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Geriatric Pirate posted:Why are you attributing the Danish McWage to their unions instead of market conditions? That same article I linked, which I guess you didn't read or whatever posted:Danish law does not require fast-food companies or their franchisees to adhere to the wages required by the agreement with the 3F union. But they do, because employees and unions pledge in exchange not to engage in strikes, demonstrations or boycotts. “What employers get is peace,” said Peter Lykke Nielsen, the 3F union’s chief negotiator with McDonald’s.
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May 10, 2015 19:35
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That doesn't really answer the question. Zeitgueist posted:I don't support keeping wages unlivably low so I'm not sure why you are asking me that? I posted an article showing that the minimum wage hurt the purchasing power of poor people, you support the minimum wage, hence clearly you hate poor people, or at the very least want them to be poorer.
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May 10, 2015 19:42
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quote:Overall, the extra costs attributable to higher prices equaled 0.63% of the nondurable goods purchased by the poorest fifth of families and 0.52% of the goods purchased by the top fifth—with the percentage falling as the income level rose. Oh no 3/4 quarters of one percent increase in costs! However will the poor survive this dramatic increase in prices while having their before tax pay doubled?!?!?
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May 10, 2015 19:48
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Geriatric Pirate posted:That doesn't really answer the question. Yes it does
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May 10, 2015 19:49
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GP you should just stop now, you're approaching jrodfeld levels of sheer stupidity and I don't think the universe can handle two of you.
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May 10, 2015 19:51
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Oh no 3/4 quarters of one percent increase in costs! However will the poor survive this dramatic increase in prices while having their before tax pay doubled?!?!? Hmm, I thought poor people were really struggling to get by (at least that's what I read here every day), but I guess that's not the case and price increases aren't a big deal to them. As long as a small portion of them, along with a bunch of teenagers from high income families, see an increase in salaries, right? Or in other words, why do you hate poor people so much? Does seeing poor people have their living costs rise make you feel superior to them? What's in it for you?
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May 10, 2015 19:56
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Geriatric Pirate posted:I posted an article showing that the minimum wage hurt the purchasing power of poor people, you support the minimum wage, hence clearly you hate poor people, or at the very least want them to be poorer. Even if your article was 100% definitive the conclusion doesn't follow. You are bad at this. Geriatric Pirate posted:Hmm, I thought poor people were really struggling to get by (at least that's what I read here every day), but I guess that's not the case and price increases aren't a big deal to them. As long as a small portion of them, along with a bunch of teenagers from high income families, see an increase in salaries, right? Why do you love businesses so much? Why don't you marry them? 
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May 10, 2015 19:57
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Zeitgueist posted:Even if your article was 100% definitive the conclusion doesn't follow. I don't know, I think you just like seeing poor people suffer. Why else would you support a policy that objectively makes most poor people worse off?
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May 10, 2015 19:59
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So you support the living wage strikes in the US right? Because if they succeed then even according to your weird just-world fallacy, that means the wages they demanded were justified by market fundamentals.
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May 10, 2015 20:02
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VitalSigns posted:So you support the living wage strikes in the US right? Because if they succeed then even according to your weird just-world fallacy, that means the wages they demanded were justified by market fundamentals. But they didn't succeed
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May 10, 2015 20:04
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Geriatric Pirate posted:But they didn't succeed No, they didn't, but market fundamentals magically provided a higher wage at exactly the same time, by sheer happy coincidence. Hooray! Washington Post posted:McDonald's will raise its minimum wage to an average of $9.90 by July 1, up from $9.01, in advance of a planned wave of strikes on April 15 by fast-food workers demanding better pay and working conditions. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/01/following-the-crowd-mcdonalds-pledges-to-raise-wages/ Praise the all-knowing all-benevolent market!
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May 10, 2015 20:08
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VitalSigns posted:No, they didn't, but market fundamentals magically provided a higher wage at exactly the same time, by sheer happy coincidence. Hooray! This slightly above inflation wage increase that's roughly in line previous increases in salary clearly shows how successful the $15 per hour campaign has been. Thank god for unions. 
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May 10, 2015 20:14
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Turns out, market fundamentals always justify a wage increase right when a strike is about to succeed or right when the minimum wage is raised, or justify better safety measures right when a labor safety law is passed. I fear for the day when one of those things happens without the wonderful accompanying free market doing it just seconds before, always saving us from the dire predictions of neoliberals, which would be unwaveringly correct if not for the astonishing intervention of luck each and every time.
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May 10, 2015 20:16
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If we pay people 0 per hour it follows that prices for staple items will plummet thereby making their lives better
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May 10, 2015 20:20
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I wish I got paid less. Why does my employer express his hatred for me by giving me this inflationary wage
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May 10, 2015 20:21
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Yeah, I mean clearly the reason McDonald's, Wal-Mart and Target raised wages like they've done semi-regularly since they were founded was because of this a campaign for better fast food wages that's been going on for about a year.
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May 10, 2015 20:22
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If employers had no labor wages just imagine how much they could lower prices.
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May 10, 2015 20:22
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euphronius posted:If we pay people 0 per hour it follows that prices for staple items will plummet thereby making their lives better Oh look, another lefty who hates poor people and loves inequality. Sure, let's raise wages for a random group of people who are just as likely to come from a household in the top 20% of the population as the bottom 20% at the expense of non-working households in the bottom 5%. Great idea, this will definitely lower inequality.
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May 10, 2015 20:24
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I don't think nonworking households care about prices, since it takes income to buy things.
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May 10, 2015 20:25
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Who cares about the non-working poor? Why won't you think about the middle class teenagers who will benefit from a higher minimum wage?
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May 10, 2015 20:25
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VitalSigns posted:I don't think nonworking households care about prices
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May 10, 2015 20:25
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Geriatric Pirate posted:Oh look, another lefty who hates poor people and loves inequality. It's amazing how income distributions of the top 20% and bottom 20% of earners are the same
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May 10, 2015 20:26
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Amazingly, people with zero money are unable to buy things no matter what the price. Sure would be nice if they could earn a living wage when they get a job though
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May 10, 2015 20:28
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People on ssdi and tanf still work. You have to work wrt to tanf. Ssdi people can earn around 1000 a month.
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May 10, 2015 20:28
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You know what would help the all-important zero-income demographic? The cost savings of bringing back slavery.
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May 10, 2015 20:29
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VitalSigns posted:Amazingly, people with zero money are unable to buy things no matter what the price. Well it's a good thing you're supporting policies that make it even harder for them to live then! At least they can be reassured by the fact that if they ever overcome their lifelong disability, there's a higher wage waiting for them. Shame about the lower standard of living now, but VitalSigns is giving them HOPE!
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May 10, 2015 20:30
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VitalSigns posted:You know what would help the all-important zero-income demographic? The cost savings of bringing back slavery. Heheheee poor people... they don't exist, lol
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May 10, 2015 20:31
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Oh you're talking about SSDI. Have you heard of this thing called a Cost-Of-Living-Adjustment? It increases SSDI benefits based on the prices of consumer goods so they are insulated from that.
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May 10, 2015 20:32
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lol unemployed people, disabled people and retired people - check out this right winger pretending they exist
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May 10, 2015 20:32
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I support legislation where poor people must pay small businesses so that prices may be lowered thereby increase the income of poor people.
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May 10, 2015 20:32
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Roughly 45% of Americans are out of the workforce for whatever reason, but they don't actually exist or care about living costs What we should really concentrate on is the 5% of the workforce who make minimum wage. Those teenagers are the future. - A left winger who hates the poor
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May 10, 2015 20:34
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Retired people and unemployed people both have cost of living increases built into their revenue IHTH
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May 10, 2015 20:34
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Geriatric Pirate posted:lol unemployed people, disabled people and retired people - check out this right winger pretending they exist I know you're not from America, and you get off calling the American poor lazy and sneer at them for looking for handouts, guy who has nuzzled at the warm full breast of Scandinavian social democracy all his life and thinks he's never gotten handouts. But you should look up COLA. We apply it to things like social security. And unemployment benefits are based on your wage, so higher wages help that.
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May 10, 2015 20:35
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I think way more than 5% of the work force makes less than 15 an hour GP
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May 10, 2015 20:35
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Dude, I just watched Vital Signs explain to asdf32 the difference between exponential and linear functions. This came a day two days after failing to correctly calculate a percentage, and a few days after claiming that $15 is closer to $100 than it is to $7.50. asdf32, is everything okay? I'm serious, this is a troubling trend
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May 10, 2015 20:36
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VitalSigns posted:I know you're not from America, and you get off calling the American poor lazy and sneer at them for looking for handouts, guy who has nuzzled at the warm full breast of Scandinavian social democracy all his life and thinks he's never gotten handouts. All 200 million Americans not currently working will be thrilled to hear about COLA
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May 10, 2015 20:37
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You mean dependents on wage earners??? Yes they would love cola
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May 10, 2015 20:38
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GP have you addressed the fact that the central banks policy is way more inflationary than any minimum wage increase.
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May 10, 2015 20:39
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The fact that the Scandinavian countries can still produce people like GP is pretty good argument against making the U.S. more like them tbh.
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May 10, 2015 20:41
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Geriatric Pirate posted:All 200 million Americans not currently working will be thrilled to hear about COLA Are you now lamenting that we banned child labor a century ago? "Get that infant off the tit, if you don't have 325 million people working, America has failed!"
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May 10, 2015 20:41
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