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Johnny Aztec posted:Oh goddamnit. I keep skipping over Sandman panels because I'm still working my way through the tradebacks, and you lay that on me! Dude I spoilered it 
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Apr 19, 2015 02:04
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Actual boobs-and-butt pose, that is dedication to a role.
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Apr 19, 2015 02:11
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This has to be intentional.
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Apr 19, 2015 03:03
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Of course it is, and so was this: How could he not have heard about the Hawkeye Initiative
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Apr 19, 2015 06:51
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Stop posting good asses in the thread for bad asses!
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Apr 19, 2015 07:15
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Flesh Forge posted:Of course it is, and so was this: I knew he'd heard of it, I didn't know he'd gotten around to actively posing for it.
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Apr 19, 2015 08:03
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Flesh Forge posted:Dude I spoilered it This bit wasn't: AnonSpore posted:Ooh yeah I remember now. Flesh Forge posted:He's just about the only uber villain I can think of who gets rehabilitated and his conversion to being One Of The Good Guys is cool and makes sense. But as I said, it's not a big deal. Just motivation for picking up the rest of the tradebacks.
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Apr 19, 2015 08:45
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Just dropping this here from an otherwise not very great GBS thread but it has a strange synchronicity
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Apr 20, 2015 02:03
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This sequence from Top Ten #10 came up in the funny panels thread, but it deserves to go here. Synaesthesia is handling a trans-universal drug-related murderer, and Comissioner Ultima, head of the trans-universal police force and general god-like powerhouse, shows up for an inspection. I should point out at this point that Syn's only power is her mixed sensory perception.        "Break her £$%&ing neck, son." Says it all. DigitalRaven fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Apr 25, 2015 |
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Apr 25, 2015 17:18
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"No, sir, commissioner,sir. No, I don't think this is going to come to trial" Holy!
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Apr 26, 2015 03:43
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Top 10 is so good. I could post almost every page here.
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Apr 26, 2015 05:17
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Nipponophile posted:Top 10 is so good. I could post almost every page here.  It might actually be my favorite work by Moore. It helps that I'm a big sucker for all the cheesy references ads that they have in the background of the city.
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Apr 26, 2015 05:45
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Top 10 is really underrated and if it were like two books longer would honestly overtake Swamp Thing as my favorite Moore work. I honestly like it more than Watchmen.
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Apr 26, 2015 06:04
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DigitalRaven posted:This sequence from Top Ten #10 came up in the funny panels thread, but it deserves to go here. I also love Top 10 to death. I just wish there were a way I could have figured out she was singing the Ode to Joy before the second page.
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Apr 27, 2015 12:59
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prefect posted:I also love Top 10 to death. I just wish there were a way I could have figured out she was singing the Ode to Joy before the second page. Speaking of the subtle things in Top 10 that accounts for so much of its character, I think it's funny that Syn's powers work through puns. Ultima's perfume is likely called Eau de Joy
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Apr 27, 2015 16:53
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prefect posted:I also love Top 10 to death. I just wish there were a way I could have figured out she was singing the Ode to Joy before the second page. Using Schiller's actual lyrics would have done it, but perhaps Moore is allergic to using anyone's lyrics but his own Okay, apart from Threepenny Opera
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Apr 27, 2015 17:55
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GrandpaPants posted:Speaking of the subtle things in Top 10 that accounts for so much of its character, I think it's funny that Syn's powers work through puns. I would never have noticed this, thanks.
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Apr 27, 2015 20:01
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Also from Top Ten. Atoman has been determined to be part of a pedophile ring, and Joe Pi, the robot, is sharper and more human than he appears.   
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Apr 28, 2015 01:39
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I'm reading about Top 10 and having trouble seeing the appeal. The Justice League analogues are pedophiles- how witty! It sounds like an extended in-joke with Moore's typical love of the grim and quirkily mentally dysfunctional taken to excess.
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Apr 28, 2015 01:48
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So Top Ten is like the Shield? A series about horribly corrupt cops who do what they please? I hope they at least get their just desserts eventually.
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Apr 28, 2015 01:54
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Discendo Vox posted:I'm reading about Top 10 and having trouble seeing the appeal. The Justice League analogues are pedophiles- how witty! It sounds like an extended in-joke with Moore's typical love of the grim and quirkily mentally dysfunctional taken to excess. "Have you ever heard of Asimov's laws of robotics?" "No" "Good" is a pretty great exchange.
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Apr 28, 2015 01:58
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CharlestheHammer posted:So Top Ten is like the Shield? Moore wanted to do a TV police drama that, while set in an absurdly hyperexaggerated superhero city, nonetheless hewed to real world rules and stayed true to human nature so no, of course they don't
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Apr 28, 2015 02:29
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CharlestheHammer posted:So Top Ten is like the Shield? What's your Reddit handle?
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Apr 28, 2015 02:44
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Flesh Forge posted:Not exactly: The Corinthian tracks Loki down, breaks his neck, and rips out his eyes and "eats" them with the mouths which are also his eyes which is gross, and Corinthian talks about how awesome it is to see through the eyes of a god and how Loki is immortal so having his neck broken is just going to suck PRETTY BAD, and then Thor and Odin come to collect Loki and put him back in his legendary prison where a woman drops snake venom from a bowl into his raw eye sockets and he can't even squirm around in agony any more because his neck is broken FOREVER, but while they're carrying him away Loki starts trying to tell Thor about how Loki hosed Thor's wife and Thor starts to get really mad and Loki's trying to goad Thor into killing him properly, but Odin is all like Na man Loki is a jerk and a liar, he is lying don't worry about it son and Thor is like Oh ok dad welp let's stuff his rear end back in the snake venom room!! Verrrry close. The woman is Loki's wife Sigyn. She's actually shielding Loki by catching the venom in the bowl. However, when the bowl is full she has to dump the poison off to the side, and in those moments drops from the snake hits Loki's eyes (or eye sockets now) and his thrashing around is what causes earthquakes, but the fact that it takes a while for the bowl to fill up is why earthquakes are rare. Also, Loki is bound in place by his son's intestines. Which is a long way to say that the Norse had some REALLY hosed up legends.
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Apr 28, 2015 02:51
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PJOmega posted:What's your Reddit handle? Honestly that part never sat well with me either, and I really don't think Moore intended it to be cool or badass either: on the following page Irma, who moments prior had been vaguely contemplating killing Atoman, was extremely skeeved out by what Joe had done. I always thought Moore was going to follow up on Joe's questionable behavior but nothing ever came of it. It really was a fun series apart from that, though.
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Apr 28, 2015 03:05
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minimalist posted:Moore wanted to do a TV police drama that, while set in an absurdly hyperexaggerated superhero city, nonetheless hewed to real world rules and stayed true to human nature Well that is kind of boring. Shame.
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Apr 28, 2015 03:06
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jng2058 posted:Verrrry close. The woman is Loki's wife Sigyn. She's actually shielding Loki by catching the venom in the bowl. However, when the bowl is full she has to dump the poison off to the side, and in those moments drops from the snake hits Loki's eyes (or eye sockets now) and his thrashing around is what causes earthquakes, but the fact that it takes a while for the bowl to fill up is why earthquakes are rare. Also, Loki is bound in place by his son's intestines. Ah oops, thanks, yeah I misremembered that because Loki curses at her while all that is going on (because Loki is a huge cock)
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Apr 28, 2015 06:15
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Discendo Vox posted:I'm reading about Top 10 and having trouble seeing the appeal. The Justice League analogues are pedophiles- how witty! It sounds like an extended in-joke with Moore's typical love of the grim and quirkily mentally dysfunctional taken to excess. Yeah this would have more weight if it was like, Ennis and not the dude who wrote "For the Man Who Has Everything" and "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow." Moore has earned the right to poo poo on JLA analogues if he wants, and for what it's worth he really doesn't use the gag as an opportunity to poo poo on the archetypes as much as posit what archetypes like the JLA and their sidekicks might look like if they existed in a world where everyone has their own unique superpower set of some kind. In a world where cosmic chessplayers can accidentally teleport and fuse with flying traffic and mice can form a miniature Marvel/DC universe with the cats hunting them in the corner of a random apartment in your average week the JLA aren't going to be saviors for humanity but powerful marketers with entertainment industry machines behind them, and this is all shown and not told via clumsy exposition. CharlestheHammer posted:So Top Ten is like the Shield? Y'all are seeing clips of pivotal moments and not seeing how the world is built. Aside from a nominal rookie cop the entire run is done in media res and the Joe Pi scene is the climax of 12 issues worth of build-up. You see the precinct slowly uncover the pedophile ring and are built to hate what's going on as much as the cops do. It's also a showcase that yeah Joe Pi is kind-of a scumbag, which is upsetting after we witness him as the victim of anti-robot racism and go out of his way to build a rapport with his partner who is still grieving over the death of her old partner. There are also loads of shorter plots and subplots that run throughout the issues, to say nothing of Gene Ha's incredibly detailed art and Moore's constant throwaway bits of dialogue about Neopolis culture that is a goddamn buffet for any superhero/geek connoisseur. Yeah there are the easy visual gags of the Question and Rorschach talking in a background, but there's so many and Moore manages to make a world where every character has superpowers seem cohesive in a way that elevates the relatively lowbrow nature of each individual gag by sheer quantity alone. It's far from perfect, but it also succeeds in a way that really wouldn't translate into any other medium visually (not without a buttfucking insane budget) or linguistically and that itself deserves respect. It also helps a lot if you realize that Moore was trying to launch Top 10 as an ongoing at ABC Comics in the early 00s to be picked up and shared with other writers, which is why he bailed without characters like Joe Pi getting any sort of comeuppance. The problem is that Moore and Ha were probably too successful in creating their world because frankly most other writers/artists can't match that level of sheer imagination and visual density, especially after Moore capitalized on big ideas like multiple universes and the JLA so early. The Top 10 follow-up books were nowhere near as good and are justly forgotten, and so the end of "good" Top 10--shortly after the Joe Pi scene--is largely left hanging.
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Apr 28, 2015 06:57
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Whatever reservations you have about the premise of Top 10, it's very well executed. It's probably the most criminally underrated comic there is.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:05
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Top 10 is up they with Astro City to me as using comic book ideas and cliches in very cool ways.
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Apr 28, 2015 12:30
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mind the walrus posted:Y'all are seeing clips of pivotal moments and not seeing how the world is built. While he clearly talked the Superman analog into suicide, it's not like Joe has any sort of Jessie Custer voice powers or even enough computational power to be manipulative to a super-power degree. He's not John Constantine, he can't talk you into bleeding to death. He just got upset and phrased Supes-lite's options in the worst possible way. It's been a while since I've read it but I think Joe Pi has almost as bad of an anger problem as Smax, he just presents it much differently. I would say it's less that Joe Pi is a scumbag and more that he got caught up in the situation just like the human(ish) detectives. I don't remember him doing anything else legally questionable in the series. For that matter I don't think talking someone into suicide is illegal, even if you do it on purpose. While morally what he did is dubious at best, legally I think the worst that could happen is being reprimanded not for "poor performance" but not waiting for their actual negotiator(who does have a super-voice that forces compliance).
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Apr 28, 2015 15:35
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Speaking of the negotiator, Irma Geddon is also a great character. (The hurt officer is Girl One, Irma's partner) 
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Apr 28, 2015 15:48
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Dr. MonkeyThunder posted:For that matter I don't think talking someone into suicide is illegal, even if you do it on purpose. While morally what he did is dubious at best, legally I think the worst that could happen is being reprimanded not for "poor performance" but not waiting for their actual negotiator(who does have a super-voice that forces compliance). Related, a girl who talked her friend into killing himself has recently been charged with involuntary manslaughter. So I guess we're going to find out. Her role was much more involved, allegedly he had doubts and got out of the car he was gassing himself in, and she explicitly told him to get back in. So Joe probably played it close enough that it would be unlikely for anyone to decide to try to make charges stick.
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Apr 28, 2015 15:50
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Dr. MonkeyThunder posted:While he clearly talked the Superman analog into suicide, it's not like Joe has any sort of Jessie Custer voice powers or even enough computational power to be manipulative to a super-power degree. He's not John Constantine, he can't talk you into bleeding to death. He just got upset and phrased Supes-lite's options in the worst possible way. It's been a while since I've read it but I think Joe Pi has almost as bad of an anger problem as Smax, he just presents it much differently. I would say it's less that Joe Pi is a scumbag and more that he got caught up in the situation just like the human(ish) detectives. I don't remember him doing anything else legally questionable in the series. I disagree with this. I am about to head out of my house, so I don't have time to go into a full break down of the legality of it at this stage, but simply put. His actions were almost unquestionably illegal and (depending on the laws of Century City) most probably murder. The big legal distinction between manslaughter and murder (the two crimes most associated or linked to any criminal charge where death is the result) is intent. (It is the Mens Rea.) As it applies to the example of Joe Pi when trying to decide his intention, you look at his action. The first action, he destroys the radio so there won't be a record of what goes on. This could be looked at that he knew what he was about to do was wrong (or at the very least illegal) and wanted to destroy the evidence before he begins his actions. Granted it could also be looked at that he was just doing that to protect his partner, but that would be up for a jury to decide. Then you come and break down what he says to Atomman. He calmly explains the likely outcomes to Atomman and breaks down his options, pointing to using his vault of sounds (Atomman's kryptonite). Going by the evidence, I think it is clear that a jury would be able to piece that Joe Pi phrased the conversation in such a way that Atomman would voluntarily kill himself rather than face justice. Taking this logical train to it's conclusion, Joe Pi wanted to cause Atomman's death. On that basis, he would fulfil the mental element of the crime. There are obviously further factors to go into in more detail, but looking at his intention, there is (in my mind) enough for a prime face case of murder. What I suppose draws my intention most to the scene is, it's common in fiction for the "hero" to kill the villain at the end of a story, because the notion is the villain is so powerful that they will evade justice. (It's a naive that ignores the complexities of the legal justice system and is there more to offer a pass for allowing heroes to kill people they don't like.) However here, they make it quite clear how Atomman IS going to face justice. He is going to face very real punishment for his crimes, which makes the decision to talk him into killing himself all the worse. It's sort of like how at the end of Lethal Weapon where Gary Buesy is arrested and cuffed. Only he's let out so Riggs can beat him to a pulp. It's pretty much police brutality.
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Apr 28, 2015 17:18
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The guy they were trying to arrest was holed up in a literally impregnable bunker. The only way to get him out was to talk him out, and that might not happen for years. Even if they did, there's no guarantee that comic book science couldn't somehow restore his powers down the line, kryptonite stand-in or no. Plus, they really wanted to kill him.
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Apr 28, 2015 17:50
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And as expressed in the comic, apparently the death penalty or a natural life sentence wasn't on the table... It's certainly very, very arguable that what Joe did wasn't right, but the point isn't to make him out to be an irredeemable scumlord who takes the law into his own hands. The point of the character is that despite looking like Mazinger, he's very human in his reactions and behaviour.
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Apr 28, 2015 17:53
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Gaz-L posted:And as expressed in the comic, apparently the death penalty or a natural life sentence wasn't on the table... It's certainly very, very arguable that what Joe did wasn't right, but the point isn't to make him out to be an irredeemable scumlord who takes the law into his own hands. The point of the character is that despite looking like Mazinger, he's very human in his reactions and behaviour. And if you don't think that that's a human reaction, just look at the facebook or news site comments every time a story about pedophiles pops up. It's not the right reaction, but it's a very human one.
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Apr 28, 2015 17:58
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Angrymog posted:And if you don't think that that's a human reaction, just look at the facebook or news site comments every time a story about pedophiles pops up. It's not the right reaction, but it's a very human one. It may be a human reaction, but it's not a good reaction for police officers.
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Apr 28, 2015 18:40
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The Question IRL posted:It may be a human reaction, but it's not a good reaction for police officers. Fair enough but I think the point is that the police officers are also human beings with human feelings (yes even the robot). When Irma's partner dies and she goes on the rampage it is because she is feeling human grief. When they really want the pedophile creep dude to pay for his crimes it is because they are feeling human anger. Maybe sometime in the future in the real world we can have a police force that is void of human emotions but what the comic book is trying to show is that these characters have human emotions that dictate their decisions.
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Apr 28, 2015 18:46
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Gaz-L posted:And as expressed in the comic, apparently the death penalty or a natural life sentence wasn't on the table... It's certainly very, very arguable that what Joe did wasn't right, but the point isn't to make him out to be an irredeemable scumlord who takes the law into his own hands. The point of the character is that despite looking like Mazinger, he's very human in his reactions and behaviour. The Question IRL posted:The first action, he destroys the radio so there won't be a record of what goes on. This could be looked at that he knew what he was about to do was wrong (or at the very least illegal) and wanted to destroy the evidence before he begins his actions.
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Apr 28, 2015 18:47
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