Auspol May: First Dog on the Moon Edition

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Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

I'm actually surprised the average income is that high.

# ? May 11, 2015 00:59

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 08:25

starkebn: May 18, 2004; "Oooh, got a little too serious. You okay there, little buddy?"

Amoeba102 posted:

I'm actually surprised the average income is that high.

I doubt they remove the top and bottom few percent to take care of outliers. The top 2% potentially skew the results more than the bottom is my guess. Also not sure if people on welfare are included (they probably are)

# ? May 11, 2015 01:06

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

I suppose we need the median.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:10

Mr Chips: Jun 27, 2007; Whose arse do I have to blow smoke up to get rid of this baby?

Amoeba102 posted:

I'm actually surprised the average income is that high.

There are a whole bunch of income measures, so you can select what you want based on how you're trying to spin things. There's the average full time income, the average income for all workers, and these averages are distorted by a small number of very high income earners. Then there's the median of both groups as well, or you can switch over to 'household' income, which can be used to hide all manner of crap. The ABS seem to kepp changing the way they report these data, so it's a bit of a wonk-ish job to sort through them all to get any sort of complete/balanced picture.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:12

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Lots of those figures were the average full-time worker, so it obviously excludes a bunch of people. Matt Cowgill did a good breakdown of the various figures in 2013.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:12

KennyTheFish: Jan 13, 2004

starkebn posted:

ahahahahaaaaa

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/really-mr-abbott-185k-not-especially-high-20150510-ggyeuh.html

the figures in the last paragraph are the best

*cuts own throat*

So even if we accept Tony's claim that a couple earning $30K or ~15% above the average income for a 2 income household is "not especially high", Why the gently caress do we let them have a transfer payment? Cool, Subsidised childcare, Like the idea. How about we set the cuttof at 95% of Median income.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:20

open24hours: Jan 7, 2001

That's how you buy votes.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:23

fiery_valkyrie: Mar 26, 2003; I'm proud of you, Bender. Sure, you lost. You lost bad. But the important thing is I beat up someone who hurt my feelings in high school.

Reading some of the budget news this morning and I did idly wonder how Tony Abbott went from his "signature" PPL scheme to trying to cut the money available to to women for PPL without his head exploding from the cognitive dissonance.

quote:

Rolling on from the riff about Hockey�s performance and the changing messages in the last post, here�s changing messages, a case study. It�s worth posting this exchange in full.

How to roll from the notion that Paid Parental Leave is a �signature� policy of the prime minister to being a helpful budget savings measure. Rooster to feather duster.

This is the ABC�s AM host Michael Brissenden and Mathias Cormann.

Q: Okay, let�s move on to some other measures. The paid parental leave changes that were announced by the treasurer yesterday, the government scheme that is in place was specifically designed to complement workplace schemes, not to replace them, to make sure that new parents spent the recommended 26 weeks with their baby. Now this change will mean, presumably, that women primarily will spend less time with their child and get less money, won�t they?

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well this is a fairness measure. Most women can only access one paid parental leave scheme and women, for example across the federal public sector, can get both paid parental leave at their replacement wage, their full replacement wage, and then also access the legislated scheme provided by the government to everyone. Now we don�t think that�s fair, we think that women should be able to access one paid parental leave scheme. It�s a matter of choice for them whether they access the government scheme or the scheme that they have access through otherwise through their employer.

Q: Nevertheless the point remains it was specifically designed to complement the work place scheme.

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well that is not the way we see it. The way we see it is it�s an equity and fairness measure, it�s an integrity measure. It�s a matter of making sure that the opportunity available to all women is the same.

Q: You�ve got Kate Carnell from the business council now saying it�s hard to see why employers would continue to pay people if it meant the government stopped paying and they were simply footing the bill for the government.

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well the truth is that many employers have paid a very generous paid parental leave schemes before the government came into this space and, you know, I can�t see why that would change. And the truth is that many of these private or public sector paid parental leave arrangements, the full replacement wages I�ve mentioned, is actually much more generous that what is on the table from the public sector. What we�re saying is that if you are accessing a more generous paid parental leave scheme elsewhere, we don�t believe it�s fair that you also access the taxpayer funded scheme on top of that.

Q: Within a year this government has gone from a rolled gold crucial paid parental leave scheme that would have given primary carers six months wage replacement and super, to now proposing something worse than what we already have for thousands of women. How did you get to this point?

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well it�s a fairness question; I mean obviously we�ve made an announcement earlier this year that we wouldn�t be proceeding with the paid parental leave scheme�

Q: Was it fair a year ago or not?

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well it�s very clear, it�s not fair for some women to be able to get access to a full replacement wage and on top of that a taxpayer funded paid parental leave scheme, whereas other women only get access to the taxpayer funded paid parental leave scheme. If you get access already to a very generous paid parental leave scheme, there is no reason why you should be able to double dip - and that is the argument we make.

Q: Nevertheless, you do concede that you�ve gone from a rolled gold paid parental leave scheme to this situation now where some women are going to get less?

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well what I�m conceding is we�re making sure that the taxpayer funded support that is provided for paid parental leave arrangements is properly targeted to those women who need it and not those women who are already getting very generous paid parental leave arrangements through their workforce.

Q: Isn�t this also about trust? About what the government tells you they�re going to deliver and what actually they end up delivering?

MATHIAS CORMANN:

Well you are a commentator, so I leave the commentary to you.

Also this:

quote:

Well the truth is that many employers have paid a very generous paid parental leave schemes before the government came into this space and, you know

is total crap. There are not that many employers who offer PPL. I've been pushing my company for years to provide a top up scheme so women can have 26 weeks at full pay, instead of the goverment issed 18 weeks at minimum wage and it's got no buy-in from senior management at all. They just see it as an additional payroll expense with no benefits, even though more than 50% of the women in my company who have a baby don't end up coming back.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:23

starkebn: May 18, 2004; "Oooh, got a little too serious. You okay there, little buddy?"

Has it generally worked how they're portraying things? It seems to me they're saying up to now some people would get a work payout of their wage rate, and then they would get a government payout _at the same time_?

I thought it was more like the employer would pay the extra above the government rate to get you up to your wage rate, or you would get the government payment for X amount of time and they would pay you after that stopped.

# ? May 11, 2015 01:53

fiery_valkyrie: Mar 26, 2003; I'm proud of you, Bender. Sure, you lost. You lost bad. But the important thing is I beat up someone who hurt my feelings in high school.

starkebn posted:

Has it generally worked how they're portraying things? It seems to me they're saying up to now some people would get a work payout of their wage rate, and then they would get a government payout _at the same time_?

I thought it was more like the employer would pay the extra above the government rate to get you up to your wage rate, or you would get the government payment for X amount of time and they would pay you after that stopped.

It's been up to the employer as to what they offer, which ranges from nothing to full replacement salary. The whole thing is completely stupid because now any employer who provided some form of "top up" PPL is likely going to stop since their employee's would miss out on the government payment all together if they kept going.

# ? May 11, 2015 02:15

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

Can't even explain or implement paid parental leave, Madama Speakah

*~muppet government~*

# ? May 11, 2015 02:16

Murodese: Mar 6, 2007; Think you've got what it takes?
We're looking for fine Men & Women to help Protect the Australian Way of Life.

Become part of the Legend. Defence Jobs.

How did I only just discover this: https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/...enefit_for_you_

# ? May 11, 2015 02:22

Mr Chips: Jun 27, 2007; Whose arse do I have to blow smoke up to get rid of this baby?

Murodese posted:

How did I only just discover this: https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/...enefit_for_you_

Have you found the list of qualifying occupations? The link on the pdf is dead

edit: this is it, apparently: http://studyassist.gov.au/sites/Stu...P%20Benefit.pdf

# ? May 11, 2015 02:31

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

Couldn't get a job in science anyway.

# ? May 11, 2015 02:34

Mr Chips: Jun 27, 2007; Whose arse do I have to blow smoke up to get rid of this baby?

Amoeba102 posted:

Couldn't get a job in science anyway.

It looks like you qualify if you've worked 1 week in that tax year in one of the qualifying occupations.

# ? May 11, 2015 02:36

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

Fulltime or part time?

# ? May 11, 2015 02:38

Mr Chips: Jun 27, 2007; Whose arse do I have to blow smoke up to get rid of this baby?

Doesn't specify.

http://studyassist.gov.au/sites/studyassist/payingbackmyloan/hecs-help-benefit/pages/hecshelpbenefit has fewer dead links and is better written than the ATO website.

edit: ahh gently caress, you have to have graduated from an undergrad course after 30/06/2008

# ? May 11, 2015 02:49

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

Well my graduation was in 2009, thanks to honours. I don't know who this helps that I know personally, because everyone that stayed in science got jobs overseas.

# ? May 11, 2015 02:56

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

The other thing is the compulsory payments part too. It's probably only apply to compulsory payments as a result from science income.

Edit: It does say one week. I should just do 1 week's employment so I guess I'm wrong.

# ? May 11, 2015 02:58

norp: Jan 20, 2004; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

let's invade New Zealand, they have oil

Amoeba102 posted:

Well my graduation was in 2009, thanks to honours. I don't know who this helps that I know personally, because everyone that stayed in science got jobs overseas.

The policy is literally to reduce the impact of this.

# ? May 11, 2015 03:07

tithin: Nov 14, 2003; [Grandmaster Tactician]

open24hours posted:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/scottish-politics/scottish-labour-inside-the-campaign-from-hell.125560928

The guy who hosed up Gillard's campaign also hosed up Scottish Labour's. How the hell does this idiot keep getting jobs?

A good read, thanks for the link.

Also, I may have been rubbing one out while reading it, from pure schadenfreude

# ? May 11, 2015 03:09

Murodese: Mar 6, 2007; Think you've got what it takes?
We're looking for fine Men & Women to help Protect the Australian Way of Life.

Become part of the Legend. Defence Jobs.

norp posted:

The policy is literally to reduce the impact of this.

It didn't work

# ? May 11, 2015 03:34

Smegmatron: Apr 23, 2003; I hate to advocate emptyquoting or shitposting to anyone, but they've always worked for me.

Murodese posted:

It didn't work

Most graduate positions make more financial sense overseas.

When you take bonuses and subsidies into account, I can get paid about the same as the top rate available to a NSW high school teacher in the first week on the job in Hong Kong. I'd have to work in NSW for about 8 years to get the same money.

The harder you work at uni here, the better off you are leaving the country when you finish.

# ? May 11, 2015 03:38

fiery_valkyrie: Mar 26, 2003; I'm proud of you, Bender. Sure, you lost. You lost bad. But the important thing is I beat up someone who hurt my feelings in high school.

Scott Morrison digs in the knife

quote:

I�m only just catching up with an unfortunate digression from Captain Chuckles on his favourite radio show earlier today. Captain Chuckles was portraying himself, modestly, as best supporting actor in a budget � or, for more manly types, a prop forward.

Scott Morrison made a comparison between the treasurer, Joe Hockey, and a footballer called Greg Bird. If, like me, you�ve never heard of Greg Bird � the context of the oops will become clear if you read this exchange.

Ray Hadley thought Morrison might have to re-phrase.

SCOTT MORRISON:

As politicians it�s our job to explain what we�re doing and that�s what I�ve been seeking to do over the last couple of weeks. It�s been a team effort. We�ve all been part of what we�re doing. It�s not unlike, you know, the way that a prop forward takes the ball up. I mean, that�s the job, and that�s my job, and to ensure that prior to the budget we�re explaining some pretty big changes, Ray, and I think it�s a good idea for us to go out there before the budget on two really big issues�

Q: Given you�ve made that comparison, you�re not suggesting Joe�s a fleet footed winger are you?

SCOTT MORRISON:

Well, in this role, that�s him.

He�s our Greg Bird.

I�ll be the prop forward taking it up and he can be the one who will score the try and that�s what he�ll be doing on budget day.

Q: Given Bird�s currently suspended for 8 weeks that�s a really poor analogy.

SCOTT MORRISON:

Probably is, but anyway, not to worry, he�s the guy who will be scoring the points.

Q: I don�t think Joe wants to be Greg Bird on Wednesday morning.

SCOTT MORRISON:

No, true.

Q: Okay, let�s say he�s your Greg Inglis.

SCOTT MORRISON:

Yeah.

RAY HADLEY:

All good.

# ? May 11, 2015 03:58

MysticalMachineGun: Apr 5, 2005

fiery_valkyrie posted:

Scott Morrison digs in the knife

*snrk*

# ? May 11, 2015 04:33

Wheezle: Aug 13, 2007; 420 stop boats erryday

fiery_valkyrie posted:

Scott Morrison digs in the knife

I see so many words but I do not comprehend them.

# ? May 11, 2015 04:48

Zetsubou-san: Jan 28, 2015; Cruel Bifaunidas demanded that you [stand]🧍 I require only that you [kneel]🧎

Hocus Pocus posted:

Does it still count as capital punishment if we trebuchet Joe Hildebrand into the Indian Ocean? Or would that be too 'cruel', 'unusual', or 'traumatizing for his children' for you bleeding hearts?

instead of the Indian Ocean, I nominate the Todd River on the grounds that it will be much more humourous.

# ? May 11, 2015 04:52

hooman: Oct 11, 2007; This guy seems legit.; Fun Shoe

Zetsubou-san posted:

instead of the Indian Ocean, I nominate the Todd River on the grounds that it will be much more humourous.

Can I nominate a huge flat slab of concrete with a comedically small glass of water in the centre.

THIS IS COMEDY HILDEBRAND YOU loving HACK. *launches trebuchet*

# ? May 11, 2015 05:17

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

fiery_valkyrie posted:

Reading some of the budget news this morning and I did idly wonder how Tony Abbott went from his "signature" PPL scheme to trying to cut the money available to to women for PPL without his head exploding from the cognitive dissonance.

It's taking their ball, going home and scorching the earth behind them. It is similar to how they've handled themselves in other areas. Either taking someone they didn't like about the previous government and doing exact the opposite (scrap carbon tax and pay polluters, double down on Nauru and tow back asylum seekers), or having a fit that they didn't get what they want and poison pilling related stuff (Cut GP rebate instead of copayment, cut science funding if bill isnt passed).

This government has indulged the most in childish and petty behaviour, out of any Australian government. It is an embarrassment to its citizens, and takes an active part in damaging our reputation across the globe.

# ? May 11, 2015 05:20

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

Wheezle posted:

I see so many words but I do not comprehend them.

I do but that is only because I live in NSW and have passively taken in enough rugby league. He is a shire boy through and thorugh, the wider world does not exist outside of his communities small bubble.

# ? May 11, 2015 05:23

Gough Suppressant: Nov 14, 2008

Tokamak posted:

I do but that is only because I live in NSW and have passively taken in enough rugby league. He is a shire boy through and thorugh, the wider world does not exist outside of his communities small bubble.

Which one of Morrison and hockey is having a dog suck them off and which one is pissing in their own mouth?

# ? May 11, 2015 05:28

Birb Katter: Sep 18, 2010; BOATS STOPPED
CARBON TAX AXED
TURNBULL AS PM
LIBERALS WILL BE RE-ELECTED IN A LANDSLIDE

Gough Suppressant posted:

Which one of Morrison and hockey is having a dog suck them off and which one is pissing in their own mouth?

This isn't an exclusive and we're talking about here.

# ? May 11, 2015 05:31

Seagull: Oct 9, 2012; give me a chip

was greg bird the one who peed in he own mouth

# ? May 11, 2015 05:32

Seagull: Oct 9, 2012; give me a chip

Gough Suppressant posted:

Which one of Morrison and hockey is having a dog suck them off and which one is pissing in their own mouth?

chris kenny played rugby?

# ? May 11, 2015 05:33

Gough Suppressant: Nov 14, 2008

Seagull posted:

was greg bird the one who peed in he own mouth

No but apparently he got a ten game suspension from the NRL which I didn't even think was possible, also glassed his girlfriend.

# ? May 11, 2015 05:37

Cartoon: Jun 20, 2008; poop

Gough Suppressant posted:

No but apparently he got a ten game suspension from the NRL which I didn't even think was possible, also glassed his girlfriend.

I can see why S&M Morrison might like him.

# ? May 11, 2015 05:38

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

Seagull posted:

was greg bird the one who peed in he own mouth

No that was Todd Carney, Greg Bird peed on a police car (and glassed his gf).

# ? May 11, 2015 05:38

Seagull: Oct 9, 2012; give me a chip

sounds like a poo poo bloke which is appropriate

# ? May 11, 2015 05:42

Laserface: Dec 24, 2004

Tokamak posted:

No that was Todd Carney, Greg Bird peed on a police car (and glassed his gf).

what the gently caress is wrong with footballers (hint: everything)

# ? May 11, 2015 05:46

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 08:25

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

quote:

Just for the detail oriented Politics Live reader, rounding out the oops, further and better particulars on Greg Bird to educate both myself, and other readers who aren�t standing start Greg Bird experts.

Gosh, he sounds like a charming sort of chap.

Bird had a conviction quashed for glassing his girlfriend Katie Milligan, but not before a judge described the pair�s lies as �extremely foolish� � according to the Herald Sun.
The Gold Coast Titans player became one of the NRL�s most suspended players with an eight-game ban � according to the ABC.
Bird, along with other NRL players, faced charges of cocaine supply and possession � according to the ABC.
Bird was also fined for urinating near police car � according to the ABC.

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2015/may/11/senate-pushes-back-on-childcare-changes-ahead-of-budget-politics-live

Seems a rather harsh comparison

# ? May 11, 2015 05:49

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol May: First Dog on the Moon Edition

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