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VDay posted:Tabarestan This is Persia progress update: formed Persia and got the Shahanshah achievement while taking like 90% of the Timurids and QaraQ's lands How did you get to three provinces? I started up a Taberestan game on a whim a few weeks ago and just remember getting declared on by QQ 1 year in.
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Jul 15, 2015 22:37
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Arzakon posted:How did you get to three provinces? I started up a Taberestan game on a whim a few weeks ago and just remember getting declared on by QQ 1 year in. I seem to have been incredibly lucky in my most recent game but from a few test runs afterwards to see how things usually turn out, QQ fairly reliably ends up at war with the OE or Timurids early on which lets you snipe their one province directly north of you - if you siege it plus their capital they'll give in easily, and if they're already in the middle of a nasty war they won't want to attack your 10k stack sitting on their mountain capital province. Then you can take Shirvan which is a solid province with a trade power bonus, and after that either vassal or conquer the other minor states in the region. If they do nothing or only declare on unallied minors I'd just restart, I mean you can wait around for a lucky break but it seems kind of pointless when you can go for another roll of the dice, and no degree of skillful play will save you if you get declared on.
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Jul 15, 2015 23:27
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PrinceRandom posted:wtf... Well, you're the same dynasty, so you ought to be able to claim their throne and force a PU, which will give you the Hungary PU too.
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Jul 15, 2015 23:40
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I mashed together a combo of EVE and Dei Gratia. Some paradox people want me to share. I don't know how or if i should also it's rough and probably bad.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:17
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In my current game, Ottomans is allied with Ming. Ming. What the gently caress? The best part is they have 0 war-joining decision penalty from "Distant War" which makes no loving sense since they're on the other side of the goddamn planet. Why is this possible? Will they happily march their armies across all of Asia to fight me if I declare on Ottomans (as France)?
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Jul 16, 2015 00:26
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Probably because they both Rival'd Russia. And yeah, I'd say it's a near certainty Ming will try to march everything they have into Europe.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:27
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Baronjutter posted:What if a now independent CA is small and I vassalize them? Would it switch to them becoming a colonial nation vassal and the mechanics related, or would they function like my european vassals giving me no trade power and costing me a relation slot? I might be wrong but I think it will become a normal vassal and cost a relation slot as long as it became independent at some point.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:31
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I want to think that the Humanist + Trade policy that gives you +0.5 Prestige and -10% idea cost is really good, but I'm not sure. 40 points per idea = 280 Monarch Points per idea set, teamed up with Humanist means 320 MP for every idea seems pretty bonkers, but then factoring in the 1 MP/month cost to keep the policy running and it seems less useful....what do you guys think?
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Jul 16, 2015 00:33
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Deutsch Nozzle posted:In my current game, Ottomans is allied with Ming. That would be a 300+k army in my EU world. I really hope that doesn't happen.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:34
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Tsyni posted:That would be a 300+k army in my EU world. I really hope that doesn't happen. In my current Ottoman game Provence invaded my holdings in India when we ended up at war. I wish I would have spent the effort to beat up their armies so I would have known where they were retreating to.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:34
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Bort Bortles posted:I want to think that the Humanist + Trade policy that gives you +0.5 Prestige and -10% idea cost is really good, but I'm not sure. 40 points per idea = 280 Monarch Points per idea set, teamed up with Humanist means 320 MP for every idea seems pretty bonkers, but then factoring in the 1 MP/month cost to keep the policy running and it seems less useful....what do you guys think? Well, if you're filling an idea set faster than every 280 months then it's worth it and the prestige is gravy. So one idea every 3.5 years to break even MP wise on the discount. edit: and I guess there might be some marginal benefit for getting certain ideas faster. Tsyni fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Jul 16, 2015 |
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Jul 16, 2015 00:39
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Arzakon posted:How did you get to three provinces? I started up a Taberestan game on a whim a few weeks ago and just remember getting declared on by QQ 1 year in. With a dip rep advisor, fully improved relations, a large gift (take loans) and a full force limit you can get QQ to ally you. Get military access and vassalise Shirvan in a war, then immediately declare war on Timurids and take some provinces to make you big enough that QQ will stay friendly. Then it's just a matter of continuously beating up the Timurids every time you get a chance, and once they're not a threat backstab QQ and take Tabriz. If Persia secedes from the Timurids it's not a big deal, just attack them too, note you need to fully wipe them out to enact the Persia decision though. If at any point QQ becomes domineering towards you you've taken too long to get large and need to restart. BBJoey fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Jul 16, 2015 |
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Jul 16, 2015 00:48
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Fintilgin posted:Well, you're the same dynasty, so you ought to be able to claim their throne and force a PU, which will give you the Hungary PU too. I don't think I quite understand how claim throne works. I did it almost immediately and was told I'd get a succession war with France, then like 15 years later I couldn't claim throne?
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Jul 16, 2015 00:54
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Tsyni posted:Well, if you're filling an idea set faster than every 280 months then it's worth it and the prestige is gravy. So one idea every 3.5 years to break even MP wise on the discount.
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Jul 16, 2015 00:59
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BBJoey posted:With a dip rep advisor, fully improved relations, a large gift (take loans) and a full force limit you can get QQ to ally you. Get military access and vassalise Shirvan in a war, then immediately declare war on Timurids and take some provinces to make you big enough that QQ will stay friendly. Then it's just a matter of continuously beating up the Timurids every time you get a chance, and once they're not a threat backstab QQ and take Tabriz. If Persia secedes from the Timurids it's not a big deal, just attack them too, note you need to fully wipe them out to enact the Persia decision though. If at any point QQ becomes domineering towards you you've taken too long to get large and need to restart. Another piece of advice: don't be afraid to take loans to hire troops to make yourself look more appealing to a major power. You've got 400 years to pay them off, but much less than that to avoid getting eaten.
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Jul 16, 2015 01:04
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ok what's going on here? I ended up abandoning a game because my Genoa conquests of north africa were totally useless due to the overseas penalties. But this Italian dude seems to have conquered a bit of north africa and is not getting the penalty. Their capital is in Sicily does that some how make north africa not count as distant overseas? I thought the only way to avoid that is to conquer a huge strip from the balkans through turkey and the middle east and egypt. Can anyone explain this wizardry ?
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Jul 16, 2015 01:48
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Baronjutter posted:ok what's going on here? I ended up abandoning a game because my Genoa conquests of north africa were totally useless due to the overseas penalties. But this Italian dude seems to have conquered a bit of north africa and is not getting the penalty. Their capital is in Sicily does that some how make north africa not count as distant overseas? I thought the only way to avoid that is to conquer a huge strip from the balkans through turkey and the middle east and egypt. Can anyone explain this wizardry ? Could it be because Sicily shares a sea-zone border with those provinces?
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Jul 16, 2015 02:09
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No, there's a range from your capital that any province that would be distant overseas isn't. Not sure what the exact range is but it isn't too far.
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Jul 16, 2015 02:12
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Baronjutter posted:ok what's going on here? I ended up abandoning a game because my Genoa conquests of north africa were totally useless due to the overseas penalties. But this Italian dude seems to have conquered a bit of north africa and is not getting the penalty. Their capital is in Sicily does that some how make north africa not count as distant overseas? I thought the only way to avoid that is to conquer a huge strip from the balkans through turkey and the middle east and egypt. Can anyone explain this wizardry ? Within a certain range of your capital (300 units maybe?) nothing counts as distant overseas.
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Jul 16, 2015 02:12
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So if I moved my capital to Cagliari I could conquer north africa and have a big Mediterranean empire with no distant overseas?
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Jul 16, 2015 02:29
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Baronjutter posted:So if I moved my capital to Cagliari I could conquer north africa and have a big Mediterranean empire with no distant overseas? I don't know about "big", but a couple of provinces immediately near Cagliari, yeah. I don't know the exact range but I doubt you'd get Tripoli for instance.
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Jul 16, 2015 02:59
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That feeling you get when you get a 6/5/5 ruler AND the event that lets you give him +2 to an attribute of your choosing, only to have him die at the ripe old age of 16.  At least I got Basileus.
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Jul 16, 2015 03:44
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In case my above post isn't clear, it isn't a good feeling.
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Jul 16, 2015 03:46
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Larry Parrish posted:Within a certain range of your capital (300 units maybe?) nothing counts as distant overseas. Wiki says 150, I guess it'd be easy enough to test with the console.
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Jul 16, 2015 04:12
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PrinceRandom posted:I don't think I quite understand how claim throne works. I did it almost immediately and was told I'd get a succession war with France, then like 15 years later I couldn't claim throne? Claim throne works two ways. If they don't have an heir you can claim the throne and will get a PU/succession war if their ruler dies without producing an heir. This is the poo poo option because even if their ruler is 70 years old they might still get an heir and if they're your dynasty and you have a royal marriage with them you'll probably get a PU if their ruler dies heirless anyway regardless of whether you claim the throne (provided your prestige is high enough). The second way is if they have an heir with weak claim strength you can claim the throne and straight up get a form union CB. This is the best option because there's no waiting and chance involved, if you see they have a weak heir you can claim throne and immediately declare war. Obviously this involves having to actually fight but provided you can win the war you are 100% guaranteed a PU. Note that the form union CB only lasts for as long as they have a weak heir, so if either ruler or heir is close to death you want to declare sooner rather than later. e: also the wiki says you can also claim throne when they're in a regency but that poo poo has never worked for me so take it with a grain of salt.
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Jul 16, 2015 04:13
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Jackson Taus posted:I don't know about "big", but a couple of provinces immediately near Cagliari, yeah. I don't know the exact range but I doubt you'd get Tripoli for instance. Ah I assumed that if I get one province that isn't overseas all connecting provinces will link up to it as well vs just a range thing.
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Jul 16, 2015 04:25
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It's been said before, but goddamn Protestantism is amazing. Need colonies? Don't gently caress about asking the Pope for approval, have +15 settler growth. Filling out ideas? Have 5% off. Unrest troubles? Got you covered. Conversions to be done? Have a 1% boost. There's just so many small, incredibly useful boosts that you just switch in and out. Witch hunters have the best church, who knew.
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Jul 16, 2015 06:42
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I kind of wish the constitutional monarchy option told you in a tooltip that it unlocked the parliament system when you selected it- I would have switched much earlier. Also glad I watched a bit of Arumba's video on CS England so I even knew that was a thing.
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Jul 16, 2015 07:23
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Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:I kind of wish the constitutional monarchy option told you in a tooltip that it unlocked the parliament system when you selected it- I would have switched much earlier. Also glad I watched a bit of Arumba's video on CS England so I even knew that was a thing. The parliament system is very bad and you should be trying to avoid it.
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Jul 16, 2015 08:47
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It's great for really small kingdoms/republics, insanely horrible for large empires. So it's just bad period since they unlock at tech 22 and if you have under 30 provinces that late in the game IDK what to tell you
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Jul 16, 2015 08:59
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From my England games it felt that it is utter poo poo if you have more than like 20 provinces, they really need to make the rewards scale or reduce the amounts of seats/bribes that are needed. It is one of those things that is straight out bad and actually provable so by some simple math. No idea why they even implemented it like this. As for the Exchange of Ideas policy, you need to plan on when to use it and you need the right ruler for it. From back when I did the math I figured you need at least +3 in the relevant monarch skill and preferably be free to move your focus. Obviously you also want to have saved up points to the cap before activating the policy. If you do it in the right situation you can save a bit more than 200 MP, but it is very situational. As a general rule it is only worth it if you can unlock at least 4 ideas during the 10 years.
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Jul 16, 2015 09:57
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The parliament seems bad at first for large empires, but if you are protestant I think it can actually be worth it. You will have a lot of seats in parliament, but that means a lot of provinces get the nice bonus for it. There are bribes I don't really mind paying: Church power, local autonomy, naval and military tradition. And if they are maxed anyway, prestige and legitimacy. And at some point money bribes are easy to afford as well. This can give you some really nice bonuses. And if you don't like the choices for debate, just loosing one isn't that much of a problem, if you are huge prestige comes easy.
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Jul 16, 2015 10:26
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Also not having a debate is a -.5 legitimacy penalty, which can often be completed nullified. In that case you're just giving a ton of your provinces free bonuses, with an occasionally good bonus from a debate that you can probably easily afford to win.
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Jul 16, 2015 10:37
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Knuc U Kinte posted:The parliament system is very bad and you should be trying to avoid it. Well it looked like fun 
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Jul 16, 2015 10:40
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Also, not to say this game is making me think Hitler was on to something...but my attempt to make a Grand Bohemia has made me think France is evil, Great Britian is a bitch, all I need is Danzig and a little space...and I guess killing Jews is ok. Weird how a game can teach you so much.
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Jul 16, 2015 10:44
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Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:France is evil, Great Britian is a bitch
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Jul 16, 2015 11:12
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I switched to a Constitutional Monarchy in like 1805 as an enormous Russia just to see what it was like since I was killing time to reach 1820. Even with a 100-seat Parliament after I filled out all Siberia's poor provinces with MPs to keep their costs down it was still auto-assigning seats to places like Rome and Constantinople, and with no party system or MPs who support the government without being bribed there was no way in hell I was ever going to win a debate (partly just because clicking through fifty bribes would be annoying as all hell, and partly because losing so much stuff up front just for the chance to get a bonus later doesn't seem worth it at all). It also tripled the admin point cost for raising stability. I can see how it would be fun if you had just a few provinces, but as someone else said the government form is unlocked so late in the game that a human player is very unlikely to remain that small at that point in the game. It was bad. So I switched to Enlightened Despotism and never looked back. If I could make one change to the parliament system it would be to make it so some MPs would already support the bill when you propose one. Not even necessarily a full-fledged party system, but just make it so there's a percentage chance based on the province's culture, religion, development, I dunno, something, that makes it so you already have some MPs on your side when you propose a bill, and then it's your choice to bribe others if you want a better chance at winning the debate.
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Jul 16, 2015 11:34
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VDay posted:Also not having a debate is a -.5 legitimacy penalty, which can often be completed nullified. In that case you're just giving a ton of your provinces free bonuses, with an occasionally good bonus from a debate that you can probably easily afford to win. I disagree with this, the stab and WE penalties are way worse than the bonus you get for having a seat in that province. The kicker are the bribes, you'll need to bribe half the seats at least and some of the effects are just loving horrible, at some point one of the seats had a loving -5 Imperial Authority, that's over 3 years worth of IA for one loving bribe. That whole poo poo needs to be rebalanced badly imo, either make the bonuses scale or reduce the bribes, as it is there's an optimal size which is less than 20 provinces and anything above that it becomes useless unless RNG hugely favors you and gives you the 2-3 bribe types that might actually be worth it. Like who in their right mind would pay 1 mercantilism to gain 1 out of 20ish votes? In the end everyone has their own opinion, to me the whole system seemed an utter waste of my and dev time (someone had to code this poo poo), if you're playing an England that annexed the British Isles and has some continental holdings you might as well ignore the whole thing.
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Jul 16, 2015 13:10
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Baronjutter posted:So if I moved my capital to Cagliari I could conquer north africa and have a big Mediterranean empire with no distant overseas? No, it's not that big, you'll only get some provinces in Tunis but won't reach Morocco or Mamlukes. Only actual connections through Constantinople/Edirne will let you satisfy your Mare Nostrum ambitions.
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Jul 16, 2015 13:26
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Bort Bortles posted:Yeah, doing more maths, you can activate the policy before you start unlocking a new idea set and then turn the policy off after 10 years, thus after 120 admin points. You get +0.5 Prestige the whole time, too. Therefore you can save 160 MP by activating the policy for exactly 10 years. I guess that is kinda useful should you have both of those ideas. I had thought about taking Maritime as my 5th Ottoman idea in part so I could Confirm the Thalassocracy, however most of the Maritime ideas I find pretty meh. Meanwhile Trade gives me some cash printing boosts and access to better policies. I am also tempted to just spam Military ideas so my Janissaries are even more insane late game once my Anatolian tech group unit pips fall off a bit. Trade is probably better than Maritime unless you're Westernizing and grabbing a couple trade companies for bonus merchants. That said, it's almost never worthwhile to pick idea groups based on policies, imo. Edit: also, I think you're being optimistic about the value of that particular policy. At a 20% Idea discount, you're paying 320 per individual Idea, a savings of 40 relative to without the policy active. So to break even on point cost, you need to buy an Idea every 40 months which equates to a monthly MP income of 8 points, very doable. However, you're not going to buy an entire idea line within 10 years and save 160 points as you describe, that would require 320 points * 7 ideas / 120 months = 18.7 MP income per month. So basically it wouldn't be hard to break even with the policy, but you'd have to have a scenario where you're filling in two idea lines with ~9-10 MP/month each to achieve that best-case 160 MP saved in 10 years. Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Jul 16, 2015 |
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Jul 16, 2015 13:45
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