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Esser-Z posted:You forgot the orks. The orks LIKE EXISTING, and Gork and Mork are far more powerful than the gods. The end of Warhammer 40k is an Ork punching another Ork, forever. I had a idea once that Gork and Mork were just two very old orks - they never got killed, and got more and more powerful until they crossed some threshold of Waaargh power.
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Apr 30, 2015 14:06
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I'm pretty sure that all the poor treatment of the Orks can be traced to Andy Chambers leaving the company. He was pretty much the Ork guy on the development team and was responsible for most of the fun concepts that came up around them. He also liked writing articles in White Dwarf that were basically "our rules are kind of unwieldy and poo poo, so I home brew them for most of the games I play" and also for using a lot of third party miniatures and conversions in his armies. Edit: Reminder that the most iconic Ork warboss was completely the result of random rolls for a "how to build an ork arm" article in White Dwarf, and was basically Chambers having fun with it and trying to make sense of it all.
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Apr 30, 2015 14:12
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Grey Hunter posted:I had a idea once that Gork and Mork were just two very old orks - they never got killed, and got more and more powerful until they crossed some threshold of Waaargh power. I approve of this! On a similar note, I want orks to get a Titan that's just a really old, and thus really big, Ork.
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Apr 30, 2015 14:14
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adamantium|wang posted:alexandra kerensky I want more 'ham fluff stolen from Battletech, Space Marines are basically Clanners anyway.
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Apr 30, 2015 14:30
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Skinty McEdger posted:I'm pretty sure that all the poor treatment of the Orks can be traced to Andy Chambers leaving the company. He was pretty much the Ork guy on the development team and was responsible for most of the fun concepts that came up around them. Considering the Ork storyline and direction in the fluff this rings really true. I feel like I couldn't put names on anyone at GW these days. Though as a hobby company with the relatively smallish number of books they do personal enthusiasm must still play a major part In fluff.
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Apr 30, 2015 14:43
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I don't know where to post pictures of my D&D models the painting thread used to be called the painting & modelling thread but now its just painting 
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Apr 30, 2015 15:55
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Esser-Z posted:I approve of this! On a similar note, I want orks to get a Titan that's just a really old, and thus really big, Ork. A Titan sized cyber squig might fit the bill better.
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Apr 30, 2015 16:05
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Moola posted:I don't know where to post pictures of my D&D models Post them everywhere, SRM posts his stuff in like four threads every time he finishes a squad (so weekly).
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Apr 30, 2015 16:06
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Indolent Bastard posted:A Titan sized cyber squig might fit the bill better. This was one of my Stompa scratch built ideas from way back before the stompa kit was released. Never got around to it, but I did a concept sketch before deciding it was too much effort to be bothered with 
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Apr 30, 2015 16:08
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Kai Tave posted:This is what Mechwarrior: Dark Ages did and ehhhhhh it didn't really pan out so well actually. Like, not that it's impossible to go "woo smash the status quo!" and make it happen, but I don't think it's necessarily the winning move. I think a better approach would be to take a page from, say, Eberron where there's a default "now" (the cusp of M42) that it's always assumed to be, but instead of cramming more and more things into that limited timespan so you can try to have a metaplot cake and eat it to, you present multiple "possible futures" that could arise, all equally valid, and let people forge their own narratives out of that. So you could have "Chaos smashes the Imperium" or you could have "someone rediscovers an intact STC and woah poo poo the Imperium is on its second wind now" or all sorts of stuff that the fiction, scenario, and RPG writers could play with. 40K: Shards, in other words. Going back a page but I wanted to take a second look at this. You're right that a complete "smash the whole universe" approach to moving the story forwards isn't a great idea. A big problem with it is that after decades, "the story" encompasses too much; too many different characters, plot threads, little bits and pieces that are all important to someone. If you try and just advance everything, all at once, you're likely tasking just one or a small handful of authors to do something in just one or a small handful of books, and they just don't have the time, or the comprehensive knowledge of the universe, to address every thread in a way that does them justice. But! Battletech does a good job, generally, of the basic idea of moving the story forward. To be sure, Battletech genre fiction is just as bad as Warhammer genre fiction (and all other genre fiction). There have been plenty of mary-sue characters, plenty of places where the author tells the reader that so-and-so is a military genius while they do things that are militarily idiotic (because the author has no understanding of battle), poo poo like that. But generally, Battletech keeps the era going. And with each new era, the technology evolves as well. New mechs come out, for people to be excited about, while old mechs become obsolete. New weapons, new armor, new everything, gradually and in fits and starts. Sometimes Faction A has an edge, sometimes Faction B. Battle lines move across the galaxy, invasions are launched, and sometimes they fail and sometimes they succeed. The key thing here is that change is good. Stories have beginnings, middles, and ends; and in a good story setting, like the Imperium, or the Inner Sphere, creates a backdrop for many many stories to be told. Where Warhammer 40k falls down is that, because the date is not allowed to move forward, none of the stories that are yet to be concluded, can be concluded. Sure, you can go back and write more stories that happened "in the past," because the Imperium is so enormous. But there are all these big important characters in the "now" of Warhammer 40k, and their stories can't be concluded because the timeline isn't being allowed to move forward. For the health of the setting, those stories need to be finished. Not all at once in one big stupid explosion; just, allow the timeline to advance a decade, and then go and write some endings where they fit, and some middles where they're needed, and... this is maybe the most important part... some new beginnings. Both Warhammer and Warhammer 40k desperately needed new stories to be begun. New characters. Evolution of the situation. New plots, plots not entirely driven by reprisals of characters created 20 years ago butting heads for the seventh time. Beginnings, middles, and ends that affect the setting in a significant, but not universe-concluding way. That's not that hard, really. It's just how stories work. The Imperium of Man is written as a stagnant empire, one incapable of developing new technology because of blah blah etc. etc. OK. That's dumb, the idea that across millions of worlds, some so remote that the agents of the Imperium visit only once every few hundred years, worlds with billions of people on them, nobody remembers how to invent things, but whatever. That's not necessarily something that has to be true, forever. A renaissance could begin. Or the inquisition could fail. Or there could be a schism, with a new breakaway piece of the Imperium (one that isn't falling to chaos; it may even continue to revere the God Emperor) that decides, collectively, that inventing new things to make their lives better is an OK thing to do. Space Marine chapters could rise or fall. The most cherished chapters, like the Ultramarines, say, could have a change of leadership, or a significant event that sends them down a new path, or even be destroyed. There's hand-wringing about what the fans of a given faction would do, if their faction is ruined... but that doesn't mean you just stomp on those players and tell them their models are now worthless. If you do the story well, write a good story with a good ending, the players and fans will come along. Give them something to do with their models - a succession chapter to the defunct Ultramarines, some of whom still wear their own livery, but with new leadership and a new direction (and not nearly as goody two-shoes). A new strain of Tyranids, a mutation in a particular hivefleet caused by eating too many psychers or orks or who knows, that sparks a new behavior in them, sets them at odds with the rest of their kin. A new Eldar subfaction, perhaps long thought lost, or whatever, emerges, and for some reason, they're able to reproduce and grow as a group. Now the other Eldar are torn; these new guys may represent hope for the entire species, but their ways flirt too closely to the past that spawned Slannesh, what with they're willingness to have sex and make babies. OK maybe not that last one. But you get the idea. I'm just brainstorming here. But it's not hard to come up with new stories to tell. GW did it not that long ago, when they introduced the Tau. I don't like the Tau due to their aesthetics, but I do like the fact that there was a time when GW was willing to make significant changes to their setting that were more than just "Big Character Everyone Is Familiar With Fights Other Big Character Everyone Knows, Plus Billions Of Faceless Mooks Die." It's not impossible, it's not even that hard, it only requires a certain amount of courage, and reasonable amount of actual hard work, and some writers who aren't just hacks phoning in formulaic garbage and/or endlessly revisiting the loving Horus Heresy as if that's the only truly important and significant story we can ever tell about Warhammer 40k, ever.
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Apr 30, 2015 16:47
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Phoon posted:I could see a divided imperium being interesting - the emperor dies for some really dumb reason like a capacitor failing, there's no immediate disaster as predicted and nobody is sure why, but as they no longer have the emperor to unite behind the chapters all fall out with each other. Each chapter holding a section of human space and running it in a completely different way. I remember an interview with one of the old designers where he said they kicked around the idea of 41K. The Emperor is dead and humanity is just a bunch of fiefdoms ruled by space marines. Thats about as far as it got. adamantium|wang posted:alexandra kerensky Grim Wolf Kerensky
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Apr 30, 2015 18:10
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 I think this is actually the worst model GW have ever made
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Apr 30, 2015 18:23
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those robots are that rarest of beasts, something that most of the 40k thread hates but that I think is pretty okay
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Apr 30, 2015 18:24
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Moola posted:
They look like chunky action figures
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Apr 30, 2015 18:26
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They look like dollar store action figures
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Apr 30, 2015 18:26
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They look like they were modelled by a 10 year old dude
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Apr 30, 2015 18:27
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Moola posted:They look like they were modelled by a 10 year old dude mentally 10 year old warham
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Apr 30, 2015 18:27
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They look like this guy off that Pixar movie-
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Apr 30, 2015 18:36
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Hixson posted:They look like this guy off that Pixar movie- Sounds like a good conversion idea!
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Apr 30, 2015 19:15
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If there was ever a model that needed the goggly eye treatment.
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Apr 30, 2015 19:40
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You can save that model with some conversions. You cannot save the centurion models no matter what you do. They are still the worst GW model 
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Apr 30, 2015 19:43
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BULBASAUR posted:You can save that model with some conversions. Please dont do this
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Apr 30, 2015 20:21
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It looks like a retro-scifi model. I dunno I kinda like it, especially as something from a lost age. Back when robots worked and did cool poo poo.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:23
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Moola posted:the worst model GW have ever made Hahaha noooooo. No no no. Remember the most evilest badass skeledude ever? Nagash?  e. Or, you can look at some of Citadel's oldest poo poo. Like this: http://www.solegends.com/citf/moltenmagic/wd12moltenmagic.htm  FS2 - Magic Mouth Doorway, FS10 Naked Girl roasting on Spit over Brazier, FS5 Old Wizard on Throne reading Book on Lectern, FF16 Giant Troll attacking with Spiked Club, FF4 Crabman FF28 Orc on Giant Tusker, FF34 Chimera, FF14 Cyclops, FF9 Carbuncle, FF31 Satanic Angel, FF10 Devil Dog FF30 Zombie, FF19 Werewolf, FF20 Goblin with Sword, FS12 Sarcophagus, FS11 Beggar on Crutches, FA4 Sneak Thief with Dagger None of those are very good, but a lot of old minis from back in the day, including Citadel stuff, were basically misshapen blobs of lead that sort of maybe looked like... something. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 20:28
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That model is actually awesome though because the sculptor was taking the piss
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Apr 30, 2015 20:29
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I want to see it redone as a really over the top fashion designer/model.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:30
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everythingWasBees posted:It looks like a retro-scifi model. I dunno I kinda like it, especially as something from a lost age. Back when robots worked and did cool poo poo. I'm with you. I think those are some of the neatest looking mecha I've seen come out of GW. Disclaimer: I dislike the general Imperium aesthetic, but like the Tau aesthetic, so I may have bad taste.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:32
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Moola posted:That model is actually awesome though because the sculptor was taking the piss I am pretty sure that is just the cover story he developed to try and explain how he made something that looked like poo poo, though. Also the Kruellagh the Vile miniature was pretty terrible. I'm assuming that we're exempting stuff from the early days like the tragic potato dreadnought.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:32
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BULBASAUR posted:You can save that model with some conversions. I unironically love centurions.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:33
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Seriously if you're interested in vintage miniatures, spend some time clicking around here: http://www.collecting-citadel-miniatures.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page and here: http://www.solegends.com/citadel/index.htm and for non-Citadel, this site is amazing: http://www.miniatures-workshop.com/lostminiswiki/index.php?title=Main_Page Loads of cool old poo poo to be found, and also horrible old poo poo best forgotten.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:34
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Moola posted:Please dont do this 
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Apr 30, 2015 20:35
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An Angry Bug posted:I unironically love centurions. I agree, Michelin Tires are an ok brand.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:37
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Moola posted:
This FW hits the same notes while being 1000000x better: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/The_Horus_Heresy/Mechanicum/Mechanicum_Heavy_Support/THANATAR_SIEGE-AUTOMATA.html Those look like high school stage production versions of the above model.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:40
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Magic Mouth Doorway needs a re-release.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:42
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Something something magic mouth doorway sweet release wink wink nawmean baby
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Apr 30, 2015 20:42
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I've seen people joke about using gundams before but you could legit get a more robot-y model by using a 1/144 Zaku. It figures people start noticing GWs models being bad when they try to edge into the robot market.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:44
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Leave off the front plates and they look a hell of a lot better. Plus, y'know, don't paint them as a massive unbroken slab of overly bright yellow.
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Apr 30, 2015 20:50
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I like the robots but I like them in the same way I like goofy ugly retro models from various companies, which means they are not actually good models.
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Apr 30, 2015 21:11
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Don't forget the  Also gonna crosspost these from the other good Warhams thread What it should've looked like:  Bonus  
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Apr 30, 2015 21:25
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Kaiju Cage Match posted:
The center looks like play-dough. Superior version: 
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Apr 30, 2015 21:58
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