That Which Sleeps - Eldritch Snooze Simulator

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Demiurge4: Aug 10, 2011

I think the game has a lot of potential for alternate history stuff. The fall of the Roman Empire, ancient Egypt, the Mongol Invasion or straight up China with a bunch of magic thrown in are all excellent starting points for modders to get started.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:17

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 17:27

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

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Wouldn't it be nice if Liu Bei braining his son on the ground was because of an eldritch horror instead of terrible parenting?

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:20

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

First thing I'll do is making a map inspired by TSW. Island overrun by fishmen, desert having problems with undead and eastern Europe country having problems with monsters. Sprinkle minor factions in, custom cultures so orcs, elves, humans and dwarves can live together in a single city and the real fight is between three giant cabals fighting for power.

Plop down as Azlan and watch how the ai handles it.

PS: another info I remembered: first two goos in beta will be Karth and Belial, I think. Two at a time released.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:20

Orv: May 4, 2011

Normal Adult Human posted:

tides of darkness era wow mod writes itself. 7 or so human cities, an elf city, 3 dwarf cities, orc uncivs to the south and troll uncivs near the elf city. Great seal gets put in the blasted lands.

I feel like a Malazan mod would be a great fit for the ideas of the game, if maybe a bit overly large.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:21

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

I was surprised that azlan wasn't the first god they were planning to add, since he by all evidence seemed like the first one they made and was the most fleshed out. Karth being the second. There's so little info about belial other than he can make birds appear from anywhere.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:23

Demiurge4: Aug 10, 2011

Belial is the coolest in my mind because he has a ton of agent slots and lots of subterfuge elements. Azlan is very passive by contrast being more magically powerful but with relatively few agent slots.

Sisiphys is still the coolest though. When you make loving with the chosen ones head your old ones primary mechanic there's just nothing better :colbert:

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:25

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

There are a lot of scenarios that would be great mods.

I don't understand the anime or pony stuff though.

Black Company, LotR, Silmarillion, more fantasy or horror that I even want to write.
But why anime. :reject:

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:26

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

Yeah i'm not complaining. My first playthrough was going to be with Belial because it maximizes sneaky fuckery.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:26

1stGear: Jan 16, 2010; Here's to the new us.

The devs have said that Belial is the best choice for a first playthrough because he has the ability to worsen or mitigate random events and eventually decide who they effect. This gives you the most room to make mistakes and recover from them.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:28

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

Normal Adult Human posted:

I was surprised that azlan wasn't the first god they were planning to add, since he by all evidence seemed like the first one they made and was the most fleshed out. Karth being the second. There's so little info about belial other than he can make birds appear from anywhere.

Belial is repeatedly cited as the newb god because you can recover more easily.

And those are only the starting agent slots, I think they get more with more power.

The thing I am wondering though. They got 25 agents or something in the game.
Any action by an agent aquires fame. The more fame the more heroes will hunt him. So, barring the agents really hard to get...what if you run out of them? I'd rather have some of them be a bit more generic.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:30

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

My cool god funhaver tier list goes like Belial > Azlan, Sissyphus > Moloch, Seraph, Karth > Limos >>>>> Inatha

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:30

Demiurge4: Aug 10, 2011

Moloch is super cool in my mind, probably even more so than Azlan because he's loving with the world itself instead of peoples heads. I'm really interested to see how that plays out for him.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:32

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

Inatha is a piece of poo poo. Stupid blue mutalisk. Nobody likes you inatha, go back to your mountain.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:33

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

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Sisyphus
Belial
Seraph
Moloch/Azlan/Karth
Inartha

Limos.

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:34

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

Demiurge4 posted:

Moloch is super cool in my mind, probably even more so than Azlan because he's loving with the world itself instead of peoples heads. I'm really interested to see how that plays out for him.

Moloch bros!

And Karth seems cool too. Just a big, angry orc with a mission.

Seraph and Inatha are like the same to me. Which one is the voice guy and which one the ice one?

Edit: am I the only one who diggs Limos? He's Nagash the Musical

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:35

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

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The Ice and Voice are both Inatha I think.

Seraph is the one with the weird crystal cult.

And Nagash was/Is cool because he has basically gone from "poo poo tier human" to "Unholy god killing abomination" and he wants to rule the world, not unmake it. That said, there should be a proper "Nagash" Vs "Sisyphus" mashup.

Josef bugman fucked around with this message at 22:41 on Apr 26, 2015

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:37

Zoe: Jan 19, 2007; Hair Elf

Plunging the world into a neverending Ice Age sounds like a good time, what's wrong with Inatha?

e: where is the info on Nagash?

And every time I see the name Azlan I think of Aslan and get really confused a moment wondering what furry Narnian Jesus has to do with Cthulhu.

Zoe fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Apr 26, 2015

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:40

RottenK: Feb 17, 2011; Sexy bad choices

FAILED NOJOE

Who won in that new god vote? The war machine?

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:46

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

I don't know if there's an old god vote going on somewhere else but the new race vote currently stands at

Minotaur 96 40%
Dhaath 93 39%
Yizrii 50 21%

# ? Apr 26, 2015 22:56

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

crazy people: here's the loading screen that was shown for half a second.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 01:39

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

Really hope Dhaath win, because Minotaurs seem so bland. The Yizrii would be cool too, though.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 05:41

FairyNuff: Jan 22, 2012

extraordinary posted:

Really hope Dhaath win, because Minotaurs seem so bland. The Yizrii would be cool too, though.

Ikr, there is 1 vote in it as of now though.

Also someone liked minotaurs enough to post 'sexy minotaur' art in the vote thread before. :shepface:

# ? Apr 27, 2015 05:45

Demiurge4: Aug 10, 2011

I'm kind of digging the Minotaur ideas they have because I don't think I've ever seen Minotaur society done in any medium before.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 06:04

Iunnrais: Jul 25, 2007; It's gaelic.

I might be odd in this, but I actually hope minotaurs win, because I want the cliche stuff to be available first. A good grounding foundation that you can start sticking weirder stuff onto without becoming lost. And in a game where you need to REALLY UNDERSTAND what the AI's reaction is going to be to something, I want the base stuff to be as familiar as possible, in as many places as possible. How else can I meaningfully tinker?

# ? Apr 27, 2015 06:10

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

Demiurge4 posted:

I'm kind of digging the Minotaur ideas they have because I don't think I've ever seen Minotaur society done in any medium before.

WoW?

The derail of the "sexy races" in that thread really was kinda awkward. You just know if it had continued they'd have pulled out their furry art.

Iunnrais posted:

I might be odd in this, but I actually hope minotaurs win, because I want the cliche stuff to be available first. A good grounding foundation that you can start sticking weirder stuff onto without becoming lost. And in a game where you need to REALLY UNDERSTAND what the AI's reaction is going to be to something, I want the base stuff to be as familiar as possible, in as many places as possible. How else can I meaningfully tinker?

I know where you are coming from, but I am pretty sure there'll be another race vote before the final release, and considering those races aren't implemented in the Beta right away anyway, it's kind of moot. I'd love to see their design document though.

quote:

quote:
extraordinary wrote:
I think you answered a similar one once. If two identical heroes/rulers, same stats, traits, everything, get the same event, do they always react the same way to it or did you add a slight bit of randomness, say a +/- 1 to courage with a chance modifier to it?

They would take exactly the same decision.

Okay, I am now a lot more confident in them being able to do the AI.

extraordinary fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Apr 27, 2015

# ? Apr 27, 2015 06:11

Sekenr: Dec 12, 2013

I really like the concept but as many said the map is ugly. Why not make it more stylized? Look for example at the map from Solium Infernum - a hex based game set in hell. I really liked the style, bleakness of hell, egomania of demons who see themselves as red and all their opponents as same black color. Beautiful pieces for the hell legions.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 08:01

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

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Really? To me Solium looks a bit flat, but I don't think the current maps look that bad, surely?

# ? Apr 27, 2015 08:39

Sekenr: Dec 12, 2013

Josef bugman posted:

Really? To me Solium looks a bit flat, but I don't think the current maps look that bad, surely?

Well, my biggest problem is lack of some sort of distinct style. I guess I want everything to look a little more "eldritchy" but everything is generic as gently caress.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 08:47

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

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Sekenr posted:

Well, my biggest problem is lack of some sort of distinct style. I guess I want everything to look a little more "eldritchy" but everything is generic as gently caress.

Well it wouldn't surprise me, given that the game itself seems to be basically a mod kit at this point, if you could design your own.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 08:51

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

New update:

Josh posted:

Not Our Best Week

This month continues to be a slog, even the relatively modest goals we set for this weekend were missed. Still, progress is made - and the game continues to just look better and better. We found time to work on the Military Screens and they're turning out well and we put out an order to an artist for some of our heraldry GUI objects and frames which will flesh out both the military and political gui screens. That's good news because things will start looking even better, but it's also a depressing reminder of how far behind we are as I had originally scheduled these updates to occur after the Beta had launched.

We did NOT release the Mod Tools, lacking the time to fix some issues found we'll be releasing them once we've fixed them. We do have the two remaining videos to release, and we're preparing a video on Military Combat which has been often requested.

In summary, a depressing week - still, nothing restores cheer like a release so we are going to keep working full steam to fix those issues and release the mod tools.

Enough Excuses, show me something

Modding Tutorial #2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VARmgV8uEzs

There's a lot to be said about the military system and the glimpses you've seen of the back-end will help us explain how the system works in the upcoming video. We designed it to be a complex but easy to use (isn't that what everyone says) system that rewards long term strategic planning and interacts well with the other elements of the game.

Here's a details view of a rather straightforward political quest - the circular icon is the same you would see on the map representing the quest, the number beneath it is the current Threat (which determines if Heroes will come to perform the quest). The two tags beneath the description help the AI figure out which skillsets will be most useful, and the icons beneath it what desires are met by this Quest. The current dangers are listed at the bottom, and adding to this list is your most "passive" method of disrupting a questing hero, and you can see the target of the quest to the right. Of note is that not all quests will have targets, but ones that do you can often help that individual to strengthen the quest against the heroes.

The quest succeeds if the Heroes overcome all of the dangers, which are generated based on the difficulty of the quest, the danger of the POI (Security for a City), and the strength of the Target. You can see this GUI page isn't quite finished - we need some markers for Success/Failure and better structure in the middle but we're leaving that until after Beta.

Sorry for the brief update, as always you can ask questions here or in the Ask Us Anything thread - but we'll be trying to work as heads down as possible on the mod release.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 08:59

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

Maybe the game will be faster on gog if you guys vote here.
http://www.gog.com/wishlist/games/that_which_sleeps?pp=cb4e5208b4cd87268b208e49452ed6e89a68e0b8

# ? Apr 27, 2015 11:55

zedprime: Jun 9, 2007; yospos

Sekenr posted:

Well, my biggest problem is lack of some sort of distinct style. I guess I want everything to look a little more "eldritchy" but everything is generic as gently caress.

I'd hold off judgments on eldritchy until we get a look at some end game shots, its been mentioned the ravens could be turned to wraiths and a big thrust of the kick starter cash was visual widgets like that. We also haven't seen any of the practical effects of the terraformers like Inatha, or Moloch (or Seraph? Seems like she should have something but its less explicit than the other two)

The new assets are good looking enough for a mapgame and I'm not sure what more they could shoehorn in to make it extra eldritchy. Or even if they should: the entire strength of the outsider trope is they are present in normal, mundane worlds. A lot of what made Eternal Darkness effective was an entirely mundane level design, until it wasn't.

# ? Apr 27, 2015 13:37

Senso: Nov 4, 2005; Always working

Normal Adult Human posted:

crazy people: here's the loading screen that was shown for half a second.

the eldritch presence that touched it's mind.

# ? Apr 30, 2015 16:10

extraordinary: Jun 9, 2011

Sooo Josh said he's finishing up the fixes and is going to release the tools.
Will be interesting.

# ? Apr 30, 2015 22:02

Demiurge4: Aug 10, 2011

extraordinary posted:

Sooo Josh said he's finishing up the fixes and is going to release the tools.
Will be interesting.

He's leaving out the map creator component for now though since it's not ready. He's just releasing because some of the regulars are getting annoyed with delays. Still it should be interesting to play around with the components behind it.

# ? Apr 30, 2015 22:12

LotsBread: Jan 4, 2013

Senso posted:

the eldritch presence that touched it's mind.

Is the apostrophe?

# ? May 1, 2015 10:11

Normal Adult Human: Feb 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

On hero/army turn management

Josh posted:

Heroes handle it "poorly" but we designed the game to account for that so I think they give a good illusion of handling time properly. Armies on the other hand make constant estimates based on time to travel, chance to hold off an enemy, time for recruitment, and other factors. The commander AI "talks" back and forth and makes decisions based on the responses - meaning that if a Commander is told to defend this section of the Kingdom that AI is saying "I need more reinforcements/I'm fine/I can hold for 10 turns" and this is based on its military skill (a terrible general may be reporting 'Everything's fine!' even as the orcs armies are flanking him) - this information is checked against expectations by the Head of the Commander AI structure to see if that should be true or if the Commander is underperforming.

The heroes on the other hand are a lot dumber when it comes to time, but this is meant to represent their limited knowledge and "rumors" of the situation. They get the Quest level information and adjust the values based on their personality but the timing is VERY imprecise, though the larger the action the more accurate it will be. You will often see heroes arriving after a Quest is finished, but keep in mind that this isn't a "bad" thing for them as they can then gather clues and start to piece together your strategy.

As for modding, you'll set a Complexity which stands as the value for the Quest system.

On desperation/AI cheating:

Josh posted:

This RECENTLY(Jan/Feb) changed - it was originally a hard-coded series of events that would build up the necessary impulse to take desperate actions but we've replaced it with the "Desperation" mechanic which is much more satisfactory (and manipulative). Now instead of pass/fail "learning what is going on" you may have Sages who have yet to figure out what exactly needs to be done starting to fall on truly desperate means like summoning up devils or torturing people they suspect of being in line with evil. Much more fun.

On Limos:

josh posted:

It is no longer in the game as such. Instead Limos' mechanics contain the necessary abilities to "negate life" including the ability to manipulate the souls of the dead and to draw life from the world through the Veins of Limos (ley lines). Still, even with these calamities occuring you won't necessary have the world allying against you - they need to "believe" it is Limos AND that their best hope lies with The Alliance, otherwise they will either try to weather the storm or seek alternate methods to cope. As part of the Limos rework we added some "countermeasures" that can be enacted which are a) bad for you because they lessen the impact of your effects but b) good for you as they aren't universally applicable and promote discord.

I think I've responded to this type of question before with the idea of "how do you face the end of the world" - you may have Kings who simply decide to go out with a Masque of the Red Death-esque party, others who will close their borders and try to survive, and then some who will band together and try to actually do something even if it "weakens" them politically. Making sure that the leaders of the world are incompetent or selfish is a great way to win the game.

josh posted:

Positive feedback loop as his powers created undead which even in dying would kill people which would then produce more undead/power his abilties which would then.... etc etc... and his other tree (at the time but this is no longer the case) was all plagues and horrors which even when defeated produced enough death to then give rise to more undead. So many undead - it was almost impossible to lose.

We took away his "end of days" abilities, toned down the "power based on death in the world", and made certain skills even more of a hard counter to undead.

# ? May 2, 2015 20:50

Comrade Merf: Jun 2, 2011

This is honestly looking like the kind of game I was hoping dominions would have been. I love Dominions but it made me feel more like a fantasy accountant rather than a pretender God fighting for ruler-ship of the world. If you buy the Beta acess on their website ca you play it now or is the beta not out yet?

# ? May 2, 2015 21:09

Josef bugman: Nov 17, 2011; Pictured: Poster prepares to celebrate Holy Communion (probablY)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund

I wish they could just bring out more videos. As much as I love these guys I just want to see and/or play the drat game.

# ? May 2, 2015 21:49

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 17:27

Theswarms: Dec 20, 2005

extraordinary posted:

Belial is repeatedly cited as the newb god because you can recover more easily.

And those are only the starting agent slots, I think they get more with more power.

The thing I am wondering though. They got 25 agents or something in the game.
Any action by an agent aquires fame. The more fame the more heroes will hunt him. So, barring the agents really hard to get...what if you run out of them? I'd rather have some of them be a bit more generic.

You can recruit corrupted heroes as agents.

I don't know if you can recruit multiple peddlers or anything like that though.

# ? May 3, 2015 14:24

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