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Thwomp posted:go the Batman Begins route Wasn't that season one?
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May 19, 2015 21:35
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So are the Flashbacks over now or what?
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May 19, 2015 21:40
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PaganGoatPants posted:So are the Flashbacks over now or what?
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May 19, 2015 21:44
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spookygonk posted:Nope, that was only year three on/off the island. Season 4: Russia? I'm thinking Coast City. And who knows, maybe Ollie will met a certain test pilot there. I finally catched up with the season and I don't see why all the complaints. It was as solid as season 2. Yes, there were some logic jumps here and there but what were you expecting of a comic book series?
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May 19, 2015 21:52
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howe_sam posted:Wasn't that season one? I meant with respect to Ras' character. Begins implies he's this mythical figurehead whose been alive for hundreds of years but it's all just a ploy and there's no Lazarus pit. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:This show has never really been coy about GA being Batman with the numbers filed off. If anything I sort of enjoy that because I like Batman, but hate all the rigid backstory and his no-kill rule. Batman is DC's goldenboy and you just cannot touch the canon in any way shape or form. Even if accidentally going too far and killing someone would be a great character building plot point - how Bruce would deal with the shame and guilt outside the suit - you can never go there because BATMAN DOESN'T KILL. Lame. GA seems to have a bit more freedom to mess with origins while still being a similar hero. Arrow has a no-kill rule now (at least, unless its absolutely necessary). Yeah, this season has been strangely full of stuff and yet really, really empty. There was: the mystery of who killed Sara, the League coming after Merlyn, Oliver taking on Ras and dying, Oliver returning to life and being pursued by the League, and finally Oliver's double-cross of Ras to thwart his plan (by killing Ras and not planning on surviving the attempt). Like, all of that was the main plot but there was also the Atom, Brick, Flash, and more Suicide Squad. (And then the flashbacks to Hong Kong which just wasn't really compelling. The idea that Oliver was back in civilization after leaving the island is neat but this story was not.) Season 2's main plot was Deathstroke coming for Ollie (with an army of super soldiers in tow). If you want to do a League storyline, you don't have to invent a weird plot where Meryln brainwashed Thea so that Oliver would have to challenge and die to Ras for Meryln but that triggered some prophecy when Ollie survived so Ollie has to be the new Ras and Starling also must be destroyed. It's like the writers thought "Let's do a Ras and the League want to destroy Starling" arc but thought that was too close to Batman Begins (it is) and invented the worst alternative reasoning to get to the same point. And had CW push another DC character in for another backdoor spin-off pilot. Thwomp fucked around with this message at 21:54 on May 19, 2015 |
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May 19, 2015 21:52
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Thwomp posted:Arrow has a no-kill rule now (at least, unless its absolutely necessary). He sure does, but it was a struggle to get there. Characterization happened, it matters that he doesn't kill people now. It isn't just some set-in stone rule that he follows even when it doesn't make sense. Ollie will still kill somebody if they give him no other choice, Batman will always let them live to harm again. I guess the argument is that Batman's parents were killed so he won't kill anyone, but GA went through the same thing really. It was really neat to see a "hero" fire arrows into people's chest in S1 totally counter to what I've come to expect from comic book good guys. I think I just have Batman fatigue. So many movies each with their own (exactly the same) origin have left me a bit tired of the story. If GA ends up following Batman's moral code 100% I would be ok with it as long as the path to get there was different.
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May 19, 2015 22:02
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Thwomp posted:If you want to do a League storyline, you don't have to invent a weird plot where Meryln brainwashed Thea so that Oliver would have to challenge and die to Ras for Meryln but that triggered some prophecy when Ollie survived so Ollie has to be the new Ras and Starling also must be destroyed. It's like the writers thought "Let's do a Ras and the League want to destroy Starling" arc but thought that was too close to Batman Begins (it is) and invented the worst alternative reasoning to get to the same point. But the idea was less about aping Batman Begins and more about presenting a R'as that was completely archaic and traditionalist. In fact, the whole point of the season was about renovation, about destroying the old to build something better.
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May 19, 2015 22:10
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Dark_Tzitzimine posted:But the idea was less about aping Batman Begins and more about presenting a R'as that was completely archaic and traditionalist. They failed this season.
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May 19, 2015 23:03
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This could've all been avoided had they not killed the original Count Vertigo.
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May 19, 2015 23:33
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Or if Count Vertigo killed Felicity 
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May 19, 2015 23:41
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:He sure does, but it was a struggle to get there. Characterization happened, it matters that he doesn't kill people now. It isn't just some set-in stone rule that he follows even when it doesn't make sense. Ollie will still kill somebody if they give him no other choice, Batman will always let them live to harm again. I guess the argument is that Batman's parents were killed so he won't kill anyone, but GA went through the same thing really. It was really neat to see a "hero" fire arrows into people's chest in S1 totally counter to what I've come to expect from comic book good guys. Batman's no kill rule makes sense internally. Traumatized by the murder of his parents, kid literally has anger issues so profound he has to beat the poo poo out of criminals with his bare hands to cope.. And he can't kill them lest he become what he hates, a killer. Not to mention he's already going beyond the law because the cops are failures in his eyes and corrupt as gently caress to boot.
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May 20, 2015 00:25
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Major mistakes of this season: - The flashbacks were incredibly dull and pointless. - Felicity went from an awesome character to a whiny little drama queen. In fact the whole Olicity thing was a huge clusterfuck and should never have been done. - Merlyn kept playing a huge role and it kept getting less and less believable. The team's whole "merlyn, we know you're a horrible, horrible person and a liar and mass-murderer but we're going to work with you... again" is just so incredibly stupid at this point. - The league started out extremely menacing, with a single league henchman able to pose a significant threat. By the end of the season they were just fodder, and impossible to take seriously. - Lazarus Pit not driving Thea insane permanently. She just slept it off. - Ray hosed over Felicity by having her sign a paper that turned out to be a colossally important document (transfer of ownership)? Wow. The only redeeming thing is that Laurel's character seemed to be on an upward trajectory. She went from completely insufferable to average. Gonna be interesting how they keep her relevant next season since it'll be in Coast City and she's in Starling.
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May 20, 2015 00:25
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Ollie will be back in Starling by the end of episode 1.
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May 20, 2015 00:33
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The flashbacks will be Coast City. Present day stuff will be Starling. How hard is it to understand?
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May 20, 2015 00:44
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The "working with Merlyn" stuff could've made some sense to me if they had kept him as the red herring and had Ra's ordering Sara's death. Instead, it was just confusing.
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May 20, 2015 00:45
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enraged_camel posted:Major mistakes of this season: how is this him loving her over? she's been a VP for the past while.
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May 20, 2015 00:47
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Bad Moon posted:Batman's no kill rule makes sense internally. Traumatized by the murder of his parents, kid literally has anger issues so profound he has to beat the poo poo out of criminals with his bare hands to cope.. And he can't kill them lest he become what he hates, a killer. Not to mention he's already going beyond the law because the cops are failures in his eyes and corrupt as gently caress to boot. No doubt it makes sense to Batman, but the logic of letting a guy like Joker go when he tells him "I am going to murder more people again, and soon." because the only other option is killing him(Arkham is always a temporary solution) never really worked for me. The people Joker kills aren't dying by Batman's hand but it's like Cmon man, you knew he was going to do it again. He told you. You let it happen. That part always seemed weird and hard to justify to me.
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May 20, 2015 00:53
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enraged_camel posted:Probably a bit too active. See: Olicity. The exception that proves the rule. Never listen to shippers.
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May 20, 2015 00:53
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Thwomp posted:It's a Green Arrow so you kind of expect Green Arrow shennanigans, not a knock-off of Batman. A knock off of Batman is exactly what Green Arrow (both the character and show) is, though.
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May 20, 2015 00:54
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:No doubt it makes sense to Batman, but the logic of letting a guy like Joker go when he tells him "I am going to murder more people again, and soon." because the only other option is killing him(Arkham is always a temporary solution) never really worked for me. The people Joker kills aren't dying by Batman's hand but it's like Cmon man, you knew he was going to do it again. He told you. You let it happen. That part always seemed weird and hard to justify to me. That's more the government and people of the united states' issue than batman's.
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May 20, 2015 00:54
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I imagine Thea will start to lose it next season. Or so I tell myself.
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May 20, 2015 01:01
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:No doubt it makes sense to Batman, but the logic of letting a guy like Joker go when he tells him "I am going to murder more people again, and soon." because the only other option is killing him(Arkham is always a temporary solution) never really worked for me. The people Joker kills aren't dying by Batman's hand but it's like Cmon man, you knew he was going to do it again. He told you. You let it happen. That part always seemed weird and hard to justify to me. Guess that's why the Joker lives in Gotham instead of Starling.
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May 20, 2015 01:05
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Drifter posted:That's more the government and people of the united states' issue than batman's. Has there ever been an arc of any sort where Batman gets tired of dealing with Joker so he just tells Waller to send ARGUS after him all the time, and in doing so Joker stops acting out because he only ever does stuff to get arrested by Batman and that doesn't happen anymore? nelson posted:Guess that's why the Joker lives in Gotham instead of Starling. 
bring back old gbs fucked around with this message at 01:08 on May 20, 2015 |
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May 20, 2015 01:05
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:Has there ever been an arc of any sort where Batman gets tired of dealing with Joker so he just tells Waller to send ARGUS after him all the time, and in doing so Joker stops acting out because he only ever does stuff to get arrested by Batman and that doesn't happen anymore? It's even easier than that. When Batman retires the Joker does too; he just sorta shuts down.
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May 20, 2015 01:10
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I dunno, did Joker bother Batman when he was Azrael?
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May 20, 2015 01:12
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greatn posted:I dunno, did Joker bother Batman when he was Azrael? God drat Azrael. 
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May 20, 2015 01:34
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Drifter posted:how is this him loving her over? she's been a VP for the past while. Actually, never mind. I went back to the second to last episode and rewatched that scene. He actually transferred ownership of the company to Felicity without her knowing. 
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May 20, 2015 01:44
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May 20, 2015 02:06
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oh man that stab really is as bad as you all said
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May 20, 2015 02:14
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:oh man that stab really is as bad as you all said Which is so sad considering the mid-season finale fight.
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May 20, 2015 02:18
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enraged_camel posted:Major mistakes of this season: And then he ends up in control of the League. 
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May 20, 2015 02:22
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:oh man that stab really is as bad as you all said That isn't a stab, he puts the blade there and then pulls, slashing the poo poo out of him.
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May 20, 2015 03:04
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greatn posted:That isn't a stab, he puts the blade there and then pulls, slashing the poo poo out of him. i lol'd
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May 20, 2015 03:51
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greatn posted:That isn't a stab, he puts the blade there and then pulls, slashing the poo poo out of him. I thought I had Irish Joe on ignore?
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May 20, 2015 03:58
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If the armor can stop sniper rounds, I doubt a hand wielded blade is going to do anything to it.
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May 20, 2015 06:57
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nelson posted:If the armor can stop sniper rounds, I doubt a hand wielded blade is going to do anything to it. League armor deflects very fast projectiles, but the slow blade penetrates it.
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May 20, 2015 07:07
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nelson posted:If the armor can stop sniper rounds, I doubt a hand wielded blade is going to do anything to it. Most Kevlar will stop a pistol round but if you knife somebody they get cut.
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May 20, 2015 07:08
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Solution: Knife gun
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May 20, 2015 08:48
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Lycus posted:League armor deflects very fast projectiles, but the slow blade penetrates it. You're thinking of this guy 
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May 20, 2015 09:11
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PFlats posted:I imagine Thea will start to lose it next season. Or so I tell myself. Even if they do that, having her go from normal for several episodes in a row to "suddenly insane" will be stupid. They just did that on Grimm too, taking a good character who was a good person for about 80 episodes and then basically having them suddenly turn dark and evil to the point where her almost-fiancee told his allies to kill her on sight. And she was indeed killed in the season finale.
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May 20, 2015 13:10
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