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Freezer posted:How is this drop presented in local media after they passed all of those information control laws? They've tried basically everything to hold the tide and eventually reality has to set in. TheBalor posted:What the gently caress. This isn't like the first stock market crash they've had, right? Why are they staking so goddamn much on being able to push back the tide? It is really quite unreal, it really goes to show how scared they are about a market downturn and the possibility for mass unrest. Remember the deal has always been for everyone to shut up about political / social rights so long as the economic train kept chugging ahead.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:12
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Kafka Esq. posted:Thank God you have to pay actual money to bribe your way into Canada! Lol Canada just changed its investor visa laws because a review found that more than 50% of visa-holders were scamming the government.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:32
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:China spent 10% of its 2014 GDP on propping up the stock market lmao  That's some real dedication to wishful thinking right there. That's bitcoin levels of ignoring how markets actually work.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:38
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Arglebargle III posted:Lol Canada just changed its investor visa laws because a review found that more than 50% of visa-holders were scamming the government. How so? The stuff I found just said that the government didn't feel they were paying enough taxes or putting down roots in the country.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:41
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paragon1 posted:How so? The stuff I found just said that the government didn't feel they were paying enough taxes or putting down roots in the country. They increased the buy in cost to 2m and you need a networth of something like 8 or 10m. Previously it was 500k investment, 1m net worth or thereabouts, quite a jump in cost.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:45
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paragon1 posted:How so? The stuff I found just said that the government didn't feel they were paying enough taxes or putting down roots in the country. I read a thing about it man.
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Jul 27, 2015 16:46
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Like were people lying about their actual net worth or something?
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Jul 27, 2015 16:47
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The new investor immigrant program only had 6 applicants. I keep reading poo poo about how mainlanders are getting in to Canada via Quebec regardless. Does anyone know how that works? Is that not part of the iip?
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Jul 27, 2015 16:50
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quote:
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Jul 27, 2015 16:52
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Cultural Imperial posted:The new investor immigrant program only had 6 applicants. Quebec is a special snowflake https://www.immigration-quebec.gouv.qc.ca/en/immigrate-settle/businesspeople/applying-business-immigrant/three-programs/entrepreneurs.html
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Jul 27, 2015 16:53
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paragon1 posted:Like were people lying about their actual net worth or something? Yeah (maybe?) and the thing where you can pool assets into some thing run by an agent made it easy. The article used the word fraud. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Jul 27, 2015 |
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Jul 27, 2015 16:53
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quote:‘revive the A shares, benefit the people; revive the A shares, benefit the people’
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Jul 27, 2015 16:54
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jm20 posted:They increased the buy in cost to 2m and you need a networth of something like 8 or 10m. Previously it was 500k investment, 1m net worth or thereabouts, quite a jump in cost. The new program has additional scrutiny of your documented income and assets. Surprisingly not many people are applying though it would be impolite to speculate on their reasons.
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Jul 27, 2015 17:19
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ocrumsprug posted:The new program has additional scrutiny of your documented income and assets. Surprisingly not many people are applying though it would be impolite to speculate on their reasons. So money laundering is no longer considered a valid source of income?
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Jul 27, 2015 18:14
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Shifty Pony posted:So money laundering is no longer considered a valid source of income? Sounds like some hurt Chinese feelings are incoming.
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Jul 27, 2015 18:20
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cheesetriangles posted:Isn't someone getting the money? If they are buying stocks at wildly inflated prices someone has to be selling it? When you buy stocks on margin you are creating money and when the price crashes it vanishes.
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Jul 27, 2015 19:21
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Bip Roberts posted:When you buy stocks on margin you are creating money and when the price crashes it vanishes. Ah 
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Jul 27, 2015 19:25
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Don't worry guys, the government is willing to pour even more money into the stock market! 10% of the GDP just wasn't enough I guess. http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/07/27/uk-markets-china-stocks-close-idUKKCN0Q10KD20150727 quote:China said on Monday it was prepared to buy shares to stabilise the stock market and avert "systemic risks", after major indices plunged more than 8 percent in the biggest one-day fall since 2007.
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Jul 27, 2015 19:40
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Hahaha "malicious shorting"
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Jul 27, 2015 19:48
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:Don't worry guys, the government is willing to pour even more money into the stock market! 10% of the GDP just wasn't enough I guess.  What do they even think is going to happen here? How much money do they even have to throw into this hole?
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Jul 27, 2015 19:57
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Yeah seriously, shorting is actually a good thing for a healthy market. Naked shorting is a whole different beast though.
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Jul 27, 2015 19:58
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The Lord of Hats posted:
My guess is that they realize that the foundations of the whole structure are rotten and the failure modes abound , so if the stock market explodes it'll snowball from there into the shadow banking sector, the property bubble, the fudged up production numbers, etc. So they're willing to be as aggressive as it takes to keep the first domino from falling. You can call their approach shortsighted and stupid, but in essence it isn't much different to what other western governments have been doing with their own speculative bubbles (hello Australia and Canada!).
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Jul 27, 2015 20:09
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I wonder when the smoke clears how much this intervention is going to cost? China has (or had) a giant amount of currency reserves but with the amount of firepower they are throwing at a full blown crash coupled with the existing poor debts, a big portion of them has to be going up in smoke.
Ardennes fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Jul 27, 2015 |
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Jul 27, 2015 20:14
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Freezer posted:My guess is that they realize that the foundations of the whole structure are rotten and the failure modes abound , so if the stock market explodes it'll snowball from there into the shadow banking sector, the property bubble, the fudged up production numbers, etc. So they're willing to be as aggressive as it takes to keep the first domino from falling. That's definitely a good point, but I'd have expected them to start instituting some emergency measures in those areas in the window of time they've bought. As it is they're just trying to punch back the tide to protect a sand castle.
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Jul 27, 2015 20:25
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 And that my friends is what they call a dead cat bounce.
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Jul 27, 2015 20:48
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Ardennes posted:I wonder when the smoke clears how much this intervention is going to cost? China has (or had) a giant amount of currency reserves but with the amount of firepower they are throwing at a full blown crash coupled with the existing poor debts, a big portion of them has to be going up in smoke. Aren't they just printing currency to buy up stocks to keep the price up? Does it really "cost" anything when the central bank does this? I really don't know much about the consequences of this action, could you explain further? I'm going to assume if it would increase inflation and devalue their currency, correct?
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Jul 27, 2015 20:50
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Cultural Imperial posted:
As in "the government will kill my cat if I don't buy shares"?
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Jul 27, 2015 21:01
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Calling it now: the government will soon grab a random trader/broker/whatever and charge him with "malicious short-selling" and make a public example out of him in a bid to scare others.
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Jul 27, 2015 21:05
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Cultural Imperial posted:
I'm honestly shocked how much this looks like that graph you guys keep posting.
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Jul 27, 2015 21:08
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drilldo squirt posted:I'm honestly shocked how much this looks like that graph you guys keep posting. There's a reason that graph exists! The problem is always timing, after it's all said and done it's trivial to match up the graph with what happened but to really make money you have to know where on the graph you are and predict when the shifts will occur. Hence 'dead cat bounce', 'catching the falling knife' and so on. Think back to the US crash- lots of people lost their asses thinking they were getting steals on housing after the first big drops only to see prices crater again in a lot of areas. Even the government made feeble attempts to 'do something'. The first time buyer home credit burned through a lot of cash but accomplished jack poo poo. Freezer posted:My guess is that they realize that the foundations of the whole structure are rotten and the failure modes abound , so if the stock market explodes it'll snowball from there into the shadow banking sector, the property bubble, the fudged up production numbers, etc. So they're willing to be as aggressive as it takes to keep the first domino from falling. Yep like I said a bit ago the whole structure is built on economic success so people don't get uppity about their other rights, the party leaders basically see a crash as meaning another Tienanmen square is right around the corner. Also a lot of people really do buy into the bullshit of 'this time it's different', even the top leaders. They could very well be happy to just buy a couple months at this point once they realized the jig is up. tsa fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Jul 27, 2015 |
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Jul 27, 2015 21:32
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Yeah, it's hilariously sad that bubbles basically always look like that, but people still keep buying stocks in them. 
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Jul 27, 2015 21:36
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Can youstop the crash by outright "buying" the whole market? Because it looks like Chian is exactly doing that. And I wonder... If you got enough money, why wouldn't it work?
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Jul 27, 2015 21:40
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tsa posted:There's a reason that graph exists! The problem is always timing, after it's all said and done it's trivial to match up the graph with what happened but to really make money you have to know where on the graph you are and predict when the shifts will occur. Hence 'dead cat bounce', 'catching the falling knife' and so on. Think back to the US crash- lots of people lost their asses thinking they were getting steals on housing after the first big drops only to see prices crater again in a lot of areas. Even the government made feeble attempts to 'do something'. The first time buyer home credit burned through a lot of cash but accomplished jack poo poo. Its a bit fractaly too if you zoom in. If you look at only the first bear trap I bet you'd be able to see an even smaller bear trap before that. It's a mugs game to play stocks against computer models making millisecond trades anyway.
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Jul 27, 2015 21:49
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mastervj posted:Can youstop the crash by outright "buying" the whole market? Because what goes up must eventually go down? Let's assume the prices are wildly overinflated, but China has enough money to buy it all up. What then? You suddenly have trillions in stock that is worth a fraction of what you paid for it.As soon as the government starts to unload it, the process will start again. That's why people say they're trying to hold back the tide: short of eternally finding more suckers to buy in for higher and higher prices, prices have to recede from the absurd highs.
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Jul 27, 2015 22:33
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EngineerJoe posted:Yeah seriously, shorting is actually a good thing for a healthy market. Naked shorting is a whole different beast though. Yes except everyone forgets this in a down market and goes after the short sellers like a witch hunt. Franks Happy Place posted:Calling it now: the government will soon grab a random trader/broker/whatever and charge him with "malicious short-selling" and make a public example out of him in a bid to scare others. Oh you beat me to this.
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Jul 27, 2015 22:53
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mastervj posted:Can youstop the crash by outright "buying" the whole market? Because assuming you haven't managed to re-start the mania, the market will crash again the moment you stop doing it. It could be worse...if investors (a cowardly and superstitious lot) get used to the idea of always having the government willing to buy their shares at an inflated price, then the government stops, that could cause a panic even if the market were doing well and those prices were sustainable in the short term.
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Jul 27, 2015 22:55
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Uncle Jam posted:Its a bit fractaly too if you zoom in. If you look at only the first bear trap I bet you'd be able to see an even smaller bear trap before that. It's a mugs game to play stocks against computer models making millisecond trades anyway. What? Mid term and long term investment does not have a lot to do with hft. Now, you still want to be careful about going up against mamoth statistical (and inside trading  ) operations for similar reasons, but it's not exactly infeasible to outguess indices.(Almost everyone who is not an inside trader will be essentially flipping a coin, though.) More on topic, this is looking rather nightmarish. Oh well, I'm sure a Chinese crash won't have negative side effects.
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Jul 27, 2015 23:02
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Cultural Imperial posted:
Alternatively, the Bull Trap.
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Jul 27, 2015 23:03
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Whats the smart money for the average banana cart investor? Watches in Macau?
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Jul 27, 2015 23:08
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GreyjoyBastard posted:What? Mid term and long term investment does not have a lot to do with hft. Now, you still want to be careful about going up against mamoth statistical (and inside trading Oh I am sure some people could do it but I would bust out almost immediately, I suck at that poo poo. Long term investment yeah, but trying to get money on a bubble like this.
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Jul 27, 2015 23:22
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