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I really hope they fix the overseas core for cheaper thing, it's one of the dumbest exploits. Surely it would be pretty easy to just flag any provinces cored with the discount as capped at 75% autonomy and require you to spend admin points equal to the amount saved in order to remove the cap? I guess it might be difficult to show properly on the UI though.
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Aug 6, 2015 17:35
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PittTheElder posted:Well the objective here is just to get provinces fast, since 1001 provinces is a lot of provinces. I typically don't take Expansion or Exploration as Russia, but if you're going for 'conquer all of Asia', then you want those two colonists. You take Exploration to sprint across Siberia and be exploring and colonizing in the Pacific ~1550. If you get lucky you can snag South Africa, but you get there early enough to put up a couple colonial nations in the western Americas (Mexico, California, Alaska you can funnel home) and be the dominant colonizer in the Pacific and SE Asia. All this comes at the cost of a decent chunk of your income, which is probably the biggest limiting factor for Muscovy/Russia early on, so you sacrifice some of your conquest expansion for the Pacific adventure. Expansion I'd only take the first idea (colonist) or fill it out entirely only for the CB, as Russia. The one colonist you get from NIs plus maybe one from Expansion is just fine for filling out Siberia and snagging a few choice ports in the Pacific.
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Aug 6, 2015 17:44
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Back To 99 posted:If i vassalize a bunch of electors will they all vote for me, or will the combined negative points for having vassal electors make it pointless? These assholes won't vote for the right superpower voluntarily so i'm trying the hard way. the penalty for having an elector as a vassal only applies to independent electors. That being said, a vassal elector doesnt have to vote for you. But between the bonus you get for being their overlord, and the +200 relations you can get, and the royal marriages you can get if they are a monarchy it ends up being very easy to secure their votes. Basically if you get 3 vassal electors and keep their opinion high you will become/stay emperor
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Aug 6, 2015 17:44
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You won't get crap for IA, though, so you'll want to release them after becoming Emperor. You can join the HRE then and it isn't too hard to stay Emperor without the penalty for not being a member.
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Aug 6, 2015 18:46
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RabidWeasel posted:I really hope they fix the overseas core for cheaper thing, it's one of the dumbest exploits. Surely it would be pretty easy to just flag any provinces cored with the discount as capped at 75% autonomy and require you to spend admin points equal to the amount saved in order to remove the cap? I guess it might be difficult to show properly on the UI though. At least they should fix autonomy jumping to 0 on connection. 420 Gank Mid posted:the penalty for having an elector as a vassal only applies to independent electors. A related Emperor question: What happens to your Government rank if you get elected/ join the HRE? Can you keep a higher rank than would usually be allowed?
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Aug 6, 2015 19:20
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genericnick posted:At least they should fix autonomy jumping to 0 on connection. It's also a Ming buff because the fake autonomy floor means that even if Ming peasants or particularists enforce their demands the autonomy won't actually go over 50%. Autonomy boosts from events and rebels are applied to the real autonomy, not the autonomy floor.
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Aug 6, 2015 19:23
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genericnick posted:A related Emperor question: What happens to your Government rank if you get elected/ join the HRE? Can you keep a higher rank than would usually be allowed? If you join the empire you get downgraded to Duchy, if you just stay emperor from outside the empire you keep whatever rank you had. But if you revoke the privilegia as non-HRE member emperor the vassal liberty desire will be calculated on their total strength, making them all rebellious.
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Aug 6, 2015 19:32
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Pyromancer posted:If you join the empire you get downgraded to Duchy, if you just stay emperor from outside the empire you keep whatever rank you had. Yeah, if you are an HRE member you are stuck at Duchy level unless you are an elector. This leads to Austria being stuck as a Duchy for much of the game 
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Aug 6, 2015 19:42
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aeglus posted:You really shouldn't have taken it in the first place if you don't want more than Siberia. Russia's free colonist is more than enough to for that. There's a very big difference between same continent colonies and overseas colonies. Going exploration until you finish Siberia and dropping the idea group is just fine. 1 colonist at +55/yr is glacial. If you want access to the east coast of China by 1600 and the Siberian provinces to be semi useful during the playthrough, the extra colonists matter.
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Aug 6, 2015 19:46
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Yeah going Exploration second as Russia makes a huge difference. Only having 1 colonist, and only getting him once you have 15 idea bonuses, is incredibly slow and getting one province every couple of years doesn't do much. Swallowing up Siberia ASAP is awesome specifically because it's this nice influx of money/manpower at a time when you probably don't want to have to grind down the Poland-Lithuania monster in the West, have conquered enough of the Crimean region to have to deal with the Ottomans if you want to go any further, and are starting to press up against a giant Timurids/Persia/QQ blob that blocks you off from Asia. Expanding into Siberia lets your income keep rising, which in turn lets you keep building armies which then lets you take advantage of any opportunities that arise from things like a messy Poland-Lithuania/Austria-Hungary war. If you can afford it, it's almost always better to turtle up and build up your income in a peaceful/diplomatic way because the increase in army size, manpower, and money will make your future wars go significantly smoother and make up for the fact that you're spending a couple of decades doing "nothing". That's not just a Russia thing but goes for pretty much any nation that can colonize a significant chunk of land as well. Speaking of which, my Spain game's already basically on auto-pilot and it's only ~1600. Beating up England early on and destroying their navy has been hilariously effective. They're basically like a colonizing vassal for me now because they keep trying to colonize in the New World without actually having the resources to defend their colonies. So every 15 years as soon as our truce is up I just declare war on them again, take their colonies, then make them give me all their money. Rinse and repeat 15 years later. England's seriously given me like two dozen colonies at this point, all taken with minimal effort since I can just blockade the entire island for like 15% warscore and take the 3-4 castles they have left to get enough to grab their colonies from them. Gonna beat up on France for another 50 years or so and then I can focus on vassalizing the HRE electors I need and getting elected as emperor for the achievement.
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Aug 6, 2015 20:27
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VDay posted:Speaking of which, my Spain game's already basically on auto-pilot and it's only ~1600. Beating up England early on and destroying their navy has been hilariously effective. They're basically like a colonizing vassal for me now because they keep trying to colonize in the New World without actually having the resources to defend their colonies. So every 15 years as soon as our truce is up I just declare war on them again, take their colonies, then make them give me all their money. Rinse and repeat 15 years later. England's seriously given me like two dozen colonies at this point, all taken with minimal effort since I can just blockade the entire island for like 15% warscore and take the 3-4 castles they have left to get enough to grab their colonies from them. Yeah I was surprised how easy it is to completely monopolize the New World if you vassalize Portugal right away. I didn't figure it was all that feasible with all the new provinces added through the various patches. Here's my 1590 Spain game. Made Portugal my March, shitlord 0/0/0 heir became ruler then miraculously I got the Isabella event like two years later and had a string of decent rulers, enough I decided to eat most of Morocco to burn Admin points. Beat up France a few times and have managed to take all their coastline, Provence is a vassal and I'm going to get the rest of their cores off the Papal State and move my trade port to Genoa soon. England is pretty much a pinata I whack every decade or so and take the lone colony or two they try to establish. Meanwhile I have almost all of the eastern coastline of the Americas colonized and blocked off, should have a pretty complete overseas monopoly and eaten most of the English Channel by ~1650. Brotugal has been dutifully colonizing Africa and is super loyal so I'll just let them keep at it. I'll grab the Imperio Espanol and Spain is the Emperor achievements but this game is already pretty boring   see if you can spot the single lonely non-Iberian colony Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Aug 6, 2015 |
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Aug 6, 2015 21:12
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What's a interesting small nation to play in the HRE?
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Aug 6, 2015 21:56
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genericnick posted:At least they should fix autonomy jumping to 0 on connection. Any HRE member state that is not the Emperor is forced into having a 'Duchy' government rank, I don't know if there are exceptions for tags meant for special tags like Prussia, but in general any nation joining becomes a Duchy StashAugustine posted:What's a interesting small nation to play in the HRE? Genoa, Ulm, Brandenburg, The Hanseatic League. Genoa is one of my favorites because they get crazy missions that give them CB's across the world just because. They have pretty crap NI's but you can set up a trade empire that'll have you rolling in cash and you can just set up a March for better troops. Brandenburg starts out as a smaller middle power in the HRE but you are very well positioned to expand outside of the HRE (and a little bit inside maybe) this start isn't nearly as punishing to players new to HRE mechanics as a lot of others. Also you're an elector so thats 1/7 votes for empire already. And when you get big you will have the most terrifying doomstacks possible (Except maybe Sweden) The Hansa are neat because once you help liberate Sweden, Denmark is a rotting corpse for you to pick at and digest. You can also usually grab Danzig and then you're making so much cash you can basically do whatever. And Ulm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSlGdnbIUw8 420 Gank Mid fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Aug 6, 2015 |
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Aug 6, 2015 21:58
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StashAugustine posted:What's a interesting small nation to play in the HRE? Most of the Bishoprics are small and interesting, take your pick. I like Magdeburg, they can form Prussia (and keep their awesome Theocracy government)
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Aug 6, 2015 22:06
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If you haven't played it before the Teutonic Order is really fun and gets super powerful. I think they don't leave the HRE anymore after forming Prussia either if I remember the patch notes correctly. Hah, that's loving great.
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Aug 6, 2015 22:12
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StashAugustine posted:What's a interesting small nation to play in the HRE? Saxony or Hesse. If things start getting hard as Saxony you can always fall back and form Prussia then steamroll the rest of the game.
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Aug 6, 2015 22:12
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So i'm trucking along in my first game. Started as castille, now spain and alternating between crushing the heathen to the south and colonising the new world. I've colonised enough to get two colonial nations but I've run into an issue. Is there any way to build manufactuories in colonial nations? Because all these colonies have these great trade goods but I can't exploit any of them. It's seems pretty weird since surely that's one of the kmain reasons to have a colony. Am I just being stupid?
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Aug 6, 2015 22:36
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UrbicaMortis posted:So i'm trucking along in my first game. Started as castille, now spain and alternating between crushing the heathen to the south and colonising the new world. I've colonised enough to get two colonial nations but I've run into an issue. Colonizing is a looooong term investment. It's a good idea to subsidize your colonies with at least 2-3g per month for the first few decades, the more the better. This will help them build up and they'll even colonize on their own (albeit slowly). There isn't any way to build manufactories, no. You just have to sort of baby them and help them expand and feed them cash, you get half their trade power and a free merchant for every colony with 10+ provinces so you can funnel most of their trade home. Edit: to clarify, I mean overseas colonization. Building up colonial nations and trade companies is an extremely long-term investment, same-continent colonization (like Russia expanding through Siberia) has a much more immediate benefit and better payoff since you get all the income and manpower immediately. Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Aug 6, 2015 |
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Aug 6, 2015 22:40
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Also colonies provide a ton of income to you through trade, which isn't always immediately apparent. As Castile/Spain you want to prioritize getting as much territory in the Caribbean and Ivory Coast as you can. That'll let you funnel all the South American trade into Sevilla (or later Genoa once you inherit Aragon/Naples and maybe steal some territory from France or Provence), which then frees you up to just take colonies from the other colonial nations if they try to colonize anywhere near you. Like Pellisworth said it's just not as big of an immediate boost as taking territory directly, but give it some time and your CNs will be making more money for you than you know what to do with. Also your rate of colonization will improve dramatically as you get more ideas/policies/colonists/colonial nations. I have 5 colonists right now as Spain, but can actually colonize 9 provinces at once because my income is big enough to support it. Meanwhile I have like 12 merchants from all my CNs and Trade Companies which means that literally all trade in the western hemisphere is being funneled into Genoa, where I get 95% of it. Colonizing is one of those things that starts off slow but just snowballs out of control if you focus on it.
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Aug 6, 2015 22:54
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Pellisworth posted:Yeah, if you are an HRE member you are stuck at Duchy level unless you are an elector. This leads to Austria being stuck as a Duchy for much of the game
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Aug 6, 2015 23:15
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Cool, thanks for the info.
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Aug 6, 2015 23:25
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VDay posted:I don't think this was actually a mistake. Those Orthodox/Byelorussian provinces Lithuania has look juicy, but Poland-Lithuania/Commonwealth are a huuuuuuuuuge pain in the rear end to fight, doubly so in the early game. Not only are they strong in terms of army strength, but they have like a dozen+ forts between the two of them and cover a giant wide area which means you're never able to siege more than one or two forts at a time if you don't want to risk having one of your armies picked off. I would actually suggest you do the exact opposite of picking on them and instead expand East as quickly as you can, only picking fights against targets of opportunity like a weakened Kazan/Nogai/Golden Horde/Uzbek. The faster you expand into Siberia the faster you'll get bigger than any of your neighbors and the easier time you'll subsequently have crushing them all. Which leads me to... To you and everyone else suggesting Exploration first, why? It's going over my head. Between that and getting expansion as my fifth idea, I easily colonized Siberia all the way to the ocean, and some of the Spice Islands too.
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Aug 6, 2015 23:47
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Node posted:To you and everyone else suggesting Exploration first, why? It's going over my head. Between that and getting expansion as my fifth idea, I easily colonized Siberia all the way to the ocean, and some of the Spice Islands too. Can't colonize what you can't see, and you need explorers for that
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Aug 6, 2015 23:49
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Node posted:To you and everyone else suggesting Exploration first, why? It's going over my head. Between that and getting expansion as my fifth idea, I easily colonized Siberia all the way to the ocean, and some of the Spice Islands too. There's a post on this page explaining my reasoning for Exploration. Simply put I think it gives a significant advantage to your early game and lets you snowball easier/harder in the mid-game compared to not taking it or taking Expansion instead and expanding way slower. Yes you can expand just fine without it and you'll always get most of those territories because you don't have to compete with anyone for them, but Exploration still lets you get them super quickly. Also Exploration should be second, not first. You need to deal with Sunni lands first and need to swallow up Perm anyway before starting to colonize. Prop Wash posted:Can't colonize what you can't see, and you need explorers for that There are some discovered uncolonized lands next to Russia (well, technically Perm) that they can colonize, which will be discovered at some point after they turn into provinces. Plus Russia's colonist NI also makes it so territories are discovered as soon as you colonize, which lets them expand into Siberia without having to take Expansion or Exploration if you really want to. Russia pretty much gets free reign of Siberia/northern Asia.
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Aug 6, 2015 23:54
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VDay posted:There's a post on this page explaining my reasoning for Exploration. Simply put I think it gives a significant advantage to your early game and lets you snowball easier/harder in the mid-game compared to not taking it or taking Expansion instead and expanding way slower. Also Exploration should be second, not first. You need to deal with Sunni lands first and need to swallow up Perm anyway before starting to colonize. You can absolutely do Exploration -> Religious, it makes very little difference. You won't have the admin points to get the 4th idea in Religious if you are keeping up on admin tech until pretty late. You can however get the first colonist rolling on Exploration asap. When you have your second idea group opened at admin 10 is a natural 'good point' to put points into admin. Exploration -> Religious goes very smoothly if you annex perm in 1454 and start colonizing Siberia right away. I fight Novgorod and Ryazan early, and a few Muslim provinces from Golden Horde is not going to cause any real issues at all.
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Aug 6, 2015 23:58
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Node posted:To you and everyone else suggesting Exploration first, why? It's going over my head. Between that and getting expansion as my fifth idea, I easily colonized Siberia all the way to the ocean, and some of the Spice Islands too. The basic rationale for why I take exploration second as Muscowy is that it gives me broader borders with countries much weaker than me, of a different religion, letting me war more often without getting coalitions formed. The sooner you reach asia, the sooner you can start taking territory there. As each religion and, to a lesser degree, culture, don't really care about you going to war against people of other denominations, it lets you grow much faster at less risk. If you conquer the sunni hordes too fast, you risk ending up with Ottomans++ in a coalition against you which will gently caress your expansion right quick. The same is also true if you go through Lithuania too fast. Once you hit the pacific with your colonists, you can either colonize your way back west through the islands in Asia, or, if you manage to vassalize Norway to get Iceland, you can colonize North America and shuttle trade to the North Sea.
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Aug 7, 2015 00:07
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Node posted:To you and everyone else suggesting Exploration first, why? It's going over my head. Between that and getting expansion as my fifth idea, I easily colonized Siberia all the way to the ocean, and some of the Spice Islands too. Exploration is the best first choice for literally anyone who starts close enough to colonizable provinces to get started quickly I think. Every month that passes when you aren't colonizing is a month of colonial growth you lose and there are a lot of advantages to having an empire on which the sun never sets, from trade control to additional theaters of war to expand into if your AE situation at home is dangerous.
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Aug 7, 2015 00:07
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Rakthar posted:You can absolutely do Exploration -> Religious, it makes very little difference. You won't have the admin points to get the 4th idea in Religious if you are keeping up on admin tech until pretty late. You can however get the first colonist rolling on Exploration asap. Yeah fair enough, I just really like taking a bunch of Sunni lands early to prevent them from going to Crimea or Timurids and feeding them to Perm to convert for me. That gives a nice early boost and I'm ok with waiting an extra couple of years to annex Perm to have them convert my provinces earlier than I would be able to and the timing on colonization works out nicely in my experience. The nice thing about Russia is that it's super versatile so at a certain point it's just about min/maxing ideas to fit your own style and how you like to open the game.
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Aug 7, 2015 00:08
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Rakthar posted:You can absolutely do Exploration -> Religious, it makes very little difference. You won't have the admin points to get the 4th idea in Religious if you are keeping up on admin tech until pretty late. You can however get the first colonist rolling on Exploration asap. Do you really need to annex Perm right away? With Exploration I would think you could walk across Perm and start colonizing right away once you found the province. That would let you pay the overseas coring costs, right?
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Aug 7, 2015 00:12
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VDay posted:Yeah fair enough, I just really like taking a bunch of Sunni lands early to prevent them from going to Crimea or Timurids and feeding them to Perm to convert for me. That gives a nice early boost and I'm ok with waiting an extra couple of years to annex Perm to have them convert my provinces earlier than I would be able to and the timing on colonization works out nicely in my experience. Yep I feel that's a valid opener as well. Either you go Religious -> Hordes -> Exploration, or you can go Exploration -> Orthodox targets -> Religious -> Hordes. I enjoy hitting the hordes around Miltech 5 which also works out timing wise with the order I use. My start also involves doing a back to back Humiliate of both Novgorod and Golden Horde while to get 100 PP within the first 10 yrs, I've been really happy with the way that plays out. You're right, Muscovy is in a fun crossroads and you can really go a variety of ways with it. Heavy towards Turkey, heavy towards India, heavy towards China, heavy on Colonization, bulldoze your way into Europe - lots of options.
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Aug 7, 2015 00:14
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LLSix posted:Do you really need to annex Perm right away? With Exploration I would think you could walk across Perm and start colonizing right away once you found the province. That would let you pay the overseas coring costs, right? You need a bordering core or colonial nation province to colonize an inland province.
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Aug 7, 2015 00:16
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LLSix posted:Do you really need to annex Perm right away? With Exploration I would think you could walk across Perm and start colonizing right away once you found the province. That would let you pay the overseas coring costs, right? I know you can do stuff like this but the coring costs are trivial - 3-5 admin points and at the start you may be getting a colony every 10-20 years. The reason I annex Perm is that I need to diploannex two and possibly three vassals right off the bat, or I run into vassal issues. So I annex Perm and either Pskov or Yaroslav first, which gives me the diplo relations to vassalize Ryazan and add Golden horde as a vassal later, and works nicely with the Siberia stuff too. Generally I find I need to grab at least one vassal (Ryazan is generally what I choose) and sometime after, and it can be useful to grab one ally like Poland or Sweden depending on circumstance. So getting rid of Perm seems logical to me for these reasons. [edit]And apparently you have to, anyway 
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Aug 7, 2015 00:17
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VDay posted:
Oh I know you can get northern Asia without Exploration, I was just referring to moving south into the Pacific because he specifically mentioned the Spice Islands. You need explorers for those, unless you wait for the rest of Europe to get there first.
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Aug 7, 2015 01:45
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Prop Wash posted:What worked for me was to abuse the colony mechanic. I started out taking Religious/Exploration/Defensive/Administrative/Offensive/Expansion/Quantity, so similar to yours, except I took Exploration early on to start on the Siberia train. Why exploration instead of expansion when expansion has that nice policy set? Well, I was first into the Pacific, so I needed to explore to keep colonizing down south in the Indonesian region. I took Expansion later but it turned out to not be a great idea because by then I was mostly done colonizing. How do you core Indian provinces you take like this? I snagged a few of Bengal's coastal provinces but even though I have some cored islands over in Indonesia that should be maybe a few hundred range away, the game is telling me provinces on the east coast of India are 99999 away from my closest port. e: Nevermind, this fixed itself on the next monthly tick. Bold Robot fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 03:21
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UrbicaMortis posted:So i'm trucking along in my first game. Started as castille, now spain and alternating between crushing the heathen to the south and colonising the new world. I've colonised enough to get two colonial nations but I've run into an issue. If by "heathen to the south" you mean North Africa, don't. North Africa has a penalty to coring costs, so it's very expensive to conquer and not really worth it. West Africa, like the Jolof/Mali area, is a different story though.
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Aug 7, 2015 05:14
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Just finished my Russia game. Focused on the Silk Road achievement, but I managed to get a million mans in 1818, plus a bunch of other ones I hadn't picked up yet like full house and blackjack etc etc. I really messed up my ideas, but I guess things worked out. I was hoping for 1001 provinces, and I think I would have gotten that if I didn't prioritize getting silk. I allied Poland at the start and they got to Danzig in record time, so I ended up going through the HRE via Sjeeland/Holstein and getting Prague to westernize fairly early. Bohemia was the emperor so I was able to just beat them down with the help of Poland-Lithuania. Not a lot of crazy things happened, though a bunch of weak emperor's turned the HRE into blob city. England didn't go protestant which I haven't seen for a while. Eventually Poland formed the Commonwealth and ate half of the Ottomans, including a silk province I needed, so I had to draw a line in the sand and eventually eat eastern Poland. Austria inherited Hungary so with mega Austria and France I was pretty unstoppable. The one thing I'll say about the strategy of getting colonial nations is that it can be a big distraction from conquering the world. Colonial Australia dragged me into 4-5 wars with Spain/Portugal that kind of hampered me for years and years. I know you guys love pretty borders, so here you go: This is in the midst of snaking all the silk provinces.  Behold the borders, and despair. This is after getting Blackjack so everything is hosed.  Europe closeup.  edit: Ming was probably the hardest thing. They had a bigger army than me and kept tech parity, so I declared war when I was on mil-tech 29 and got 30 in the middle of the war and upgraded my men after a 400,000 man battle when ming was retreating. After that I stacked them again and again. Tsyni fucked around with this message at 05:39 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 05:34
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 You know, might be good if some of these options had some alternative penalties for folks who don't have the relevant DLC.
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Aug 7, 2015 05:41
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Ofaloaf posted:
Maybe Lowtax and Paradox Interactive can subsidize a special poors version of this thread in the poors forum.
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Aug 7, 2015 05:44
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My latest hands-off game yielded some pretty interesting results.
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Aug 7, 2015 07:09
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A Buttery Pastry posted:My latest hands-off game yielded some pretty interesting results. edit: Is that the Livonian Order out in Russia? And Moldavia got Sinope?
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Aug 7, 2015 07:12
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