EuroPol: abide by D&D values or don't post

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > EuroPol: abide by D&D values or don't post

Sheng-Ji Yang: Mar 5, 2014

I like the idea of Castro just being an old dude sitting around in retirement watching TV and occasionally sending off fan mail to his favorite politicians.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:42

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 18:38

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Effectronica posted:

In an honest discussion, you wouldn't be allowed in the room. Furthermore, I didn't say "reveal what kind of freakish motivation lies underneath your refusal to explain yourself", now did I? I could have lived my life entirely happily without knowing that "Boner Slam" is a paranoid wacko, and I still intend to do so even as you reveal all the disgraceful parts of your personality and intellect unprompted.

But it's rather ridiculous to demand that someone lay out an entire system before you'll put up even one bit of relevant information, or should I say, rather European...

Ok then, simply next time don't misread my posts, construct a logically invalid argument and attack me personally.

Then, with a bit of reading comprehension, you could have grasped the point of my post: that there is an experience with communist systems irl and that the disdain is strong enough to be actively against similar ones. From this you would then take that people like me would need to be convinced that whatever you are planning will infact enhance our lives, which are now better than under the communist iteration that reigned before. It's not really that complicated, and it doesn't require at all for me to confess all my deepest believes and desires AND it doesn't require you to write out every minutae of your communist system.

Deal?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:42

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

https://www.facebook.com/501456643350586/photos/a.501460190016898.1073741828.501456643350586/501477776681806/?type=1&fref=nf

quote:

Dear people of Greece!

We, the pensioners, the doctors, the police officers, the teachers and your other ordinary fellow european citizens of Latvia are so delighted to hear that you demand european solidarity!

We're sure that you'll be happy to discover, that you've finally found new allies - us! So let's change Europe together!

The average pension in Greece is �800. The average pension in Latvia is �300. The Average salary in Greece is �820 Netto, the average salary in Latvia is �600 Netto. And by the way, Latvia is a northern country, we have a thing called 'heating season' here, when temperatures fall below -10�C, and utility bills rise by �150 a month.

So, wouldn't it be wonderful, if you could kindly share 1/3 of your pensions, taxes and salaries with us? It's our democratic choice, so please respect it! We all want it. After all, we are one european family...

Except that we never borrowed the money that we couldn't pay back to blackmail our creditors with suicide later, and to blame them for failed policies of our national government that we voted for. Our debt to GDP ratio doesn't exceed 40%. During the financial crisis, we had managed to bail out our banks and return to pre-crisis levels after 4 years of "Troika-imposed" austerity, that helped us complete important structural reforms and get our economy grow faster than anywhere in Europe! And guess what, before we joined the European Union and the Euro, we were much poorer than we are today, because after 50 years of eastern european '"solidarity" in the USSR we forgot what it means to be competitive. We forgot how to manufacture anything that could compete in a free market, but we've learned. We've learned that you shouldn't spend more than you earn. And if you need to borrow money, at least have the decency to admit that it's not a gift and should be returned. We never lied about our public debt when we joined the Euro, and we never had the need to unpeg our national currency from the euro, before or after we joined it.

Get your act together. Have the decency to admit the mistakes of your democratically elected governments that they've been making for decades. Don't blame Europe for not giving you free cash (writing off the debt). Yes, it would have been better if some debt were written off, but it's not for the one who owes the debt to decide. And if you want your creditors to do more to help you - they will, if you'll respect them, if you'll recognize their free right to do so, and if you'll show the results and the political will to change Greece to make it competitive and growing again. Vote Yes.

Greece is Europe. Europe is Greece.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:42

Badger of Basra: Jul 26, 2007

Riso posted:

https://www.facebook.com/501456643350586/photos/a.501460190016898.1073741828.501456643350586/501477776681806/?type=1&fref=nf

Lol "you're a bunch of whiny babies who won't do what we want - vote yes!"

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:44

Effectronica: May 31, 2011; Fallen Rib

Boner Slam posted:

Ok then, simply next time don't misread my posts, construct a logically invalid argument and attack me personally.

Then, with a bit of reading comprehension, you could have grasped the point of my post: that there is an experience with communist systems irl and that the disdain is strong enough to be actively against similar ones. From this you would then take that people like me would need to be convinced that whatever you are planning will infact enhance our lives, which are now better than under the communist iteration that reigned before. It's not really that complicated, and it doesn't require at all for me to confess all my deepest believes and desires.

Deal?

Why would "we" need to convince freakish paranoids about the benefits of the system? Your particular brain problems would make that quite insurmountable, it seems. Furthermore, Europeans are essentially the aristocrats of the world! Why would you benefit from a reordering?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:44

Franks Happy Place: Mar 15, 2011; It is by weed alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the dank of Sapho that thoughts acquire speed, the lips acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by weed alone I set my mind in motion.

Riso posted:

https://www.facebook.com/501456643350586/photos/a.501460190016898.1073741828.501456643350586/501477776681806/?type=1&fref=nf

lumpen_proles.txt

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:45

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

Franks Happy Place posted:

lumpen_proles.txt

Marx himself was not a fan. To put it mildly.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:46

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Effectronica posted:

Why would "we" need to convince freakish paranoids about the benefits of the system? Your particular brain problems would make that quite insurmountable, it seems. Furthermore, Europeans are essentially the aristocrats of the world! Why would you benefit from a reordering?

Well I thought you wanted to discuss my post when you replied. So what you are saying is that you just wanted to call me a dumb person and European and were not interested in any discussion.
Okay then, you are really a class act.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:47

Effectronica: May 31, 2011; Fallen Rib

Boner Slam posted:

Well I thought you wanted to discuss my post when you replied. So what you are saying is that you just wanted to call me a dumb person and European and were not interested in any discussion.
Okay then, you are really a class act.

I was interested in discussion when I could pretend you were a normal human being. Now that I can't, the gloss is somewhat off pseudoconversation with a pseudohuman, especially a highly paranoid one.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:48

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

Boner Slam posted:

Okay then, you are really a class act.

Don't you know class is a bourgeois concept we must overcome to be truly free?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:49

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Riso posted:

Don't you know class is a bourgeois concept we must overcome to be truly free?

how inconsiderate of me, you are right

Effectronica posted:

I was interested in discussion when I could pretend you were a normal human being. Now that I can't, the gloss is somewhat off pseudoconversation with a pseudohuman, especially a highly paranoid one.

you are literally unable to respond in anything other than insults, do you realize that?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:49

GaussianCopula: Jun 5, 2011; Jews fleeing the Holocaust are not in any way comparable to North Africans, who don't flee genocide but want to enjoy the social welfare systems of Northern Europe.

So let's say Tsipras new plan is actually the Juncker's plan and he sucks enough dick tomorrow so that the creditors agree. What was the point of the referendum, the capital controls and the bank holiday?

How much change is needed to make it "worth it"? Would an agreement along the "Tsipras letter (30th June)" be worth it?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:49

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

That custom title that Fucktronica had for a while, warning people not to engage in "debate" with him because he's constantly full of poo poo, was useful. We, as a thread and a forums, are poorer for having lost it. It's like this in every single thread.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:50

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

GaussianCopula posted:

What was the point of the referendum, the capital controls and the bank holiday?

Domestic politics.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:51

Badger of Basra: Jul 26, 2007

Riso posted:

Domestic politics.

And Angela Merkel is obviously being a clear-eyed internationalist.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:52

Effectronica: May 31, 2011; Fallen Rib

Boner Slam posted:

how inconsiderate of me, you are right

you are literally unable to respond in anything other than insults, do you realize that?

Look, it's not my problem that phrenological science shows that European skulls are crushed an inch inward during birth, causing permanent and abiding brain damage.

PT6A posted:

That custom title that Fucktronica had for a while, warning people not to engage in "debate" with him because he's constantly full of poo poo, was useful. We, as a thread and a forums, are poorer for having lost it. It's like this in every single thread.

Oh drat, you replaced part of my username with a swear. Now I'm in the hospital for third-degree burns.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:53

GaussianCopula: Jun 5, 2011; Jews fleeing the Holocaust are not in any way comparable to North Africans, who don't flee genocide but want to enjoy the social welfare systems of Northern Europe.

Riso posted:

Domestic politics.

Yeah but I don't get it. If Tsipras wanted he could have backed YES and get around the ELA thumbscrews being tightened (the question would have been another but that doesnt matter).

And talking about ELA thumbscrews, the ECB just tightened them a bit

http://www.ecb.europa.eu/press/pr/date/2015/html/pr150706.en.html

quote:

In this context, the Governing Council decided today to adjust the haircuts on collateral accepted by the Bank of Greece for ELA.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:54

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

quote:

Oh drat, you replaced part of my username with a swear. Now I'm in the hospital for third-degree burns.

Don't worry, I burned you three posts earlier.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:54

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Effectronica posted:

Look, it's not my problem that phrenological science shows that European skulls are crushed an inch inward during birth, causing permanent and abiding brain damage.

Oh drat, you replaced part of my username with a swear. Now I'm in the hospital for third-degree burns.

This is really somewhat demeaning for you, given that you started your rant basically as "I am smart, you are dumb".

# ? Jul 6, 2015 18:57

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

GaussianCopula posted:

Yeah but I don't get it. If Tsipras wanted he could have backed YES and get around the ELA thumbscrews being tightened (the question would have been another but that doesnt matter).

And talking about ELA thumbscrews, the ECB just tightened them a bit

http://www.ecb.europa.eu/press/pr/date/2015/html/pr150706.en.html

I think the point is that they can believably claim to have gone against the Troika to the bitter end. If Merkel really gives out no deal at all, she will damage her reputation and deeply fracture the EU. I think now SYRIZA has much more power than before. It was a gamble they won.

Edit: VVV flight into absurdity does not erase your shame VVV

Boner Slam fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Jul 6, 2015

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:00

Effectronica: May 31, 2011; Fallen Rib

Boner Slam posted:

This is really somewhat demeaning for you, given that you started your rant basically as "I am smart, you are dumb".

It's pure science. Even an American of average intelligence, thanks to the civilizing practices of African and Native American culture which correct for this flaw in childbirth, is roughly twice as smart as any European.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:00

Flowers For Algeria: Dec 3, 2005; I humbly offer my services as forum inquisitor. There is absolutely no way I would abuse this power in any way.

V. Illych L. posted:

actually, could one of the frogs itt give a rundown on the myriad corruption scandals on a slow burn these days

Sorry, all I remember is stuff about how Sarkozy tried to obtain favors for a high-ranking judge in exchange for info on another scandal he was involved in.
I think that's the main thing facing hom now, IIRC the legality of the wiretaps was recently confirmed.
The case about the financing of his 2007 campaign by Libya and Bettencourt has fallen apart.
I forgot about the rest. He's utter poo poo and I hope he goes to prison.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:02

lollontee: Nov 4, 2014; Can't post for 10 years!

IMO the thread would be much improved if effecrtonica, boner slam and gaussian cupola would stop posting in it

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:02

Flowers For Algeria: Dec 3, 2005; I humbly offer my services as forum inquisitor. There is absolutely no way I would abuse this power in any way.

Friendly Tumour posted:

IMO the thread would be much improved if pro-yes posters would stop posting in it

Ftfy

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:06

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

And another factor is that France and Spain have basically now revealed that they will cave in the negotiations. This was probably not intended, but is important information Greece can now use.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:06

Al-Saqr: Nov 11, 2007; One Day I Will Return To Your Side.

Yanis Varoufakis publishes an excerpt of his upcoming book, really interesting stuff:-

Yanis Varoufakis posted:

Bankruptocracy is as much a European predicament as it is an American �invention�. The difference between the experience of the two continents is that at least Americans did not have to labour under the enormous design faults of the eurozone. Imagine their chagrin if the citizens of hard-hit states (eg Nevada or Ohio) had to worry about a death embrace between the debt of their state and the losses of the banks who happened to operate within the state.

Additionally, Americans were spared the need to contend with a central bank utterly shackled by inner divisions and the German central bank�s penchant for treating the worst-hit parts of the union (the eurozone, that is) as alien lands that had to be fiscally waterboarded until they ceased to obey the laws of macroeconomics.

In the past two years, the debate in Europe has focused exclusively on issues that sound technical and minor: will there be �conditionality� attached to the purchases of Italian and Spanish bonds by the European Central Bank? Will the ECB supervise all of Europe�s banks, or just the �systemic� ones?

These are questions that ought to be of no genuine interest to anyone other than those with a morbid interest in the interface between public finance and monetary policy. And yet these questions (and the manner in which they will be answered) will probably prove as important for the future of Europe as the treaties of Westphalia, Versailles or even Rome. For these are the issues that will determine whether Europe holds together or succumbs to the vicious centrifugal forces that were unleashed by the crash of 2008.

Even so, they are not issues that are worth expounding upon here. All they do is to reflect a tragic, underlying reality that can be described in simple lay terms without the use of any jargon whatsoever: Europe is disintegrating because its architecture was simply not sound enough to sustain the shockwaves caused by the death throes of what I call the Global Minotaur: the system of neoliberal capitalism centred on Wall Street, extracting tribute from the world after 1971.

It is quite obvious that the insolvency of Madrid and Rome had nothing to do with fiscal profligacy (recall that Spain had a lower debt than Germany in 2008 and Italy has consistently smaller budget deficits) and everything to do with the way in which the eurozone�s macroeconomy relied significantly for the demand of its net exports on the Global Minotaur. Once the latter keeled over in 2008, and Wall Street�s private cash disappeared, two effects brought Europe to its knees.

One was the sequential death-embrace of bankrupt banks and insolvent states (beginning with Greece, moving to Ireland, to Portugal and continuing until Italy and Spain were torn asunder). The other was the Minotaur�s simulacrum and its determination to hang on to its option of exiting the eurozone at will, therefore denying each and every rational plan for mending the currency union in a sustainable manner.

The telling question thus becomes: why such resistance, particularly from Germany, to every idea that would end the euro crisis? The standard answer is that Germany does not wish to pay for the debts of the periphery and will resist all federal-like moves (eg a banking or a fiscal union) until it is convinced that its partners will behave responsibly with their German-backed finances. While this captures well the mindset of many northern Europeans, it is beside the point. Consider the following mental experiment, which, I believe, helps us unveil a deeper motive.

Picture the scene when a sheepish finance minister enters the chancellor�s Berlin office bearing a control panel featuring one yellow and one red button, and telling her that she must choose to press one or the other. This is how he explains what each button will do:

The red button

If you press it, chancellor, the euro crisis ends immediately, with a general rise in growth throughout Europe, a sudden collapse of debt for each member state to below its Maastricht limit, no pain for Greek citizens (or for the Italians, Portuguese, etc), no guarantees for the periphery�s debts (states or banks) to be provided by German and Dutch taxpayers, interest rate spreads below 3% throughout the eurozone, a diminution in the eurozone�s internal imbalances, and a wholesale rise in aggregate investment.

The yellow button

If you press it, chancellor, the situation in the eurozone remains more or less as it is for a decade. The euro crisis continues to bubble along, albeit in a controlled fashion. While the probability of a break-up, which will be a calamity for Germany, remains non-trivial, the chances are that, if you push the yellow button, the eurozone will not break up (with a little help from the European Central Bank), German interest rates will remain extremely low, the euro will be nicely depressed (�nicely� from the perspective of German exporters), the periphery�s spreads will be sky-high (but not explosive), Italy and Spain will enter deeper into a debt-deflationary spiral that sees to a reduction of their national income by 15% over the next three years, France shall slip steadily into quasi-insolvency, GDP per capita will rise slowly in the surplus countries and fall precipitously in the periphery. As for the first �fallen� nations (Greece, Ireland and Portugal), they shall become little Latvias, or indeed Kosovos: devastated lands (after the loss of between 25% and 40% of national income, a massive exodus of their skilled labour) on which our people will holiday and buy cheap real estate. In aggregate, if you choose the yellow button, chancellor, eurozone unemployment will remain well above UK and US levels, investment will be anaemic, growth negative and poverty on the up and up.

Which button do you think, dear reader, the chancellor would want to push?

Whereas the yellow button would hold no attraction for the American president or the British prime minister, for the German chancellor the yellow button is a far more powerful option. Even if the chancellor wanted to opt for the red button, she would be terrorised by the reaction of the German electorate were she to do so. Letting the Greeks and the Italians, the Spaniards and the Portuguese, off the hook of their Great Depression so �easily� would be unlikely to win many votes east of the Rhine and north of the Alps.

For two years now, the German public has become convinced that Germany has escaped the worst of the crisis because of its people�s virtuous embracing of thriftiness and hard work; in contrast to the spendthrift southerners, who, like the fickle grasshopper, made no provision for when the winds of finance would turn cold and nasty.

This mindset goes hand in hand with a moral righteousness which implants into good people�s hearts and minds a penchant for exacting punishment on the grasshoppers � even if punishing them also punishes themselves (to some extent). It also goes hand in hand with a radical misunderstanding of what kept the eurozone healthy and Germany in surplus prior to 2008: that is, the Global Minotaur whose demand-generation antics were for decades allowing countries like Germany and the Netherlands to remain net exporters of capital and consumer goods within and without the eurozone (while importing US-sourced demand for their goods from the eurozone�s periphery).

Interestingly, one of the great secrets of the post-2008 period is that the Minotaur�s death adversely affected aggregate demand in the eurozone�s surplus countries (Germany, the Netherlands, Austria and Finland) more than it did the deficit member states (like Italy, Spain, Ireland, Portugal and Greece). While the sudden withdrawal of capital from the deficit countries brought about their insolvency, countries like Germany saw their �fundamentals� more grievously affected by the crash of 2008. This fact, in conjunction with the terrible squeeze on German wages, explains the deeper causes of the animosity in places like Germany that so very easily translates into anger against the Greeks and assorted Mediterraneans � feelings that are then reciprocated, thus giving the wheel of intra-European animosities another spin, favouring the rise of xenophobia, even Nazism (in countries like Greece, quite incredibly), and thus leading to a wholesale readiness to push all the yellow, as opposed to the red, buttons in sight.

To recap, the Minotaur�s surplus recycling was essential to the maintenance of the eurozone�s faulty edifice. Once it vanished from the scene, the European common currency area would either be redesigned or it would enter a long, painful period of disintegration. An unwillingness by the surplus countries to accept that, in the post-Minotaur world, some other form of surplus recycling is necessary (and that some of their own surpluses must also be subject to such recycling) is the reason why Europe is looking like a case of alchemy-in-reverse: for whereas the alchemist strove to turn lead into gold, Europe�s reverse alchemists began with gold (an integration project that was the pride of its elites) but will soon end up with the institutional equivalent of lead.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:07

Job Truniht: Nov 7, 2012; MY POSTS ARE REAL RETARDED, SIR

Riso posted:

https://www.facebook.com/501456643350586/photos/a.501460190016898.1073741828.501456643350586/501477776681806/?type=1&fref=nf

The crab mentality has finally taken over. Now it's a race to the bottom to see which European post Cold War travesty can be the poorest.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:08

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

GaussianCopula posted:

Yeah but I don't get it. If Tsipras wanted he could have backed YES and get around the ELA thumbscrews being tightened (the question would have been another but that doesnt matter).

Yes why didn't the guy that was elected on a platform of reducing austerity because it was loving his people campaign for his people to accept austerity?

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:12

Sheng-Ji Yang: Mar 5, 2014

Al-Saqr posted:

Yanis Varoufakis publishes an excerpt of his upcoming book, really interesting stuff:-

I was pretty disappointed when he resigned, but now I get to read an angry tell all book from him :allears:

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:14

LemonDrizzle: Mar 28, 2012; neoliberal shithead

GaussianCopula posted:

And talking about ELA thumbscrews, the ECB just tightened them a bit

http://www.ecb.europa.eu/press/pr/date/2015/html/pr150706.en.html

So, uh, about those claims that the Greek banking system would be able to hold out until Wednesday...

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:17

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Sheng-ji Yang posted:

I was pretty disappointed when he resigned, but now I get to read an angry tell all book from him

I hope he will publish it in pdf for free, given that it would be mightily wrong to profit from the situation and plight of his brethren in this way.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:19

GaussianCopula: Jun 5, 2011; Jews fleeing the Holocaust are not in any way comparable to North Africans, who don't flee genocide but want to enjoy the social welfare systems of Northern Europe.

MeLKoR posted:

Yes why didn't the guy that was elected on a platform of reducing austerity because it was loving his people campaign for his people to accept austerity?

But if he is no proposing a deal along the lines of the Juncker proposal isn't he backing austerity? really confusing.

LemonDrizzle posted:

So, uh, about those claims that the Greek banking system would be able to hold out until Wednesday...

The adjusted haircut should have little practical effects under current circumstances, as the ELA cap should be lower than their potential collateral.

Update: According to Reuters via ZeroHedge ELA cap = remaining collateral, meaning that banks can't open without being recapitalized (or haircut adjusted again)

GaussianCopula fucked around with this message at 19:22 on Jul 6, 2015

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:19

DekeThornton: Sep 2, 2011; Be friends!

LemonDrizzle posted:

So, uh, about those claims that the Greek banking system would be able to hold out until Wednesday...

Don't worry, the cash will start raining from the sky any minute now.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:20

Job Truniht: Nov 7, 2012; MY POSTS ARE REAL RETARDED, SIR

Boner Slam posted:

I hope he will publish it in pdf for free, given that it would be mightily wrong to profit from the situation and plight of his brethren in this way.

Yeah, like those damned leftist hypocrites Russel Brand, Thomas Picketty, and Karl Marx.

e: also Zizek

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:21

Nonsense: Jan 26, 2007

DekeThornton posted:

Don't worry, the cash will start raining from the sky any minute now.

Anti-EU paper gives a gently caress what the EU thinks is legal. Britain is staying farragailures.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:23

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

Riso posted:

Austrian apple pie is not so much a pie as a very nice cinnamon flavoured danish.

Sounds good. I think I had the French version once.

V. Illych L. posted:

apple pie is inferior to apple cake imo

I prefer either depending on my mood, but I can understand and respect your position.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:23

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Merkel Hollande press conference:
https://amp.twimg.com/v/1e4ff679-f0b4-4a95-8900-5650e350382d

Merkel:
- Respect decision of Greece people
- Door stay open
- However, currently no way to enter into ESM program
- Therefore, need new proposal from Greece asap
- Solidarity with Greece is one principle, last offer was generous
- On the other hand each country needs to take responsibility
- And: Tomorrow the interests of all other 18 states will also be weighted in
- "That is also democracy"

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:24

GaussianCopula: Jun 5, 2011; Jews fleeing the Holocaust are not in any way comparable to North Africans, who don't flee genocide but want to enjoy the social welfare systems of Northern Europe.

Random observation of the day: Sch�uble, Sapin and Merkel all mentioned refugee crisis as major priority for the EU. Seems like Renzi is going to get paid.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:28

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

GaussianCopula posted:

Random observation of the day: Sch�uble, Sapin and Merkel all mentioned refugee crisis as major priority for the EU. Seems like Renzi is going to get paid.

Good luck convincing Eastern Europe (esp Poland) to take refugees.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:29

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 3, 2024 18:38

Boner Slam: May 9, 2005

Riso posted:

Good luck convincing Eastern Europe (esp Poland) to take refugees.

Maybe Merkel just gives some money to Renzi so that he can send back the refugees and in return he joins in keeping the Greek people poor.
A truly humanitarian solution.

# ? Jul 6, 2015 19:38

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