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Or you could just not skip any parts because it's not a race and you don't need to burn through JoJo as fast as possible.
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Jul 10, 2015 15:47
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CodfishCartographer posted:Or you could just not skip any parts because it's not a race and you don't need to burn through JoJo as fast as possible. People aren't skipping parts to race to the finish line though. They are skipping ones with bad translations to read the parts with good ones. That's why I skipped Part 5 to read 6.
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Jul 10, 2015 15:52
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SyntheticPolygon posted:If only because the C-Moon fight is really great and then he just ends up upgrading his stand through nonsense. The C-Moon fight is peak Jojo. To avoid getting turned inside out, I'm going to turn my heart into a mobius strip. One of many reasons why Jolyne is the best and Stone Free is the coolest protag stand
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Jul 10, 2015 15:54
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I'm not a huge fan of Pucci, but that final fight is real good. Pucci starts turning Jolyne inside out so Jolyne counters that by turning herself into a Mobius strip and that's like the coolest thing ever. Also Do Not Skip JoJo Parts
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Jul 10, 2015 15:54
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Everything is good about Stone Ocean but the ending. It's so bad that it soils the whole arc for me. It doesn't feel satisfying in the slightest. Everything happens so quickly and then bam, day is saved by not a Jojo.
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Jul 10, 2015 15:57
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I like Stone Ocean, but it is easily one of the weaker parts of the series. Stands are cooler and unique, but the trade off for that is some fights are really annoyingly drawn and the art is not great in certain places. There are too many fights, Part 5 is the perfect example of how you pace fights in a weekly series, Stone Ocean is like the complete antithesis of that and doesn't know how to properly pace itself. The main character is cool, but at times Araki writes her to be unnecessarily brutal and it makes her come off as a more unlikeable person. Annasui is an absolutely horrible character and the funny lines he gets does not make up for the fact that one of the best characters is sacrificed for him. The ending is terrible, I'm sorry to say, because I know some people like the ending. It's such a clusterfuck of so much happening, so many character deaths, and the culmination of the villain's bullshit plot armor. The only cool thing about the ending is how the villain dies. The whole new universe thing is made more pointless by SBR not even being the same one, so it doesn't even have the excuse that it created one of the best parts of the series. SBR has a lot of fun in like the main three girl team all being fun, the stands are cool, and prior to leaving the prison it's only huge issue was the fight fest that took place when Survivor was doing stuff.
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Jul 10, 2015 16:23
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It does still have excuse because it established that there's the concept of an alternate universe and gave Araki the freedom to wipe the slate clean. I'm in the "Ending is great" camp, but I've always loved things where the heroes don't necessarily win.
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Jul 10, 2015 16:33
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Part 7 would've done it anyways with Valentine, so it absolutely does not have that excuse.
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Jul 10, 2015 16:39
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Part 7 likely would have followed on in the same universe as Part 6 if Araki hadn't decided to say that plot line ends there. The fact that he could start over from the beginning, in any time period, without having to think about whose child should be whose and such is what allowed Steel Ball Run to go back to the 1890's and refresh things and begin again. Without that reset, any attempt to restart would be questioned as to why he's starting over, why these characters reference the existing ones and lots of other stuff. The ending of Part 6 is unquestionably responsible for Part 7. It's both context for it and justification.
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Jul 10, 2015 16:46
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Part 6 is one of the strongest parts of the series. Different strokes for different folks.
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Jul 10, 2015 16:46
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Aurain posted:Part 7 likely would have followed on in the same universe as Part 6 if Araki hadn't decided to say that plot line ends there. The fact that he could start over from the beginning, in any time period, without having to think about whose child should be whose and such is what allowed Steel Ball Run to go back to the 1890's and refresh things and begin again. SBR wasn't even a JoJo story until some time after it started. Saying it is context and justification when Part 7 can be easily read without needing to read other parts of the series is silly. No one ever questioned why Araki was starting over, but it's not because of the Stone Ocean ending, it's because SO was legit structured like it was the last part of the JoJo series. SBR was serialized in WSJ, but quickly went to Ultra Jump so the divide between SBR and the rest of JoJo was made clear and to the audience that actually read it as it was happening it was a completely new series by Araki who was done with JoJo. No one thought it was an alternate universe, because it wasn't immediately clear what SBR even was. Among the use of like character names people recognized, it was set in the 1890s, so it could've just as easily been a new story using two names people recognized for all they knew and that was how it was thought to be for a bit. The alternate universe thing didn't become apparent until the manga got further and further along and it became more obvious. Your audience does not need evidence that there can be alternate universe for them to accept there is an alternate universe. Contextualizing things that an audience can and DID infer through basic story progression and character recognition is unnecessary and a stupid justification for someone who was making a silly comment that wasn't even the crux of the argument he was making about why Stone Ocean's ending loving sucked.
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Jul 10, 2015 17:11
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Shukaro posted:Part 6 is one of the strongest parts of the series. Different strokes for different folks. Totally, insofar as it's cool if you like Stone Ocean, but I think it made it clear that Araki needed some time to rethink what he wanted to do. SBR is a great because Stands are less a thing onto themselves and more a compliment to a person's natural abilities, and I hope JoJolion doesn't stray too far from it.
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Jul 10, 2015 17:49
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Since there's a lot of question about which part has good scans and translation and colour and whatnot, would there be any interest in compiling an effortpost of sorts, with what Part has what? I'm about 75% done with DiU and it's kind of disheartening to think about how what comes ahead is pretty impenetrable.
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Jul 10, 2015 17:51
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Rodyle posted:So that was pretty rad, can I read Vento Aureo or is it afflicted with whatever weird scan disease Jojo has always seemed to suffer from? The actually good scan is still ongoing but it's clipping on at a pace of about one chapter a week, so I'd say it's worth checking out.
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Jul 10, 2015 17:56
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Serperoth posted:Since there's a lot of question about which part has good scans and translation and colour and whatnot, would there be any interest in compiling an effortpost of sorts, with what Part has what? that's not really true, it's just part 5 that's not so good right now and there's people working on it
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Jul 10, 2015 18:17
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How did I miss that there's a horse named "Kanye" in Steel Ball Run?
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Jul 10, 2015 18:24
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all the talk of final fights has me really excited for Jojolion's. i mean we don't even have the villain yet, but its been a while since Gappy fought and who knows if he would punchghost or not.
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Jul 10, 2015 18:33
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Beef Chief posted:The main character is cool, but at times Araki writes her to be unnecessarily brutal and it makes her come off as a more unlikeable person. The only time I remember Jolyne being excessively brutal is when she split her ex's tongue in half, and even then I found that perfectly understandable considering him framing her played a major part in putting her into a series of life-and-death battles. The fact that he feels genuinely sorry about it after the fact doesn't change all the hosed up poo poo that happened to Jolyne so I don't exactly begrudge her any petty revenge. Compare to her dad who regularly beat people half/entirely to death as a matter of course and she never seemed unnecessarily brutal to me.
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Jul 10, 2015 18:40
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a cartoon duck posted:The only time I remember Jolyne being excessively brutal is when she split her ex's tongue in half, and even then I found that perfectly understandable considering him framing her played a major part in putting her into a series of life-and-death battles. The fact that he feels genuinely sorry about it after the fact doesn't change all the hosed up poo poo that happened to Jolyne so I don't exactly begrudge her any petty revenge. Compare to her dad who regularly beat people half/entirely to death as a matter of course and she never seemed unnecessarily brutal to me. Except he didn't intend for any of that to happen. Holding the fights that happened to her against him is putting the blame on someone who had no way of knowing any of that would happen. He still did an insanely terrible thing, but nearly killing this dude who is trying to make up for his huge gently caress-ups by helping you escape and get you where you need to go to comes off as super lovely. Jotaro never actually did that, all of the people he beat up by the time the series started were all terrible people or assassins sent to kill him and his friends, Romeo is just some idiot dude that Jolyne dated and has no involvement in anything happening.
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Jul 10, 2015 18:49
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My main problems with Stone Ocean are that sometimes fights just kind of run into each other with nothing in between, sometimes the noses looked weird and the character usage was kinda awkward. Like, we get a ton of Annasui who, while he has a cool stand, is a garbage person, while Foo Fighters doesn't really do much at all besides healing after she joins the goodguy team and Hermes spends a big part of the manga absent. The main issue with the ending is Pucci wins entirely through author fiat. And I guess that's the only reason anything happens in a story, but usually there's more than a token effort at obfuscating that. I also don't like endings where everyone just dies, but that's a personal thing. I was also really happy in Steel Ball Run that Johnny addresses the issue that if Gyro is replaced by an alternate version of him, it's not really the same dude, his friend is still dead, which is a bit of a bugbear of mine too and so I didn't really like Emporio just farting off with Irene and Co at the end of SO. But Pucci had three cool stands and Emporio beating him was bad rear end.
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Jul 10, 2015 19:00
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I think in SO's case, Irene and co are supposed to be reincarnations or something. Though the cast as we know them would be gone in that case anyway. Hell, the entire universe up until that point is gone as we know it. It's supposed to be "Jojos don't have to fight anymore, it's a happy ending," but I don't know how I feel about that. Butt Ghost fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Jul 10, 2015 |
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Jul 10, 2015 19:02
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Don't worry Johnny and Gyro make up for it with cowboy stands.
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Jul 10, 2015 19:05
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Well, Emporio remembers at least. Emporio went on to become a mangaka and write a series called "Jojo's Bizarre Adventure." Beef Chief posted:Don't worry Johnny and Gyro make up for it with cowboy stands.
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Jul 10, 2015 19:06
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I actually really like the final fight and most of Stone Ocean as a whole. When Pucci finally attains Made in Heaven there is something like a soft reset and the protagonists and the readers experience Made in Heaven as subtle hints in typical Araki fashion. It begins with innocuous events like the automatic door slamming on Hermes' leg and the debris falling down nearly instantaneously. As the weather drastically shifts from rain to sun the mystery of Made in Heaven starts to unravel until Jotaro confirms the acceleration of time in the spinning hands of his wristwatch: the flow of time is once again slipping, rearing the final battle. However, what's even more devastating about this power is that it is continuous and operates on a global, if not universal, scale, and the final fight constantly cuts away from the action to show the sudden impacts of the acceleration. The protagonists have no real options to take on Pucci head on and make a dire retreat. JoJo's uncommonly has multiple Stand Users due it out at once, but what we have here is a very unique display of powers in unison. Kiss and Burning Down the House provide mobility, Diver Down plays defense, and Star Platinum is critical for when they can take the offensive. In spite of their plan and combination of powers, time is still acceleratingand at a greater speed. The clouds are rolling by and the sun is a solid ray of light extending from one horizon to the next. Scenes from around the world are peppered throughout: a mangaka crumbles down as he is unable to make his deadline, exclaiming who can Rohan;an elderly pedestrian is cleaved in two by the insane, uncontrollable speed of the cars; a family grieves the loss of their grandpa and in the next frame rush out of the room from his odorous decomposition. Comedy, gore, despair, and back again. These scenes are 1-2 panels long and end as quickly as they appeared. There is this rapid-fire series of micro-scenes and emotions. This rapid-fire, I think, is very good and appropriate for a power like Made in Heaven. Time is still accelerating. A final scene plays out where a man argues with his peers about the fact that time is accelerating, but another man refutes him that there is no scientific evidence while another man calls for a commercial break. That familiar inverse of colors engulfs the men. Time has stopped. The focus now is on the seemingly predetermined outcome of the fight. Annasui is killed. Stone Free's arm was manipulated into backstabbing him. Jotaro shakes off his initial shock and moves to attack. He nudges Jolyne away who is then impaled by the first of many in a swarm of knives, referencing the final fight with DIO. Jotaro has one second to make the call and chooses to defend his daughter instead of attacking Pucci, proving how much Jolyne means to him. Time continues. Hermes motions to attack Pucci but is cut down. On the next page, Jotaro is also cut down completing Thoth's prophecy. Jolyne lays in shock impaled by a single knife. Once again, I feel like the rapid fire nature of these scenes works really well. The out come of the fight was always going to be instantaneous as stressed by Annasui telling Jotaro to time The World just right. Furthermore, it complements the short micro scenes. Had Araki lingered on each death I think the pacing would be akin to a speeding bus braking hard at each stop. It would be sudden and awkward to the point of being disorienting. There is a break in the scene where he encounters Emporio. The pacing has slowed down as has Pucci, taking Emporio lightly. However, Jolyne takes advantage of this and grazes Pucci with the same knife that hit her. I get that people think that these characters deserve a richer end, and I get that they think that the main JoJo ought to be the one to deliver the final blow. Nonetheless, I think this sort of ending is appropriate. Pucci goes on and on about gravity and everyone's destiny, but with his own hands he seals his own fate and dies at the brink of his new world. That just seems awesome to me. Its not like the main JoJo has to be the one to do this for it to be good. Not like Josuke ultimately killed Kira. And Johnny didn't ultimately kill DIO.
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Jul 10, 2015 19:08
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mountain tim was too good for his world
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Jul 10, 2015 19:09
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~Oh, Lonesome Me~
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Jul 10, 2015 19:11
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Like most people in SBR, he wanted to bang the 14 year old girl.
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Jul 10, 2015 19:12
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Can we not start this again?
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Jul 10, 2015 19:14
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thread, reading is fun and can take you farther than any Nintendo 64, please do it
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Jul 10, 2015 19:29
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go back to your dreamcast, stair
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Jul 10, 2015 19:30
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Beef Chief posted:Except he didn't intend for any of that to happen. Holding the fights that happened to her against him is putting the blame on someone who had no way of knowing any of that would happen. He still did an insanely terrible thing, but nearly killing this dude who is trying to make up for his huge gently caress-ups by helping you escape and get you where you need to go to comes off as super lovely. Jotaro never actually did that, all of the people he beat up by the time the series started were all terrible people or assassins sent to kill him and his friends, Romeo is just some idiot dude that Jolyne dated and has no involvement in anything happening. Well sure, Romeo isn't personally responsible for all the stand fights, but even in the best case scenario I wouldn't blame her for decking him in the face after doing her sentence (how long was her sentence, anyway?). As far as "nearly killing" goes, this is JoJo, people get entire limbs cut off and get skewered and they're fine a week later, I don't think the intent was for the reader to see his tongue being split as a life-threatening injury. Either way, it would've been easy to write Romeo as a generic douchebag who's glad his ex took the fall for him and make Jolyne seem morally justified, but instead Araki went with making him genuinely feel awful about what he did and make Jolyne in turn seem petty and vengeful and I actually really appreciate that? Like what she did to Romeo was undeniably lovely and the story makes no real excuses about it but at the same time I could fully understand where Jolyne's coming from because I sure as gently caress would hold a grudge over someone framing me for vehicular manslaughter.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:13
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That's fair and yeah, the tongue thing isn't life threatening considering some of the other poo poo that happens in this series.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:17
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Is there a single JoJo villain who doesn't lose due to their own gently caress ups? (gently caress ups such as jumping into a volcano when it's the only thing that can kill you, shooting yourself in the face, etc (pissing the protagonist off is expected and therefore doesn't count as a gently caress up for the purposes of this question))
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Jul 10, 2015 20:27
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So Steel Ball Run is finished. man, talk about a bittersweet ending.... But! looks like next part is back to good ol' Morioh. I wonder if Part 12 will be in Morioh too, when I'm an old man and Araki is still young and vibrant.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:27
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Jolyne is extremely petty. This is one of the things that makes her great. I mean, seriously, if you didn't find her splitting Romeo's tongue just because to be the funniest poo poo I don't even want to know what's wrong with you.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:27
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Jolyne is just a very hardcore gal. She's lighting herself on fire and having a lot of confidence everywhere in her fights. The Planet Waves fight is so good because it's an absolute slugfest versus a 100kg prison guard on standroids. But I agree that the pacing is very exhausting to the middle/late middle point. Around Bohemian Rhapsody it gets better. Anyway, anyone re-read Jojolion lately? I was not a fan of the slow burn but it has a lot of drama and horror elements to it that really help the mood of the story. And Josuke is growing to be one of my favorite Jojos at the moment. He's basically the most macho jojo yet.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:29
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Wild Horses posted:Jolyne is just a very hardcore gal. She's lighting herself on fire and having a lot of confidence everywhere in her fights. The Planet Waves fight is so good because it's an absolute slugfest versus a 100kg prison guard on standroids. But I agree that the pacing is very exhausting to the middle/late middle point. Around Bohemian Rhapsody it gets better. i go in and reread it every few months so i can keep the big plot points fresh and it's so loving good. pretty much every fight so far's been golden and josuke's a top-loving-tier protagonist
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Jul 10, 2015 20:32
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Stand design is one of the best things in part 8. Very specialized effects, with some great design. Soft and Wet and Paisley Park are top tier, with Soft and Wet maybe being a bit overpowered but still used in an inventive way.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:35
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if jolyne hadn't at least broken romeo's nose or some poo poo i'd be wondering why, because none of the joestars after johnathan are even remotely saints and it would be super weird if she didn't want at least a tiny bit of revenge on a dude who, ultimately, still had a hand in sending her to prison.
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Jul 10, 2015 20:45
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Cerebral Bore posted:I mean, seriously, if you didn't find her splitting Romeo's tongue just because to be the funniest poo poo I don't even want to know what's wrong with you. lmao
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Jul 10, 2015 20:54
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