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wouln't all anyone have to do is mock up a mailer with a black man and white woman and say 'stand with candidate X against Perry' or some catchy slogan?
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Jul 4, 2015 16:38
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Lu Yan posted:My history lessons glossed over the fact that Bryan was the prosecuting attorney at the motherfucking SCOPES MONKEY TRIAL. That's the thing I most remember him for. (That and Brian Boyko being "William Bryan Jennings' revenge" or something.) quote:Evangelical Christianity, as everyone knows, is founded upon hate Can you imagine what would happen if someone had written this today?
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Jul 4, 2015 16:40
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Santorum supports anorexia apparently. (And bad Photoshop)
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Jul 4, 2015 16:41
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Carrasco posted:Can you imagine what would happen if someone had written this today? It would be furiously retweeted by bitter nerds the world over.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:36
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Agrajag posted:The left tearing up Hillary and loving up the elections just to have a GOP candidate win will be hilarious to watch. The people whining that their default candidate actually has competition in the primary is hilarious to watch.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:39
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:The people whining that their default candidate actually has competition in the primary is hilarious to watch. I think Sanders is going to be very good for the Democratic primary, though I don't think he's actually competition. I would like him to do even better than he is now by becoming a more well-rounded candidate, but he may want to focus nearly totally on economic issues.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:46
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He is already doing this- listen to his Madison speech.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:52
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Obdicut posted:I think Sanders is going to be very good for the Democratic primary, though I don't think he's actually competition. I would like him to do even better than he is now by becoming a more well-rounded candidate, but he may want to focus nearly totally on economic issues. To be honest I think that's probably the best Democrat strategy right now. I can think of a lot of people that really dislike Hillary. Bernie is a newer face to a lot of folks but the ones that did know him like him. A lot of people are fed up with both parties right now and a lot of young are squirming and scraping through life right now because of how hosed they are financially. Then here's this guy saying "poo poo is hosed up and bullshit." Here's a guy that's been an independent Senator the whole time he's been there. He's perfectly willing to stand up for economic issues. Really I think if the D side puts Bernie on the pedestal and focuses heavily on economic issues you'd see a relatively easy win. Now that it's becoming apparent what the right stands for you're going to see them losing a lot of most demographics. They of course have the "old white guy" demographic down but that one just doesn't win elections by itself anymore.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:53
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Mr Hootington posted:I still think a Scott Walker/Marco Rubio ticket could beat HIllary if WI doesn't implode before the election. \ Maybe if Hilary completely bombs in multiple debates as badly as Obama did in his first against Romney and/or manages to drive Latinos away from the Democrats in large numbers, sure they have a shot.
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Jul 4, 2015 17:53
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Brave New World posted:From a couple pages back: Perot is also a better person than John McCain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_McCain quote:Businessman and POW advocate Ross Perot paid for Carol's medical care, and she remained grateful, later remarking: "The military families are in Ross's heart and in his soul...There are millions of us who are extremely grateful to Ross Perot".
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Jul 4, 2015 18:16
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ToxicSlurpee posted:To be honest I think that's probably the best Democrat strategy right now. I can think of a lot of people that really dislike Hillary. Bernie is a newer face to a lot of folks but the ones that did know him like him. A lot of people are fed up with both parties right now and a lot of young are squirming and scraping through life right now because of how hosed they are financially. Then here's this guy saying "poo poo is hosed up and bullshit." Here's a guy that's been an independent Senator the whole time he's been there. He's perfectly willing to stand up for economic issues. Sanders is not an independent, though, he is running for the Democratic nomination. You can't campaign on "I was independent for years" when your the Democratic nominee.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:29
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Obdicut posted:Sanders is not an independent, though, he is running for the Democratic nomination. You can't campaign on "I was independent for years" when your the Democratic nominee. He's running as a Democrat but I think him being an independent for so long speaks in his favor to many. This is especially true when you consider how much he hates the Citizens United decision.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:31
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ToxicSlurpee posted:He's running as a Democrat but I think him being an independent for so long speaks in his favor to many. This is especially true when you consider how much he hates the Citizens United decision. Okay, I think that it really doesn't speak to many people if he's willing to give up being an independent to get the Democratic nomination for president. He also caucused with the Democrats and was assigned to committees based on the Democrats.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:35
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Obdicut posted:Okay, I think that it really doesn't speak to many people if he's willing to give up being an independent to get the Democratic nomination for president. He also caucused with the Democrats and was assigned to committees based on the Democrats. Through shifting rhetoric, the ally is simultaneously a Washington Outsider and is weighted by decades of experience.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:36
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Obdicut posted:Okay, I think that it really doesn't speak to many people if he's willing to give up being an independent to get the Democratic nomination for president. He also caucused with the Democrats and was assigned to committees based on the Democrats. This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed?
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Jul 4, 2015 18:46
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Obdicut posted:Okay, I think that it really doesn't speak to many people if he's willing to give up being an independent to get the Democratic nomination for president. He also caucused with the Democrats and was assigned to committees based on the Democrats. People aren't stupid, they know the only way to have a shot at the presidency is through the major parties. The democratic establishment is seen as a major part of 'the problem' by moderate republicans and independents and Sanders' status as an independent puts him miles ahead of Hillary in their eyes for this reason. E: they see Sanders as subverting the two party system. E2: a party outsider with Washington experience. Miltank fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Jul 4, 2015 |
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Jul 4, 2015 18:48
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taqueso posted:This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed? Probably? It'd be a state by state thing, since they set the rules for who can appear on the ballot. But I know Rubio is possibly giving up his senate seat since Florida prohibits running for two different offices at the same time, so I imagine the wording of that rule would also prohibit running in both the the republican and democratic primaries, but not all states have that rule.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:52
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Miltank posted:moderate republicans and independents Are there any of either of these left in the wild?
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Jul 4, 2015 18:53
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taqueso posted:This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed? Technically no but I think a vote for the candidate in Party A would be separate/competing with a vote from the candidate in Party B, unless you have New York's Fusion voting system. Basically, normal situation: quote:Party A - Candidate: 30% In fusion voting: quote:Candidate - Party A&B - 60%
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Jul 4, 2015 18:54
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taqueso posted:This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed? If you tried, one or both would likely drop their support for you like a hat; much of the reason why you associate with a party is to gain access to their resources.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:54
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Miltank posted:People aren't stupid, they know the only way to have a shot at the presidency is through the major parties. The democratic establishment is seen as a major part of 'the problem' by moderate republicans and independents and Sanders' status as an independent puts him miles ahead of Hillary in their eyes for this reason. I'll be voting for Sanders but the idea that "moderate Republicans" will vote for him because he was a de jure non-member and de facto member of the Democratic party for several years is ridiculous.
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Jul 4, 2015 18:57
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Vienna Circlejerk posted:Are there any of either of these left in the wild? They're all Democrats now, basically, or else completely sidelined and ignored.
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Jul 4, 2015 19:02
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Miltank posted:People aren't stupid, they know the only way to have a shot at the presidency is through the major parties. The democratic establishment is seen as a major part of 'the problem' by moderate republicans and independents and Sanders' status as an independent puts him miles ahead of Hillary in their eyes for this reason. Okay, I don't get how he is, or has ever, subverted the two-party system. Badger of Basra posted:I'll be voting for Sanders but the idea that "moderate Republicans" will vote for him because he was a de jure non-member and de facto member of the Democratic party for several years is ridiculous. Yeah, basically. There are probably, as covered before, a small number of cool Republicans willing to cross party lines for Sanders out of respect for him as an individual, but nobody who hates the Democrats or the two-party system is going to go "Well, I guess he has to run as a Democrat and had to caucus with them and had to get committee appointments from them so I'll overlook all that and say he was fighting them the whole time".
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Jul 4, 2015 19:05
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Vienna Circlejerk posted:Are there any of either of these left in the wild? Plenty of cultural conservatives who see both parties as completely bullshit but still vote for the GOP because their parents did. Miltank fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jul 4, 2015 |
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Jul 4, 2015 19:06
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Obdicut posted:Okay, I think that it really doesn't speak to many people if he's willing to give up being an independent to get the Democratic nomination for president. He also caucused with the Democrats and was assigned to committees based on the Democrats. The other issue is that if he runs independent, he splits the liberal base, which hands things over to the republicans like you saw with Nader. Running as a Dem prevents that split that allows the republican side to win by default.
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Jul 4, 2015 19:11
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Roydrowsy posted:The other issue is that if he runs independent, he splits the liberal base, which hands things over to the republicans like you saw with Nader. I have no problem with him running as a Democrat. I think it's absolutely the best thing to do, partially for the reason you say and partially because it gives his views more credibility and gives other Democratic candidates incentive to align themselves with him. What I'm saying is that claiming he'll draw support because he's an 'independent' really doesn't make any sense, since he's not an independent and even when he technically was, he functioned inside the Democratic political apparatus, caucusing with them (though he had to fight his way in) and given appointments by them.
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Jul 4, 2015 19:13
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdIDFL8dLIs American nationalism is centrally about democracy moderated by the practical concerns of the federal republic.
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Jul 4, 2015 19:41
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taqueso posted:This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed? Stephen Colbert attempted to do exactly that, at least in South Carolina. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Colbert_presidential_campaign,_2008
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Jul 4, 2015 20:44
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taqueso posted:This got me thinking down a stupid path. Is there any rule barring a person from seeking the nomination in multiple parties simultaneously? I assume there would be outrage, but procedurally/legally would it be allowed? Skwirl posted:Probably? It'd be a state by state thing, since they set the rules for who can appear on the ballot. But I know Rubio is possibly giving up his senate seat since Florida prohibits running for two different offices at the same time, so I imagine the wording of that rule would also prohibit running in both the the republican and democratic primaries, but not all states have that rule. Correct. There are various state laws that make it impossible. For example, New Hampshire requires you to be a registered member of the party to appear on the party's ballot and Sanders will have to register as a Democrat to compete there (as will Lincoln Chafee).
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Jul 4, 2015 20:45
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Joementum posted:(as will Lincoln Chafee). Who?
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Jul 4, 2015 20:48
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Jul 4, 2015 20:50
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The Clinton campaign used a rope to keep the cameras away at today's parades. 
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Jul 4, 2015 20:57
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Joementum posted:The Clinton campaign used a rope to keep the cameras away at today's parades. A great way to connect with the people!
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Jul 4, 2015 21:00
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By the way, this is the first time I can remember when I haven't personally seen Bernie in a 4th of July parade.
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Jul 4, 2015 21:02
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Joementum posted:The Clinton campaign used a rope to keep the cameras away at today's parades. My mother and grandfather were both journalists, but I kinda like Hillary's feud with reporters.
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Jul 4, 2015 21:04
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Obdicut posted:Okay, I don't get how he is, or has ever, subverted the two-party system. Its all about messaging obviously. The GOP is blatantly corrupt, but so is the 'Democrat Party.' Sanders tells it like it is and votes his conscience. 'Even if I disagree with some of his policies, I still trust him to not blindly follow the Democrat bosses.'
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Jul 4, 2015 21:05
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Miltank posted:Its all about messaging obviously. The the GOP is blatantly corrupt, but so is the 'Democrat Party.' Sanders tells it like it is and votes his conscience. 'Even if I disagree with some of his policies, I still trust him to not blindly follow the Democrat bosses.' I'm sorry, I don't get how this is a reply to what I'm saying. Sanders may 'tell it like it is' and may 'vote his conscience', but if the Democratic party is totally corrupt why is he seeking their nomination? I understand this is not your actual view and you're taking some hypothetical, but I'm saying that would only work if he was seeking the presidency as an independent.
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Jul 4, 2015 21:08
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Well it's a test of the democratic primary system - is it fair or is it rigged so the person with the most sponsors wins?
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Jul 4, 2015 21:12
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While I suppose it may be to the distaste of the folks who prize Bernie for his outsidery flavor and cool ranch seasoning, how likely is it that - if he did win the nomination - he would have support from the various committed Democratic groups? I suppose the punchline may be "what committed Democratic groups," which may also be why the Republicans kept running so successfully.  To be clear I mean like county political organizations rather than 'minorities in the general sense.'
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Jul 4, 2015 21:12
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Nessus posted:While I suppose it may be to the distaste of the folks who prize Bernie for his outsidery flavor and cool ranch seasoning, how likely is it that - if he did win the nomination - he would have support from the various committed Democratic groups? I suppose the punchline may be "what committed Democratic groups," which may also be why the Republicans kept running so successfully. He doesn't have anything that would stop him from getting support, I don't think. If he won Democrats would throw their weight behind him and I doubt there'd be anything less committed .I'm totally assuming that if he got the nomination he'd be smart enough to meet with and take seriously minority leaders, too so I think he'd have plenty of support from those org too.
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Jul 4, 2015 21:15
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