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Gimnbo posted:A lot of people think Big Money is the supreme strategy of Dominion. These people probably open with Village on a 3/4
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Aug 3, 2015 18:30
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Gimnbo posted:A lot of people think Big Money is the supreme strategy of Dominion. Big Money is the default. Anyone that explains Dominion to a newbie and doesn't mention "Hey, if you just buy silver and gold you will win in X turns. If you can't figure out how to win faster than that with the cards on the table do that" is a dick. Of course "Big money + one other card" is usually a lot better than big money on its own, so this gets a newbie playing properly right away. I always give out basic strategy when teaching a game, and when they play the first few times. There's no reason to make them suss it out themselves except to boost your own ego by beating on a noob.
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Aug 3, 2015 18:30
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GrandpaPants posted:I thought you were supposed to be able to combine the sets (Alien and Predator) since that's sort of a thing? Also, the competitive Legendary (Marvel) is way worse than the co-op one, if for no other reason than the co-op one eliminates the random draw factor of the market row. The weird thing about the co-op one though, is that it seems like the game gets harder the more players you have, since each player has less refined decks, but the onslaught of encounter cards doesn't really slow down. It still does the two currency thing though, but even in Aliens that is somewhat alleviated since your buddies can always throw in assists as necessary. The base set of Marvel Legendary is also ridiculously easy from the co-op perspective. Most "enemies" let you trash a card or something else ridiculous. Further compounding the "these aren't provinces problem". Oh, you just had a bonkers early turn and killed two sentinels? Well what if we let you trash two cards, too? There is no tension between getting points or keeping the villains from winning. I played the GotG expansion recently though and it actually makes the villains a legitimate threat if you leave out the base set henchmen bozos which makes it a bit more interesting. It still seems like it would be much better if it copped the structured encounter deck and asymmetric avatar starting cards from Encounters. They should patch that poo poo in.
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Aug 3, 2015 18:35
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Hearing that legendary predator is not co-op as a base game has really put me off it
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Aug 3, 2015 18:43
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medchem posted:A friend of mine just got back from Gen Con. He tried out Legendary: Predator and said he liked it better than than Legendary: Aliens because of the replayability of Predator. He said Predator is more replayable since it's competitive whereas Aliens is co-op and you pretty much stop playing it once you beat it. So, it may be worth waiting for Predator if you're thinking of getting Aliens? I played Legendary Encounters: Predator at Gen Con as well. We demoed it at the booth and it was for the cooperative side of the game. It was setup for the first Predator movie so we started off fighting humans in objective 1 and Predator cards started showing up in the objective 2 stack. No idea what objective 3 was because we all died. I was playing with some Legendary Encounters newbies and we had horrible luck with the strike deck. First strike of the deck was the 5 damage one and then shortly afterward we got 2 4s back to back. I had some healing cards, but never got to use them. I was marked by the Predator and that starts a combo where you're forced to discard any 1+ value cards from the top of your deck. So I kept getting stuck with base cards. That or I'd get one of the heal cards, but it required playing a red combo card first and wouldn't have one. All in all it seems like you get many more strikes in the game versus Alien. The humans we were fighting at first all had an automatic strike ability if you killed them. Only the objective card stopped that, but it wasn't drawn till the very end of the stack. Bad luck all around. The, I guess, drones that popped up occasionally also had an auto strike ability if you scanned them. Then they would flip back over, so you just couldn't fight them till they hit the combat area. Oh, also strikes that make you draw a second strike on yourself, or strikes that if they aren't healed by your next turn give you two more strikes, or strikes that do zero damage but prevent you from healing anything else till they're gone. So not very long into the game we all had a stack full of strikes. Never got a single heal off. Three people died from strikes and the game was over because the 3rd guy had a strike that made everyone lose if he died. Not a great experience for the newbies I'm sure. I was expecting it to be tough because I have Alien, but even I was a bit surprised just hard badly we got owned. New abilities vs Alien: "Call for Backup" triggers if someone plays a Coordination card on your turn. "Brothers in Arms" gives you bonuses for each other character you play during your turn. I think Coordination cards can be played to add more characters as well, but not sure... That's all I remember.
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Aug 3, 2015 18:43
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By the way, if you can grab a hold of the Fantastic Four Legendary expansion, do so. It's apparently going for $50-$70 on eBay due to it being out of print and I suppose it won't be reprinted till Sony and Marvel work things out. Also, it sounds like CGE is working on digital versions of Dungeon Lords and possibly Codenames as well: https://www.boardgamegeek.com/blogpost/44509/app-news-gen-con-short-takes
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Aug 3, 2015 18:47
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Tekopo posted:Hearing that legendary predator is not co-op as a base game has really put me off it It has co-op and competitive. You play as humans vs Predators co-op or you can play as Predators competing for honor and kills vs...um, not sure. Whatever is in the baddie deck. Didn't play that in the demo. You can also combine it with LE: Alien to have Predators hunting Aliens competitive or co-op with humans vs Predators, Aliens, or Predators and Aliens. Lots of options.
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Aug 3, 2015 18:48
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medchem posted:By the way, if you can grab a hold of the Fantastic Four Legendary expansion, do so. It's apparently going for $50-$70 on eBay due to it being out of print and I suppose it won't be reprinted till Sony and Marvel work things out. I'm not crazy about Dungeon Lords as a board game because of the effort it takes but I would play the ever loving poo poo out of an app
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Aug 3, 2015 18:55
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OmegaGoo posted:And it was BGG game of the year last year! For some reason this annoys me more than something like Dead of Winter taking it because even if Dead of Winter is trash it's at least easy to see how "a post-apocalypse traitor game with zombies!" could blind a lot of people to its flaws and get by on theme alone, but Splendor? Splendor's theme is effectively non-existent...Dominion is a fluffier game...and gameplay wise it's the epitome of average. I can't fathom the sort of person who chooses Splendor as their game of the year being anything other than the most boring person alive.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:01
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Rutibex posted:Big Money is the default. Anyone that explains Dominion to a newbie and doesn't mention "Hey, if you just buy silver and gold you will win in X turns. If you can't figure out how to win faster than that with the cards on the table do that" is a dick. Of course "Big money + one other card" is usually a lot better than big money on its own, so this gets a newbie playing properly right away. It's not a default so much as it's a time limit, really.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:05
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Kai Tave posted:For some reason this annoys me more than something like Dead of Winter taking it because even if Dead of Winter is trash it's at least easy to see how "a post-apocalypse traitor game with zombies!" could blind a lot of people to its flaws and get by on theme alone, but Splendor? Splendor's theme is effectively non-existent...Dominion is a fluffier game...and gameplay wise it's the epitome of average. I can't fathom the sort of person who chooses Splendor as their game of the year being anything other than the most boring person alive. Why exactly do you need theme for a good game? Have you ever played abstracts? Like, criticize it for just being a one-note game mechanics wise, but it has exactly, precisely as much theme as Dominion, which is to say none whatsoever.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:05
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Splender was GotY because it had heavy chips and you could teach the ever coveted demographic Non-Gamer Friends the game in a minute.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:06
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thespaceinvader posted:It's not a default so much as it's a time limit, really. Eh, it only works as a time limit if someone is willing to say "ok, I will buy the biggest money I can this turn, unless I can buy a Province, in which case I will buy that." Like, conceptually it's a timer, but few people would be willing to actually sit down at a table with 10 cool cards that let them combo into each other or whatever and just buy money instead.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:07
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Countblanc posted:Eh, it only works as a time limit if someone is willing to say "ok, I will buy the biggest money I can this turn, unless I can buy a Province, in which case I will buy that." Like, conceptually it's a timer, but few people would be willing to actually sit down at a table with 10 cool cards that let them combo into each other or whatever and just buy money instead. ...huh that means Dominion would actually work fine solo, since you could just compete against a bigmoney bot. Interesting. You could also have a bot be a timer and if no one beats it, everyone loses archipelago style. Just make an app for it, simple enough.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:10
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Countblanc posted:Splender was GotY because it had heavy chips and you could teach the ever coveted demographic Non-Gamer Friends the game in a minute. That's really it, I enjoy Splendor, but mostly it is an easy introductory game that non gamers tend to like without being complete random nonsense like cards against humanity or munchkin.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:11
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silvergoose posted:Why exactly do you need theme for a good game? Have you ever played abstracts? No, Splendor actually has less theme than Dominion because at least in Dominion you have different cards that do different stuff which have vague thematic relationships like Remodel letting you trash stuff for other things or the Cellar letting you bury useless junk for a bit and rummage around for something more useful, meanwhile Splendor is just pushing numbers around until someone gets the most points, the end. Also while I accept the premise that theme isn't necessary for a good game, Tash Kalar would probably be somewhat less exciting if I was playing Advanced Card Number 7 instead of summoning a Titan to wreck poo poo up.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:14
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Kai Tave posted:No, Splendor actually has less theme than Dominion because at least in Dominion you have different cards that do different stuff which have vague thematic relationships like Remodel letting you trash stuff for other things or the Cellar letting you bury useless junk for a bit and rummage around for something more useful, meanwhile Splendor is just pushing numbers around until someone gets the most points, the end. How about go, chess/shogi/xiangqi, backgammon? Poker? None of these have theme at all, but are super exciting. And simpsons chess is not in any way more exciting. Would splendor have been more exciting if the mines were weapons, the factories were adventurers, and the merchants were monsters and you were purchasing weapons, hiring adventurers, killing monsters? If so, how the gently caress would that be more exciting?
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Aug 3, 2015 19:17
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Splendor is a fun game and I enjoy it.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:19
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Countblanc posted:Eh, it only works as a time limit if someone is willing to say "ok, I will buy the biggest money I can this turn, unless I can buy a Province, in which case I will buy that." Like, conceptually it's a timer, but few people would be willing to actually sit down at a table with 10 cool cards that let them combo into each other or whatever and just buy money instead. It works as a time limit if you analyse the board, realise that BM/X is the way to win, and play that. Otherwise, it's only really a conceptual time limit rather than an actual one, yeah. silvergoose posted:...huh that means Dominion would actually work fine solo, since you could just compete against a bigmoney bot. Interesting. You could also have a bot be a timer and if no one beats it, everyone loses archipelago style. Just make an app for it, simple enough. This is a clever idea, but BM is so bad on some boards that a BM bot wouldn't be a functional solo opponent. It would be relatively easy to make an app for it or make a BM bot card though.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:21
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Malt posted:Splendor is a fun game and I enjoy it. poo poo Post Protocols: Initiated
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Aug 3, 2015 19:23
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silvergoose posted:How about go, chess/shogi/xiangqi, backgammon? Poker? None of these have theme at all, but are super exciting. And simpsons chess is not in any way more exciting. Jesus Christ dude, did I touch a nerve or something, what the gently caress? My point isn't "Splendor is a bad game because it doesn't have zombie cthulhus in it," my point is that I don't get how it somehow won GotY despite not having either interesting gameplay OR being draped with a theme that would make people vote for it despite still not being a good game (see: Dead of Winter). No, Splendor would not be any more fun with Lords of Waterdeep trade dress, is that what you want me to say here? Because no poo poo.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:24
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thespaceinvader posted:It works as a time limit if you analyse the board, realise that BM/X is the way to win, and play that. Well right, it's not meant to be a good solo opponent, it's suppose to give you a time limit, and if you fail it you're awful/your chosen combo doesn't work. Hmm, I guess against certain attack cards it would lose pretty bad? I wonder if you could program the app to take that into account, or you just ignore it? Hmm.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:24
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Kai Tave posted:Jesus Christ dude, did I touch a nerve or something, what the gently caress? My point isn't "Splendor is a bad game because it doesn't have zombie cthulhus in it," my point is that I don't get how it somehow won GotY despite not having either interesting gameplay OR being draped with a theme that would make people vote for it despite still not being a good game (see: Dead of Winter). No, Splendor would not be any more fun with Lords of Waterdeep trade dress, is that what you want me to say here? Because no poo poo. No, what I'm saying is that Splendor is a perfectly fine game and perfectly fine games deserve GotY way more than shite like dead of winter.  What else came out, anyway, that it was competing with?
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Aug 3, 2015 19:26
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I think component quality is important in a board game, theme not as much. It would take a lot to convince me to play print-and-play Go where the board was drawn on a piece of cardboard in crayon and the stones were shredded bits of black or white paper. Similarly, theme (or perhaps "window dressing" if we don't care about thematic conveyance through mechanics) doesn't necessarily need to be exciting to be cool or good - Splendor's art and theme of jewel trading is actually cool as gently caress, and so is Suburbia's real estate and Millennium Blade's TCG emulation and Nevermore's weird birds.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:26
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silvergoose posted:Well right, it's not meant to be a good solo opponent, it's suppose to give you a time limit, and if you fail it you're awful/your chosen combo doesn't work. Hmm, I guess against certain attack cards it would lose pretty bad? I wonder if you could program the app to take that into account, or you just ignore it? Hmm. Yeah, attack cards are a particular problem with BM/X play. Attack cards slow down BM/X WAY more than most other common strategies.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:36
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My win ratio in Androminion was worst against the AI that basically amounted to a Big Money bot.
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Aug 3, 2015 19:36
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silvergoose posted:...huh that means Dominion would actually work fine solo, since you could just compete against a bigmoney bot. Interesting. You could also have a bot be a timer and if no one beats it, everyone loses archipelago style. Just make an app for it, simple enough. It does work fine solo, and someone has made a Big Money bot to play against (it's a bit more intelligent than Big Money if you want it to be): Dominion.net http://dominion.technowall.net/ Rutibex fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Aug 3, 2015 |
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Aug 3, 2015 19:56
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silvergoose posted:What else came out, anyway, that it was competing with? Splendor came out in 2014, so here is a list of games, in no particular order, that are better than Splendor and were also published in 2014 (according to BGG): Imperial Assault Roll for the Galaxy Castles of Mad King Ludwig Legendary Encounters: Aliens Sheriff of Nottingham One Night Ultimate Werewolf King of New York La Granja Fire in the Lake Warhammer 40k: Conquest The Battle of Five Armies Cthulhu Wars Red 7 Lagoon Sellswords Lost Legacy: Starship & Flying Garden There are probably more, but even in the same "weight" category as Splendor, there's Castles, Sheriff, ONUW, King of New York and Red 7, plus or minus weight categories there.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:01
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Honestly? Yeah I'd probably put splendor at the top, then, I like castles and roll well enough, but for a general goty splendor was really good for playing with people of all gaming stripes, was super quick to teach, and I don't mind lack of theme. gently caress every form of werewolf I don't even know why you'd put that in consideration. Yes, I hate fun, what's your point?
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Aug 3, 2015 20:06
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Caylus came today!  ...is CoolStuffInc's packaging usually this ridiculous/wasteful? I could probably have fit five additional copies of the game in there. Aerox fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Aug 3, 2015 |
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Aug 3, 2015 20:07
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I just ordered Baseball Highlights 2045 from them and it was also packaged in a box 3x its size, stuffed to the gills with peanuts.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:09
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Aerox posted:...is CoolStuffInc's packaging usually this ridiculous/wasteful? I could probably have fit five additional copies of the game in there. Congrats on your Caylus, I should really get a copy.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:13
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Aerox posted:...is CoolStuffInc's packaging usually this ridiculous/wasteful? I could probably have fit five additional copies of the game in there. Gotta use enough cardboard and plastic to make sure your cardboard and plastic is safely shipped.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:13
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silvergoose posted:Honestly? Yeah I'd probably put splendor at the top, then, I like castles and roll well enough, but for a general goty splendor was really good for playing with people of all gaming stripes, was super quick to teach, and I don't mind lack of theme. To echo Countblanc's point, I think Linko would be maybe as popular as Splendor if it didn't look like furry fan fic. If it had full color art of like M:tG landscapes with giant helvetica text and some glass beads or some poo poo it would be the better Splendor and cost like twice as much, IMO. I don't get why, if your game is just a deck of cards, you don't get some bad rear end art on that thing. You need to commission what, like 10 pieces of art maybe? I think Roll for the Galaxy would have taken it if it were released earlier in 2014. It was released in like the last week of December. Or EmDo:Escalation if they had just made that the drat game
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Aug 3, 2015 20:14
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Bobby The Rookie posted:Yeah, I think every package I've gotten from CSI has had an excess amount of packing peanuts. If I'm gonna be ordering $40-60+ board games via post I'd rather have this than what seemed to happen every time I ordered stuff off of Amazon where it showed up looking like someone had kicked the box down every flight of stairs they could.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:18
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Speaking of buying games because they're fun, I lol'ed at this:
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Aug 3, 2015 20:20
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GrandpaPants posted:Splendor came out in 2014, so here is a list of games, in no particular order, that are better than Splendor and were also published in 2014 (according to BGG): You missed Tragedy Looper, GOTY 2014 (Yes, I'm aware that Sangeki Looper came out in 2011 and Sangeki Looper X came out in 2013 and Tragedy Looper is a localization of Sangeki Looper X, but there were notable changes and it exploded in popularity once TL came out)
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Aug 3, 2015 20:20
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medchem posted:Speaking of buying games because they're fun, I lol'ed at this: For reals, I'm pretty hype on this game, even though I know it will be like everything else where I'll binge on this amateur flicking stuff only to end up wishing I just spent the money on crokinole at the beginning
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Aug 3, 2015 20:21
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Another thing re: Splendor, I know there are probably people that appreciate both that and Dominion, and that's reasonable, but as I browse BGG I've noticed a lot of the new wave of gamers have completely overlooked Dominion and something like Splendor might be their first raw engine builder game. Dominion, while having a high rating on BGG, seems to be poo poo on constantly in favor of Star Realms and whatever on places like BGG and reddit. It's surprising how many people who are gobbling up all the top games on BGG haven't been exposed to Dominion, or how infrequently it's recommended at places like BGG or reddit.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:24
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Even if both Splendor and Dominion have zero theme Dominion is still a vastly better game, so for GotY to go to "Like Dominion but not as good, but it has heavy poker chips!" strikes is as a weird decision. Especially when 2014 wasn't exactly starved for decent games to choose from.
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Aug 3, 2015 20:27
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