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Just reading it now and holy poo poo this is House of M on LSD, I love it
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May 13, 2015 17:43
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The reason I suggest that is because Sues group broke off. The raft that opened had the Ultimate Survivors and this is the first time they've been encountered. I'm assuming that means there's another raft with our heroes too
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May 13, 2015 18:00
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Gatts posted:The reason I suggest that is because Sues group broke off. The raft that opened had the Ultimate Survivors and this is the first time they've been encountered. I'm assuming that means there's another raft with our heroes too Sue's group died. The Cabal and the 616 heroes on the lifeboat survived. I'm thinking that Battleworld is all the universes that Doom hurled at the Beyonders.
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May 13, 2015 18:04
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Codependent Poster posted:Sue's group died. The Cabal and the 616 heroes on the lifeboat survived.
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May 13, 2015 18:07
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This issue probably would've worked better for me if they'd done the old new-character viewpoint dodge, so the explanations and worldbuilding would've felt a bit more organic. As it is, Hickman had to throw an "as you know, Bob" in there, which is usually a sign of problems.
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May 13, 2015 18:10
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I thought this issue was supposed to have a tour of Battleworld with profiles on the different regions.
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May 13, 2015 18:12
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Sue and the others could just have been made by Doom out of whole cloth. I doubt Sinister and the Braddocks were in the piece that broke off. Hell, this might be a piece of a parallel earth and these aren't the 616 survivors at all.
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May 13, 2015 18:15
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I mean, the Battleworld map at the end specifically says 616 Manhattan and Ultimate Manhattan are a part of Battleworld... So more than just the Raft(s) people survived. I wouldn't be surprised if the Sue/Valeria/Franklin with God Doom are the 616 versions that he plucked away to safety after Reed failed to reattach them.
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May 13, 2015 18:21
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Wasn't that Valeria referring to Doom as father though? Either it's Reed under the mask or it's not 616 Valeria. That Doom was wearing the outfit he had when he was hanging out with the FF during Hickman's run though right? Along with the other people sitting around his throne. Wasn't he wearing that when he created his own universe?
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May 13, 2015 18:32
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I'm also amused that both Doom and Namor prize Sue so much. Both want Reed's woman.
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May 13, 2015 18:32
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head58 posted:Sue and the others could just have been made by Doom out of whole cloth. I doubt Sinister and the Braddocks were in the piece that broke off. redbackground fucked around with this message at 19:07 on May 13, 2015 |
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May 13, 2015 18:39
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I think this would be better if we were just dropped into Battle World out of the blue without the... uh... six years? Of buildup. Right now we ostensibly know what happened while waiting for everyone else to figure it out, in addition to having a pretty strong idea about what WILL happen: but can you imagine reading this poo poo with minimal to no lead-in? Just boom, first issue (instead of second), page 2, there's an army of Thors, who worship Dr. Doom, who is considered a god?
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May 13, 2015 19:02
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That was fantastic. It's really AoA, 1602 or House of M took to the nth power. Right now, I don't want this status quo to end and I'm done trying to presume what the hell this means in the grand scheme of Marvel things. Just gonna enjoy the ride. So many nice touches, this is a love letter to the Marvel Universe(s). I second the notion this could have been issue #1. And yeah, they didn't lie, great jumping point for anyone.
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May 13, 2015 19:06
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To be honest the first thing I wanna know right now is what happened to Miles. He jumped on the ultimate raft didn't he?
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May 13, 2015 19:08
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Caidin posted:To be honest the first thing I wanna know right now is what happened to Miles. He jumped on the ultimate raft didn't he? The preview cover of the next issue is a pretty big clue to that, I think. OnimaruXLR posted:I think this would be better if we were just dropped into Battle World out of the blue without the... uh... six years? Of buildup. Better for who? What's up with all the concern for the hypothetical brand new reader. I mean, we all read the lead up right?
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May 13, 2015 19:15
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Am I the only one that keeps on laughing at how Ultimate James Braddock keeps getting poo poo on? Also kudos to Ribic for using the vastly superior MI13 version of Brian's suit that he wore after he became imaginationland Superman. I always hated the old version of the costume.
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May 13, 2015 19:20
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Jiro posted:Am I the only one that keeps on laughing at how Ultimate James Braddock keeps getting poo poo on? You're not, friend. Dude can't catch a break.
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May 13, 2015 19:22
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Yeah, James Braddock gets more poo poo than Wile E. Coyote. I love it. 
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May 13, 2015 19:32
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So I take it that I'm the only one who didn't really enjoy Hickman and everyone in his story figuratively and literally slurping at Doom's dick for fifty pages.
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May 13, 2015 19:36
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BrianWilly posted:So I take it that I'm the only one who didn't really enjoy Hickman and everyone in his story figuratively and literally slurping at Doom's dick for fifty pages. Yeah since like the last Secret War its not going to end with Doom getting defeated. Its like being mad at them doing the same to Magneto in House of M.
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May 13, 2015 19:38
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1) House of M was pretty lovely. 2) Man, I didn't even realize how much this was flat-out ganking from House of M until you mentioned it. 3) Something becoming more enjoyable at the end doesn't magically make the prior unenjoyable parts enjoyable.
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May 13, 2015 19:47
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BrianWilly posted:So I take it that I'm the only one who didn't really enjoy Hickman and everyone in his story figuratively and literally slurping at Doom's dick for fifty pages. Finally, I didn't take every Doom moment as "yeah he's right and great". I mean, the whole thing about censorship and controlling information didn't come across as an analogy for "gently caress yeah, Kim Jong Un".
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May 13, 2015 19:52
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PelvicNerve posted:Yeah, James Braddock gets more poo poo than Wile E. Coyote. I love it. At least he gets a real costume rather than the thong his 616 counterpart wore.
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May 13, 2015 20:16
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BrianWilly posted:So I take it that I'm the only one who didn't really enjoy Hickman and everyone in his story figuratively and literally slurping at Doom's dick for fifty pages. You mean a world created by Doom ruled by Doom has people worshipping him as a God? 
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May 13, 2015 20:18
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Codependent Poster posted:You mean a world created by Doom ruled by Doom has people worshipping him as a God? Well the previous universe Doom created was a bit too much like Doom and rebelled. I I think it's why he's just setting up base rules and letting each area govern itself. Doom is good and he saved life. I'm sure Doom 100% is aware of what's going on but the rest of them seem to have been wiped of pre-incursion knowledge. I wonder if Stephen got wiped too or if he's also rolling with Doom in keeping this world together.
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May 13, 2015 20:25
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I mean Hickman has used Doom a lot in his stories but I don't understand why people here get so annoyed with it. It's not like he's presenting Doom as some infallible hero that comes in and saves the day. In FF he served his purpose which was to stall some celestials for a few seconds, and even past that when he was messing around with his own universe, he completely blows it. In Avengers he at first presented as someone who has figured it out and is going to save everything, but then he just fails. We don't know anything about the Doom here or how Battleworld was created yet. We don't know for sure that this exists because of something 616 Doom did.
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May 13, 2015 20:34
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Y'know, I kinda take the opposite view about how much this is fellating Doom. I mean, he's the King Grand Poo-bah of the remaining Universe, which he created, and has everyone and their mother bowing down to him as the God of everything. Stephan Strange is his minion, there isn't a Richards in sight, and its his way or the highway. All that, and he has the female part of the Fantastic 4 as his family. It would almost be sweet, if it wasn't kinda obvious how much Doom wants what Richards has. He's achieved everything he's always wanted, but it's all to basically have a Sue and Valeria in his life. That's kind of sad.
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May 13, 2015 20:36
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Senor Candle posted:I mean Hickman has used Doom a lot in his stories but I don't understand why people here get so annoyed with it. It's not like he's presenting Doom as some infallible hero that comes in and saves the day. In FF he served his purpose which was to stall some celestials for a few seconds, and even past that when he was messing around with his own universe, he completely blows it. In Avengers he at first presented as someone who has figured it out and is going to save everything, but then he just fails. We don't know anything about the Doom here or how Battleworld was created yet. We don't know for sure that this exists because of something 616 Doom did. Or if he even could control creating Battleworld. Why the gently caress would you even have a zone specifically for Ultron AIs, Marvel Zombies, and the goddamn Annihilation Wave, when you're whole thing is to remake a world under your complete control. Unless he keeps those around in order to periodically invade and keep everyone else in line which means he keeps in contact with them. Anyone else notice that Susan was back in her Future Foundation uniform as was Doom being in white, when he was made stupid.
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May 13, 2015 20:38
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Jiro posted:Or if he even could control creating Battleworld. Why the gently caress would you even have a zone specifically for Ultron AIs, Marvel Zombies, and the goddamn Annihilation Wave, when you're whole thing is to remake a world under your complete control. Unless he keeps those around in order to periodically invade and keep everyone else in line which means he keeps in contact with them. Anyone else notice that Susan was back in her Future Foundation uniform as was Doom being in white, when he was made stupid. Barbarians at the gates are a powerful tool for maintaining order.
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May 13, 2015 20:42
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Jiro posted:Or if he even could control creating Battleworld. Why the gently caress would you even have a zone specifically for Ultron AIs, Marvel Zombies, and the goddamn Annihilation Wave, when you're whole thing is to remake a world under your complete control. Unless he keeps those around in order to periodically invade and keep everyone else in line which means he keeps in contact with them. Anyone else notice that Susan was back in her Future Foundation uniform as was Doom being in white, when he was made stupid. His brain was fixed while he was still hanging around with them, and I'm pretty sure this was the costume he was wearing when he created his own universe. Also the costume Sue is wearing is the same as back then, and not what she was wearing when she got on the raft.
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May 13, 2015 20:42
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Jiro posted:Or if he even could control creating Battleworld. Why the gently caress would you even have a zone specifically for Ultron AIs, Marvel Zombies, and the goddamn Annihilation Wave, when you're whole thing is to remake a world under your complete control. Unless he keeps those around in order to periodically invade and keep everyone else in line which means he keeps in contact with them. Anyone else notice that Susan was back in her Future Foundation uniform as was Doom being in white, when he was made stupid. I don't think Doom had direct control of how Battleworld was formed. He (apparently) survived the multiverse explosion he caused and came to be on a world made of remnants of other universes. I think him and Strange are the ONLY members of the 616 universe we see in this issue. Everyone else is the scattered remains of dead universes brought to life to Doom by whatever means he had left to either forge and rekindle the shattered earths into one. Based on what happened with the Cabal's raft, Doom is taking great measures to keep the birth of this world a mystery.
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May 13, 2015 20:47
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:I don't think Doom had direct control of how Battleworld was formed. He (apparently) survived the multiverse explosion he caused and came to be on a world made of remnants of other universes. I think him and Strange are the ONLY members of the 616 universe we see in this issue. Everyone else is the scattered remains of dead universes brought to life to Doom by whatever means he had left to either forge and rekindle the shattered earths into one. Based on what happened with the Cabal's raft, Doom is taking great measures to keep the birth of this world a mystery. I'm choosing to read it less intensely than that, with some sort of 'Battleworld forming scrambled their brains!' thing for everyone who wasn't super-safe (the life rafts, basically). Meaning there'll be a semi-obliterated raft someplace with Phoenixclops and Mr. Fantastic, almost certainly showing up next issue? e: so basically House of M but 
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May 13, 2015 20:53
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Most definitely. Phoenix Cyclops is going to fine Sinister and go all extinction on him. Again.
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May 13, 2015 20:56
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Majuju posted:I'm choosing to read it less intensely than that, with some sort of 'Battleworld forming scrambled their brains!' thing for everyone who wasn't super-safe (the life rafts, basically). Meaning there'll be a semi-obliterated raft someplace with Phoenixclops and Mr. Fantastic, almost certainly showing up next issue? The 616 lifeboat contains the heroes for this series, which is everyone Manifold got. They're going to fight the Cabal, who will fight Doom, who will fight the heroes. It's just like the setup of the original Secret Wars, just on a much higher scale.
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May 13, 2015 20:57
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Jiro posted:Or if he even could control creating Battleworld. Why the gently caress would you even have a zone specifically for Ultron AIs, Marvel Zombies, and the goddamn Annihilation Wave, when you're whole thing is to remake a world under your complete control. So he can do what he did to Ult. Captain Britain in this issue
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May 13, 2015 20:59
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If we go by tradition Doom may have godlike power but he lacks a godlike mind to wield it, a stray thought here or there during creation and you have zombies and Ultrons and Anhilation waves.
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May 13, 2015 21:27
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BrianWilly posted:So I take it that I'm the only one who didn't really enjoy Hickman and everyone in his story figuratively and literally slurping at Doom's dick for fifty pages. Nah, I thought it was pretty dumb too. Here's hoping some of the side books are good, because right now this just seems like another event to ignore like AoU or AXIS.
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May 13, 2015 21:35
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redbackground posted:...We did not see any Reeds, Namors, Black Panthers, etc, either... Actually, there is a LITERAL Black Panther as they're talking about alliances- right next to the Konshu Warrior looking woman. While they're talking about "Upper and Lower Egyptia".
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May 13, 2015 22:10
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I wonder if the writers know black panthers aren't a real animal.
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May 13, 2015 22:11
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So the line early on about the stars winking out, this universe is still dying eh?
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May 13, 2015 22:12
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