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pentyne posted:Well, John Brown was a insane murderous terrorist who literally believed God spoke to him and ordered him to end slavery. While Brown was a killer, I've read some accounts that dispute his insanity. e: Though the only one I can remember well is a chapter from Lies My Teacher Told Me that I read as a teenager, and I wouldn't exactly call that reliable. Motto fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Jun 25, 2015 |
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Jun 25, 2015 04:54
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bobkatt013 posted:You did read the whole thing? At the bottom where it's like peculiar instutition that's where I realized this was a bad stone and not a good stone but I"m still not 100% on what is up
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Jun 25, 2015 04:56
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Krinkle posted:At the bottom where it's like peculiar instutition that's where I realized this was a bad stone and not a good stone but I"m still not 100% on what is up South: "There are good Negroes and bad Negroes. The good ones were the ones who didn't murder us in our beds once we were no longer holding them down and loving them in the rear end. The bad ones were the ones who had the temerity to leave slavery for the horrors of freedom."
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Jun 25, 2015 04:58
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Toplowtech posted:That's because it's mostly a boring flamefest between MRA and Feminists on Twitter and some gawker-like video game media about the industries and it's literally all sperging about video games. I don't think anyone sane should even care and i am doing some video game related sperging here. Also, in particular, if some gamers become drone pilots and others join ISIS (allegedly, I mean, drat), asking especially about the high popularity of games that glorify war and present a false, simplified narrative of it has some broader implications. Like, I mean, the way I see it from the sidelines, American Sniper is a shitmovie, but a rarity. Among games, it's those with a counternarrative that are the rare thing (off the top of my head, I can only name Spec Ops: The Line and This War of Mine).
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Jun 25, 2015 05:13
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pentyne posted:Well, John Brown was a insane murderous terrorist who literally believed God spoke to him and ordered him to end slavery. It's only terrorism when the people you do it against aren't assholes. The South had John Brown coming.
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Jun 25, 2015 05:13
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It's infuriating because it's neo-Confederates falsely characterizing John Brown as an anti-black racist.
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Jun 25, 2015 05:45
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You lost the war, chumps.
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Jun 25, 2015 05:57
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Krinkle posted:At the bottom where it's like peculiar instutition that's where I realized this was a bad stone and not a good stone but I"m still not 100% on what is up TL;DR of that message: "Here is a rock dedicated to the loyalty of the Good Niggers."
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Jun 25, 2015 06:34
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bobkatt013 posted:Speaking of awful things in the south #notyourshield
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Jun 25, 2015 06:38
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Motto posted:While Brown was a killer, I've read some accounts that dispute his insanity. John Brown was a god damned Hero and a Patriot, and in a Just world his face would be on one of our bills today. His life was more righteous than every single Johnny Reb combined.
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Jun 25, 2015 07:17
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How are u posted:John Brown was a god damned Hero and a Patriot, and in a Just world his face would be on one of our bills today. His life was more righteous than every single Johnny Reb combined. I unironically agree with this.
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Jun 25, 2015 07:24
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Boogaleeboo posted:It's only terrorism when the people you do it against aren't assholes. The South had John Brown coming. Perhaps so, but that's the same argument being made to justify death threats on that crazy woman.
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Jun 25, 2015 07:37
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Motto posted:While Brown was a killer, I've read some accounts that dispute his insanity. Most of the Abolitionist groups believed God wanted them to end slavery...and good handful more were anti-slavery simply because they were so personally racist that they felt the best course of action was freeing them just to send them right back to Africa before some liberally-minded government in the near or far future could make miscegenation legal. You've got to hand it to us - our racism's so wonderfully complex that we even flirted with expatriaxenoracism. Hell, we still do if they're Salvadorean! It doesn't change the fact that since the 60s, the only real progress we've made as a nation is a bunch of fathers sitting in their trademark Archie Bunker armchairs saying "I hope she never brings a black guy home" instead of "I'll disown her if she ever brings a black guy home."  for the most minor of progress.
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Jun 25, 2015 07:39
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BIG HEADLINE posted:Most of the Abolitionist groups believed God wanted them to end slavery...and good handful more were anti-slavery simply because they were so personally racist that they felt the best course of action was freeing them just to send them right back to Africa before some liberally-minded government in the near or far future could make miscegenation legal. You've got to hand it to us - our racism's so wonderfully complex that we even flirted with expatriaxenoracism. Hell, we still do if they're Salvadorean! I wouldn't necessarily give yourselves too much flak in that regard - that same strategy was actually advocated by numerous black leaders around the first half of the 19th century. The exact reasons why varied, from feeling that it was 'going home' (forgetting of course that most African Americans had never been to Africa), to a belief that racial integration and harmony was so impossible that it was literally easier just to take every black person in the USA across the Atlantic. Though, from what I've been able to piece together, apparently some history courses for schools in the USA just sorta... skip events after the end of the civil war. I apologise, being an outside observer looking in and all, but it seems like a weird omission given the relative cultural significance, compared to say, learning about the Tudors.
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Jun 25, 2015 07:59
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Astro Nut posted:Though, from what I've been able to piece together, apparently some history courses for schools in the USA just sorta... skip events after the end of the civil war. I apologise, being an outside observer looking in and all, but it seems like a weird omission given the relative cultural significance, compared to say, learning about the Tudors. Learning more about the Reconstruction period is reserved for 300-level courses in undergrad, and you maybe spend two days and 100 pages of text on it in the HIST 10x course they make everyone take so colleges can claim they're producing 'well-rounded academics.' Now...when you talk about *regional* history education in places like Texas or the solid red Bible Belt states...they spend quite a bit of time talking from one perspective about the War of Northern Aggression. As you can see, Texas spending extra time in its curriculum making students learn massive amounts of state history is working wonders: http://www.star-telegram.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article13262738.html BIG HEADLINE fucked around with this message at 08:08 on Jun 25, 2015 |
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Jun 25, 2015 08:03
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Astro Nut posted:Though, from what I've been able to piece together, apparently some history courses for schools in the USA just sorta... skip events after the end of the civil war. I apologise, being an outside observer looking in and all, but it seems like a weird omission given the relative cultural significance, compared to say, learning about the Tudors. High school history is pretty lacking in a lot of areas. I literally knew nothing about the history of Islam or the middle east until I started playing Crusader Kings 2 and actually researching the topic more. Basically a video game prompted me to learn about the Sunni/Shia divide rather than my own education system. Even tough said history is kind of extremely relevant to the things that are happening there right now, as far as western education is concerned nothing important actually happened outside of Europe until the mid 19th century (you might get a mention of ancient China if you're lucky).
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Jun 25, 2015 08:12
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School is the worst place to learn history. It's not so much that the tidbits are incorrect as it is the tidbits being cherry-picked as hell and glossing over hundreds of important eras of human history in favour of: romanticised ancient Greece, factually incorrect Rome, ideologically spun french revolution, really basic overlook on trans-atlantic slavery, the american revolution, industrialisation, WW1, WW2 and maybe the cold war if you're lucky. Take or add some subjects base on where you are from. You pretty much have to learn on your own. MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 08:22 on Jun 25, 2015 |
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Jun 25, 2015 08:20
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Thanks for the additional insight. Admittedly, my look into things was itself somewhat specialised (history GCSE, done around ages 15-16), so I suppose its not an apt comparison, but it still proves fascinating to contrast. Though, to Cheshire specifically, one of the oddly most useful subjects I had in secondary school for learning about other cultures was RE. Sure, as a Catholic school, Christianity ended up the focus for our later tests, but years 8 and 9 were dedicated to Islam and Hinduism respectively. I'm not sure if that's because my town is relatively diverse (only around 65% White British as of the last census), or the school being more open minded, or some other reason. But it was really, really drat useful.
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Jun 25, 2015 08:49
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I can't wait for Sunday so we can't all shut the gently caress up about this in this particular thread (important a topic as it is)
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Jun 25, 2015 10:28
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Oliver was really playing a dangerous game when he decided to package both latent racism and internet sexism in one 30 minute television program.
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Jun 25, 2015 12:48
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I mean pissing off people on the internet is nothing when he's made a habit of pissing off entire nations. Hell he shits on Time Warner despite them owning HBO and The Bugle made a habit of making fun of Rupert Murdoch, despite him owning the site the Podcast was hosted and paid for on. Fans fucked around with this message at 12:58 on Jun 25, 2015 |
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Jun 25, 2015 12:55
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Comedy and political commentary both sustain themselves on controversy so it should be no surprise Oliver takes every opportunity to delightfully shake the hornets nest.  The constant slap-fights with world leaders, media profiles and billionaires is quickly becoming my favourite part of the show.
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Jun 25, 2015 13:17
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Xoidanor posted:Comedy and political commentary both sustain themselves on controversy so it should be no surprise Oliver takes every opportunity to delightfully shake the hornets nest. The best part is that he not only does so, but that on learning he's actually gotten their attention, he doesn't back down (and even admits when they do right). Instead, well... 
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Jun 25, 2015 13:30
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Fans posted:I mean pissing off people on the internet is nothing when he's made a habit of pissing off entire nations. He also made fun of the Entourage movie just as it was coming out.
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Jun 25, 2015 14:56
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The Cheshire Cat posted:High school history is pretty lacking in a lot of areas. I literally knew nothing about the history of Islam or the middle east until I started playing Crusader Kings 2 and actually researching the topic more. Basically a video game prompted me to learn about the Sunni/Shia divide rather than my own education system. Even tough said history is kind of extremely relevant to the things that are happening there right now, as far as western education is concerned nothing important actually happened outside of Europe until the mid 19th century (you might get a mention of ancient China if you're lucky). To be fair, Paradox games are pretty educational.
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Jun 25, 2015 14:57
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Mr. Fowl posted:To be fair, Paradox games are pretty educational. Well, they're educational in the sense that they inspire you to learn more about the eras themselves. In terms of what actually happened they tend to diverge pretty wildly from history. Which I guess to be fair is what good education should do - make you want to learn more on your own. The thing is that this stuff isn't even MENTIONED in high school and it's not nearly as complicated as a lot of people believe. They just think it is because nobody ever explained it to them and when the middle east gets brought up in the news they tend to just kind of throw out a bunch of words that won't mean anything to you if you don't already understand the issues which isn't really a good way to get people to look into it. This particular issue annoys me just because it's something that much like post Civil War reconstruction and racial tensions, it's something that's incredibly relevant to current events yet gets passed over for poo poo like ancient Greece and Rome. Yes, they might be the foundation of western civilization, but the thing is that you're already going to learn plenty about western civilization just by like, living in it.
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Jun 25, 2015 15:18
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Yinlock posted:holy poo poo It's literally a confederate soldier. The irony is sometime after I graduated, they lost the head from the costume and had to replace it. It's the head from an Ulysses S. Grant costume 
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Jun 25, 2015 15:57
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Fans posted:Hell he shits on Time Warner despite them owning HBO and The Bugle made a habit of making fun of Rupert Murdoch, despite him owning the site the Podcast was hosted and paid for on. "*tap tap* is... is this on? Is this on? Are we still here?" I'm pretty sure nobody at News International even bothered checking what they were doing from week to week.
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Jun 25, 2015 16:18
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thehustler posted:"*tap tap* is... is this on? Is this on? Are we still here?" It was later confirmed when John got the daily show hosting gig and News International acted like they had no idea who he was.
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Jun 25, 2015 16:43
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Well, they're educational in the sense that they inspire you to learn more about the eras themselves. In terms of what actually happened they tend to diverge pretty wildly from history. Which I guess to be fair is what good education should do - make you want to learn more on your own. The thing is that this stuff isn't even MENTIONED in high school and it's not nearly as complicated as a lot of people believe. I literally did not know the Ottoman Empire and Byzantium was even a thing until I played AOE3 and Europa Universalis. 
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Jun 25, 2015 18:07
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Well, they're educational in the sense that they inspire you to learn more about the eras themselves. In terms of what actually happened they tend to diverge pretty wildly from history. Which I guess to be fair is what good education should do - make you want to learn more on your own. The thing is that this stuff isn't even MENTIONED in high school and it's not nearly as complicated as a lot of people believe. They just think it is because nobody ever explained it to them and when the middle east gets brought up in the news they tend to just kind of throw out a bunch of words that won't mean anything to you if you don't already understand the issues which isn't really a good way to get people to look into it. Crusader Kings 2 is putting my geography straight. I can now identify the rough regions of Aragon (Spain) and Bourbon (France); in fact tons of places in France are named after foods!
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Jun 25, 2015 18:13
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Mr. Fowl posted:To be fair, Paradox games are pretty educational. My history teacher in High School listed off a list of "maritime states" that existed in the "1600's" and shushed me when I corrected her that Italy didn't exist yet until the mid 19th century that it was "too advanced" for the class to know. Sure yeah its hella nitpicky but I feel it reflects the apathy of a lot of teachers who view their job as teaching to the textbook and not trying to get kids to be interested in engaged. reignofevil posted:Crusader Kings 2 is putting my geography straight. I can now identify the rough regions of Aragon (Spain) and Bourbon (France); in fact tons of places in France are named after foods! Hell inheritance law is something you'll rarely see outside of CK.
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Jun 25, 2015 18:14
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Raenir Salazar posted:Hell inheritance law is something you'll rarely see outside of CK. Please, you know as well as I do that inheritance laws make up about 30% of the discussion in all game of thrones threads.
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Jun 25, 2015 18:23
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Please, you know as well as I do that inheritance laws make up about 30% of the discussion in all game of thrones threads. I like to play a mod that is like Agnatic Primogeniture but in reverse, True Cognatic?. 
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Jun 25, 2015 18:36
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I'm not sure its entirely relevant, but one year we spent the entire black history month learning about Paul Robeson. I'm pretty sure the teacher met him once as a teenager and that was pretty much why, but hey at least it was different then learning about Booker T. Washington and 100 things you can do with a peanut, which is what we did throughout grade and middle school.
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Jun 25, 2015 18:52
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Zythrst posted:I'm not sure its entirely relevant, but one year we spent the entire black history month learning about Paul Robeson. I'm pretty sure the teacher met him once as a teenager and that was pretty much why, but hey at least it was different then learning about Booker T. Washington and 100 things you can do with a peanut, which is what we did throughout grade and middle school. To be fair, though, George Washington Carver came up with so many uses for the peanut that it would be hard to cover them all in one month, much less the stupidly short month of February. I mean, take peanut brittle. That's a rich subject! Easily worth a week all on its own.
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Jun 25, 2015 19:02
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Raenir Salazar posted:I like to play a mod that is like Agnatic Primogeniture but in reverse, True Cognatic?. This mod exists! Search for "Enatic" succession to fulfill your matriarchal needs. Sex-based succession used to be hard coded, but Paradox added it for modding purposes a while ago. Also, seconding that these games are great for geography. If nothing else, you get a much better idea of where everything is in the world.
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Jun 25, 2015 19:09
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Please, you know as well as I do that inheritance laws make up about 30% of the discussion in all game of thrones threads. I imagine it also comes up more if you're British.
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Jun 25, 2015 19:15
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If anyone's hankering for some contextualised history stuff, I recommend the world history series done by PBS and John Green. Its a little simplified, but it covers a wide range of stuff one will probably never hear about in a classroom. I'm actually curious how John's background affects his particular understanding of the United States and its history. Ie, how he might understand aspects of the cukture but still disagree due to where he came from, and alternatively vastly appreciates aspects that others take for granted (such as how wide and diverse it is both culturally and geographically).
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Jun 25, 2015 19:25
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The Cheshire Cat posted:This particular issue annoys me just because it's something that much like post Civil War reconstruction and racial tensions, it's something that's incredibly relevant to current events yet gets passed over for poo poo like ancient Greece and Rome. Yes, they might be the foundation of western civilization, but the thing is that you're already going to learn plenty about western civilization just by like, living in it. I'm very old and this has no relevance to modern education, but US history and world history were separate years, and we did talk about Reconstruction for probably longer than most other topics (not that that means all that much in the context of less than 170 hours of instruction) and ran out of school year somewhere between the modern civil rights movement and the Vietnam War. The thing is, since I grew up in the far north in an almost entirely white town, it was really easy to present it as this thing that happened somewhere else and wasn't relevant to us. When the only black people you ever see are cops/doctors/lawyers in scripted TV and/or Jesse Jackson's numerous presidential campaigns, it's easy to believe racism is basically over.
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