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semper wifi posted:You know for a guy hyper-focused on forgiveness, love and kumbaya poo poo you seem to spend a suspiciously large amount of your posting time pontificating about how anyone who feels actions should have consequences is dumb and bad. If you believe that someone deserves to suffer consequences as terrible as literally dying for doing dumb things, then yes - you are a bad person. Pretty much the only thing that I find unforgivable is people who, as their general mindset, believe that other people are worse than them and should suffer as a result. Though even then I would be completely willing to forgive someone for such a terrible attitude if they realized it was terrible and changed, and most importantly I don't think that they should be punished for it (beyond other people shunning them or whatever). Thinking someone is a bad person (in a way that isn't actively committing a dangerous crime) and thinking that someone should suffer dire consequences for it are completely different things. The part that you seem to have trouble understanding is that there is a huge difference between "actions do have consequences" and "actions should have consequences." You are mixing up "doing X is likely to result in Y" with "doing X should result in Y."* You also seem to fail to understand that the consequences of a bunch of these actions are not some immutable fact of reality. It is not some law of nature that police have to kill or beat the poo poo out of people who are rude to them (or even do some minor physical action like kicking them in the shin or whatever). The police should be held to a higher standard than wild animals. And there are plenty of other professions where people are treated poorly and do not respond in kind (trauma medical personnel are the most obvious option; not only are they often treated terribly and even with violence, but they also have great power over their patients). Actually, I think police might be the only profession where there's this assumption that you'll have "your day ruined" if you treat them badly. That says something bad about no one but the police themselves. No one in this thread (or at least very few people) are actually arguing that it is prudent to do the sort of things that are causing people to be shot/whatever. They are only arguing that the things these people did should (again, the key word) not result in the punishments they received. I feel like you and a couple other posters in this thread are arguing against some strawman that thinks it's a good idea to mouth off to police or whatever, but no one is actually saying that. This really shouldn't be complex. If you ask yourself "would it be okay for what this person did to be punishable by _____ in a court of law" and the answer is "no", then it is wrong and shouldn't happen. *I think this is called the is-ought fallacy or something. Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Jul 29, 2015 |
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Jul 29, 2015 17:03
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The family of Sam Dubose is viewing the body cam footage right now, so we will likely know what happened before day's end. Some information that has leaked says he was shot in the back of the head and the rumblings behind the scenes are that Cincinnati is about to become (Ferguson x Baltimore)ˆ2 edit: UofC Campus Police are going door to door alerting Summer session students to evacuate the campus in advance of potential riots.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:18
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quote:But Cincinnati’s police chief said he had seen the video, and he said “the video is not good.” LINK
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Jul 29, 2015 17:24
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The video of the University of Cincinnati shooting will be released today, instead of tomorrow. I'm not sure why they changed their minds but there's a press conference at 1:00 PM. I'm assuming that's Eastern time, so we'll hear what they have to say in about half an hour. http://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/colleges/uc-news/hamilton-county-prosecutors-office-to-release-body-cam-footage-of-uc-shooting-thursday
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Jul 29, 2015 17:25
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pathetic little tramp posted:The family of Sam Dubose is viewing the body cam footage right now, so we will likely know what happened before day's end. Not to get all TVIV on you but where are you reading this? For content the comparison of police behavior to medical professionals was about the worst one semper wifi could have possibly chosen. Anyone with any exposure to high acuity patients is going to understand that they come in an incredible array of flavors and they need to be treated with the appropriate standard of care regardless. Nobody is going to cover for you if your patient tachs out and you didn't give them their medication because they were belligerent of even physically violent, let alone that they hurt your feelings.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:26
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quote:A CNN records search showed that Dubose had more than 60 arrests. He was a father to 13 children, according to CNN affiliate WKRC-TV. CNN just casually slips this into the middle of their article so get ready for another scintillating round of He Was No Angel
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Jul 29, 2015 17:26
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TehSaurus posted:Not to get all TVIV on you but where are you reading this? Some UofC students on Twitter and the local fox affiliate reporters are posting updates on their Twitters as well.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:30
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Assuming Tensing is indicted today, I think the responsible authorities deserve some kudos. 10 days from on-duty killing to indictment is really, really fast
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Jul 29, 2015 17:31
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Licensed medical professionals also face ethics investigations and licensure inquiries over domestic violence and substance abuse issues, something that this thread has repeatedly shown as not happening for cops. Additionally they have to carry liability insurance and losing your insurance coverage is pretty much career ending.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:32
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Some good news, I guess.quote:And on Tuesday, the court of appeals reversed a lower court’s ruling and said Davis could go ahead with his excessive force suit.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:45
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As a (well now former) defense attorneys, one of my guilty pleasures is to watch cops and the like and yell at the screen about everytjong being done wrong (a lot). Yes, I'm broken. In any event, these university cops were on one of these shows a lot and they seemed extraordinarly unprofessional and quick to escalate an issue into UoF and arrest. (Which is normally uncommon on cop shows as the "stars" generally try to be good between coerced searches and confessions.) I've been try to figure out if this cop was on one of these shows all morning.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:46
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C2C - 2.0 posted:Some good news, I guess. “As unreasonable as it may sound, a reasonable officer could have believed that beating a subdued and compliant Mr. Davis while causing only a concussion, scalp lacerations and bruising with almost no permanent damage did not violate the Constitution,” Are you loving kidding me?
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Jul 29, 2015 17:50
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heh  C2C - 2.0 posted:Some good news, I guess. quote:“As unreasonable as it may sound, a reasonable officer could have believed that beating a subdued and compliant Mr. Davis while causing only a concussion, scalp lacerations and bruising with almost no permanent damage did not violate the Constitution,” the district court ruled in tossing out the case. That sounds like an onion article.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:50
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nm posted:As a (well now former) defense attorneys, one of my guilty pleasures is to watch cops and the like and yell at the screen about everytjong being done wrong (a lot). Yes, I'm broken. In any event, these university cops were on one of these shows a lot and they seemed extraordinarly unprofessional and quick to escalate an issue into UoF and arrest. (Which is normally uncommon on cop shows as the "stars" generally try to be good between coerced searches and confessions.) yeah, it's pretty funny spotting unconstitutional searches on Cops
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Jul 29, 2015 17:52
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http://www.wcpo.com/live Cleveland press conference starting in ~5
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Jul 29, 2015 17:52
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I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez:quote:SPARTA, NJ – Three young adults were arrested in the early hours of Saturday morning after mistakenly knocking on the door of a New Jersey State Trooper and fleeing the scene. https://www.tapinto.net/towns/sparta/sections/police-and-fire/articles/in-dark-of-night-off-duty-trooper-fires-at-unar
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Jul 29, 2015 17:54
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nm posted:“As unreasonable as it may sound, a reasonable officer could have believed that beating a subdued and compliant Mr. Davis while causing only a concussion, scalp lacerations and bruising with almost no permanent damage did not violate the Constitution,”
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Jul 29, 2015 17:55
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Now this is just the presser that's going to say "yes we are charging mr. x with murder" and we'll see the actual video probably much later today, right?
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Jul 29, 2015 17:56
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UFOTofuTacoCat posted:I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez: This is unbelievable. The dude was willing to kill for a mistaken address. That cop should be the one in jail.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:57
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UFOTofuTacoCat posted:I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez: Fleeing from an officer attempting to murder you, 5 years iso-cubes. e; C2C - 2.0 posted:What possible charges could they make up for something like that? read above.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:57
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What possible charges could they make up for something like that?
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Jul 29, 2015 17:57
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Radish posted:This is unbelievable. The dude was willing to kill for a mistaken address. That cop should be the one in jail. This is America, he's legally allowed to kill anyone as long as he feels threatened, the law is clear.
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Jul 29, 2015 17:58
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UFOTofuTacoCat posted:I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez: What the gently caress? What's the process to start a loving manhunt? "Oh hey sarge, some kids knocked on my door so I chased them with my gun and started shooting at them, I got them to crash but one got away. Can we bring the helicopter out for this one?" "Sounds good, I'll grab the dogs, too!"
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Jul 29, 2015 17:58
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Wait, so they knocked on the wrong door, it happened to be a cop. He yelled at them, they fled, and then he shot at them as they were fleeing? Did I read that right?
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Jul 29, 2015 18:00
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UFOTofuTacoCat posted:I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez: Wait, wait. They're talking about whether or not to charge the guys who didn't shoot the gun, not the moron who popped off 3 rounds without cause? Lets be clear, in any competent jurisdiction, warning shots are just not allowed (except in prison) because they are a use of dealy force (in a nieghborhood a stray could easily hit a bystander) but as they are not targeted at a party, imply no actual fear. This is a firing offense in even the worst police departments because of how stupid and unjustifiable it is. Jesus gently caress people.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:00
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UFOTofuTacoCat posted:I'm glad no one died in this one, jeez: Hahaha and they're going to try and charge people who knocked on the wrong door with a crime, just to justify the troooper trying to kill them.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:00
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pathetic little tramp posted:Now this is just the presser that's going to say "yes we are charging mr. x with murder" and we'll see the actual video probably much later today, right? he's indicted
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Jul 29, 2015 18:01
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Trabisnikof posted:Hahaha and they're going to try and charge people who knocked on the wrong door with a crime, just to justify the troooper trying to kill them. The System works. I know it's gauche to say it, but incidents like this are why I find it irritating when people go on about how treating cops differently is so unconstitutional and thus inherently terrible. Three kids are potentially going to have their lives ruined by the justice system because they made the unfortunate mistake of accidentally pissing off a cop who then tried to murder them. Even if it all works out in the end which isn't a guarantee that's absolutely terrifying and will certainly damage their futures. Police and regular people are already treated so incredibly different that saying that we are all under the same rules is totally untrue. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Jul 29, 2015 |
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Jul 29, 2015 18:01
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Raerlynn posted:Wait, so they knocked on the wrong door, it happened to be a cop. He yelled at them, they fled, and then he shot at them as they were fleeing? Did I read that right? They were no angels. quote:repeatedly ringing the doorbell and loudly knocking on the door
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Jul 29, 2015 18:02
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:he's indicted Uhhh are you getting some cooking show audio over top of the press conference?
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Jul 29, 2015 18:02
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Trabisnikof posted:Hahaha and they're going to try and charge people who knocked on the wrong door with a crime, just to justify the troooper trying to kill them. They're no angels.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:02
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Yeah I'm hearing a cooking show right now
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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^^^^^ It just got fixed
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:he's indicted For?
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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twitter: 'I've being this over 30 years. This is the most asinine act I've ever seen' Joe Deters. Deter's says shooting of #SamDubose was purposeful. Deters: He should have never been a police officer. @WCPO #SamDubose pathetic little tramp posted:Uhhh are you getting some cooking show audio over top of the press conference? yes, so twitter.com/wcpo (they just fixed it)
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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http://www.fox19.com/story/29656580/charges-grand-jury-can-consider Had to change streaming sites to get away from Carla cooking on the Chew. edit: Missed the first couple minutes. The prosecutor is really ripping the officer a new one. although "This doesn't happen in america" is pretty funny.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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nm posted:For? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwRQ4G7fXuo
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Jul 29, 2015 18:03
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Rollofthedice posted:^^^^^ Yeah I thought I was going nuts, checked all my browsers, but only Opera and Chrome have that "here's the tab that's playing an annoying sound!" icon. This press conference is amazing. This man is very open about how this was a completely senseless killing.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:04
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'#SamDubose didn't follow simple, nonviolent commands. He was subdued. I mean it was so unnecessary for this to occur' -- Deters
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Jul 29, 2015 18:04
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:twitter: I was confused at first and though the "purposeful" statement contradicted the others he made; I suppose, rather, he's implying that "purposeful" doesn't mean "lawful" and was done with ill-intent.
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Jul 29, 2015 18:05
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