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SubG posted:It's kinda crazy that they've gone up in price as much as they have, but there aren't a lot of competing options if you're specifically looking for something cheaper. The low-end Tojiro Chinese cleaver is a hundred bucks more. The Moritaka's over two hundred more. About the cheapest `name brand' Chinese cleaver you're going to find outside the CCK is the JCK house brand cleaver, which is still more expensive than the CCK and a couple inches smaller. Same with the Misono #6, which is another `entry level' Chinese cleaver, but'll still run you around US$125 and is under 200mm. And for the record, Amazon does not sell CCK slicers. 
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Jun 12, 2015 14:37
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Flash Gordon Ramsay posted:And for the record, Amazon does not sell CCK slicers. Uh, no, no I definitely did not. Stay away from me.
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Jun 12, 2015 16:33
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Flash Gordon Ramsay posted:And for the record, Amazon does not sell CCK slicers.
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Jun 12, 2015 17:00
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It's good to see that Amazon is reaching out to the (BME Pain) olympic athlete.
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Jun 12, 2015 17:48
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My cock slicer is made of the finest Hanzo steel.
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Jun 12, 2015 18:48
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heheh that's an interesting cock timer
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Jun 12, 2015 20:55
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I cook quite a bit and have been using a set of Cuisinart Ceramic Knives/A few Harbor freight ceramic chef's for about 5 years. I have broken a few HF knives(By broken I mean the blades chipped when my fiance or her mother would cut on a dinnerplate with them) and the cusinart Chef's knife has a few small chips. I know a few years back a few goons were saying Kyoceras were decent ceramic knives so I have been looking for a good deal. The Cutlery and More.com warehouse had a rummage sale today and I picked up a Kyocera 6" Nakiri for $10, 6" Santoku for $10 and a Santoku/Pairing set for $15. I have had really good luck thus far with cheap ceramics by treating them carefully and using a kapoosh knife block. I know Kyocera offers a lifetime guarantee/sharpening and was wondering if any goons have had to use it? I didn't notice at the sale but the Santoku/Pairing set has a tiny chip out of the Santoku in the package so I'm wondering it I should just send it in before I try to use it.
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Jun 13, 2015 01:25
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Steve Yun posted:Can anyone recommend a good chinese chef knife that's not the CKTG CCK? $70 is ridiculous. just go to your local ethnic market, and pick up a cleaver that looks good. honestly. one of my favorite knives of all time is the one I got in this manner, and it was like a $9 cleaver. I chop through two inch thick solid frozen cubes of stock, hack chicken bones in half, make precise cuts, mince herbs, everything. It holds an edge not as well as a my thin high carbon knives, but when its fresh off the sharpening stone, it's every bit as sharp. love it. has an awesome (maybe bamboo?) wooden handle too. worst case scenario, you spent 9 dollars, and now own a knife you don't really like all that much. sell it in a garage sale for 15, a bargain, clearly!
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Jun 15, 2015 06:06
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Can I just let off some steam here? I picked up a Tojiro DP parer from Amazon - 3 times, from 3 different sellers but Fulfilled By Amazon. My god the fit and finish on these is garbage, it's more what you'd expect from a bottom of the barrel made in China Wally World special. First one I don't remember much about - the out of the box edge was so dull I ran my thumb down the edge and nothing happened. Could not cut paper, at all; it would just slide along the length of the blade. The edge was so thick you could actually see it. I may have been better off if I just sharpened this one, but it was delivered via slow boat from China (ParcelPool) and to top it off, it was delivered late, so it went back. Second one was the worst of the three. A crooked and wonky looking blade with a blunted tip. Handle had gaps by the bolster, by the rivets, and along the spine. Edge was at least capable of slicing paper. Box was taped shut and the adhesive residue left behind was sticky like it was sitting on the shelf for a long, long time. Sent back. Third one has a weird ground down spot on the spine near the bolster, one relatively big gap on one side where the bolster and scales meet, but the primary blade grind is pretty good and it's relatively straight. This seller had the box wrapped up in cellophane so the Amazon UPC sticker wasn't stuck on the front of the box, which was a nice surprise. I know Tojiro has somewhat of a reputation for their dodgy fit and finish, but jeez, there's gotta be a limit to acceptable wabi sabi or whatever you want to call it.
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Jun 15, 2015 12:31
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Scott808 posted:I know Tojiro has somewhat of a reputation for their dodgy fit and finish, but jeez, there's gotta be a limit to acceptable wabi sabi or whatever you want to call it. Wabi-sabi should call to mind impermanence and transience, although I see where you're going.  Morimoto's old knives demonstrate wabi-sabi. If Victorinox and Tojiro are both dodgy now, and you can't convince someone to go Chinese cleaver, what's next? Like... a Mac or something? I don't even know.
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Jun 15, 2015 17:16
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Scott808 posted:I know Tojiro has somewhat of a reputation for their dodgy fit and finish, but jeez, there's gotta be a limit to acceptable wabi sabi or whatever you want to call it. You're paying for the quality steel with Tojiro dude, pretty sure we've said that all throughout the thread. You get a great knife with rough F&F for less than 100bux. You want good F&F, get ready to spend $250+
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Jun 15, 2015 17:20
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A lot of us are not interested in doing the fiddling that comes with that. I almost bought a Tojiro and I'm glad I didn't. What's wrong with the Victorinox as an entry-level knife now? I didn't hear about problems. You can get a very good knife with good fit and finish for well under $250, that's a very high line to draw. I have a Mac Professional that came in around $150. I'm not sure how good they are, but Mac has at least two lines below Professional, so if there really is a problem with the Victorinox now, they might be worth a look. I'm looking at an 8" Chef series knife on Amazon that's $60., which IIRC is around Tojiro DP pricing. (I can't vouch for it myself.)
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Jun 15, 2015 17:59
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I got The Miracle Blade III set from Amazon they are soooo freaking good I love them
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Jun 15, 2015 18:31
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Nooner posted:I got The Miracle Blade III set from Amazon they are soooo freaking good I love them An 11 piece set for $23? That seems a little cheap for knives. Let's see what the manufacturer has to say about them: Amazon posted:High-quality German stainless-steel blades; never dull--no need for sharpening I would expect magic knives to be more expensive.
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Jun 15, 2015 18:34
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guppy posted:A lot of us are not interested in doing the fiddling that comes with that. I almost bought a Tojiro and I'm glad I didn't. What's wrong with the Victorinox as an entry-level knife now? I didn't hear about problems. Page back to the bit about the Victorinox costing 2x as much as when it was the thread endorsement? At that price it's kind of hard to recommend. Not a bad knife, but there are other options at that price point. At $25, the Victorinox was a clear winner in budget knives. Compared to a Tojiro it's lower-quality steel (from what I've heard) but at least you get a consistent knife, and for $25 you can gently caress up and chip it and just buy a new one who cares. At $50-$60? Not as much. I still love my knife, but if I'm recommending a starter for someone, I might have to insist on a Chinese cleaver because gently caress ruining a $60+ knife because you're an untrained moron. Or just give them my old Victrorinox and buy a Global. Why yes, that sounds reasonable.
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Jun 15, 2015 18:48
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Flash Gordon Ramsay posted:An 11 piece set for $23? That seems a little cheap for knives. Let's see what the manufacturer has to say about them: yeah they are a really great deal! You have to be careful with them though, they are really sharp and I accidnetly cut myself a few times when I first bought them cause i was so used to using the bad dull knives I had before
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Jun 15, 2015 19:07
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revdrkevind posted:Page back to the bit about the Victorinox costing 2x as much as when it was the thread endorsement? At that price it's kind of hard to recommend. Not a bad knife, but there are other options at that price point. Huh. I definitely wouldn't pay $50-60 for the Victorinox, or suggest that anyone else do so. But I see it between $35-40 on Amazon, same as it's been for a long time now. I do see the rosewood-handled version (versus Fibrox) at $55; I wonder if that's where the confusion is coming from. I don't think I've seen the Victorinox at $25 except as a temporary markdown. There's a 10" version even cheaper at $31 right now.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:19
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The best bet with the Victorinox is to set up a 3Camels alert. That's how I paid $30 for the Frustration-Free Packaging version last year.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:59
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guppy posted:Huh. I definitely wouldn't pay $50-60 for the Victorinox, or suggest that anyone else do so. But I see it between $35-40 on Amazon, same as it's been for a long time now. I do see the rosewood-handled version (versus Fibrox) at $55; I wonder if that's where the confusion is coming from. Dunno why I'm blind and couldn't find the last link but http://camelcamelcamel.com/Victorinox-Fibrox-8-Inch-47520-5-2063-20/product/B000638D32 Mine was $29.12 years ago and without really digging for a sale, and a lazy google shows prices more like ~$38-45 ("Victorinox Chef knife" first Amazon result is 38.xx, sidebar shows a lot of 44.xx), and trend seems to be toward the $45 range although maybe that's just a flux. Which isn't bad, it's just not the dirt cheap wonder I initially recommended it as.
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Jun 15, 2015 20:01
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revdrkevind posted:Which isn't bad, it's just not the dirt cheap wonder I initially recommended it as. It's still basically the same price if everyone's earnings actually kept up with inflation.
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Jun 15, 2015 22:26
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I bought one last fall for a little less than $35. That's not a bad price for that knife, I think.
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Jun 16, 2015 01:13
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Does that mean they just take the knife and put a stamp on the side of it and drop it in the mailbox?
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Jun 16, 2015 02:16
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CrazyLittle posted:Does that mean they just take the knife and put a stamp on the side of it and drop it in the mailbox? No, it's just cardboard packaging, so you don't have to mess with the space plastic.
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Jun 16, 2015 02:51
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revdrkevind posted:Wabi-sabi should call to mind impermanence and transience, although I see where you're going. I'm no expert on the intricacies of wabi sabi, but I always hear imperfection, or finding the beauty in imperfections, as part of it. Tojiro has had a reputation for dodgy fit and finish for a long time now. Why is Victorinox dodgy? Chef De Cuisinart posted:You're paying for the quality steel with Tojiro dude, pretty sure we've said that all throughout the thread. You get a great knife with rough F&F for less than 100bux. You want good F&F, get ready to spend $250+ Are you arguing for a quality blade or just quality steel? A quality blade with a not so great handle I can understand, but a poor blade just because it's a higher grade of steel than most mass market kitchen knives, sorry, that I don't buy into. I would argue that a "great knife" includes the handle. At the end of the day there are different things that people are going to find acceptable in terms of fit and finish - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557177&pagenumber=13&perpage=40#post427881182 Chef De Cuisinart posted:It's kinda common with the DP series. This is why I buy from ck2g because Mark won't send those out. Honestly though, it's not that big a deal, you can fill it in yourself, and it's still an amazing knife for the price. In that conversation you said Mark from CKTG won't send out Tojiros with fit and finish issues, but reading reviews on his own store it's clear that he does. Does he only not send those out to customers who specifically ask that they not get knives with those flaws? I have other Tojiro knives that aren't nearly as bad as the paring knives. My Tojiro F-270 bread knife has tiny handle gaps that are visible if you hold them up to light. I have Tojiro gyutos with small gaps by the handle and bolster, and on my 270mm the tang is proud of the scales. But since it's on the butt of the handle it doesn't bother me. I've read opinions from others that they find a tang standing proud of the scales to be unacceptable at any price point. The choils are somewhat sharp and had burrs out of the box, so I took off the burrs and softened the edges. Again, stuff I have no issue with touching up. A crooked knife and a poor grind, though, are not for me.
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Jun 16, 2015 03:53
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guppy posted:No, it's just cardboard packaging, so you don't have to mess with the space plastic. Sounds like a bit of frustration to me (actually the amazon packaging is really really great compared to space plastic that can cut you all on its own.)
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Jun 16, 2015 05:30
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Does the length of the honing rod matter? I've got a 10" chef's knife, would I need one at least that long?
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Jun 20, 2015 01:49
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22 Eargesplitten posted:Does the length of the honing rod matter? I've got a 10" chef's knife, would I need one at least that long? Not really, it's more of a look and feel thing. On a shorter one you need to move the blade across the surface of the rod more rapidly so that you don't reach the end of the rod before getting a full stroke on the blade, it's not an issue unless the rod is really, really short and the blade is really long. I could see a 8 inch rod being a bit of a pain on something like a 12 or 14 inch knife, but few knives are that long.
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Jun 20, 2015 03:04
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Hello dinner,
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Jun 21, 2015 05:09
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:Stainless steel is fine, all of mine are stainless and they cut extremely well. For both the aesthetics and functional qualities of the knife to be quite high I would budget $300-$500 for the gyuto, $150-$250 for the parring knife and $200-$300 for the nakiri. You should also think about other qualities of the knife like the hardness of the steel, the weight, thickness, profile and geometry of the blade and so on. Since you will be able to hold the knife in your hand before buying you will have an easier time finding one that feels right to you. For steel hardness I like 61-63 HRC, that gives you a nice balance of edge taking and durability. Heavier knives will give your arm more of a work out but will also have better performance when doing things like rapid chopping. The thickness and geometry of the blade will have a huge effect on how it goes through different ingredients, the thinner the knife the more easily it will cut but it will also be more easily damage and need sharpening a little more often. Profile is how much curve the edge has and in what shape. You will notice that both my gyutos have very flat profiles and make a large amount of contact with the board, this is good for me because I don't do much rocking when I cut, instead I do slices, push cuts and rapid chopping. If you rock a lot you might want something more like a continuous gentle curve with less of a flat spot. Anyway, there are tons of factors that go into finding a really good knife that is a good fit for yourself, good luck with your search.  drat, that much huh. Ok. Gonna start saving now. Thanks for the write-up, it was really helpful!
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Jun 21, 2015 23:37
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I'm looking for a petty knife. I've heard the Dojo recommended here, but it seems a little small. Moritaka seems to be well respected, they've got a 165mm that looks good to me. Is there anything in between that price range I should be looking at, or anything I should beware with those? http://www.chefknivestogo.com/dojopetty135mm.html http://www.chefknivestogo.com/mosu16pe.html
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Jun 22, 2015 00:03
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Karia posted:I'm looking for a petty knife. I've heard the Dojo recommended here, but it seems a little small. Moritaka seems to be well respected, they've got a 165mm that looks good to me. Is there anything in between that price range I should be looking at, or anything I should beware with those? I can say from personal experience that 135mm is quite small, so you're right on that 150mm feels much larger, 165mm might feel a little cumbersome for in the hand work, 150mm is a nice sweet spot IME. Other knives I'd look at in your price range: http://www.chefknivestogo.com/fujiwara4.html Stainless clad, white steel core and treated to an extremely high hardness. From everything I have heard it is one of the best knives on the market period and it's both in stock and a bit cheaper than the Moritaka. http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kar2pe15.html Fully stainless knife with a core of R2 steel. I own the 240mm gyuto version of this knife and I can say that it is a superb knife that does a great balancing act between performance and durability, R2 steel holds a great edge for a long time and it can get incredibly sharp with a good sharpening. http://www.chefknivestogo.com/koaosupe15.html Stainless clad AS steel, should be a great performer just like the rest of the Kohetsu AS line, also pretty cheap and in stock. http://www.chefknivestogo.com/takamura2.html All stainless with an R2 core like the Kamo R2 above. Has a very nice western handle, incredibly thin and high performance, the R2 lets it hold an edge for a long, long time. Probably the best straight up cutter of all of the knives here, because of it's thinness it will be slightly flexible. Incredible knife for the money if you don't mind the smallish western handle.
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Jun 22, 2015 01:28
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:I can say from personal experience that 135mm is quite small, so you're right on that 150mm feels much larger, 165mm might feel a little cumbersome for in the hand work, 150mm is a nice sweet spot IME. Other knives I'd look at in your price range: Hmm, interesting. Thanks for the suggestions. I'm going to turn down the Shiro Kamo right off the bat: fake damascus steel patterns annoy me. How much do I need to worry about the white steel #1 core on the Fujiwara? My nakiri is SLD, I'm of the impression that shirogami is on a whole different level of corrosion. How does it compare to the Kohetsu's AS in toughness and corrosion resistance? I'm really uncertain about the western handle. I haven't really used mine regularly since I got my nakiri. That may be a deal breaker for the Takamura, unfortunately. I'll break out the chef's knife for a bit to see how it feels.
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Jun 22, 2015 02:53
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Karia posted:I'm looking for a petty knife. I've heard the Dojo recommended here, but it seems a little small. Moritaka seems to be well respected, they've got a 165mm that looks good to me. Is there anything in between that price range I should be looking at, or anything I should beware with those? Why do you want a petty knife?
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Jun 22, 2015 02:56
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Karia posted:I'm really uncertain about the western handle. I haven't really used mine regularly since I got my nakiri. That may be a deal breaker for the Takamura, unfortunately. I'll break out the chef's knife for a bit to see how it feels. I love takamura steel, but those handles are goddamn tiny. I have small hands, and would consider them too small for my use.
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Jun 22, 2015 03:00
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SubG posted:The Dojo recommendations were probably for the paring, not the petty knife. It rocks. A few reasons, really. A. My paring knife isn't that great, and I find it's often too small for any real work. I'd prefer something larger that has a wider applicable range. B. I want a knife for some meat work unlike my nakiri, but I really don't need the fullsize gyuto, and having the smaller blade would be good for more delicate trimming. So essentially I want a mid-sized knife that can be used for delicate work. Chef De Cuisinart posted:I love takamura steel, but those handles are goddamn tiny. I have small hands, and would consider them too small for my use. Yeah, the picture definitely looked that way. Anybody know how big the handle is on the Fujiwara? It seems like it's smaller than the Takamura, though the octagon is probably a bit wider. More finger clearance, though.
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Jun 22, 2015 03:22
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Karia posted:Hmm, interesting. Thanks for the suggestions. I'm going to turn down the Shiro Kamo right off the bat: fake damascus steel patterns annoy me. From what I have read about the Fujiwara it is not very reactive, in fact it is pretty low on the reactivity scale for white steel, it will be more reactive then the SLD knife but SLD is semi-stainless so that is to be expected. Over all I'd favor the Kamo R2, but if the damascus is a deal breaker then I'd say get the Fujiwara as long as you are comfortable with cleaning it after every use and keeping the edge dry. EDIT: Karia posted:Yeah, the picture definitely looked that way. Anybody know how big the handle is on the Fujiwara? It seems like it's smaller than the Takamura, though the octagon is probably a bit wider. More finger clearance, though. It's a 5 inch handle, get a ruler and compare the proportions in the picture scaled to the length of the handle and you should get a fair idea of how large the handle is. AVeryLargeRadish fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Jun 22, 2015 |
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Jun 22, 2015 03:24
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:From what I have read about the Fujiwara it is not very reactive, in fact it is pretty low on the reactivity scale for white steel, it will be more reactive then the SLD knife but SLD is semi-stainless so that is to be expected. Over all I'd favor the Kamo R2, but if the damascus is a deal breaker then I'd say get the Fujiwara as long as you are comfortable with cleaning it after every use and keeping the edge dry. "Damascus" to me just seems like the ultimate appearance over content thing (yes, I realize the irony of the fact that I'm judging the knife by it's appearance rather than performance.) Actual damascus steel cannot be made now. If they just called it etched or pattern welded steel I'd be totally cool with it, but they have to throw the name on there. I'll sleep on it, not going to pull the trigger for a few days, but it actually really pisses me off. Hey, someone being stubborn and obstinate on the internet? Surprise.
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Jun 22, 2015 04:44
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Karia posted:"Damascus" to me just seems like the ultimate appearance over content thing (yes, I realize the irony of the fact that I'm judging the knife by it's appearance rather than performance.) Actual damascus steel cannot be made now. If they just called it etched or pattern welded steel I'd be totally cool with it, but they have to throw the name on there. I'll sleep on it, not going to pull the trigger for a few days, but it actually really pisses me off. Oh, I know that the method to making real damascus has long been lost. It's just that it's no different than the nashiji, hammered, and so on finishes you see on many high end japanese knives, it does not impair the function of the knife in any way so it's not form over function, it's just adding beauty to an already very functional object. It's a bit like objecting to there being carvings and such on really nice hand made furniture, form and function can go together and I don't really see anything wrong with that. Now if you just dislike how damascus finishes look then that is another matter entirely, everyone has their own tastes in aesthetics and that is cool.
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Jun 22, 2015 04:58
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Scott808 posted:I'm no expert on the intricacies of wabi sabi, but I always hear imperfection, or finding the beauty in imperfections, as part of it. Victorinox isn't dodgy- except that it's got a cheapo plastic handle (which actually has perfect fit and finish for what it is), and the quality of the steel is not as good as a "real" (Shun or better) chef knife. It's a great starter and not a bad knife at all, but it does leave you hankering to someday move up to one of the big names. Not to continue to be a rampant Japanophile but it's just that you're missing half of wabi-sabi. Half is imperfection, half is transience. So getting a poorly-finished Tojiro, but falling in love with it because the blade is amazing, is a good start. Going on to realize that if you keep using it you're going to grind that blade down, and accepting that as a natural consequence of using a knife, is the other half. AVeryLargeRadish posted:Oh, I know that the method to making real damascus has long been lost. And modern steel outperforms it. So you're paying more for a pretty design that, even if it were accurate, isn't as good as a modern steel of the same price.
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Jun 22, 2015 15:26
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Does anyone know of any good places in the Northeast US to go check out knives in person? I'm looking to finally get a decent chef's knife and I'd really like to be able to hold some different handles and lengths and see what feels right to me before purchasing something. I live in Orlando and have been looking all around this state for a place to check out knives down here with little to no luck. I have a few work trips in the northeast over the next couple months though and figured if there were any places up there, it might be worth looking into.
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Jun 22, 2015 15:50
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