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BottledBodhisvata
Jul 26, 2013

by Lowtax

SatansBestBuddy posted:

They're also reinforcing those sentiments by making light of and joking about them. Do I think George Carlin convinced someone to commit rape because he made a stupid joke? No. But I do think that his joking about rape contributed to making it harder for the criminal to really see how terrible his actions were, and harder for the victim to be taken seriously, because those views are already in place in culture, and instead of trying to dismiss those views people joke about them, which undercuts how serious the crime is.

Lmao, no. Just no, none of that is true. If you think that, or you read something that told you that, you are mistaken and should reevaluate that attitude and think that maybe it's a ridiculous attitude to take. In no court of law has a criminal said "I didn't think it was bad because George Carlin said that Elmer Fudd getting raped was funny and so I raped this girl".

Like, just loving no.


Well I think the obvious joke here is that it's an undead suicide bomber moreso than a racist cariacture. The bit largely hinges around him having blown himself up and not realizing it. It's a caricature, and it depicts a specific race, but it's not really out-and-out racist. It's more surreal or silly, honestly. Out of curiosity, if people made caricatures of Irish terrorists from the IRA when they were blowing up buildings all over the place, would that have contributed to anti-Irish sentiment? Should nobody have made jokes about them either?

Like, half of you just pointed at the joke and said "it's racist" and that's all you got. Is that really all you'd need to declare that a loving puppet show is somehow contributing to...

Ah forget it, there's no hope. Sorry I said anything, go back to whatever it is you guys do in here with Internet shows and the people who still make them.

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The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

Jsor posted:

You guys are assuming that the purpose is to see a movie or further their reviewer career. It's not. It's bonding. Their friends and fans see these movies and bitch about them, so they also see them so they can share some yuks over Twitter. It's not much different than a bunch of people getting together at the bar to complain about work or their SO. I've seen some dreadful poo poo my friends have complained about because it can be fun to talk about. Maybe "fun" isn't quite the right word, but it's kind of just a shared experience. The exact target of the vitriol isn't that important, it's just that the internet reviewer/geek community (as much as it can be called a cohesive community) has collectively agreed Transformers and superhero films are fun things to complain about.

[/amateur sociology]

E: Though if you take this mentality too far you become Spoony.

Well most of my bonding rituals don't involve giving directors I hate money, but whatever.

I Am Fowl
Mar 8, 2008

nononononono

bbf2 posted:

They should do a Best of the Worst with Patton Oswalt where the three movies are all movies that he appeared in

Not as rich a vein as you might think, sadly. Unless they watched episodes of shows he was in--he's been in a lot of lovely TV.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow
Like, it's one thing where it's harmless endearing morons like late Shyamalan, but if you really really viscerally hate Michael Bay as a person, why are you giving him money?

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

The Vosgian Beast posted:

Like, it's one thing where it's harmless endearing morons like late Shyamalan, but if you really really viscerally hate Michael Bay as a person, why are you giving him money?

Other than the Transformers series, Michael Bay's directorial work has actually been pretty good stuff. Not like, high art, but good fun action. Except Pearl Harbor.

In fact, according to IMDB and not having watched any of the Transformers movies or The Island, Pearl Harbor is the only movie directed by him that I wouldn't watch again.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

Gyges posted:

Other than the Transformers series, Michael Bay's directorial work has actually been pretty good stuff. Not like, high art, but good fun action. Except Pearl Harbor.

In fact, according to IMDB and not having watched any of the Transformers movies or The Island, Pearl Harbor is the only movie directed by him that I wouldn't watch again.

Well sure that's a pretty decent reason for YOU to attend his movies, but not for someone who hates him and everything he stands for.

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

The Vosgian Beast posted:

Well sure that's a pretty decent reason for YOU to attend his movies, but not for someone who hates him and everything he stands for.

All I'm saying is he's a Criterion Collection guy, so hating everything he stands for means hating film.:smug:

Actually though, I didn't mean to quote you.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.
There are better movies in the Criterion Collection. Like Hausu.

Actually, I haven't watched a single Nostalgia Critic video since all the backstage stuff came out, but I'd make an exception if he reviewed Hausu. Even, or maybe ebcause, his review would be terrible. I'm sorry.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

MonsieurChoc posted:

There are better movies in the Criterion Collection. Like Hausu.

Actually, I haven't watched a single Nostalgia Critic video since all the backstage stuff came out, but I'd make an exception if he reviewed Hausu. Even, or maybe ebcause, his review would be terrible. I'm sorry.

He'd be the wrong person.

You want someone like Brad or Kyle on that poo poo.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.

The Vosgian Beast posted:

He'd be the wrong person.

You want someone like Brad or Kyle on that poo poo.

That's for the good review though, the one I'll rewatch.

VolticSurge
Jul 23, 2013

Just your friendly neighborhood photobomb raptor.



MonsieurChoc posted:

There are better movies in the Criterion Collection. Like Gojira.

Fixed that for you.

Beefstew
Oct 30, 2010

I told you that story so I could tell you this one...
Hausu is a loving masterpiece.

Mad Lupine
Feb 18, 2011

all the things you said
running through my head
Don't want to quote BottledBodhisvata as it appears the rest of the thread has them on ignore, but I think they brought up a good point. Except the caricature was created by Jeff Dunham who also created a Mexican Jalepeno named Jose.

But Jeff should just be condemned for being unfunny.

dreezy
Mar 4, 2015

yeah, rip.

The Vosgian Beast posted:

Well sure that's a pretty decent reason for YOU to attend his movies, but not for someone who hates him and everything he stands for.

In a lot of theaters it's pretty easy to buy a ticket for one movie and watch a different one. You still have to watch the movie but at least you can give your money to someone who you think deserves it.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

dreezy posted:

In a lot of theaters it's pretty easy to buy a ticket for one movie and watch a different one. You still have to watch the movie but at least you can give your money to someone who you think deserves it.

That's a lot of effort to see Transformers 4: Age of Extinction, but w/e

dreezy
Mar 4, 2015

yeah, rip.

The Vosgian Beast posted:

That's a lot of effort to see Transformers 4: Age of Extinction, but w/e

If you consider walking into screen #3 instead of screen #4 effort then sure

KKall
Oct 15, 2012

MonsieurChoc posted:

That's for the good review though, the one I'll rewatch.

I love Hausu. I love it to bits. The only reason I haven't talked about it yet is because I have no clue how I'd approach it, aside from going "ha ha, this part is really weird lol." Maybe I can compare its use of editing as an early precursor to Youtube Poop? I dunno.

There is a rather good, if dry, video essay out there on Hausu and its relation to the atom bomb.

https://vimeo.com/110502648

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.

Beefstew posted:

Hausu is a loving masterpiece.

Well, he's not wrong: Gojira is also much better.

Edit:

KKall posted:

I love Hausu. I love it to bits. The only reason I haven't talked about it yet is because I have no clue how I'd approach it, aside from going "ha ha, this part is really weird lol." Maybe I can compare its use of editing as an early precursor to Youtube Poop? I dunno.

There is a rather good, if dry, video essay out there on Hausu and its relation to the atom bomb.

https://vimeo.com/110502648

Maybe an explanation of how the production went, the context, the goals of the filmmakers, etc. would suffice on their own? Or maybe something about how it apparently influenced Sam Raimi and Peter Jackson?

Just throwing random ideas in the wind here.

MonsieurChoc fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Jul 14, 2015

BottledBodhisvata
Jul 26, 2013

by Lowtax

Mad Lupine posted:

But Jeff should just be condemned for being unfunny.

Oh god yes, he's dreadful.

Tracula
Mar 26, 2010

PLEASE LEAVE

KKall posted:

I love Hausu. I love it to bits. The only reason I haven't talked about it yet is because I have no clue how I'd approach it, aside from going "ha ha, this part is really weird lol." Maybe I can compare its use of editing as an early precursor to Youtube Poop? I dunno.

There is a rather good, if dry, video essay out there on Hausu and its relation to the atom bomb.

https://vimeo.com/110502648

I've watched Hausu something like a dozen times now and I have never gotten tired of it and I force every single one of my friends to watch it and love it. And the editing of the film really is masterful on an odd way.

Edit: And it's worth mentioning that it's also the only film that Criterion sells a shirt specifically for: http://www.criterion.com/shop_products/69-men-s-house-t-shirt

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow
Speaking of: How has the Nostalgia Critic never done Clifford https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCNe0z7TsPE

Annointed
Mar 2, 2013

So, I just watched Magic Mike: XXL and I had a good time. A wonderfully masculine muscle men time. Do you guys have any opinion pieces/reviews I can look at to see other people's opinions on the film?

DStecks
Feb 6, 2012

Mad Lupine posted:

I think they brought up a good point.

You would think that, wouldn't you.

Gyges
Aug 4, 2004

NOW NO ONE
RECOGNIZE HULK

MonsieurChoc posted:

There are better movies in the Criterion Collection. Like Hausu.

I don't see how anything could be better than Ben Affleck playing with animal crackers on Liv Tyler's stomach while her daddy's songs play in the background. That's Citizen Kane level cinema.

Mad Lupine posted:

Don't want to quote BottledBodhisvata as it appears the rest of the thread has them on ignore, but I think they brought up a good point. Except the caricature was created by Jeff Dunham who also created a Mexican Jalepeno named Jose.

But Jeff should just be condemned for being unfunny.

If Jeff Dunham were just unfunny, he'd be unremarkable. Unfunny guys who somehow make money in comedy are a dime a dozen. It's the combo build of adding casual racism and lovely puppetry to the act that really demands the condemnation.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.

KKall posted:

I love Hausu. I love it to bits. The only reason I haven't talked about it yet is because I have no clue how I'd approach it, aside from going "ha ha, this part is really weird lol." Maybe I can compare its use of editing as an early precursor to Youtube Poop? I dunno.

There is a rather good, if dry, video essay out there on Hausu and its relation to the atom bomb.

https://vimeo.com/110502648

Just wanna say, I checked that video, and it's really good.

Hausu is a good movie.

Miss Wallace
Feb 24, 2013

The nights will never be the same. ARARARAR!
New Baywatching is up! Had some awesome twitter followers help me with this one since it's a clip show.
http://phelous.com/2015/07/13/obscurus-lupa/baywatching/baywatching-the-chamber/

Tracula
Mar 26, 2010

PLEASE LEAVE

MonsieurChoc posted:

Just wanna say, I checked that video, and it's really good.

Hausu is a good the best movie.

Cyron
Mar 10, 2014

by zen death robot

Annointed posted:

So, I just watched Magic Mike: XXL and I had a good time. A wonderfully masculine muscle men time. Do you guys have any opinion pieces/reviews I can look at to see other people's opinions on the film?

from brad review both of them felt it was progressive in the sense of Masculinity, where the strippers drop the fireman, cowboy and navy getup for their true self of what they like to do, example one is a artist he that his gimmick stripping.

they also went to see a drag show just because their friendswith the head guy and he was hangig out with them the whole movie.

echopapa
Jun 2, 2005

El Presidente smiles upon this thread.

Kunster posted:

Aw yeah! That's the one! Thank you!

Thanks for the compliments. I wasn’t able to respond until now because the cable between here and the next island over got cut on Wednesday, so we had no ability to communicate with anyone off-island until very recently.

The last thing I did before everything went to hell was write a review of the John Wayne-Sophia Loren adventure Legend of the Lost. This is my first written review and I’d like your comments.

PiedPiper
Jan 1, 2014

ACES CURE PLANES posted:

This discussion is boring and stupid.

You know what isn't boring and stupid? Ishtar Space Cop.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28OEdVi-FPo

These cops are PAWNS!

Jay O
Oct 9, 2012

being a zombie's not so bad
once you get used to it
Well, Summer anime season just started, so here's my traditional anime recommendation DUMP POST for the new season, should it interest anyone looking for steaming hot new streaming anime! But first, a Spring season recommendations post-partum: what held up from the season so blah that I couldn't even make a top five out of it? Not fuckin' much!

Jay O posted:

1. Blood Blockade Battlefront (action/sci fi dramedy from the creator of Trigun, superbly well-directed and researched, lovable cast, just look at this loving credit song, <3)
2. MY love STORY!! (romantic comedy, great heartwarming premise, extremely lovable characters, based on an award-winning manga)
3. Plastic Memories (sci fi melodrama, from the writer of Steins;Gate, terrific animation and color palette, promising if mushy premise)
4. The Heroic Legend of Arslan (re-adaptation of the HOOGE HIT fantasy novels by the Legend of the Galactic Heroes guy, but re-imagined with character designs by Hiromu Arakawa, the creator of Fullmetal Alchemist, good fix for your SRS BZNS low fantasy needs)

Quality sequels to good things that may interest you if you dun saw the first thing: Fate/stay Night Unlimited Blade Works is back for its second half, My Teenage Romcom SNAFU is not my bag personally but its fans swear by it and it got a much higher-budget second season, Uta no Prince-sama has a new lower-budget season by contrast if you like shameless beefcake parades, and The Disappearance of Nagato Yuki-chan is a cute romcom-y Haruhi Suzumiya spinoff that I honestly kinda enjoyed provided you're down with "sweeter and kinder TMOHS universe."

Blood Blockade Battlefront was the only show on this list to impress start to finish, every episode a precious jewel of insanity, it's now one of my new favorite anime of all time, and I haven't even seen the last episode yet. Yes, the only downside to this otherwise loving awesome show is that because it was a surprise megahit in Japan (which I am also exceedingly happy about because Western-style poo poo that I love never becomes a megahit in Japan,) the production team decided to beef up the final episode to double-length or so, and is now waiting on their network for an available timeslot to air it in. So episode 12 has still not aired, and I assure you it is killing me, but it'll land eventually, and I'm sure it'll knock my socks off when it does. Anyway. Blood Blockade Battlefront was the real poo poo after all, but I can't say that about my other once-promising picks...

My Love Story!! didn't become bad or anything, but it's basically a spoonful of sugar in kind of the same flavor every single week. The leading couple are adorable. They love each other very much. They are exceedingly good people and everybody in their lives are good people, with conflict arising principally out of people trying not to burden one another with their personal problems. It's funny, it's sweet, and it's easy to watch, but personally I need a little salt with my sugar, so it's hard for me to beam too much about a show that's just pure fuzzies every single week (and it's only half-over, because it's slated for 24 episodes instead of 12.) It's a good show and all, but...yeah. It's the same "d'awwwww" emotion every week. It's a "healing show," as we tend to call them. There were a lot of those this past season. It's good that the comedy is sharp enough to keep it entertaining, but it's a healing show and I prefer stuff that's a little more challenging.

Plastic Memories poo poo the bed throughout its run, but it also stuck the landing in the last episode, so I guess I can't hate it? Definitely can't recommend it, though. They took the sci fi hook and dumped it right out the window in favor of the melodramatic romance (which was fine) and aimless comedy hijinks (which were the Absolute Worst.) But the first episode is wholesale deception, the show only kinda dips its toes into exploring the occupation of expired-android retrieval and then just rolls right out. It's a movie's length of story in 12 television episodes, and they do an absolutely miserable job of disguising that. Strong start, strong ending, and then IDKLOL farting around in the middle. It's not a terrible show (although the comedy is uniformly terrible, the drama works okay,) but it is a GIANT waste of potential.

The Heroic Legend of Arslan is dry and boring musty-rear end fantasy, and the production values have gotten kind of embarrassing. I was honestly being optimistic when I included it in my recommendations, because I didn't know the story and I didn't know if it was more exciting and carnal low fantasy or dry, musty-rear end, people-sitting-around-strategizing fantasy. Turns out it's the latter! And there's a market for that and all, but goddamn some of this animation...



Goddamn. So yeah, unless you like musty-rear end fantasy novels with more lore and archetypes and proper names than flavor, Arslan will probably bore you, and the shaky production really does not help.

Quick notes on the sequels: Fate/stay Night UBW completely Shat The Bed Oh My God You Don't Know You Just Don't Even Know, and it wouldn't be so bad except that Type-Moonies are the literal worst fandom in creation short of maybe bronies but I think they could give the bronies a run for it, because they made managing that show and its editorial a living hell from the beginning but became ten thousand times worse in its second half. Anyway, the second half of FSN UBW was so sanctimonious, anticlimactic, gross, and just plain un-fun that it totally soured the first half for me and a lot of other tentative fans of the new series. (But we're filthy secondaries, so we don't matter to the True Fans.) My Teenage Romcom SNAFU was, once again, not my bag, but the people who loved it before loved it more in the second season, and the people who hated it, hated it more, if that tells you anything. Uta no Prince-sama went to no-budget land visually and don't-care-buy-this writing-wise and became horribly boring and joyless. I still swear by the second season, but I think the fun's officially over as of this third season. The Disappearance of Nagato Yuki-chan overloaded on Haruhi (go away drat you, this is not your show) and became a pretty boring slice-of-life show despite some cute moments. It's mostly harmless and flavorless, but I was hoping for more romance and intrigue than the blandness we got.

Ugh, Spring. Good riddance.

=========================================================================================

Okay, so this season! Bad news first: it's not as strong as Winter from this year, or most of 2014. That upward trend of "always more exciting things in anime" that I bragged about in past seasons has ebbed a little. The good news is that it's still way better than Spring. The real problem with this season is that it's just kinda filled with solid genre work. There's good stuff, but there's nothing great, nothing breakout or ambitious, nothing making waves as a HIT, and that's not good for this industry. It's nice to have a season of "solid," but what you want is a season of "solid" with one or two "Settin' the Internet on Fire"s. We got the former but not the latter. Oh well. At least this season is filled with genre-diverse and style-diverse projects that have plots and potential and controversy and poo poo, not a bunch of slice-of-life and healing shows, which put me right to sleep and even at their best promote zero interesting discussion. At least I have five things to recommend!

So here's what I got. Links for Snow White and Monster Musume go to ANN's preview guide, and the review I wrote for the show is under "Hope Chapman," but there are plenty of takes on every show under the sun this season so you can and should browse the full guide to your heart's content. The other three shows just have links to twitter-thoughts on Storify because I was crazy-busy with Anime Expo coverage this year and didn't have time to review them for the site. Such is life.

1. Rokka: Braves of the Six Flowers (High fantasy series based on high fantasy books in a mesoamerican-themed setting about divinely chosen heroes. Best to read others' thoughts on it because I didn't end up tweeting much apart from "yay this is neat!")
2. Snow White with the Red Hair (Fairytale fantasy with Disneylike charm in a more grounded world, its Snow White and Prince are strong and likable characters, and the animation is beautiful)
3. Charlotte (Character-driven melodrama with mild fantasy and comedy elements, courtesy of Jun Maeda if you liked Angel Beats!, it's more of that. The show's real well-animated too, and the second episode was strong, albeit melodramatic, but the show knows what it wants to be.)
4. Gangsta. (Mafia story, action/drama with hot older muscular gritty motherfuckers in the lead roles very clearly framed For The Ladies. I was actually lukewarm on it because of the low-key writing and brown-on-brown production values, but I love the deaf protagonist, and I saw a lot more enthusiasm from others more into the aesthetic.)
5. Monster Musume: Everyday Life with Monster Girls (Okay...hear me out...this is an ecchi show. It is intentionally gross. It's lowbrow comedy for the head that is not on your shoulders. It is the kind of show you watch in secret or show to people exclusively so they'll go "oh my god why." But I loved the experience of watching it. And I have seen so many other people who don't like titty-time shows express the same joy. The comics it's based on are the best-selling manga in America right now. So there's something there, and I thus feel compelled to recommend it.)

Notable sequels this season if you've seen the first and are jonesin' for more. Gatchaman Crowds is back for a second season, and while I violently disagree with its social politics, it's still an interesting and thought-provoking show that's worth watching and discussing if you can dig its aesthetic. I know lots of people that think its thematic beliefs are full of poo poo and still get a lot out of the story, so it'll be interesting to see where the second season takes it. Durarara is back again, and this return is a lot more promising than it was last time! They seem to have gotten their ducks in a row for the production this time, kinda fell apart last winter, but with the nature of this story, it's no harm no foul. Wagnaria! (Working! was the Japanese title, changed for google-ability) and Non Non Biyori are back if you like them cute healing-show comedies. Aquarion Logos is apparently weird and a direct continuation of Aquarion EVOL if you liked how weird that was. Junjou Romantica has a third season if you hate yourself. To Love-Ru has a fourth season if you hate yourself and everyone around you.

Anyway, that's all the anime crit-dumping for now! Next dump in three months, as the worm turns. :v:

watho
Aug 2, 2013


The real world will, again tomorrow, function and run without me.

I don't know why but I really, really love My Teen Romantic Comedy SNAFU. I kind of want to review it because I have so many thoughts on it but I'm awful at writing so…

I guess that it's because it scratches the same itch that Honey & Clover did which is what got me into anime in the first place and I haven't really seen anything that was quite like it since.

This season seems really meh. I'll check out Gangsta though since it seems to be up my alley. Is it on Crunchyroll?

Edit: It's only on funimation and is not available here. :sigh:

watho fucked around with this message at 11:21 on Jul 14, 2015

Tracula
Mar 26, 2010

PLEASE LEAVE
I know this is an odd question but has anyone done a real breakdown about the psychological effects and why incremental/idle games work? Cookie Clicker, AdVenture Capitalist, etc. I feel like there's an interesting psychology to them for the same reasons that people get addicted to MMO's with just watching numbers go up albeit less sinister in most cases.

Spark That Bled
Jan 29, 2010

Hungry for responsibility. Horny for teamwork.

And ready to
BUST A NUT
up in this job!

Skills include:
EIGHT-FOOT VERTICAL LEAP

Jay O posted:

Junjou Romantica has a third season if you hate yourself. To Love-Ru has a fourth season if you hate yourself and everyone around you.

Junjou Romantica pretty much embodies a lot of what me and a lot of other fans hate about BL: not just the weirdly proportioned art with the long limbs and weird faces, but also in the dynamic of the main couple. One's a manipulative control freak with no regard for boundaries, the other is a wet blanket who seems to be constantly rolling over and accepting his boyfriend's abuse. It's a wonder that this series has been this popular, especially for so long.

Same with To Love-Ru, now that I think about it.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow
My favorite currently running anime is Steven Universe

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

"Hi Everybody!"

watho posted:

I don't know why but I really, really love My Teen Romantic Comedy SNAFU. I kind of want to review it because I have so many thoughts on it but I'm awful at writing so…

I guess that it's because it scratches the same itch that Honey & Clover did which is what got me into anime in the first place and I haven't really seen anything that was quite like it since.

This season seems really meh. I'll check out Gangsta though since it seems to be up my alley. Is it on Crunchyroll?

Edit: It's only on funimation and is not available here. :sigh:

If you're in Australia, it's up on AnimeLab.

Infamous Sphere
Nov 8, 2010
Blargh oh my god yes, I have read fanfiction, in a way it's a guilty pleasure/so bad it's good thing. I can't read trashy romance though. Fanfiction..oh god..some of the anatomical limitations are..well..let's just say these women don't very much und
New episode! In which, at the request of forums member Celery Face, I reveal my ignorance about Shakespeare! Basically the opposite of Kyle Kallgren's Shakespeare Month.

watho
Aug 2, 2013


The real world will, again tomorrow, function and run without me.

Neddy Seagoon posted:

If you're in Australia, it's up on AnimeLab.

Sweden. There's not really of an anime licensing scene here.

DStecks
Feb 6, 2012

Tracula posted:

I know this is an odd question but has anyone done a real breakdown about the psychological effects and why incremental/idle games work? Cookie Clicker, AdVenture Capitalist, etc. I feel like there's an interesting psychology to them for the same reasons that people get addicted to MMO's with just watching numbers go up albeit less sinister in most cases.

Well, as a matter of fact...

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Baka-nin
Jan 25, 2015

Miss Wallace posted:

New Baywatching is up! Had some awesome twitter followers help me with this one since it's a clip show.
http://phelous.com/2015/07/13/obscurus-lupa/baywatching/baywatching-the-chamber/

Heh heh Trout on human violence

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