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Sad King Billy
Jan 27, 2006

Thats three of ours innit...to one of yours. You know mate I really think we ought to even up the average!

zedprime posted:

I don't think we've heard anything besides "1000 star systems" which I guess would be the default scale, although with support for custom/modded/determinate maps the scale should be at least modifiable down, if not up to some level that will cook your computer.

I'd be happy with 1000, though I would push my computer as far as it could go with galaxy generation.

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Ofaloaf
Feb 15, 2013

Baronjutter posted:

That doesn't look like Berlin at all!
Yeah, there's a working airport in that screenshot!

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007

yospos

Baronjutter posted:

I check the thread hoping for some news on space game and instead I'm not sure I have the ability to feel human anymore :(
Paradox release the phenotype list so we know what species we really feel like after being dehumanized by sunset invasions and/or holocaust debates.

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


Actually speaking of those portraits, are there ones for generic generals too for the nations you haven't hand-drawn specific ones for?

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Drone posted:

Actually speaking of those portraits, are there ones for generic generals too for the nations you haven't hand-drawn specific ones for?

I think in one of the diaries they said there was a generic portrait. Probably a man in shadow or something.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
Nah, there's a few generics with actual faces n stuff, no shadows.

Groogy
Jun 12, 2014

Tanks are kinda wasted on invading the USSR

Darkrenown posted:

Nah, there's a few generics with actual faces n stuff, no shadows.

So vampires?

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


I'm reminded of that one April Fools Day (I think it was?) prank in CK2 where someone showed a culture mapmode shot of Europe and 80% of it was covered with a giant word: SKELETONS

In short, please make a lich nation DLC.

Tomn
Aug 23, 2007

And the angel said unto him
"Stop hitting yourself. Stop hitting yourself."
But lo he could not. For the angel was hitting him with his own hands

Sad King Billy posted:

I want a huge galaxy, with a slow initial exploration phase

Galaxy size aside, everything Paradox has released on Stellaris so far suggests that they think exploration is an important thing to focus on even after you get into the empire-jostling phase, so that should be good news for you.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Drone posted:

I'm reminded of that one April Fools Day (I think it was?) prank in CK2 where someone showed a culture mapmode shot of Europe and 80% of it was covered with a giant word: SKELETONS

In short, please make a lich nation DLC.

It was some kind of "wizards do terrible things!" mod IIRC.

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

Darkrenown posted:

Nah, there's a few generics with actual faces n stuff, no shadows.

But what will Jamaica do without political juggernaut Red Shadow :ohdear:

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Latest dev diary looks pretty cool, I like the sound of all the combat width vs flanking and support/tactics stuff. Though support companies being so important, I hope there's an easy way to visually see where they are and organize them, from the screenshots I can't even tell where the recon unit is at all (I'm assuming that's just a UI todo). Like if you draw out your fronts, does the AI try to balance out where supports are or what?

podcat
Jun 21, 2012

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

Latest dev diary looks pretty cool, I like the sound of all the combat width vs flanking and support/tactics stuff. Though support companies being so important, I hope there's an easy way to visually see where they are and organize them, from the screenshots I can't even tell where the recon unit is at all (I'm assuming that's just a UI todo). Like if you draw out your fronts, does the AI try to balance out where supports are or what?

Support is part of a divisions template. Each of those units on the screen and in combat is a Division and the name and icon will tell you what template. Then there is another screen where you can dig into the contents of the actual templates and design them. So like, decide how much artillery or if you should have recon or engineers in your divisions and all units using that template will begin changing with the changes you have done. Its a lot easier to explain when I can say "its kinda like ship designing in eve online" but that means you have to have played that ;)

here is a diary on it: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/hearts-of-iron-iv-dev-diary-6-division-design.783017/ although a bunch of details has changed since then.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Gotcha, I hadn't seen that dev diary. So, is the idea that as you expand your division template, the size of that division grows larger and it supports more variety of support and unit types? So like, you could have one type of division that is very small and cheap and another that is very large and expensive?

If that's the case, is there any advantage to smaller divisions? Other than they can spread out across the map more I guess? Or am I misunderstanding how they work?


The idea sounds a lot like ~ship design~ in a 4x game, except kind of fun and not annoying.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
Smaller divisions are normally cheaper (not always though, depends what you put in them), you can cover more provinces, and you can fit more into combat. Oh, and they're easier to transport. There's no inherent benefit to being small, but if you have a long front or many places needing garrisoned they can be handy.

You can certainly have a small and a large division type, in fact in theory you can have as many division templates as you feel like designing, although in practice your Army XP will limit the number you can practically use. I expect players will mostly have a cheap garrison template, a larger "frontline" template that they continually upgrade, and a number of specialised templates depending on their situation, e,g armour, mechanized, paratrooper etc.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Do you ever find that it's hard to tell the relative strength of a stack because of divisions being so variable in their composition like that? Like when I look at the screenshots I could see that maybe this is a 2 stack and this is a 4 stack, but what if the divisions making up the 4 stacks are like, half the size of the ones in the 2 stack and they have lovely tanks? I suppose as long as the tooltips are good it wouldn't be a problem, but I almost feel like I would like to see stuff like total Manpower or Hard/Soft attack values on the map screen instead of division count.

I don't have a ton of experience with HoI in general though so maybe this is all stuff that will be very obvious once I actually get to play the game. :)

Hryme
Nov 4, 2009
http://www.spacegamejunkie.com/featured/stellaris-fan-qa-strong-influences-directions/


Short Q&A Brian Rubin had with Henrik Fåhraeus about Stellaris that I found linked on Quarter to Three forums.

Samog
Dec 13, 2006
At least I'm not an 07.

podcat posted:

I think I forgot where I was posting :D

Obvisouly germany is too touchy for stuff like this and none of it is particularly fun from a gameplay standpoint.

so it's just gonna be russia, right

Baronjutter
Dec 31, 2007

"Tiny Trains"

It sounds like when they were putting together Stellaris they had two ideas: generic 4X or more of an emperor of the fading suns / CK2 in space sort of deal with only humans. I'm sure they can pull of a good generic 4X but man oh man would I love to see a Paradox grand strategy CK2 in space sort of thing. Who knows maybe if it does well it could be an expansion sort of thing, depending on how suitable the base game is.

Zohar
Jul 14, 2013

Good kitty

Hryme posted:

http://www.spacegamejunkie.com/featured/stellaris-fan-qa-strong-influences-directions/

Short Q&A Brian Rubin had with Henrik Fåhraeus about Stellaris that I found linked on Quarter to Three forums.

quote:

It is extremely unlikely that you will suffer some kind of catastrophic setback in the early stages of the game.
:mrgw:

Decrepus
May 21, 2008

In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.


Germany has gone with Jews Out has happened to us.

Top Hats Monthly
Jun 22, 2011


People are people so why should it be, that you and I should get along so awfully blink blink recall STOP IT YOU POSH LITTLE SHIT
Did I open up the paradox forums, what the gently caress did I just read last page

Enjoy
Apr 18, 2009

Top Hats Monthly posted:

Did I open up the paradox forums, what the gently caress did I just read last page

A pretty reasonable criticism of a design choice? The Paradox forums are nothing like this

Fidel Cuckstro
Jul 2, 2007

The literal "Hitler was right" forums of SA is gonna tell you about how to approach the tragedies of WW2.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Hryme posted:

http://www.spacegamejunkie.com/featured/stellaris-fan-qa-strong-influences-directions/


Short Q&A Brian Rubin had with Henrik Fåhraeus about Stellaris that I found linked on Quarter to Three forums.
Thanks for posting this.

I've got to be honest when I say that I am really not feeling that excited for the game. It has not shown me anything that really gets me excited yet.

Gay Horney
Feb 10, 2013

by Reene

Enjoy posted:

A pretty reasonable criticism of a design choice? The Paradox forums are nothing like this

right I can't figure out why people are being like "ugh this thread got bad" or whatever the discussion has been completely reasonable except for like one dude straw manning.


I think pretending the Holocaust didn't happen in your ww2 game is fine because there aren't any interesting choices to be made whereas with the purges and other stuff that directly affects the military you have interesting game play possibilities and this is a video game so that should come first.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Bort Bortles posted:

Thanks for posting this.

I've got to be honest when I say that I am really not feeling that excited for the game. It has not shown me anything that really gets me excited yet.

I'm definitely reserving judgement until we see more, but I'm excited by

1.) Randomized aliens
2.) Stated focus on emergent storytelling
3.) Injecting actual diplomacy/CBs/Peace negotiations on top of the 4x formula
4.) A host of late game mega disasters

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
But the allocation of resources towards the Holocaust did directly affect the military. That's roughly half the point. The other half is that not only are Stalin's Purges being represented in game as something you can choose to do or not do because of its impact towards the military, but that it is going to be framed in such a way that the player can view it as potentially beneficial to do (because that's how Stalin viewed it as, at the time).

What people have been trying to say is that the juxtaposition looks bad if applied the same way. Not that the Holocaust should be represented in HOI, but that the implications are a bit heavy as far as encouraging the player to take the same decisions for the purpose of historical handrails (not necessarily railroads).

I mean, okay, let's try something else: would the US get an event asking the player if they want to begin interring Japanese-Americans? Further, if the instinct of the player would be to say no because of the morality of such a choice, would the event involve bonuses for saying yes as an encouragement to say yes, reflecting upon the views at the time that it was a necessity?

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Fintilgin posted:

I'm definitely reserving judgement until we see more, but I'm excited by

1.) Randomized aliens
2.) Stated focus on emergent storytelling
3.) Injecting actual diplomacy/CBs/Peace negotiations on top of the 4x formula
4.) A host of late game mega disasters
Yeah I am by no means decrying it; I definitely need to learn more before I can make any real decision.
I like all of those things that you pointed out, however I am worried about some of the gritty details
1.)Economy
2.)Development
3.)Combat

Punished Chuck
Dec 27, 2010

Top Hats Monthly posted:

Did I open up the paradox forums, what the gently caress did I just read last page

The Paradox devs wished that they had a forums to engage with their fanbase on that wasn't a bed of right-wing nationalism, and then one finger of the the monkey's paw curled up.

Kavak
Aug 23, 2009


WeaponGradeSadness posted:

The Paradox devs wished that they had a forums to engage with their fanbase on that wasn't a bed of right-wing nationalism, and then one finger of the the monkey's paw curled up.

Best explanation yet.

Also whoever said we need a new OP is right- the current one(s) is/are nearly a year and a half out of date.

Eskaton
Aug 13, 2014

gradenko_2000 posted:

But the allocation of resources towards the Holocaust did directly affect the military. That's roughly half the point. The other half is that not only are Stalin's Purges being represented in game as something you can choose to do or not do because of its impact towards the military, but that it is going to be framed in such a way that the player can view it as potentially beneficial to do (because that's how Stalin viewed it as, at the time).

What people have been trying to say is that the juxtaposition looks bad if applied the same way. Not that the Holocaust should be represented in HOI, but that the implications are a bit heavy as far as encouraging the player to take the same decisions for the purpose of historical handrails (not necessarily railroads).

I mean, okay, let's try something else: would the US get an event asking the player if they want to begin interring Japanese-Americans? Further, if the instinct of the player would be to say no because of the morality of such a choice, would the event involve bonuses for saying yes as an encouragement to say yes, reflecting upon the views at the time that it was a necessity?

The purges are in the game because a really large chunk of the generals you can pick when you play Russia are removed by the choice. I'm not an expert, but I don't think the German command was nearly as affected by this.

David Corbett
Feb 6, 2008

Courage, my friends; 'tis not too late to build a better world.
Uhhh... well this sure has been a discussion. At this rate I'm beginning to wonder whether the player should even get a choice whether to get purgey as the USSR. Just make it happe, accept the consequences and move on. Then at least there won't be a need for similar decisions as Germany.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

David Corbett posted:

Uhhh... well this sure has been a discussion. At this rate I'm beginning to wonder whether the player should even get a choice whether to get purgey as the USSR. Just make it happe, accept the consequences and move on. Then at least there won't be a need for similar decisions as Germany.

Exactly. Thank you.

GSD
May 10, 2014

by Nyc_Tattoo
Make it like a jrpg, it just redirects you back to the same choice whenever you select "You know, let's not kill them all." "But thou must."

Ofaloaf
Feb 15, 2013

:shrug: The Great Purge was a choice in Darkest Hour, wasn't it? And it was in HoI2 proper as well, iirc. Never played the original Hearts of Iron, no idea if it was there.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

Ofaloaf posted:

:shrug: The Great Purge was a choice in Darkest Hour, wasn't it?

No. There was a small-scale one pretty much any country could enact that sacked four or so generals in exchange for a small morale boost, but The Great Purge just happened to the USSR, it wasn't a choice.

Ofaloaf
Feb 15, 2013

Gort posted:

No. There was a small-scale one pretty much any country could enact that sacked four or so generals in exchange for a small morale boost, but The Great Purge just happened to the USSR, it wasn't a choice.

code:
#########################################################################
#  The Great Officer Purge Begins
#########################################################################
event = {
	id = 2609
	random = no
	country = SOV

	trigger = {
		headofgovernment = 4002 # Iosif in charge
		}

	name = "EVT_2609_NAME"
	desc = "EVT_2609_DESC"
        picture = "gulag"
	style = 0

	date = { day = 1 month = march year = 1938 }
	action_a = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME2609A" # Purge the traitors!
		ai_chance = 98

		command = { type = manpowerpool value = -10 }
		command = { type = belligerence which = SOV value = -1 }
		command = { type = ministerofsecurity which = 4041 }
		command = { type = chiefofstaff which = 4051 }
		command = { type = chiefofnavy which = 4061 }
		command = { type = chiefofair which = 4065 }

		[ABBREVIATING A LOT OF command = { type = sleepleader which = xxx } LINES]
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME2609B" # No need for brutality
		ai_chance = 2
		command = { type = dissent value = 30 }
		command = { type = domestic which = defense_lobby value = -2 }
		command = { type = domestic which = free_market value = -2 }
	}
}
I don't have HoI2 proper installed to dig through the files and see what was what there, but the player did have the option of not doing the purges in DH HoI2. It'd hurt them in the short term, sure, but it was there.


e: wait I'm being dumb, DH has all the HoI2 files and that's exactly what I was looking at. Darkest Hour removes the action_b option.

Ofaloaf fucked around with this message at 06:45 on Aug 22, 2015

Gorgo Primus
Mar 29, 2009

We shall forge the most progressive republic ever known to man!

Kavak posted:

Best explanation yet.

Also whoever said we need a new OP is right- the current one(s) is/are nearly a year and a half out of date.

Don't worry, I plan to retire this thread and put out a nice clean new one with a fully updated OP sometime in the next few weeks.

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Mans
Sep 14, 2011

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

David Corbett posted:

Uhhh... well this sure has been a discussion. At this rate I'm beginning to wonder whether the player should even get a choice whether to get purgey as the USSR. Just make it happe, accept the consequences and move on. Then at least there won't be a need for similar decisions as Germany.

gently caress you i want a trotsky portrait.

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