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Obdicut posted:See, from the outside, the whole GG thing looks wildly incoherent. Is it about ethics in game journalism? Is it about SJWs daring to say that games are racist and sexist and should be improved? If it's about ethics in game journalism, why are they attacking journalists and not the megastudios that poo poo up games journalism? None of it makes the slightest amount of logical sense. Whoever is considered "anti" at this point has wrestled with the pig so long as to be indistinguishable. Essentially its two groups of people determined to out-tweet the other to oblivion, 24/7. 365. It's Total Twitter Annihilation (good game btw) Control Volume posted:So in this threads educated opinion, who is "winning" and why The audience. To a greater extent, Capitalism.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:03
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Control Volume posted:So in this threads educated opinion, who is "winning" and why i don't know if anyone is winning, but the MRAs are losing because they're all insane and dumb
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Jul 2, 2015 03:03
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Control Volume posted:So in this threads educated opinion, who is "winning" and why The uninvolved.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:03
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How much has video gaming been destroyed by the SJWs, in one sentence? Thanks
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Jul 2, 2015 03:05
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Control Volume posted:How much has video gaming been destroyed by the SJWs, in one sentence? Thanks They wrote articles and blogs that made me very mad.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:07
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Motto posted:They wrote articles and blogs that made me very mad. That's incredibly hosed up and I support gamergate now.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:08
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InsanityIsCrazy posted:Whoever is considered "anti" at this point has wrestled with the pig so long as to be indistinguishable. Essentially its two groups of people determined to out-tweet the other to oblivion, 24/7. 365. It's Total Twitter Annihilation (good game btw) I get that this is being asserted, but I don't get why. Who is 'anti'? I feel like I'm anti-gamergate--I think it's stupid as gently caress, for the reasons I've outlined. How am I not anti-GG?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:08
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Obdicut posted:I get that this is being asserted, but I don't get why. Who is 'anti'? I feel like I'm anti-gamergate--I think it's stupid as gently caress, for the reasons I've outlined. How am I not anti-GG? Yeah, you're probably anti-GG, but there's a difference between those who take a position and argue on a semi-private forum, and those who argue publicly on twitter, especially if you've been doing it for months on end. They've been playing with the poop too long. Look what happened to Spacedad.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:15
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Obdicut posted:I get that this is being asserted, but I don't get why. Who is 'anti'? I feel like I'm anti-gamergate--I think it's stupid as gently caress, for the reasons I've outlined. How am I not anti-GG? You're not fighting them on social media for most of your natural existence, for one. Subreddits, IRC, comment sections, anywhere that happens to allow open discussion, theyre all minefields of horseshit when it comes to this subject. People seem to be taking major chunks of time and energy to prove someone wrong on the internet.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:17
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Gianthogweed posted:Yeah, you're probably anti-GG, but there's a difference between those who take a position and argue on a semi-private forum, and those who argue publicly on twitter, especially if you've been doing it for months on end. They've been playing with the poop too long. Look what happened to Spacedad. I don't know who spacedad is. This just seems like you're saying a truism: that people being assholes on twitter are being assholes on twitter. The fact remains that GG seems totally incoherent, it started from a very weird place in that a journalist got attacked for sex stuff, it somehow ties in with paranoia about SJWs wanting to destroy gaming, and it's just a huge embarrassing mess. Nobody can explain how it's even supposed to reform games journalism. Given that the 'anti' position seems to be 'GG should go away', then even if they're also being assholes, I agree with them. InsanityIsCrazy posted:You're not fighting them on social media for most of your natural existence, for one. Subreddits, IRC, comment sections, anywhere that happens to allow open discussion, theyre all minefields of horseshit when it comes to this subject. People seem to be taking major chunks of time and energy to prove someone wrong on the internet. See above. The horseshit originates with the GGers, right?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:20
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you can be a weirdo and be anti-gg, but you pretty much have to be a weirdo to be pro-gg. hope that explains it
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Jul 2, 2015 03:21
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Obdicut posted:I get that this is being asserted, but I don't get why. Who is 'anti'? I feel like I'm anti-gamergate--I think it's stupid as gently caress, for the reasons I've outlined. How am I not anti-GG? I would say I'm anti-gamergate on most issues, but there are things I agree with them on, such as gaming journalism being an absolute cesspit (I just don't think it matters that much). More importantly, I think gaming journalism, as is, is an impediment to more diversity in games. I don't consider myself a part of anti-gamergate because I disagree with their methods and many of the people involved. In addition, I strongly suspect their motivations given their behavior.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:22
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You can't take the GGers' "reform of games journalism" thing seriously because the actual problem in game related journalism is that the people whose things they're supposed to review and the people who buy ad space are the same people and it screws up impartiality. Then again, if it's not a conflict of interest for an elected official 
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Jul 2, 2015 03:24
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Obdicut posted:See above. The horseshit originates with the GGers, right? Most avenues of discussion usually end up in petty sniping from everyone, "racist subhuman" this, "sjw" that, it's all a bit excessive really! Nobody comes out looking clean, just obsessed.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:24
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Gum posted:can someone remind me which of you still openly support gamergate and which switched to the 'both sides are as bad as each other' thing when people started making fun of them? just as relevant now as when i first posted it in this thread
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Jul 2, 2015 03:26
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Adventure Pigeon posted:I would say I'm anti-gamergate on most issues, but there are things I agree with them on, such as gaming journalism being an absolute cesspit (I just don't think it matters that much). This is true, and has been forever, for reasons I laid out. It's the same for any journalism about any product: the manufacturers are the ones who advertise. quote:More importantly, I think gaming journalism, as is, is an impediment to more diversity in games Explain this? InsanityIsCrazy posted:Most avenues of discussion usually end up in petty sniping from everyone, "racist subhuman" this, "sjw" that, it's all a bit excessive really! Nobody comes out looking clean, just obsessed. I'm sorry, that doesn't really answer what I asked. This did all start with the GGers, right? The anti-GGers weren't around before them, and the anti-GGers position is "GG and GGers suck"?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:27
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Obdicut posted:I'm sorry, that doesn't really answer what I asked. This did all start with the GGers, right? The anti-GGers weren't around before them, and the anti-GGers position is "GG and GGers suck"? Oh you're asking how it started? GGers began flooding every place reporting on it and getting the comments closed, that's undeniable.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:30
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InsanityIsCrazy posted:Oh you're asking how it started? GGers began flooding every place reporting on it and getting the comments closed, that's undeniable. Okay, and if GGers stopped their bullshit and went away, the anti-GGers wouldn't have anyone to fight with, right? Whereas if the anti-GGers vanished, there'd still be these journalists out there like that woman that guy smeared in here, and Anita, and other people, and GGers would still be attacking them, right?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:32
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Obdicut posted:
#GamerGate was about ethics in journalism. But when someone claims you are being sexist then SJWs come running to defend the helpless. I wont deny that some crazy people in the GG camp made threats and released some dox info but the vast majority of GG was about journalists making money or benefiting their people by writing awesome reviews for the right games.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:33
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Obdicut posted:Okay, and if GGers stopped their bullshit and went away, the anti-GGers wouldn't have anyone to fight with, right? They've actually had a poor history of circular firing squads since this started, so even if the hashtag dropped off the face of the earth they'd still be trying to flush out the impure on their own "side," whoever that is. quote:Whereas if the anti-GGers vanished, there'd still be these journalists out there like that woman that guy smeared in here, and Anita, and other people, and GGers would still be attacking them, right? Probably. I don't see them stopping any time soon.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:36
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Ridonkulous posted:#GamerGate was about ethics in journalism. But when someone claims you are being sexist then SJWs come running to defend the helpless. I wont deny that some crazy people in the GG camp made threats and released some dox info but the vast majority of GG was about journalists making money or benefiting their people by writing awesome reviews for the right games. And certainly it was not wrong to try to secure freedom for our fellow gamers held in barbaric media captivity. But we did not achieve what we wished, and serious mistakes were made in trying to do so. We will get to the bottom of this, and I will take whatever action is called for.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:37
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Ridonkulous posted:#GamerGate was about ethics in journalism. How so, though? How is ethics in journalism achieved by attacking journalists? The problem with games journalism isn't the journalists, it's the big studios and their advertising dollars. Right? quote:But when someone claims you are being sexist then SJWs come running to defend the helpless. I'm sorry, I don't know what you're saying here. Are you talking about the attacks on Anita, or the sexism that she points out in games, or what? Why would GGers be attacking her anyway? And what do you mean by SJW? People who think sexism sucks, or what? quote:I wont deny that some crazy people in the GG camp made threats and released some dox info but the vast majority of GG was about journalists making money or benefiting their people by writing awesome reviews for the right games. I haven't seen almost any discussion of this, at any point, by anyone in GG, except in this weird vague insinuation that people in the indie scene give good reviews to each other. The 'money' part I haven't seen in any way discussed, and if it were, it wouldn't be about kotaku and poo poo like that, it'd be about the big game journals and the big studios. So sorry, this is totally unconvincing. InsanityIsCrazy posted:They've actually had a poor history of circular firing squads since this started, so even if the hashtag dropped off the face of the earth they'd still be trying to flush out the impure on their own "side," whoever that is. I doubt this is actually true, though. Would people still argue on twitter? Sure. Would they be anti-GGers? No. quote:Probably. I don't see them stopping any time soon. Okay, that's my point. It's not GGers vs Anti-GGers. It's GGers vs completely valid journalists, which is like the exact opposite of people who want to promote games journalism should do, with anti-GGers there too. Uncle Wemus posted:AntiGG would go back to fighting tumblr targets like the patriarchy and people who need to check their privilege. You do know our society is still way sexist, right? Obdicut fucked around with this message at 03:39 on Jul 2, 2015 |
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Jul 2, 2015 03:37
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Obdicut posted:Okay, and if GGers stopped their bullshit and went away, the anti-GGers wouldn't have anyone to fight with, right? AntiGG would go back to fighting tumblr targets like the patriarchy and people who need to check their privilege.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:37
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Uncle Wemus posted:AntiGG would go back to fighting tumblr targets like the patriarchy and people who need to check their privilege. they would probaly just whine about IOS games https://twitter.com/femfreq/status/616413143607062528
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Jul 2, 2015 03:39
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Dapper_Swindler posted:they would probaly just whine about IOS games How is making a criticism of a game--which is something a games journalist should be doing-- "anti-GG"? I don't get how the GGers supposedly are fans of game journalism and hate it at the same time. Did they all get way too into Steppenwolf or something?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:41
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Obdicut posted:I doubt this is actually true, though. Would people still argue on twitter? Sure. Would they be anti-GGers? No. There have been cases of wrong doxxings and public shamings for whatever amounts to betrayal, but I appreciate you just calling it bullshit. I guess look it up. quote:Okay, that's my point. It's not GGers vs Anti-GGers. It's GGers vs completely valid journalists, which is like the exact opposite of people who want to promote games journalism should do, with anti-GGers there too. It's GGers and trolls and idiots versus journalists and trolls and idiots.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:42
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the whole reason it was called gamergate in the first place is because they tried to make a no-name videogame developer possibly sleeping with a journalist into a watergate style scandal. the movements been around for less than a year and its supporters are already trying to revise its history
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Jul 2, 2015 03:43
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InsanityIsCrazy posted:There have been cases of wrong doxxings and public shamings for whatever amounts to betrayal, but I appreciate you just calling it bullshit. I guess look it up. I didn't call it bullshit. I called the GGers supposed cause bullshit. Like I said, I have no doubt that anti-GGers have done awful poo poo. quote:It's GGers and trolls and idiots versus journalists and trolls and idiots. Yeah, so there's only one part of that that is anything worthwhile: Journalists. Who GGers should actually be supporting, but are instead attacking.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:44
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Obdicut posted:Yeah, so there's only one part of that that is anything worthwhile: Journalists. Who GGers should actually be supporting, but are instead attacking. 
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Jul 2, 2015 03:45
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Dapper_Swindler posted:they would probaly just whine about IOS games Man DnD looks like Andrew WK compared to her fans.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:45
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Gum posted:the whole reason it was called gamergate in the first place is because they tried to make a no-name videogame developer possibly sleeping with a journalist into a watergate style scandal. the movements been around for less than a year and its supporters are already trying to revise its history Actually it's derived from a Hebrew word "Gamér", which means "Honesty". The Honesty Gate was the largest gate in Jerusalem, so if the lies of SJWs can't even fit through it then they are truly a great Satan.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:46
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Gum posted:just as relevant now as when i first posted it in this thread Eh, I think it's A-Okay to have had a bad opinion and then rectified it when people proved how dumb it is, than to continue having a bad opinion because elsewise you might look like a coward or hypocrite. InsanityIsCrazy posted in hellthread enough to get a tag, but he's been a decent "i know this stuff is dumb as heck, just wanna point out why people might be swayed to gamergate or think Anti-gamergate dudes are crazy" poster in this thread, ditto for IN5I or whatever his name is. It's good to have moderates to question and critique arguments, it makes for better, refined rhetoric. The real jackoffs are the people who go "Both sides are equally bad but [fullthroated defense of gamergate/ranting about Anita Sarkeesian]", they're trying to gently caress the pig while playing off like they're some kind of cool non-pigfucker. And that's terrible. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 03:50 on Jul 2, 2015 |
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Jul 2, 2015 03:46
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Obdicut posted:How is making a criticism of a game--which is something a games journalist should be doing-- "anti-GG"? I don't get how the GGers supposedly are fans of game journalism and hate it at the same time. Did they all get way too into Steppenwolf or something? Because twitter is the worst place ever to attempt criticism/discussion and only allows you to reduce things to absolutist statements, leave massive assumptions about what you are talking about or mean? How is that helpful?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:52
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Neurolimal posted:Eh, I think it's A-Okay to have had a bad opinion and then rectified it when people proved how dumb it is, than to continue having a bad opinion because elsewise you might look like a coward or hypocrite. InsanityIsCrazy posted in hellthread enough to get a tag, but he's been a decent "i know this stuff is dumb as heck, just wanna point out why people might be swayed to gamergate or think Anti-gamergate dudes are crazy" poster in this thread, ditto for IN5I or whatever his name is. It's good to have moderates to question and critique arguments, it makes for better, refined rhetoric. i guess thats possible but imo its much more likely that they still have the same opinions, they just know being openly pro-gg on this website is social suicide
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Jul 2, 2015 03:53
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Gum posted:the whole reason it was called gamergate in the first place is because they tried to make a no-name videogame developer possibly sleeping with a journalist into a watergate style scandal. the movements been around for less than a year and its supporters are already trying to revise its history Was that before or after the no-named videogame developer harassed The Fine Young Capitalists? I'm sure she had nothing to do with the doxxing of TFYC member.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:53
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Anita Sarkeesian did 100 percent act like a "professional victim" during this. It did make me lose respect towards the femfreq organisation. When they call her a professional victim I feel they are being totally correct.afeelgoodpoop posted:Also I wanted to do a quickie on anita sarkeezy and gamergate. I say this as someone who only occasionally watch her videos and have never felt any ill will towards them. After gamergate got in the news and Zoe was getting all these headlines over her horrible abuse, Anita made a tweet that I believe was exactly "these #gamergate guys are the same people who have been harrasing me for years". If you use a hashtag, and you have a fair amount of followers, your tweet shows up at the very top of the hashtag for awhile. Why would she do this if she legitimately believed gamergate was some gamer terrorist group? A few days after that, anita released info of receiving a bomb threat the year before at a conference she was attending. She began to appear in some headlines, while she was she began to tweet her donation address. I believe about two weeks after that is when she received her latest bomb threat. she blamed it on gamergate, feminist blamed it on gamergate though more importantly later a feminist site checked out the twitters of some of the men who where sending anita harassment. every single one of them was just a regular person who otherwise talked about shoes or their cat, though that didnt stop what they were pushing. then it came to that ridiculous abc special
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Jul 2, 2015 03:54
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Yeah, I wish they'd write an article on games they want to talk about rather than randomly firing off a string of tweets for others to argue about.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:54
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Gum posted:i guess thats possible but imo its much more likely that they still have the same opinions, they just know being openly pro-gg on this website is social suicide Posting in this thread is social suicide.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:55
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Dapper Dan posted:Because twitter is the worst place ever to attempt criticism/discussion and only allows you to reduce things to absolutist statements, leave massive assumptions about what you are talking about or mean? How is that helpful? This wasn't an answer to the question I asked, though. Are you claiming GGers are against twitter? Or against journalists using twitter? afeelgoodpoop posted:Anita Sarkeesian did 100 percent act like a "professional victim" during this. It did make me lose respect towards the femfreq organisation. When they call her a professional victim I feel they are being totally correct. Somehow, the idea that you had respect for the organization before this doesn't ring completely true. What is a 'professional victim'? Is it someone who monetizes the hatred thrown at them, or are you claiming she made it up, or what?
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Jul 2, 2015 03:55
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Dapper Dan posted:Because twitter is the worst place ever to attempt criticism/discussion and only allows you to reduce things to absolutist statements, leave massive assumptions about what you are talking about or mean? How is that helpful? because she is whiny about a dark parody of 1950s.
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Jul 2, 2015 03:55
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