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Yeah, the CV matchmaking is still abysmal. I'm sure the brown sea is filled with posts about it though, so at least WG knows. Lets hope they do something about it. Like delete CVs
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Jul 15, 2015 05:45
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Hazdoc posted:No, just no. DDs counter BBs. That is a fact that wargaming intends. If you are traveling alone, don't get upset when you can't run away from a ship significantly smaller and faster than you. They'll die in just a couple of hits from your primary armament, and you want to take away the only tool they have for staying alive? Have you even played DDs?
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Jul 15, 2015 06:09
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Insert name here posted:Even in a 1v1 situation I've never really felt threatened very much by a DD while driving a BB. All the slow ones tend to have small turning radii, so you just keep your rear end pointed towards them when you spot them and the best they can do is try to boop you straight on the butt, and the fast ones are capable of minimizing the rate of closure so you have ample time to shoot them. The real issues are in the larger sense, since you're now out of position, and when fighting other ships and having to deal with a DD at the same time. I think the problem I have with DDs in a BB is that A: You usually want AP loaded in a BB and so swapping it out for HE is awkward and takes time and B: Hitting the little bastards with extremely slow-firing guns that already have accuracy issues is a problem. Add to that that having one nearby means having to worry about torpedoes, each of which often does damage on par with a citadel hit, and running into a DD without anything faster nearby to take care of him is really unpleasant in a BB.
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Jul 15, 2015 06:21
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Insert name here posted:Even in a 1v1 situation I've never really felt threatened very much by a DD while driving a BB. All the slow ones tend to have small turning radii, so you just keep your rear end pointed towards them when you spot them and the best they can do is try to boop you straight on the butt, and the fast ones are capable of minimizing the rate of closure so you have ample time to shoot them. Turning your rear end to an approaching DD doesn't really work, though. At medium to short distances, you may be able to keep your front or rear end pointed towards them, but then all they have to do is short-spread a wave of torpedoes towards you. If you swing yourself left or right to try and avoid them, you'll almost certainly expose your rear end and eat all three-four torps before you can get out of the way. If you keep going straight, well, it's a short spread so you'll eat at least a couple. And if you've gotten in a situation where this happens, the DD will swing around, start circling you, outturn you and put another batch on the water if it's one with two launchers on each side. Note, I'm talking relative short distances here, five to three kilometers for instance. (I'm not complaining about this, I think it's fine the way it is) I agree though, that often, if you see them coming towards you, you have plenty of time to shoot them, and leading a fast-moving DD that's trying to circle you is all about practice: once you get good at it, you can splat them out of the water before they even get their torps out. Hazdoc posted:No, just no. DDs counter BBs. That is a fact that wargaming intends. If you are traveling alone, don't get upset when you can't run away from a ship significantly smaller and faster than you. They'll die in just a couple of hits from your primary armament, and you want to take away the only tool they have for staying alive? Have you even played DDs? I think his point is maybe that, when you get yourself in an endgame situation where it's you in a BB versus a DD, if the DD captain has even two brain cells to rub together, then the DD will never, ever be in a position where he can lose, due to the range DD's get detected when compared to BB's. The BB simply has no way to see or fight back against the DD when this sort of thing happens. Is that okay? Maybe. It happens so rarely that I don't think anybody is complaining about it. Is that intended? From what you're saying, yeah. It still feels kinda lovely at the end of the day though.
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Jul 15, 2015 06:44
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James Garfield posted:Are they just mad at you calling them wehraboos, or are they mad you stole their name gimmick? This is very important to me. I was in a game with him where a pubbie got mad at him thinking he was real FOG. Lots of people got really mad at FOG for letting in such assholes.
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Jul 15, 2015 07:24
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Man, how does anyone play Battleships past tier 4 or so? The turn rate of the turrets is so slow. I can't seem to hit cruisers for poo poo. Everything is so fast and my guns are so slow.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:18
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You're basically WoT arty. Use your gun's really long range to fire at ships that can't fire back at you. This means you're going to have to lead your shots a ton.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:29
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Hazdoc posted:Naw, torpedo wakes are actually pretty noticeable unless you really are not paying attention hardcore. And yeah, the whole mod thing. They'd just change the torpedo wakes to look neon pink and then it'd be impossible to not notice. I believe if you have a DD spotted you can sometimes see their torpedo tubes deploy torpedoes if they're close enough, but don't quote me on that. I certainly saw it before in CBT.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:29
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Night10194 posted:I think the problem I have with DDs in a BB is that A: You usually want AP loaded in a BB and so swapping it out for HE is awkward and takes time and B: Hitting the little bastards with extremely slow-firing guns that already have accuracy issues is a problem. Add to that that having one nearby means having to worry about torpedoes, each of which often does damage on par with a citadel hit, and running into a DD without anything faster nearby to take care of him is really unpleasant in a BB. Drive Japanese Battleship. Have 7 to 10km secondaries. Watch fireworks. Need to get to Tier 7 though.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:30
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Krogort posted:Drive Japanese Battleship. 10km secondaries? What? I've seen em go out to like 6.5ish but 10? If that's possible I know what I'm doing. OSad posted:Turning your rear end to an approaching DD doesn't really work, though. At medium to short distances, you may be able to keep your front or rear end pointed towards them, but then all they have to do is short-spread a wave of torpedoes towards you. If you swing yourself left or right to try and avoid them, you'll almost certainly expose your rear end and eat all three-four torps before you can get out of the way. If you keep going straight, well, it's a short spread so you'll eat at least a couple. And if you've gotten in a situation where this happens, the DD will swing around, start circling you, outturn you and put another batch on the water if it's one with two launchers on each side. Yeah, a BB turning away from me when I move in a for a point blank run makes them much harder to do bad things to. BBs have plenty of options to deal with close range torpedo runs, though if you can't kill the DD fast enough, they WILL run you down and sink you in a hurry. They have to contend with the potential of your primary armament and your secondaries chipping away at them, though. Last Stand makes this a lot more realistic, as getting hit by secondaries and having your engine knocked out is hilariously anti-climactic. Point blank runs are really fun, though. Any engagement at less than 3 KM is pretty exciting, even if you're up against a CA, since you can sometimes pen them with AP at this range, letting you pull ahead to victory with a good sequence of citadel hits or distracting them long enough to put torpedoes into them. And you've got the right idea regarding torp tactics against a BB that's wise to your strats. Less useful as an IJN DD, as you typically can't waste your shots, but US DDs can use some torps to force a turn out of the BB, or corral them into an area favorable to them, then bring their other side of torps to bear for the kill. quote:I think his point is maybe that, when you get yourself in an endgame situation where it's you in a BB versus a DD, if the DD captain has even two brain cells to rub together, then the DD will never, ever be in a position where he can lose, due to the range DD's get detected when compared to BB's. The BB simply has no way to see or fight back against the DD when this sort of thing happens. Basically, there are a lot of really lame ways to go in this game. Getting hunted by your ship counter isn't that bad compared to getting dunked by an uncontested CV or a ship that has 3+ tiers on you. The DD can only abuse his concealment advantage by actually staying concealed and only using torpedoes, which is a tactic reserved almost purely for IJN DDs, and launches at 6KM+ take 15+ seconds to reach you, so unless they're a psychic, you can make yourself hard to hit. If they close in, then you can see them and the concealment issue is gone, and you can try to take them out or hope your secondaries are up to snuff.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:53
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Hazdoc posted:10km secondaries? What? I've seen em go out to like 6.5ish but 10? If that's possible I know what I'm doing. The range increases with tiers and there's a mod and a skill to improve it further, I am having a lot of fun because of that in my Warspite.
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Jul 15, 2015 08:59
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James Garfield posted:Are they just mad at you calling them wehraboos, or are they mad you stole their name gimmick? This is very important to me. Both. Doesn't help that I poo poo up chat pretty well and ruin their "good name" in game.
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Jul 15, 2015 09:03
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Hazdoc posted:10km secondaries? What? I've seen em go out to like 6.5ish but 10? If that's possible I know what I'm doing. You can get two +20% range bonus, one from a ship upgrade and the other from a captain skill. Izumo and Yamato have 7km base range (9.8km bonused) on their secondaries, Nagato and Warspite have 5km (7km bonused).
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Jul 15, 2015 09:05
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They've SKUed up the Atlanta and Atago for real money - the Atlanta for $41.16 and the Atago for $47.86. At least the Atlanta is $3.21 cheaper than the $44.37 9000g would cost you, and you get the ~free port slot~. I still see absolutely no loving reason I should drop money for either of them when a gold mesh would leave me with over 30k.
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Jul 15, 2015 09:28
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NTRabbit posted:You mean aside from the St Louis, which utterly ruins everything including Kawachis Well yeah, the St. Louis is a hard-counter to anything up to around tier five..
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Jul 15, 2015 09:45
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ijyt posted:Well yeah, the St. Louis is a hard-counter to anything up to around tier five.. The Phoenix is better. Also DDs and CVs.
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Jul 15, 2015 09:54
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Durendal posted:Fog_FuelAirBomb_Shinano Ahem, that would better suit the Taiho.  Fog_Shipclass_LittleGirlName
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Jul 15, 2015 10:29
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It would seem that I sold my level 10 commander along with my Aoba. gently caress their UI that require to manualy select to sell the upgrades rather than dismount, I must have clicked the wrong button.  I don't suppose support can help ?
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Jul 15, 2015 10:30
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El Disco posted:Ahem, that would better suit the Taiho. Oh yeah. I got them mixed up 
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Jul 15, 2015 10:37
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Zettace posted:You're basically WoT arty. Use your gun's really long range to fire at ships that can't fire back at you. This means you're going to have to lead your shots a ton. If you're a coward and unsupported yeah. Otherwise get stuck in with everyone else. gently caress you and gently caress this games battleship meta.
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Jul 15, 2015 10:43
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I'm getting weird lag problems playing just now, my ping is fine at a constant 38ms but sometimes I just lose control of my boat, it appears maybe 1 or 2 boat lengths back from where I actually am, so I can see people shooting, hitting the water in front of me and I take damage. All my shots go straight through boats etc. I have to relog to fix it which is a pain in the rear end. It's cutting into my torpedo funtimes.
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Jul 15, 2015 10:48
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are goons honestly shocked that most people flocked to battleships? This is the same community that flocks to heavy tanks and heavy TDs in WoT. it's all about the weight.
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Jul 15, 2015 10:52
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Mans posted:are goons honestly shocked that most people flocked to battleships? This is the same community that flocks to heavy tanks and heavy TDs in WoT. it's all about the weight. Of course battleship are sexy, they have big guns and small guns everywere. Of course they should absolutely not be threatened by small destroyers that cost less than a tenth of their bigass battleship, king of the oceans. The fact that destroyers have the same experience and credit cost and use the same slots in a team is of course irrelevant.
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Jul 15, 2015 11:35
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Krogort posted:It would seem that I sold my level 10 commander along with my Aoba. Ouch. Even if support says no, I'd say it's worth a try.
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Jul 15, 2015 12:07
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Scikar posted:You'll probably want both by the end but you might regret not getting the engine/rudder damage skill as early as possible, unless they cut back the engine damage in a patch. I've tried it out now, and Aiming Expert seems almost pointless on the 45 second turn time IJN DDs. The guns still turn so slow that they don't keep up while I'm turning the ship. 
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Jul 15, 2015 13:07
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PirateBob posted:I've tried it out now, and Aiming Expert seems almost pointless on the 45 second turn time IJN DDs. The guns still turn so slow that they don't keep up while I'm turning the ship. It's workable on a grem, and the skill is like two thirds the turret turn speed. The ship can outturn the turrets but it ends up being fine if not ideal.
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Jul 15, 2015 13:30
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Wow how Cleveland can be such a piece of poo poo? It's slower to turn, slower than Omaha. The guns are TERRIBLE and HE does no damage. AP does not pen cruisers due to the lovely angle the shells arrive atl. The shell flight time is abysmal. The only thing this is good at is shooting down planes. Would sell immediately to the scrap yard.
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Jul 15, 2015 13:48
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Ihmemies posted:Wow how Cleveland can be such a piece of poo poo? It's slower to turn, slower than Omaha. The guns are TERRIBLE and HE does no damage. AP does not pen cruisers due to the lovely angle the shells arrive atl. The shell flight time is abysmal. The only thing this is good at is shooting down planes. Would sell immediately to the scrap yard. Source your quotes
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Jul 15, 2015 13:56
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Ihmemies posted:Wow how Cleveland can be such a piece of poo poo? It's slower to turn, slower than Omaha. The guns are TERRIBLE and HE does no damage. AP does not pen cruisers due to the lovely angle the shells arrive atl. The shell flight time is abysmal. The only thing this is good at is shooting down planes. Would sell immediately to the scrap yard. You have bad opinions.
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Jul 15, 2015 14:09
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Those numbers are facts. Omaha is a better ship in every way. It even gets to play better maps and easier enemies. Omaha could relatively easily carry games, Cleveland.. hell no. Since I assume you claim Cleveland is not a POS, I could use some advice how to make it not suck. With Omaha I got avg exp over 1700 and dmg over 52000: http://worldofwarships.eu/community/accounts/500155007-Ihmemies/#!ships_pvp How I can do the same with Cleveland?
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Jul 15, 2015 14:18
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Ihmemies posted:Those numbers are facts. 
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Jul 15, 2015 14:20
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Ihmemies posted:How I can do the same with Cleveland? Cleveland has much better armor, much better anti-air, a bit more range and can point 12 guns on target.
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Jul 15, 2015 14:34
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So far the North Carolina is a good ship. I don't like that maybe 33% percent of the time a t8+ carrier decides I don't get to play that match and I die before firing my guns.
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Jul 15, 2015 14:34
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Ihmemies posted:Those numbers are facts. Omaha is a better ship in every way. It even gets to play better maps and easier enemies. Omaha could relatively easily carry games, Cleveland.. hell no. What I find strange is that you had a 14:14 K/D ratio in the Phoenix (which is a pretty good ship) yet 53:14 K/D in the Omaha. Maybe the Omaha is the only ship you're really good at
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Jul 15, 2015 14:37
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PirateBob posted:What I find strange is that you had a 14:14 K/D ratio in the Phoenix (which is a pretty good ship) yet 53:14 K/D in the Omaha. Maybe the Omaha is the only ship you're really good at I did not have time to learn how to play with the Phoenix before getting Omaha unlocked. Omaha worked basically the same so it was a lot easier going. I think Omaha is a very durable ship because it is faster and turns faster, and has less crap on superstructure, thus being harder to hit. I don't really give value to armor or HP since you aren't really supposed to take hits with a cruiser, and that worked well with Omaha. Cleveland has noticeably worse rudder turn time and turning radius and max speed than Omaha. I guess I need to invest 1M to the rudder speed upgrade to get the same 7.5s speed with upgraded hull. Omaha had 4 static guns on each side, so you had always a couple of guns pointing at the right direction, just like Phoenix. With Cleveland half of the guns are always pointing to a wrong direction when you try to avoid enemy shelling. Travel time feels like 2x longer, and because the angle of hitting shells is steeper, AP doesn't penetrate that well anymore. Maybe I'm just bad but Cleveland simply feels like a huge downgrade, I'd rather have grinded the 100k exp with Omaha than with Cleveland. I guess the main point why people like Cleveland because it's so "easy" and the skill ceiling is so low. Just put in some HE and spam away and hope you achieveme something. Meh. At least Pensacola should have better guns with longer barrels and thus better proj speed and lower trajectory again. E: also you are forced to play some deep garbage maps like Ocean with Cleveland. Ihmemies fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Jul 15, 2015 |
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Jul 15, 2015 14:50
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Ihmemies posted:Those numbers are facts. Omaha is a better ship in every way. It even gets to play better maps and easier enemies. Omaha could relatively easily carry games, Cleveland.. hell no. Assuming you did not blow a bunch of free exp, reserve judgement until you get the second hull and upgraded guns. The second hull takes almost three seconds off the rudder shift time, and you can fit Steering Gears Modification 2 for another -20%. The upgraded guns reload almost as fast as the Omaha, but the turrets have a slow traverse so you have to plan turns ahead of time. The good part is that you have a 12 gun broadside that can rain fire with HE, especially with a Demolition Expert captain. Avoid using AP unless a Japanese cruiser is presenting its broadside. Edit: Literally anyone above tier 4 can get Ocean, so that's a dumb reason to knock the Cleveland. You will face tougher ships, until the bulk of the population catches up. Right now tier 8 is overpopulated by the Atago and Atlanta. grrarg fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Jul 15, 2015 |
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Jul 15, 2015 15:01
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Omaha has to be very careful about its angling or it'll get citadelled into oblivion even against cruisers. Clevelands cut that down to battleships. I will agree that I like better shell travel time and that it's nice being able to weave and only lose two guns, but 12 guns is a freaking ton and the Cleveland is a lot tougher against cruisers. It's more about angling and weaving a bit than huge swerving centered on the bow or stern, since you can get away with a less steeply angled belt.
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Jul 15, 2015 15:02
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Ocean actually owns and I am sorry to all the people who require islands as a crutch. (Substitute "IS-8" for "ocean" and "armour" for "islands" as necessary for bad WoT opinions.)
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Jul 15, 2015 15:12
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Ihmemies posted:I did not have time to learn how to play with the Phoenix before getting Omaha unlocked. Omaha worked basically the same so it was a lot easier going. I think Omaha is a very durable ship because it is faster and turns faster, and has less crap on superstructure, thus being harder to hit. I actually had a similar experience during closed beta version 0.30 - I did so much better in the Omaha than in the Cleveland.  A lot of people on this forum seem to do very well in the Cleveland though.How often did you use AP in the Omaha, btw? In the open beta I've fired almost nothing but HE so far. I'm closing in on unlocking the Omaha now and I'm unsure of when to switch to AP.
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Jul 15, 2015 15:29
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Speaking of AP, don't let the current HE/fire meta turn your brain into pubbie mush. Cruiser-on-cruiser broadsides should be AP except at invulnerability ranges (you'll know when you hit them) and when you're being given bad angles. If you're able to get full broadside shots, AP will demolish the HE-slinging publords before they get a chance to react, especially out of 8" guns. For instance, there's this match, assuming the replay works properly. Consider that replay also an endorsement for the Atago, possibly the best all-round cruiser in the game and probably also the best ship overall. It does everything well enough, doesn't require grinding, can train any cruiser crew for the IJN, and makes mad loving bank (600,000 credits for that match, with premium). AP is good at most ranges against the sides of cruisers or against any aspect if you can get plunging hits. It's not very good against DDs unless you hit them end-on, in which case it utterly demolishes them. It's situational against battleships (some can be damaged sufficiently with plunging fire, some can't) and so HE is safer. Against carriers, it's only really useful if you can hit the citadel consistently, since fire not only hurts them but also prevents them landing/alighting aircraft.
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Jul 15, 2015 15:35
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