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Am I too late for the AMD funeral prep? Regarding the x86 license: quote:the pact has a number of limitations. For example, the companies are not allowed to build processors that are compatible with competitor’s infrastructure (e.g., sockets, mainboards, etc.). The companies also cannot change their ownership, merge with other companies on certain terms or enter into certain kind of joint-venture agreements that effectively change their ownership. But none of that matters, because there is a 100% chance Intel would be forced to relicense x86 anyways. Otherwise, Intel would have an effective monopoly on the desktop CPU market. Justice Department sues, forces Intel to relicense x86, *boom* problem solved. This is not the insurmountable barrier people think it is. No amount of lobbying from Intel would stop it, either. There are just too many companies with an interest in x86 CPUs for Intel to win. Not just Microsoft, but Apple (which appreciates not being forced to pay monopoly pricing — the threat of switching to a competitor is all that's been required to keep Apple's suppliers in line) and probably SAP as well. (Also, a reminder that the European Union is still kicking Microsoft in the nuts for the Internet Explorer fiasco. EU regulators will throw everything they have at Intel if it becomes a monopoly.) The real question is, who buys AMD if it goes under? Some possibilities: Very Likely option: Bought by a private equity company. (AMD's market cap is a measly $1.75 billion — that's chump change for private equity groups.) This is the most likely outcome — AMD's existence would be essentially mandated by the government, but the company itself would still be a fixer-upper. It's almost tailor-made for a private equity firm to adopt. Somewhat likely option: Bought by another public company. NVidia is the most obvious candidate, or at least the only company that's desperate for an x86 license. Unfortunately for breathless fanboys, a merger with AMD would just create a different monopoly on dedicated GPUs, and nobody wants that to happen. IBM is another likely candidate, but otherwise I'm at a loss to name someone else who'd be willing to step up to the plate. Probably not Apple, despite wild speculation about it (even though it sort of makes sense — vertical integration is their thing). Apple is a brutal min-maxer, and would only get an x86 license so they could build a custom Apple-focused CPU for their Macbooks; it wouldn't break an Intel monopoly in any meaningful way. (Also, Microsoft would poo poo their pants.) Probably not Qualcomm, either, because Qualcomm is primarily a telecom business (and even though they want to enter the server market, they plan to do so with their specialty, ARM). And please stop bringing up Cisco. Cisco is a network hardware company that wants to dominate the Internet of Things, not the Internet of Desktops. Unlikely option: Bought by a foreign company. The U.S. doesn't like certain technologies going to overseas manufacturers, so despite excited speculation about a Samsung buyout, the U.S. Justice Department would probably nix any deal that gave an x86 license to a foreign company. So as nice as it'd be for a Taiwanese OEM to swoop in and give AMD the home it needs, it's probably not going to happen. Comedy option: The European Union forces Intel to give a European company an x86 license that applies only to the European market. The black market quickly becomes saturated with French CPUs (which would still be cheaper than Intel's). Maximum irony option: Bought by GlobalFoundries. Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Jun 3, 2015 |
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Jun 3, 2015 04:25
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NVIDIA is an American company.
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Jun 3, 2015 04:39
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GrizzlyCow posted:NVIDIA is an American company. Whoops. Fixed.
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Jun 3, 2015 04:46
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Curvature of Earth posted:Whoops. Fixed. Just replace it with Samsung.
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Jun 3, 2015 04:50
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Curvature of Earth posted:And please stop bringing up Cisco. Cisco is a network hardware company that wants to dominate the Internet of Things, not the Internet of Desktops.
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Jun 3, 2015 05:12
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I'd worry about cisco's main business focus being take away with SDNs then them trying to get a x86 license.
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Jun 3, 2015 05:27
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I really want Zen to be a success, I like rooting for the underdog. Even if it's not quite as good as Skylake or whatever the Intel equivalent is, if it's within spitting distance I'll buy a Zen processor for my gaming computer's mobo/CPU upgrade. And private equity groups are the devil. Woolie Wool fucked around with this message at 06:22 on Jun 3, 2015 |
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Jun 3, 2015 06:20
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Woolie Wool posted:And private equity groups are the devil. AMD is already controlled by His Highness General and Crown Prince محمد بن زايد بن سلطان آل نهيان (18.2%) and various western devils (~39%)
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Jun 3, 2015 10:35
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Curvature of Earth posted:. More like mildly annoying them on the level of lightly tapping a wrist.
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Jun 3, 2015 10:40
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Nintendo Kid posted:More like mildly annoying them on the level of lightly tapping a wrist. I'll concede that a single tear from Bill Gates is worth more than the EU's fine. But my point still stands: EU regulators are relatively aggressive -- they still forced Microsoft to display a list of selected browsers to customers. That they even bothered at all is remarkable.
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Jun 3, 2015 16:25
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I really think Ars Technica really did a good job explaining AMDs new mobile platform: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/06/sixth-time-lucky-amd-details-the-carrizo-apu/ 15 watt target, for a sub-$400 notebook capable of crunching 4K video? Uh, sure why not?
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Jun 3, 2015 16:32
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Angry Fish posted:I really think Ars Technica really did a good job explaining AMDs new mobile platform: If they can make something that's broadly comparable to Sandy Bridge and sell it for Atom prices, we're cooking with gas.
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Jun 3, 2015 16:35
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Curvature of Earth posted:But none of that matters, because there is a 100% chance Intel would be forced to relicense x86 anyways. Otherwise, Intel would have an effective monopoly on the desktop CPU market. Justice Department sues, forces Intel to relicense x86, *boom* problem solved. poo poo they basically allowed Ma Bell to become resurrected and they used to be the go to example of modern commercial excess and market abuse.
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Jun 3, 2015 16:42
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Curvature of Earth posted:I'll concede that a single tear from Bill Gates is worth more than the EU's fine. But my point still stands: EU regulators are relatively aggressive -- they still forced Microsoft to display a list of selected browsers to customers. That they even bothered at all is remarkable. To no real effect. I mean seriously you just keep pointing out how they can't accomplish more than slaps on the wrist at best. Remember when they made Microsoft sell a special version of Windows without something like IE or Media Player? Remember how no one bought them? PC LOAD LETTER posted:poo poo they basically allowed Ma Bell to become resurrected They really didn't. Something like 35% of all phone service for the biggest company (Verizon or AT&T depending on phase of the moon), and significantly less of other relevant things like internet access, is not even close to being that. Substantial chunks of American phone service are things that aren't even related to Baby Bells: T-Mobile (German), Sprint (never part of AT&T), Frontier, and so on.
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Jun 3, 2015 16:46
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edit: nvm its fishmech waste of time edit 2: 
PC LOAD LETTER fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Jun 3, 2015 |
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Jun 3, 2015 16:54
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PC LOAD LETTER posted:edit: nvm its fishmech waste of time Yes, it is a waste of time to repeat an utterly untrue factoid like you did. 
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Jun 3, 2015 16:56
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Who uses the ignore list?
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Jun 3, 2015 18:47
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SH/SC #nofilter
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Jun 3, 2015 19:43
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The Devil Tesla posted:Who uses the ignore list? Using the ignore list is a lot like using adult diapers. If it's the only way you can get through your day without embarrassing yourself, you shouldn't be ashamed. But pointing it out proudly is just weird, man.
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Jun 3, 2015 20:27
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Killer robot posted:Using the ignore list is a lot like using adult diapers. If it's the only way you can get through your day without embarrassing yourself, you shouldn't be ashamed. But pointing it out proudly is just weird, man. This is an amazingly apt and well-thought analogy that I will use in the future. I look forward to the day when I replace my Llano box with something faster than a Core 2 Duo from 2007. I'm going to wait for Skylake...
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Jun 3, 2015 20:33
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Killer robot posted:Using the ignore list is a lot like using adult diapers. If it's the only way you can get through your day without embarrassing yourself, you shouldn't be ashamed. But pointing it out proudly is just weird, man. I use it specifically for Fishmech because he changes his name so drat much that I got tired of the 5ish-post period after a name change before I realize I'm arguing with fishmech. I still read his posts, it's just the only way to easily flag his posts across browsers and machines.
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Jun 3, 2015 20:41
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Google probably has enough change under the couch-cushions to buy AMD *and* a pop too. 
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Jun 3, 2015 23:11
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Killer robot posted:Using the ignore list is a lot like using adult diapers. If it's the only way you can get through your day without embarrassing yourself, you shouldn't be ashamed. But pointing it out proudly is just weird, man.
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Jun 4, 2015 03:41
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Historical question! Did Dell or any other big OEM make Athlon XP (32bit) desktops? I can only find desktops using Athlon64. I recall vaguely that 32bit Athlons weren't very popular with OEMs and where mostly an enthusiast chip but I'm sure some OEMs picked it up towards the end of its life.
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Jun 8, 2015 19:24
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Shaocaholica posted:Historical question! Time period was messed up. Intel tried to use their market leader position to force OEMs into not purchasing from AMD. There were anti-competitive behaviors that went to court. http://www.theverge.com/2014/6/12/5803442/intel-nearly-1-and-a-half-billion-fine-upheld-anticompetitive-practices http://www.dailytech.com/FTC+Intel+Reach+Settlement+Intel+Banned+From+Anticompetitive+Practices/article19265.htm Many legal settlements later, Intel's behavior hasn't gotten that much better. Regardless, HP did manufacture some Turion-based 17 and 15 inch laptops from 2005-2007. I had one. It was okay, and ran Windows XP Media Center with a little remote that slipped into the PCIe Express slot. Had an ATI x600 for light gaming, too. A Bad King fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Jun 8, 2015 |
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Jun 8, 2015 19:40
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edit: found one: http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c00239779&tmp_task=prodinfoCategory&cc=us&dlc=en&lc=en&product=431082 Nothing to write home about but it does have a 32bit XP proc. .... Say I wanted to build an Athlon XP system for 'historical' reasons, what motherboard was baller back then? Shaocaholica fucked around with this message at 19:59 on Jun 8, 2015 |
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Jun 8, 2015 19:51
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Shaocaholica posted:Say I wanted to build an Athlon XP system for 'historical' reasons, what motherboard was baller back then? Maximum PC archives on Google Books would be your best source for that sort of question. Look up their Dream Machines for that era. https://books.google.com/books?id=UgIAAAAAMBAJ&source=gbs_all_issues_r&cad=1 What year? 2005 was different from 2006 which was really different from 2007 which was different from 2008 which was a whole 'nother year behind 2009... edit: avoid via chipsets like a plague.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:01
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Angry Fish posted:Maximum PC archives on Google Books would be your best source for that sort of question. Look up their Dream Machines for that era. Thanks I'll dig around. Mostly around the tail end of the 32bit era. Whatever was the best of SocketA/32bit-AthlonXP which I'm assuming was at the end of its life. edit: dark horse Nvidia motherboard option? 
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Jun 8, 2015 20:03
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Angry Fish posted:Maximum PC archives on Google Books would be your best source for that sort of question. Look up their Dream Machines for that era. I still have hard copies of all the 2000 era issues of Maximum PC. Seeing them immortalized in digital form online is making me feel old and poo poo. Also, the first computer I built had a VIA KT133A chipset  It also had Hercules 3D Prophet video card, haha.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:12
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I vaguely remember the last stand of 32bit was the Athlon XP 3200+, on an Abit NF7-S mainboard if you were in the cool boys club.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:31
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Shaocaholica posted:Thanks I'll dig around. Mostly around the tail end of the 32bit era. Whatever was the best of SocketA/32bit-AthlonXP which I'm assuming was at the end of its life. http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K7/AMD-Athlon%20XP%203200+%20-%20AXDA3200DKV4E.html http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K7/AMD-Sempron%203300%2B%20-%20SDA3300DKV4E.html
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Jun 8, 2015 20:37
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In reality though the tail end of the 32 bit era was dudes running Windows 2000/Windows XP 32 bit even though they'd just gotten the early generations of 64 bit chips.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:39
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Nintendo Kid posted:In reality though the tail end of the 32 bit era was dudes running Windows 2000/Windows XP 32 bit even though they'd just gotten the early generations of 64 bit chips. People still run 32bit Win7/8 and now to be 10 on pretty modern 64bit hardware like Nehalem. It's horrible. At least with a 32bit only CPU you have an excuse.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:48
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Shaocaholica posted:Thanks I'll dig around. Mostly around the tail end of the 32bit era. Whatever was the best of SocketA/32bit-AthlonXP which I'm assuming was at the end of its life. I remember the nForce 2 chipsets being awesome at the time. I think I had an Asus board with the nivida chipset? I also had a similar Asus board with the Via K8T800 I think, or something like that and it was a pile of hot dogshit. Then you moved in to nForce 3 and 4 for S754 and 939 and they weren't as cool as the old nForce2  DFI and Abit made the EXTREME OC MASTER boards back then though.
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Jun 8, 2015 20:55
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Nintendo Kid posted:In reality though the tail end of the 32 bit era was dudes running Windows 2000/Windows XP 32 bit even though they'd just gotten the early generations of 64 bit chips. I ran 32bit until three weeks ago when I wanted to play Witcher 3 too badly. Making a 64bit boot USB stick on a 32bit OS is a tremendous pain in the neck, also saying goodbye to your trusty Windows 7 that ran flawlessly since launch day 
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Jun 8, 2015 21:02
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sauer kraut posted:I ran 32bit until three weeks ago when I wanted to play Witcher 3 too badly.  I too have a launch day install of win7 working fine, but it's x64. The only people I know using 32 bit are the people stuck with terrible images on their work machines.
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Jun 8, 2015 21:26
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Angry Fish posted:edit: avoid via chipsets like a plague. NghaAAAAaaaAAAAAhh, I just had a chill run up my spine. SPEAK NOT OF THE EVIL ONE'S NAME. If you say it three times, I hear your BIOS will self-corrupt every time you shut down, before the southbridge releasing its magic smoke arbitrarily under desktop idle conditions.
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Jun 8, 2015 21:28
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Gwaihir posted:I remember the nForce 2 chipsets being awesome at the time. I think I had an Asus board with the nivida chipset? I also had a similar Asus board with the Via K8T800 I think, or something like that and it was a pile of hot dogshit. Then you moved in to nForce 3 and 4 for S754 and 939 and they weren't as cool as the old nForce2 nForce boards seemed awesome at the time because there was dick all for chipsets for AMD procs, but man there was some bad poo poo that was tolerated. Who cares if I'm getting data corruption with my SATA drive as long as I got an AMD proc and that sweet position audio!
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Jun 8, 2015 22:04
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Nintendo Kid posted:In reality though the tail end of the 32 bit era was dudes running Windows 2000/Windows XP 32 bit even though they'd just gotten the early generations of 64 bit chips. The problem was that XP 64-bit was always a ghastly mess for compatibility and drivers, and people didn't want Vista's bloat and bugginess (perceived or real). The tail end of people running XP 32-bit extended way past the "early 64-bit days", it held a relatively large marketshare until Win7 came out and the tail end extended out to the extended support cutoff and beyond. Even today a lot of niche hardware doesn't run on Vista or newer. You'll be finding old XP installs in Grandma's living room and niche industrial setups for decades to come.
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Jun 8, 2015 22:11
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Paul MaudDib posted:You'll be finding old XP installs in Grandma's living room and niche industrial setups for decades to come. As long as grandma is still living
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Jun 8, 2015 22:33
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