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I'm a couple of days late with this (the revision set things back a bit, I think), but I finally got to sit down for a conversation about Beast with Matthew McFarland and got a more comprehensive sense for what his vision is for the game now: here.
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Jun 14, 2015 21:43
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I guess it's kind of impressive that McFarland's just going to stick to his guns on this terror and fear thing, considering that before a couple weeks ago just about no one would have taken the claim that creatures such as "dragons, krakens, and griffins" primarily evoked Fear as opposed to Wonder/Awe seriously. That's not even getting into the fact that you don't actually play as a dragon, a kraken, or a griffin.
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Jun 14, 2015 21:53
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quote:I guess it's kind of impressive that McFarland's just going to stick to his guns on this terror and fear thing, considering that before a couple weeks ago just about no one would have taken the claim that creatures such as "dragons, krakens, and griffins" primarily evoked Fear as opposed to Wonder/Awe seriously. They can rewrite some of the fluff but there's no way they were going to dump the entire concept of the book. They'd have to rewrite all of the mechanics and start from step 0 rather than rewriting some of the fluff sections and mostly leaving the mechanics (Nightmares, etc.) alone.
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Jun 14, 2015 21:56
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I run a Demon game set in Long Island, and I enjoy fleshing out the other supernaturals around, though my players may rarely, if ever, run into them. I'm going to talk about them because I like talking about stuff and may end up using the setting again later for other lines. I want opinions. Most of what I have at the moment is fragmentary, mind you. Vampires The Invictus are primarily based around crime - local Mafiosos and street gangs, primarily. They haven't been doing quite so well since the 90s - crime rates are dropping, and the police have been cracking down. This has led to some internal strife within the Invictus - they're weakening, and a growing segment of the more upper-class Invictus wants to move to infiltrating the cops. The lower-class members - some of whom are quite powerful - won't hear of it. The old-school mafiosos and the street monsters don't like rats, y'see, but a few of them are okay with the idea of dirty cops. It's just not exactly an easy sell. The only notable NPC I have used so far is a Ventrue who lives in the subway system, running a brisk drug trade with the aid of the homeless people who live in the tunnels of Brooklyn, a number of whom he's ghouled. Leon Radescue, Lord of the Mole-People, is making inroads into Long Island's drug trade due to conflict with one of the PCs, who is a member of MS-13. The Carthians are built like an old-school labor movement - grassroots politics, workforces. They're big on the Occupy movement, but their roots actually date back to the turn of the 19th century and immigrant workers unionizing. Their leadership is primarily in the form of one charismatic, century-old vampire who used to be a union man. He collects Golden Age comic books and has made it a law that no Carthian in New York crosses picket lines, on pain of death. They're mostly drawn from workers, low-level cops and other blue-collar folks. The Lancea et Sanctum are the boardroom vampires, ever since the infusion of some new blood back in the 70s and 80s. Much as standard-issue Lance theology is a twisted and corrupted Catholicism, these guys have latched onto the Prosperity Gospel and bent it backwards to fit. It's not as heretical to the Lance as you'd think - they basically just have decided that material wealth is proof of God's love, and draw mostly from the wealthy stockbrokers of Wall Street and the socialites of New York. Their entire theological setup is built to reinforce the idea that wealth is the blessing of God, and that their purpose is to terrorize and punish the weak (IE, the poor) for not having the spiritual fortitude to pull themselves up. The local Bishop is basically Gordon Gekko. The Carthians and Invictus are actually rather united in hating these guys. Haven't really found a place for the Ordo or the Circle yet in my thoughts. More later on other groups.
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Jun 14, 2015 22:11
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Mors Rattus posted:Much as standard-issue Lance theology is a twisted and corrupted Catholicism, these guys have latched onto the Prosperity Gospel and bent it backwards to fit. Bend nothing, Prosperity Gospel fits the modern Sanctified to a T.
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Jun 14, 2015 23:49
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Kavak posted:Bend nothing, Prosperity Gospel fits the modern Sanctified to a T. The main twist is that in the real world, the Prosperity Gospel is, perhaps ironically, most popular with the poor as an attempt to try and control their situation. 
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Jun 15, 2015 01:31
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Mors Rattus posted:The main twist is that in the real world, the Prosperity Gospel is, perhaps ironically, most popular with the poor as an attempt to try and control their situation. Oddly, a bunch of papers I've read on Prosperity gospel suggested while this was true, its real home is among the middle classes, who are prosperous enough to see it 'working' but also to want more. They are then disagreed with by other papers saying what you're saying. The one thing we can definitely agree on is that Prosperity gospel is incredibly depressing. E: Looking back over my old paper and references, it isn't Prosperity gospel that's especially popular with the middle class, it's Megachurches, specifically, so I'm wrong and yes, Prosperity Gospel preys primarily on the poor. 
Night10194 fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Jun 15, 2015 |
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Jun 15, 2015 01:34
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Mors Rattus posted:The main twist is that in the real world, the Prosperity Gospel is, perhaps ironically, most popular with the poor as an attempt to try and control their situation. Yeah, you've got to research really carefully to avoid creating a World of Darkness that ends up better than our world in some ways. It's why I prefer to just focus on the monsters, real life is bad enough as-is.
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Jun 15, 2015 01:40
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The thing that's so insidious about the Prosperity Gospel is that it makes a victim blame themselves for being victimized. It's one of those 'cannot fail, only be failed' ideologies, because it's based around the charismatic figure who has all the money and thus is 'obvious' proof it works. And so people blame their own lack of faith as their kids go hungry or they get sick and die. Goddamnit, everything about it makes me sad.
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Jun 15, 2015 01:44
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But yeah the Prosperity Gospel is what gave me the idea to have the Lance be the Wolves of Wall Street.
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Jun 15, 2015 01:54
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Nice. I'm doing a game set in a version of Detroit that is actually beginning to rebuild and my Lancea is split between the old school faction who believe that the city is hopelessly corrupt and must destroy itself for soul s to be saved and the new school faction who want to surgically remove the worst of the worst in order to put the fear of God into the less heinous sinners.
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Jun 15, 2015 05:09
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Kavak posted:Yeah, you've got to research really carefully to avoid creating a World of Darkness that ends up better than our world in some ways. It's why I prefer to just focus on the monsters, real life is bad enough as-is. Just do what I do and throw in the adjectives Warped, Evil, Sinister, and Shadow liberally. The coterie has a covert meeting with their informant in the Wraped Parking Lot of an Evil McDonald's in Sinister Los Angeles, Shadow California. Work done, hire me White Wolf.
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Jun 15, 2015 05:51
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Loomer posted:The coterie has a covert meeting with their informant in the Wraped Parking Lot of an Evil McDonald's in Sinister Los Angeles, Shadow California. "Sir, the entire parking lot is covered in what appears to be Christmas paper." "Only the Sabbat are capable of something so twisted."
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Jun 15, 2015 05:55
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In the World of Darkness, Kwanzaa is a federal holiday in the United States. 
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Jun 15, 2015 05:56
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Obviously it was a paradox backlash from the earlier battle between Warped Kung Fu Monks and Shadow Robot Nerds.
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Jun 15, 2015 05:57
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Loomer posted:Obviously it was a paradox backlash from the earlier battle between Warped Kung Fu Monks and Shadow Robot Nerds. I think the latter is a Free Council legacy.
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Jun 15, 2015 07:00
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I really need to read the Ordo Dracul book some time. I've always had this impression of them as a bunch of radical loners whose studies isolate them from society at large and only really see them come together in large numbers to show off and share tips on their depravity; the Otaku of the Vampire world,.
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Jun 15, 2015 15:06
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Axelgear posted:I really need to read the Ordo Dracul book some time. I've always had this impression of them as a bunch of radical loners whose studies isolate them from society at large and only really see them come together in large numbers to show off and share tips on their depravity; the Otaku of the Vampire world,. RequiemHack.
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Jun 15, 2015 16:55
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Axelgear posted:I really need to read the Ordo Dracul book some time. I've always had this impression of them as a bunch of radical loners whose studies isolate them from society at large and only really see them come together in large numbers to show off and share tips on their depravity; the Otaku of the Vampire world,. There's definitely a lot of that in the Ordo (They don't proselytize, demonstrate, or really recruit in an active way, and tend to make other covenants nervous considering the Ordo's mild 'gently caress it all' attitude towards Domain politics...), but there's also a strong sense of an old-fashioned university or philosophical school, where cabals of students learn at the feet of more learned professors and mystics.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:00
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Kurieg posted:"Sir, the entire parking lot is covered in what appears to be Christmas paper."
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Jun 15, 2015 19:35
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A certain kind of them sure.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:39
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Loomer posted:Just do what I do and throw in the adjectives Warped, Evil, Sinister, and Shadow liberally. Pretty sure this is the preferred method in Darkest Vancouver.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:42
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CommissarMega posted:Didn't it have something to do with the power of True Names and such? If you know Winter Harrow's true name is Rob Robertson, then your spells and such are more powerful. I also recall one character in the demo whose Keeper would be summoned if you repeat her True Name three times. At higher levels of Wyrd, some bans and taboos also rely on knowing your True Name. Also, it's a big thing in oath-crafting. If you swear an oath on your true name, there's huge prices on failure. And given that it's possible to bind an oath that someone swore on accident, using your true name seems like a big risk. Even if it's something minor, there's a handle there stuck into what remains of your soul. I could easily imagine being introduced to some spooky high wyrd changeling as "Frank Jones", your actual true name, they offer you some cash to do some apparently simple task, you say "No problem, I'll do it if you pay me", reaching out your hand to shake, they smile and take your hand, saying "Consider it a promise, 'Frank'." Honestly, if/when I get around to actually running Changeling, I'll probably do that as a bit of prelude to establish why the PCs need to use fake fairytale names. Maybe even have the first session be dealing with the repercussions of the accidental oath.
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Jun 15, 2015 20:40
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Anyone have a list of some three dot Wonders from mage? I just joined a game and I'm attempting to figure out how wonders work. Book isn't very forthcoming.
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Jun 15, 2015 21:04
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Loomer posted:The coterie has a covert meeting with their informant in the Wraped Parking Lot of an Evil McDonald's in Sinister Los Angeles, Shadow California. To get to Shadow California, you just want to take Phantom Five down from our Washington and drive until you reach the outer darkness. If you run into prehuman spectres from beyond the dying stars, you went too far, stop for gas and ask a spectre for directions.
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Jun 16, 2015 01:00
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I need some crafting advice. One of my players in this Hunter game is playing a science nerd who is all about potions and elixers. I'm trying to balance it by making it like a Vampire dicipline but it's proving to be difficult. To throw, say a fire potion, she rolls (STR+weaponry+potions) where "potions" is a 1-5 rank dicipline. Each rank grants her access to a set of potions. Usually 5 per rank. She's got a bag to hold them and the limiter is she only gets one of each per day. Is there a better way to go about this? Her refills are free but needs to return to base to get ingredients.
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Jun 16, 2015 01:57
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Inzombiac posted:I need some crafting advice. Isn't Elixir a core Hunter endowment? Just go from there.
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Jun 16, 2015 02:04
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I Am Just a Box posted:To get to Shadow California, you just want to take Phantom Five down from our Washington and drive until you reach the outer darkness. If you run into prehuman spectres from beyond the dying stars, you went too far, stop for gas and ask a spectre for directions. Once in Occulted Sacramento, take Darkest 80 towards the setting sun, through Fairfield of Death and Shadowed Vallejo, and finally into Forgotten Contra Costa and on to Black Oakland- wait, poo poo, this is nWoD, nevermind. Kavak fucked around with this message at 02:12 on Jun 16, 2015 |
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Jun 16, 2015 02:07
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Yawgmoth posted:Isn't Elixir a core Hunter endowment? Just go from there. It is, however, notably weaker than your posited firebomb thing.
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Jun 16, 2015 02:41
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Swags posted:Anyone have a list of some three dot Wonders from mage? I just joined a game and I'm attempting to figure out how wonders work. Book isn't very forthcoming. Here's a PDF of every published Wonder, complete with page references. I think the Revised MtAsc corebook has a chart that breaks down Wonder cost by strength etc, and Forged by Dragonfire is a book all about Wonders that might help. That said, if you backed Mage 20th Anniversary edition then the backers pdf should be out for that - your group might be using M20 rules, in which case you'd probably do best to ask them about it or if someone could send you the Wonder rules from it since I think they were one of the specific areas of attention when tightening up rules. I can't be more specific since I haven't had the chance to go through the pdf myself yet, sorry.
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Jun 16, 2015 02:54
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Won't you take me to. Spookytown? I cannot find it. My car broke down. I hitched a ride from. A bunch of Wraiths. I didn't like them. One had no face.
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Jun 16, 2015 02:59
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Inzombiac posted:Is there a better way to go about this? Her refills are free but needs to return to base to get ingredients. Is there some reason she just doesn't specialize in Molotovs? I mean "fire potion" sounds cool and all, but it sounds like you're falling into the trap of houseruling extant rules. E: If that's her character's big thing, maybe let her roll to make them extra-burny. moths fucked around with this message at 03:27 on Jun 16, 2015 |
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Jun 16, 2015 03:24
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pkfan2004 posted:Won't you take me to. Spookytown? I cannot find it. My car broke down. I hitched a ride from. A bunch of Wraiths. I didn't like them. One had no face.
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Jun 16, 2015 03:38
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Ambi posted:Here's a PDF of every published Wonder, complete with page references. I think the Revised MtAsc corebook has a chart that breaks down Wonder cost by strength etc, and Forged by Dragonfire is a book all about Wonders that might help. We are using M20, but the area on Wonders is actually pretty lacking. Thanks for the list, though.
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Jun 16, 2015 04:14
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The latest Monday Meeting notes are up. They sound very promising.
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Jun 16, 2015 05:06
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The Ordo are working really hard to better themselves, to become the ideal vampire, whatever that might be, bravely facing unknown possibilities with the only thing they can be sure of is that their soul is on the line. The Invictus don't need to; they have money for all that stuff. Join the Invictus.
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Jun 16, 2015 07:46
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The link talking about the Aeon Continuum right below the meeting notes has me more excited than I should be, because I really want to see Dark Eras style sourcebooks for the line. Seventies Pulp Revival Adventure, based on a mashup of Men's Adventure Novels+ Mystery solving teens cartoons.
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Jun 16, 2015 12:17
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On the topic of Beast, while for the most part the changes seem good I'm still rather worried; the "beasts have a right to abuse people" thing and everything tied to that was the worst part of the game for me, for reasons I've elaborated on previously, and it seems like that may still be lingering in some form; at least some beasts apparently do their weird horrible things to "help" people or "teach" them, and if the ways they "help" people are the same abusive things they did before and the text tries to sell this as a good thing then that will be pretty awful. I want to be optimistic but given what the first release was I am still rather nervous. That said, I hope that all this, regardless of Beast's final quality, ends up inspiring people to run some nWoD games, crossover or otherwise. I've been looking at Demon stuff again and really want to play one.
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Jun 16, 2015 16:11
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I think the goal there is that Beasts who try to help people are going to terrorize bad people as an example? Like, you teach people that being a murderer is bad by terrorizing murderers, or teach people not to go into dangerous places by scaring the gently caress out of them when they do? I think this is still going to end up, in some ways, kind of creepy and weird and vaguely abusive, but it's gonna be a lot better than the text was before.
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Jun 16, 2015 16:15
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It's too late to make the game not creepy and lovely without a total rewrite, so I'm more concerned that the writers apologize and show that this whole clusterfuck wasn't intentional by changing what they can, so we can move on to better things.
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Jun 16, 2015 16:25
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