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tatankatonk posted:Ferrinus is fine, and concern trolling on behalf of imaginary Mage neophytes is incredibly tiresome. I hope this clears things up. Ferrinus posted:Good, gently caress off to Dungeon World or something. Mage'd certainly be lost on you.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:04
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paradoxGentleman posted:The fact that you are picking Dungeon World, a game that while not perfect is decently serviceable, as a negative example is not helping your case.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:07
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Chernobyl Peace Prize posted:Wasnt your sole contribution to the Mage discussion noting how many posts were made in it Yes, because I have never read anything related to Mage and was bemused to see it create once again such heated discussion. What's wrong with that?
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Jul 9, 2015 20:11
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You know, having come into WoD relatively late I never understood why Mage had such a bad rep in online discussions. Now I know 
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Jul 9, 2015 20:15
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paradoxGentleman posted:Yes, because I have never read anything related to Mage and was bemused to see it create once again such heated discussion. What's wrong with that? wow +1 post from this guy, whats next a novel
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Jul 9, 2015 20:15
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paradoxGentleman posted:Yes, because I have never read anything related to Mage and was bemused to see it create once again such heated discussion. What's wrong with that?
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Jul 9, 2015 20:15
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I should note at this point that perhaps the discussion wouldn't be so heated were the sample character in question not created by the developers of the game to specifically troll people on this board. "Wow, all this talking and caring about things just came out of NOWHERE, must be a problem inherent to Mage" is a pretty disingenuous response to that!
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Jul 9, 2015 20:23
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Kibner posted:Speaking of layout, what tool(s) do you guys use for that? The only ones I am familiar with is LaTeX and its family. Adobe. Many printers, especially in PoD, won't give anything else the time of day. Note that layout and art direction are done by different folks than the writer/developer team, though the developer does back and forths with Chaney or whoever else is doing art and layout.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:34
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Crion posted:I should note at this point that perhaps the discussion wouldn't be so heated were the sample character in question not created by the developers of the game to specifically troll people on this board. "Wow, all this talking and caring about things just came out of NOWHERE, must be a problem inherent to Mage" is a pretty disingenuous response to that! Maybe the people on this board should be less easy to troll.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:51
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Blockhouse posted:Maybe the people on this board should be less easy to troll. Calling a change to a published professional product a year in the making an "easy troll" does a disservice to the fine writers over at OPP. Easy trolling would be, for example, this http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3712435&pagenumber=88&perpage=40#post447535269
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Jul 9, 2015 20:56
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I think you're vastly overestimating this board's importance in the scheme of things. I don't even know if the author of the Order writeups reads it.
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Jul 9, 2015 21:09
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I'm pretty sure that the guy who wrote "Put simply, I wanted an Arrow where a lawyer is just as valid a character as a knight, and I think Neall Raemonn Price, long-suffering Scion Developer and oft-fired freelancer, has delivered." and indeed "Congrats, WoD Megathread: You finally get Phoenix Wright as an Arrow." reads this board, though.
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Jul 9, 2015 21:36
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Come on, obviously an Adamantine Arrow lawyer is not going to be Phoenix Wright. He's going to be LT / LCDR / CDR / CAPT Harmon "Harm" Rabb, Jr., JAGC, USN, and the Mage NCIS spin-off will run for eleven years.
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Jul 9, 2015 22:47
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Guys? Calm down please  EVERYTHING in Mage is subjective. The Orders means different things to different mages. Please keep your ontological discussions ingame.
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Jul 9, 2015 22:54
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DJ Dizzy posted:Guys? Calm down please Who isn't calm?
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Jul 9, 2015 23:08
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DJ Dizzy posted:EVERYTHING in Mage is subjective. We're talking about the good Mage.
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Jul 9, 2015 23:27
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That's just like... your opinion man. 
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Jul 9, 2015 23:36
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On a non-Mage topic, is that Atavism that gives Beasts always-on 3/2 Armor genuinely as broken as it appears at first glance?
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Jul 9, 2015 23:52
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Poltergrift posted:On a non-Mage topic, is that Atavism that gives Beasts always-on 3/2 Armor genuinely as broken as it appears at first glance? Beast: for when you really want to push your friends around in an rpg game
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Jul 10, 2015 00:09
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Ferrinus posted:I'm pretty sure that the guy who wrote "Put simply, I wanted an Arrow where a lawyer is just as valid a character as a knight, and I think Neall Raemonn Price, long-suffering Scion Developer and oft-fired freelancer, has delivered." and indeed "Congrats, WoD Megathread: You finally get Phoenix Wright as an Arrow." reads this board, though. I do! And my days of not taking it seriously are certainly coming to a middle. I did not instruct Neall to make one of them a lawyer, the sample character was not in his first draft. Another one that I didn't like was, and I asked him to replace it with a non-physical example. And then, when I put the spoiler up, I remembered that this thread is obsessed with Arrow lawyers. If I misremembered it as something you were all keen on rather than something you all hated, I apologize. Still not changing it, though.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:17
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Dave Brookshaw posted:I do! And my days of not taking it seriously are certainly coming to a middle. I did not instruct Neall to make one of them a lawyer, the sample character was not in his first draft. Another one that I didn't like was, and I asked him to replace it with a non-physical example. And then, when I put the spoiler up, I remembered that this thread is obsessed with Arrow lawyers. What does a 'non-physical example' mean?
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Jul 10, 2015 00:21
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I don't see the big deal about Arrow lawyers tbh. Could jut be a mage that sees every court case as his own personal battle, and the courtroom as his battleground. He must win this battle without mentally influencing the judge/jury, or in other ways use illegal means such as blackmail. Postcognition, mind reading and other things are all perfectly legitimate though. His virtue would be Justice.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:24
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I liked it! 
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Jul 10, 2015 00:24
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MalcolmSheppard posted:Adobe. Many printers, especially in PoD, won't give anything else the time of day. Note that layout and art direction are done by different folks than the writer/developer team, though the developer does back and forths with Chaney or whoever else is doing art and layout. Thanks for the response. A few years ago, I was asked to create some documentation for a piece of software and we didn't have access to any Adobe products and the hospital I worked for sure as gently caress wasn't going to buy any. So, I learned how to use that LaTeX stuff I mentioned. I imagine Adobe is much easier to use, since TeX based tools you pretty much write markup (like html) and using GUI based ways to write markup often leads to a lot of pain later.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:25
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tatankatonk posted:What does a 'non-physical example' mean? He doesn't fight by physical means.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:25
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What is an Arrow? In 1e, they were the footsoldiers in the war against the Exarchs. I have no idea what they are now.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:27
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Kibner posted:Thanks for the response. A few years ago, I was asked to create some documentation for a piece of software and we didn't have access to any Adobe products and the hospital I worked for sure as gently caress wasn't going to buy any. So, I learned how to use that LaTeX stuff I mentioned.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:34
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Dave Brookshaw posted:I do! And my days of not taking it seriously are certainly coming to a middle. I did not instruct Neall to make one of them a lawyer, the sample character was not in his first draft. Another one that I didn't like was, and I asked him to replace it with a non-physical example. And then, when I put the spoiler up, I remembered that this thread is obsessed with Arrow lawyers. Of course you're not going to change it. Who on earth expected you to change it? You people didn't even change Beast. I certainly wouldn't want you to. I'd rather have the fact that I trolled you into making both Arrow example characters Seers immortalized.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:35
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Chernobyl Peace Prize posted:Adobe InDesign's probably the easiest layout software to use on the market. Drag and drop anything, anchor stuff and flow with a few clicks, shortcuts for basically everything. For instance, it takes a single keyboard shortcut to add an index entry anchor/reference to a word/phrase, and just two more to generate an index that outputs the current page location of every indexed item in the book file! Nice. TeX is similar, but more cumbersome. You use different tags to mark things (captions, images, chapters, quotes, words for indexing, etc.). You then call a command that will use those tags to output whatever you want wherever that command is called. This leads to things like table of contents, indexes, reference pages, etc. always having the correct page number. Being able to do that kind of stuff without having to type all of it seems much easier. Especially when it comes to positioning images where you want them to appear on the page.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:43
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Mexcillent posted:Beast: for when you really want to push your friends around in an rpg game I'm pretty sure that Armor 3/2 is equivalent to plate mail. This one Atavism lets a Beast basically shrug off most damage, and since it's supernatural armor, it can probably be finagled into providing resistance to Armor-ignoring effects (i.e. electrical current). Why would you let anyone play a Beast.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:43
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Using google street view as a means to be familiar enough with an area to teleport there: great idea, or greatest idea? Discuss.
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Jul 10, 2015 00:53
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DJ Dizzy posted:I don't see the big deal about Arrow lawyers tbh. Could jut be a mage that sees every court case as his own personal battle, and the courtroom as his battleground. He must win this battle without mentally influencing the judge/jury, or in other ways use illegal means such as blackmail. Postcognition, mind reading and other things are all perfectly legitimate though. His virtue would be Justice. The problem is that a courtroom isn't an actual battleground by the Order's own standards. It's a symbolic battleground in some ways, so it might serve as good practice or a handy rote laboratory or something, but if the cliffs notes version of the character begins and ends with how good he is at throwing people into prison something has gone wrong. Poltergrift posted:I'm pretty sure that Armor 3/2 is equivalent to plate mail. This one Atavism lets a Beast basically shrug off most damage, and since it's supernatural armor, it can probably be finagled into providing resistance to Armor-ignoring effects (i.e. electrical current). Is it actually a big deal, though? A demon takes 1 damage from all attacks, a werewolf regenerates their entire health bar per round, a vampire's effectively got [Resilience] armor whenever they need it, etc.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:09
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Ferrinus posted:The problem is that a courtroom isn't an actual battleground by the Order's own standards. It's a symbolic battleground in some ways, so it might serve as good practice or a handy rote laboratory or something, but if the cliffs notes version of the character begins and ends with how good he is at throwing people into prison something has gone wrong. Could also be exonerating people as a defense lawyer.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:16
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I don't have any issue with Adamantine Arrow Lawyers in a vacuum, and don't need the character changed to be satisfied. Its a silly one-off spawn of a cheap freelancer. You'll never run into one "in the wild" because they'd be fired from their job the minute they got lost in the Astral for a week or shot by a Banisher. But having the line about temporal values and sleeper championship needs work and either alteration or redefinition, because I'm seeing in this very thread people going nuts trying to make that mean something else, from "only border wars count" to "the order is does not believe anything because everything is temporal", all just to justify a silly meme of a State Prosecutor as the leadoff example of an Arrow. Gerund fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Jul 10, 2015 |
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Jul 10, 2015 01:17
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Kibner posted:Nice. TeX is similar, but more cumbersome. You use different tags to mark things (captions, images, chapters, quotes, words for indexing, etc.). You then call a command that will use those tags to output whatever you want wherever that command is called. This leads to things like table of contents, indexes, reference pages, etc. always having the correct page number. I have to use TeX to submit math homework, and formatting is often harder than doing the work itself. I can't imagine laying out a whole document in it, so I'm pretty impressed that you managed.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:37
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Ferrinus posted:Is it actually a big deal, though? A demon takes 1 damage from all attacks, a werewolf regenerates their entire health bar per round, a vampire's effectively got [Resilience] armor whenever they need it, etc. a) Which kind of demon are we talking about, here? I may be missing something if it's a Descent demon. b) I will admit, I'm not super knowledgeable on nWoD's mechanics. I do know that bane access for vampires and werewolves, where supernatural armor doesn't apply, is a whole lot more common (own a lighter or open your curtains, own a nice candlestick) than for Beasts (only what Heroes do and only if you've been neglecting your awfulness practice), which seems to me to imply that a Beast's always-on 3/2 is more valuable than a vampire's Resilience-for-Vitae or a werewolf's bashing for nothing / lethal for Essence. If I'm wrong here, well, it's why I'm asking.
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Jul 10, 2015 01:39
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DJ Dizzy posted:Could also be exonerating people as a defense lawyer. The sample character isn't, though. What's his deal? Why's he an Arrow? What makes him that way?
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Jul 10, 2015 01:53
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Yawgmoth posted:Using google street view as a means to be familiar enough with an area to teleport there: great idea, or greatest idea? Discuss. I like the idea of McDonald's Roulette- any attempt to teleport to a McDonald's sends you to a random McDonald's with the same layout.
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Jul 10, 2015 02:07
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Poltergrift posted:a) Which kind of demon are we talking about, here? I may be missing something if it's a Descent demon. a) There's a power "just bruised" which reflexively and costlessly allows a demon to reduce any amount of damage they take to one. The dicepool shrinks if you fail repeated rolls but it's not hard to get a good dicepool on it. b) I think Resilience explicitly works on fire and werewolves have a few ways lying around to heal aggravated. Also, like, if you really want some 3/2 armor, you could just... put on armor. In general the number of insane buttblasts littering the 2E combat arena means that it's really hard to point to any individual power and say it's a problem. Like, if I was going to worry about Beast balance re: other supernaturals I'd be worrying about the various save-or-suck Nightmares they have floating around rather than an armor bonus that I assume everybody and their brother has some means of replicating... but I would tell you that worrying about 2E combat balance is a lost cause from the start. Nobody's trying.
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Jul 10, 2015 02:23
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Pope Guilty posted:I like the idea of McDonald's Roulette- any attempt to teleport to a McDonald's sends you to a random McDonald's with the same layout.
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Jul 10, 2015 02:25
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