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Elswyyr posted:Welp, I think it's about time for my yearly return to this game, followed by quitting for unknown reasons. How's Artificer nowadays? Based on what little testing I've gotten done this morning, not nearly as well as warlock. Holy poo poo chain shape is loving amazing. Its almost good enough to make up for the laughable hp warlocks have. I'm sure it probably won't be quite as bad once I have greensteel and stuff though
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May 31, 2015 16:22
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They've got rogue/bard/artificer levels of HP. No guild buffs costs you around 70 hp at 28, so a human should be able to get 800ish without too much trouble, as the test server can't do higher than +4 tomes as well. I felt a bit flimsy too, but I don't think it'll be as much of an issue on live. You've got access to medium armor for PRR/MRR without ASF and self casting displacement to add on top. And sleet storm if you've got perma Freedom. But yeah Chain shape is awesome. Warlocks are archers with good AE damage and some extra spells/abilities to use and that's super cool. Cone shape is likely going to be better DPS than Chain but also require more work to utilize properly, but I'll probably end up swapping between Cone/Chain/Seeking as needed. And I think Artificers big problem is they're the only class that the new enhancement trees are just flat out worse than the old system for really. It seems more difficult to make a workable melee artificer and you have to dump a ton of points into the casting tree to get all items caster level = 20 thing, which sucks.
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May 31, 2015 19:17
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I wouldn't play an artificer right now. If you really want to use repeaters, the rogue ranged tree got made over and is very solid for pure ranged rogue, or 12 pal 6 rogue will make a shockingly strong repeater user. They fixed the corrupt dat files on the test server so I was able to get in a solid day of testing. Warlocks have some great potential. I felt a bit of a sting testing without all the comforts of the live server, but am really looking forward to more testing on a slightly better polished version, with souleater added in. It was really cool watching that chain bolt zip all over the screen, and I found it far too entertaining that while chain bolt would not break boxes, it would hit them and chain onto mobs. I did not care for my first attempt at a melee warlock hybrid, it seems like you have to make too many sacrifices for to little gains, but maybe they make a decent way for a melee who really wants to add self displacement and haste.
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May 31, 2015 20:02
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Did either of you check to see if Max/Empower was working on Blast or not? Last I heard the devs wanted them to work on Blast and Blast derived abilities (Ball for example) but people were claiming it didn't do anything. My damage didn't really feel that bad, so curious how it'll be if it's not working and they fix it. Extra 150 spellpower is not insignificant.
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May 31, 2015 20:10
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I checked it, it was not working for sure. I think this is just a matter of being the earliest implementation, because without it affecting them there is little reason to take the damage meta magics, which leaves a pure warlock with very few good feat choices, something the devs mentioned concern over. I also did not see one single crit on my main damage type for blasts, though I saw crits on the pact damage. I noticed in your video you were using the piercing damage type, and it looked like you were getting crits so I wonder if the base force type just doesn't crit.
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May 31, 2015 20:13
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Elswyyr posted:Welp, I think it's about time for my yearly return to this game, followed by quitting for unknown reasons. How's Artificer nowadays? They're called 'rogues' now since the Mechanic tree got some amazing buffs and the Battle Engineer tree is stale. (Great crossbow > heavy repeater in the hands of a mechanic IMHO) I just did a 8 rogue / 12 artificer quick 20 TR to get that life out of the way and the 12 artificer levels were basically meaningless.
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May 31, 2015 20:23
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What was your feat layout for that? I need to get an Artificer life done sometime here in the near future and while I don't think it'd be terrible to play, I pretty much just want to get it done.
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May 31, 2015 20:26
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DemonMage posted:What was your feat layout for that? I need to get an Artificer life done sometime here in the near future and while I don't think it'd be terrible to play, I pretty much just want to get it done. Human (extra feat unneeded, because of artificer freebies) 1st Point Blank, Precise Shot 2nd Rapid Reload - artificer 3rd Rapid Shot 6th Precision 9th Past Life Barbarian 12th Lesser Dragonmark of Passage, Improved Crit - arti 15th Quicken I think, I just like fast buffs 16th Improved Precise Shot - artificer 18th Toughness 20th something else random from arti freebie Something around 40 points in mechanic tree, KTA/Int-Hit from Harper tree, Dim Door from human, and the rest was thrown here and there. 6 rogue gets you INT/Damage so you don't need to bother with arti buffs. 300 point raw crits on a great crossbow, +12 sneak dice using great crossbow at 12th level. Seeing that I made a greensteel radiant great xbow and never looked back. Up until then I used heavy repeaters mostly (wounding/bleeding or holy/undead bane) After TRing I'm doing a pure rogue build and am seeing 600 point raw crits from the x4 boost at 18th level, and ~18 sneak dice with a great xbow. Heavy repeaters would be 3x crits, but would crit less and lose at least 8 sneak dice. This will be my cleric life, I have one of those +20 lesser hearts from way back that's been collecting dust.
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May 31, 2015 20:43
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Thanks and for anyone curious I was doing 19 Warlock/1 Cleric Sun Elf in the videos. PDK/Human is probably ideal. I couldn't get warlock to work in LRing since i'm VIP I couldn't buy it. Didn't feel like looking/trying workarounds or I would have dropped the 1 Cleric. 18 cha, 16(18) con, 14(12) int. 348 Acid, 350 force, 394 light, 294 positive | 26% acid/positive, 27% light, 31% force crit chance | 30% all crit multi Gear Eyes: Cannoneer's Goggles (225 SP, -10% spell costs), Helm: Mythic Seraphim (144 devo, deathblock 8, set bonus), Neck: Epic Noxious Embers (17% spell crit) Trinket: Epic Litany (+2 stats) Cloak: Epic Cloak of Ice (junk) Belt: Epic Belt of Thoughtful Rememberance (deathblock 7, con 11, concentration 20, resist 11, dodge 11) Ring1: Epic ring of unknown origins (fear immunity, whirlwind ward) Gloves: Iron mitts (healing amp, vitality 40) Boots: Epic boots of the innocent (resist 11, speed 15, greater hero) Ring2: Lantern ring (insight cha 2, 40 false life, light damage proc, 18% light crit, 144 light spellpower, insightful wis 2) Bracers: Dumathoins Bracers (heavy fort, natural armor 10, ele resist 45, 30 PRR/MRR, 11 dex) Armor: Epic Scales of Surety (+3 insightful con, 50% exceptional fort, set bonus) Weapon: Thunder-Forged Rapier (corrosion 138, 22% force crit, 6 evoc DCs, 150 force) Offhand: Libram of Silver Magic (11 int/cha, 10 insightful potency, 2% insightful spell crit, 20 spellcraft) Lots of overlap here and I had an empty slot in my Libram, could have easily put devotion into that. The main thing you'd be missing out on from not having Tier 3 thunderforge or Noxious Embers (aka Epic Abbot loot) is going to be that spell crit on your acid/force. If you're fiend you can use the Sage's Goggles to cover your Fire damage and fire crit. There's probably a way to get some acid crit in here, you can get force crit from Sage's Bracers if nothing else. The rest of the stuff is either farmable fairly easily or replaceable pretty easily. Guardian's Ring instead of Unknown Origins will cover you for Sheltering. Resist Energy SLA is almost as good as having it passive. Also the Lesser Maximize on the Noxious would have been great if I'd swapped in Ruin as well I imagine. That's expensive base, let alone Max/Empowered. Feats: Empower, Maximize, Spell Focus Evoc, Greater Spell Focus Evoc, Wizard Past Life, Quicken, Mental Toughness, Improved Mental Toughness, Epic Spell Focus Evoc, Epic Damage Reduction, 30 Force Spellpower, Elusive Target With Human/PDK you could get Epic Mental Toughness, or swap that line for regular Toughness possibly. Or maybe get Heighten, depends on how that affects the SLAs. Quicken is mostly handy for SLAs so could also potentially be dropped if needed. 39 Enlightned Spirit, 41 Tainted Scholar Shiradi with Acid Energy Burst, Black Dragon Heritage, Radiant Power - Don't think this was ideal but it's lazy and obvious. DemonMage fucked around with this message at 21:12 on May 31, 2015 |
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May 31, 2015 21:10
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I didn't get a chance to test it, waiting on soul eater, but I was thinking about using TF throwing weapons instead of melee, and that would open up the two thrown attacks in shiradi for 2 no save helplessness. Also, if you wanted to do an arti past life as an iconic, 6 rog/12arti/2pali sacrifices very little from 8/12, and should make for a great iconic life, although ranged is probably still stronger at lower levels than epic so they might not be the best candidate for iconic lives.
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May 31, 2015 21:23
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Seconding that meta magics don't work on blasts. They do work on bursts and the other no-sp SLAs though
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May 31, 2015 22:49
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First world problem: Logging onto the game for the first time in FOREVER and having no idea what to do with the MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF STUFF you have on your old toons. I'm planning on starting a new toon but I don't necessarily want to get rid of all the great things that I already have, because they may not be items that are available anymore and that I could use the future or sell!
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May 31, 2015 23:33
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Hey Obnoticus, I'm on lammania on the character testhaggis if you wanna show me your build Edit: Anyone know where you can grab epic tapestry shreds in the test dojo? Game_Whino fucked around with this message at 03:38 on Jun 1, 2015 |
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Jun 1, 2015 00:31
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You guys are making we want to fire up DDO again. Between Witcher 3 and WoW I already lose all my free time. This is just going to make it worse...but Warlocks sound awesome, and I really need to finish that paladin life...
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Jun 1, 2015 07:03
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Game_Whino posted:Edit: Anyone know where you can grab epic tapestry shreds in the test dojo? Don't think you can. Didn't find any when poking around.
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Jun 1, 2015 07:57
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Gammon posted:You guys are making we want to fire up DDO again. Between Witcher 3 and WoW I already lose all my free time. This is just going to make it worse...but Warlocks sound awesome, and I really need to finish that paladin life... There is no better time to finish a paladin life. Especially if you're a bladeforged. Paladins kick rear end now. I'm not sure what the breakdown would be between preview warlock and paladin, but I have a feeling it would be close dps-wise with all the different procs and such you can get (and of course, enervating strike stance develing red-nameds. I really hope that they don't fix that)
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Jun 1, 2015 08:17
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Game_Whino posted:There is no better time to finish a paladin life. Especially if you're a bladeforged. Paladins kick rear end now. I'm not sure what the breakdown would be between preview warlock and paladin, but I have a feeling it would be close dps-wise with all the different procs and such you can get (and of course, enervating strike stance develing red-nameds. I really hope that they don't fix that) I'm a dwarf, because my original plan for this life was get to 28, ETR then TR again straight away. If all goes to plan, I'll have a 4 day weekend this weekend, so I'll see if I can get DDO all setup again in time for that, login and have a bit of fun again.
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Jun 1, 2015 11:12
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quote:Metamagics aren't intended to work with basic attack Eldritch Blasts, but relevant metamagics should work with most of the activated enhancements that are actually spells, so Quicken should work with enhancement versions of Conusion, Eldritch Burst, Command, Eldritch Ball, etc. I guess that frees up a lot of feats for Toughness unless you wanna go Ruin spec? Though I suppose that does make Energy Burst not worth it if you don't take metas. On the bright side they're going to make Blast work against breakables. [Edit] Basically I feel the devs were right, without metas working on Blasts there's a good argument for not taking the metas just for SLAs. Which then leaves you with not many good feat options. And it feels lovely to take max/emp for primarily Energy Burst and Cure Moderate. On the other hand it's nice not having a feat tax on your basic, but most people do in the form of combat style feats anyways. I guess it's nice to get away from that Bad Design, but I'm just really torn overall. DemonMage fucked around with this message at 20:29 on Jun 1, 2015 |
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Jun 1, 2015 20:19
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I'm gonna have soooo many toughnesses on my warlock. I'm tempted to do a full set of primal PLs too and then do my second and third warlock lives while out-HPing everyone but the barbs. I might still grab maximize for the cure mod since I don't have much in the way of healing amp gear at end game.
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Jun 1, 2015 23:15
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Heres a screenshot of the lock build I came up with on lamannia, managed to solo EE mentaus for the most part, still need to be careful if you get a bonus damage champion i got 2 shot by a golem that double hit for 385 apiece. Run in divine crusader ED. Bear in mind this is still a work in progress
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Jun 2, 2015 00:54
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Perpetual Notion posted:Heres a screenshot of the lock build I came up with on lamannia, managed to solo EE mentaus for the most part, still need to be careful if you get a bonus damage champion i got 2 shot by a golem that double hit for 385 apiece. Run in divine crusader ED. Bear in mind this is still a work in progress Can you explain this build a little bit? You give up a ton of poo poo by not going 18 or 20 warlock, and I don't see many benefits offered in those altnerante levels. I see you get to use longswords with charisma instead of strength, and you gain 8% spell crit but those are about the only dvantages I see, where as you gave up over 50% eldrich blast damage, which sems kind of huge, not to mention the extra dice and spells. I see almost no bonuses to meleeing either.
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Jun 2, 2015 01:19
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Hey guys, you can see a little of it in the videos that DemonMage (Caisha) posted, but I made a melee warlock since he was doing caster just to see how that panned out. I was a PDK with 2 fighter and 18 warlock, using Charisma to damage with longswords and keeping the aura going instead of shooting stuff manually, while whacking stuff with a sword. I had all three Single Weapon Fighting feats and offhanded a spellcaster book thing and was in the Divine Crusader ED. Took Energy Blast, Soundburst and presumably something else, I don't know. Bulked up on Charisma and evocation increasing feats and items and had a pretty solid feeling DC by the end of things, though it's hard to tell since as far as I can see, literally nothing affects your spell DCs when you mouse over things other than changing your core casting stat. By which I mean putting on a +5 evocation item and taking it off literally didn't change anything so who knows! Regardless, stuff didn't save that often and your Soundburst SLA is going to hit pretty consistently which is really nice. I felt really solid in a ridiculously melee heavy quest on Epic Hard, though not as much in Epic Elite just because you can easily be two-shot by things you're being surrounded by constantly due to no fault of your own in that one quest. I might try some others just to see what that's like, but I was hitting stuff pretty hard with my sword and doing good aura damage ticks. With empower/max not being useful with eldrich blast stuff, I suppose you'd have a lot of free feats doing this but hopefully that will be fixed at some point in the future and actually encourage warlocks to be able to take feats that actually do something for their class. If anyone is curious, I can try posting a video of things from my perspective, but I seemed to be doing at least as much damage as Caisha was if not a little more, I just sort of depended on being in melee range of everything and he was kiting everything around since he wanted to see what that was like.  4lyfe bro
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Jun 2, 2015 01:47
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I was wondering what build you were using, it sounds like unless you are going to grab the really powerful low level melee abilities, 18/2 or 18/1/1 is a good split for melee focused warlock, since you loose very little of your blasting ability which is key to damage without swashbuckling or stick fighting. I have tried 12lock/6rog/2pal stick fighitng + aura, and it worked out about as well as regular stick fighting, the aura is nice for AE damage, but you only take 1 of the two cleave blasts, since you go to tier 5 in rogue, which is kind of meh, and still lends towards wanting to cleave. This build also has evasion, and stupidly high saves, although you are split between dex and charisma for primary stats. Not that big a deal. Right now I am building up a 12 lock 3 bard 5 ranger Swashbuckling build, I will post the results later if anyone is interested.
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Jun 2, 2015 01:58
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I would just like to thank this group for the guild and the airship. You've turned my low level halfling rogue into a killing machine in these beginner quests.
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Jun 2, 2015 18:55
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Turns out I left my paladin at 14 which is better than I thought. Think I will try go for the ETR->TR combo on him, see what class lives I feel like skipping with my Otto stones I still have. I remember I really wanted to unlock Favoured Souls this life as well.
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Jun 2, 2015 21:25
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Gammon posted:Turns out I left my paladin at 14 which is better than I thought. Think I will try go for the ETR->TR combo on him, see what class lives I feel like skipping with my Otto stones I still have. I remember I really wanted to unlock Favoured Souls this life as well. Hit me up (I'm haggis) and I'll do favor runs with ya on stuff below your level
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Jun 3, 2015 00:05
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Fenris13 posted:Can you explain this build a little bit? You give up a ton of poo poo by not going 18 or 20 warlock, and I don't see many benefits offered in those altnerante levels. I see you get to use longswords with charisma instead of strength, and you gain 8% spell crit but those are about the only dvantages I see, where as you gave up over 50% eldrich blast damage, which sems kind of huge, not to mention the extra dice and spells. I see almost no bonuses to meleeing either. Yea I can expand on that a bit, its a melee hybrid build. Medium armor, bastard swords not longswords with single weapon fighting line and an orb offhand, effectively making it a greatsword with 30% haste but no expanded glancing blows. The blasts on a pure lock vs what I have now really wasn't that different. Dont bother with cleave feats you have the enhancements. And what you lose in blasts you more than make up for in melee.
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Jun 3, 2015 00:05
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I'm another returner, although my highest char since launch was like 6. I just want to swash and buckle and sing songs, is a full 20 bard running down the single weapon fighting feats viable, and how should I split my stats for it?
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Jun 3, 2015 02:24
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Being a dastardly swashbuckler is pretty easy actually. Full 20 bard works just fine, though personally, I'd probably go for a 4 rogue/16 bard mix just so you can get some of the neat tricks (especially Killer) that the Assassin tree offers. I'd put most of my points into dexterity, some into int so you can get disable devices, open lock, search, use magic device, perform and maybe heal at a minimum. I'd also ignore strength entirely and have an okay amount of charisma and constitution. Finally, in the Swashbuckler tree, I took Dashing Scoundrel, which gives you flat +damage and 10% doublestrike when wielding nothing in your offhand, Slap in the Face, which lets you almost guarantee a stun on enemies, which you then follow up with Coup de Grace, which instantly kills stunned enemies. The DC on Coup de Grace and Slap in the Face will be so high that basically nothing will ever reliably be able to resist them, meaning that every single time Coup de Grace comes off of cool down, you can reliably instantly kill a guy around you. Also if you get really overwhelmed, you can Fascinate a group of enemies, then pick them all off with Coup de Grace as well. Also, take Precision instead of Power Attack (which you won't qualify for anyway since you're ignoring strength), since Thread the Needle is just +5 damage anyway while in Precision stance, so there's no reason to ever use Power Attack while swashbuckling. I did this on my last life and it was pretty absurd. I was able to do tons of damage and crowd control entire rooms at once both with Fascinate and with the Sound Burst SLA you can get from one of the Epic Destiny trees. Caisha went with a strength-based build, while I stuck with dexterity and I feel that it probably made me a little stronger overall. I feel the same might hold true with intelligence, but it's a little more of a tradeoff, since dexterity gets you armor class (sort of useless on Elite difficulty, but you might not do those) and reflex save, which is really handy. Intelligence would let you take the Harper enhancement which gives you a bonus to damage based on the amount of intelligence you have, which would be sort of cool and might end up giving you a non-trivial amount of added damage at the endgame. That said, you can still take that enhancement and come out with a fair amount of added damage even if you don't focus on intelligence as your core stat. Finally, I'd ignore Weapon Precision entirely. When I made this character, I realized with some dawning horror that I didn't have any means of using dexterity to hit while swashbuckling and figured I might miss a lot. Was not even noticeable at all, so I'm pretty sure that when they overhauled the hit chance/AC system, they made it a lot easier to achieve a good hit rate without maxing your chance to hit chance out hugely.
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Jun 3, 2015 22:13
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So how are dungeons even handled in this game? When you can customize your character at the intro and choose their stats, and can choose whether or not to multiclass, are there any instances of people just not being good enough to go on a "raid"? A "Well we'd like to have you, but you have a level 20 Fighter, why didn't you take that one level of Cleric you idiot." mentality to it? I know enough about DnD to make an alright build, but probably nothing incredible. Was curious how ok the community is with stuff like that,
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Jun 4, 2015 20:41
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Rookersh posted:So how are dungeons even handled in this game? The game is too easy for people to be this picky about your build. It's not really a part of the culture, as far as I've seen. That said, for your first life on your first character, it's best to stick with a pure build. They're all at least decent. Multiclassing can produce really bad characters if you don't know what you're doing (knowledge of tabletop DnD is not much help here). But even then, it's likely few will even notice or care; it's more that you might find it less fun to play gimpy characters. The main thing you might catch crap for is not having enough HP. This is a highly visible mistake. So don't skimp on Constitution (less than 14 is rarely justified). eth0.n fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Jun 4, 2015 |
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Jun 4, 2015 21:21
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I silently judge anyone who has less HP than me in a pubbie party and sometimes in goon groups. If I know you don't have enough hp to survive a drop in the pit (and you aren't wearing featherfall) I will be greasing the walkway. I'm kind of a dick though, it's my thing.
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Jun 4, 2015 21:28
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eth0.n posted:The game is too easy for people to be this picky about your build. It's not really a part of the culture, as far as I've seen. Yeah, as I mentioned I do know a bit about DnD. I was planning on a 16-18 Str, 14-16 Con, 12ish Dex Fighter with the rest of my stats between 8-10ish, which I figured would be enough to get me through the base game. I was just worried that I'd get flak/poo poo for being a level 20 Fighter trying to do stuff near the end of the game, rather then a 12F/6R/2C mismash thing for xyz reason you wouldn't know before beating the game the first time. Every DnD video game I've played has had different rules ( Dex gives free armor! Dex is countered by wearing armor! Dex does nothing at all! ), so I figured it'd be best to just stick with the straight and narrow safe bet of a high Str/Con Fighter. Just wanted to make sure I could do that before I started. Otherwise I'd have gone and dug up some guides first.
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Jun 4, 2015 21:42
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Saying "dexterity gives AC" and "armor counters dexterity" actually both apply to D&D 3rd Edition. Dexterity gives bonus armor up to the max dex bonus of the armor that you're wearing. In the case of a bard swashbuckler like I was describing above, you'd be wearing light armor which has a very high dex bonus along with the enhancements from swashbuckler which gives you even more max dex bonus. So unless you have way too much dexterity to cap it out and then some, you're still going to be getting AC from dexterity. Light armor has a very high max dex bonus, medium less so, with heavy armor having almost none at all. So your 40 dexterity isn't going to do you any good while running around in full plate, but depending on which particular piece of light armor you're wearing, it very well could. Also, 20 fighter is perfectly viable, but fighters are one of the least impressive or fun melee classes in the game. You're probably better off picking literally any other class in the game and leveling them up to 20 if you want to maintain a pure split. Note this includes wizards, sorcerers (though sorcerers are going to be the weakest here if you don't plan on any real offensive spells), clerics and favored souls, all of whom make better and more interesting melee fighters than the fighter does himself. The reason for this is that each of these classes have trees that are melee-oriented and with the buffs and other spells they have available, they're able to outmatch a fighter. That said, it's probably better if you're going to do something like be a melee wizard to split your classes, but you can still be perfectly viable as a pale master/eldrich knight level 20 wizard, who would have better aoe damage, defense, healing and buffs than a level 20 fighter.
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Jun 5, 2015 00:28
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Just incase anybody was waiting around for it, no new Lamannia build this week/end. Current plan is to get a ton of polish + Soul Eater build in early next week.
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Jun 5, 2015 20:56
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God I miss playing this game with you big ol' crowd of weirdos and ne'er-do-wells but I can't justify it with my timezone and work schedule. This is almost certainly a 'no', but have server populations increased to the point where I can reliably PUG stuff about 1am-6am US time on a weeknight? I can't enjoy this game playing solo or with hirelings, and whenever I would log on in prime time here, every server would be a dead zone, including the "australasian" ones.
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Jun 6, 2015 08:26
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Brain In A Jar posted:God I miss playing this game with you big ol' crowd of weirdos and ne'er-do-wells but I can't justify it with my timezone and work schedule. Sup fellow Aussie (I am assuming)! This game is definitely more fun with just one more person to regularly cruise around with. Soloing is fine for some things, but most of the good quests I find I need to do with other people because I am bad at being versatile.
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Jun 6, 2015 14:32
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OH wow, potentially 3 aussies playing?
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Jun 6, 2015 15:05
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Resubbed for 3 months. Let's see how this goes. Is there any way to check what my current max tomes are? I figure some +6 ones while they're on sale isn't bad, but I can't remember which stats I've got the largest tomes for, and at only 14 I'm not going to hit a high enough level to find out in time.
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Jun 7, 2015 00:24
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Sadly I don't think there is unless you can hit 19 and see if you have +5 or not at least. You could try paging about it, they MIGHT be able to tell you. It's definitely kind of a crappy, if niche, issue. Also they're going to tie caster level to epic level, possibly in U26, instead of to destiny stuff. Which is largely a buff. They're going to look at DC issues and other changes going forward but this is one small one they can sneak in. Also some potential critical damage spell feats there, which is handy for damage casters who don't have much interesting ones to take. DemonMage fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jun 7, 2015 |
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Jun 7, 2015 00:38
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