cops who have committed murder recently how? We all get that there is a double standard but wanting to punish a mother and her unborn child for the crimes of her spouse is pretty extreme.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:23
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Internet Webguy posted:And this is different from all other cops who have committed murder recently how? The other cops didn't get to wait until their child was born to get fired? 
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Apr 9, 2015 21:24
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Radbot posted:I'm glad you caught on to why we're talking about this at all. My concern was the white-knighting of the poor murderer's family, when the poster in question hasn't said poo poo about people being laid off keeping THEIR health insurance in other threads. Eat poo poo. I've argued for universal health care in plenty of threads including this one pages back. The fact that I don't feel the need to reiterate it every post and go full LF in calling for medieval torture of the guy in question does not mean I'm defending what happened.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:25
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JT Jag posted:The argument is that others wouldn't get the same benefit of the doubt, not that they should generally go gently caress themselves. And? We should give everyone the benefit of the doubt, not punish the wife of a murderer because we don't like police.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:25
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Popular Thug Drink posted:As a progressive who advocates for the poor, I think in the interest of fairness we need to place an extreme financial burden on the cop's family at a delicate moment in their lives. I agree. It was her decision to marry a violent racist psychopathic murderer, now she must live with the consequences. If we just killed all cops at conception, none of this would happen.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:26
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Popular Thug Drink posted:And? We should give everyone the benefit of the doubt, not punish the wife of a murderer because we don't like police.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:26
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"Why are government servants even having children anyway, don't I get some say in this as a taxpayer?  "JT Jag posted:We don't give everyone the benefit of the doubt though. The fact that some people are given the benefit of the doubt and others aren't is favoritism. We should, though. The solution is to treat everyone better, not to make sure everyone is treated equally poorly.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:26
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Popular Thug Drink posted:And? We should give everyone the benefit of the doubt, not punish the wife of a murderer because we don't like police. Yes we should[give everyone the benefit of the doubt]. We should also have universal health care. We aren't going to get there by only granting special privileges to those in positions of power.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:28
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In non-insane strawman bullshit, here's an example of a right wing site coming up with something fairly funny http://www.ijreview.com/2015/04/289349-turned-eight-republican-presidential-candidates-sims-dropped-white-house/
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Apr 9, 2015 21:28
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Unzip and Attack posted:Yes we should. We should also have universal health care. We aren't going to get there by only granting special privileges to those in positions of power. We're not going to get there by demanding a consistent level of poor healthcare across the board, either. If you want to punish this woman because she married a cop, can you at least just say "I want her to face a burden because her husband murdered someone and that makes me angry?" There's no reason to take the baffling step of framing your indignance as somehow socially progressive.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:29
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Popular Thug Drink posted:We should, though. The solution is to treat everyone better, not to make sure everyone is treated equally poorly.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:29
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Popular Thug Drink posted:We're not going to get there by demanding a consistent level of poor healthcare across the board, either. I'd argue this is actually a better approach than allowing lovely treatment for everyone except the socially advantaged.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:30
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Step 1 in my plan to make things better for the poor: make things horrible for the poor.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:31
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How about we punish the kid and the next 6 generations with shameful dishonor?
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Apr 9, 2015 21:32
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Hey cool more strawmen!
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Apr 9, 2015 21:32
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Everblight posted:Miami has gays and minorities. The gays live in Hollywood, Wilton Manors, and West Palm. They only visit Key West now; it is inhabited by the aforementioned Parrotheads. In many ways Key West has gone way downhill...
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Apr 9, 2015 21:34
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Unzip and Attack posted:Hey cool more strawmen! Even a glorious victory over an enemy made of straw is still a glorious victory.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:37
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anonumos posted:The gays live in Hollywood, Wilton Manors, and West Palm. They only visit Key West now; it is inhabited by the aforementioned Parrotheads. In many ways Key West has gone way downhill... That's because everyone with half a brain has noticed that Duval St. is going to be ankle-deep by 2050. Hell, it already is when a storm blusters through once a week. One time I got caught out in it and was simply forced (forced, I tell you) to remain in an all-you-can-eat crab leg buffet for two hours. It turns out I can eat several pounds of crab legs when the pressure is on.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:38
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Popular Thug Drink posted:Step 1 in my plan to make things better for the poor: make things horrible for the poor.
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Apr 9, 2015 21:38
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Unzip and Attack posted:Yes we should[give everyone the benefit of the doubt]. We should also have universal health care. We aren't going to get there by only granting special privileges to those in positions of power. That's literally how we got all our social programs. New Deal, GI Bill, Great Society, they all started with heavy race and gender restrictions that let them give their benefits to privileged people. They were all expanded after the fact. God drat, a bunch of ostensible liberals screaming about how dare someone not lose their health insurance due to corruption of blood. And apparently if you didn't chomp at the bit to gently caress over people here you are in full support of murder. What the gently caress is wrong with all of you?
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Apr 9, 2015 21:38
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