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Argas posted:Eh, it does take a while to do and many of them drag on (loving Ramuh chain). There's nothing really difficult about them, just annoying. It made sense at release because you'd play these story stuff with each new patch rather than doing them all at once. There's six trials (boss fights) and two mandatory dungeons and they're nothing special in terms of difficulty though that doesn't stop other players from being a liability. They're all included in the various daily bonuses for doing roulettes too so they're mostly full of players who've already cleared the content before. Mattavist posted:Because walking around and talking to NPCs is really loving boring. All of it could take place in a 10 minute cutscene. Both of these posts apply 100% equally to heavensward content. This is the disconnect I have. People here are mad about having to do some poo poo to get to other poo poo when both shitpiles are identical. Either you like questing in which case the more the better, or you don't, in which case you shouldn't play the game instead of imagining some grass is greener pasture the mean devs won't let you get to. Like, nothing in the 2.x quests are anywhere remotely close to as loving awful as the 3 separate times you get sent off to churning mists to do moogle bullshit in Heavensward. If you couldn't stomach chores with the Domans, be glad you quit while you were ahead.
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Aug 23, 2015 05:27
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Because one shitpile gets you to the new endgame, whereas the other stalls you and furthers the gap between you and your friends. Especially if you want to play one of the new classes.
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Aug 23, 2015 05:49
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Failboattootoot posted:Both of these posts apply 100% equally to heavensward content. This is the disconnect I have. People here are mad about having to do some poo poo to get to other poo poo when both shitpiles are identical. Either you like questing in which case the more the better, or you don't, in which case you shouldn't play the game instead of imagining some grass is greener pasture the mean devs won't let you get to. I found that Heavensward definitely keeps things moving at a more interesting pace but that's just me At the time, I blew through most HW leveling content at an even pace, only having to go back and do new sidequests that pop up because there were plenty of goons asking for runs of the new dungeons. I wouldn't mind if they end up making it optional and just throwing in a recap cutscene that drops the player off close to the end of 2.55. I can see why people who finish 2.0 want to hop straight to 3.0 for new content and poo poo but 2.x isn't fake content or anything. They could definitely do with some streamlining and shortcuts so that it isn't quite as long because let's face it, people want to get to the new zones or try out the new jobs, especially if they bought the expansion.
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Aug 23, 2015 05:50
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Mattavist posted:Because walking around and talking to NPCs is really loving boring. All of it could take place in a 10 minute cutscene. Nah. Mostly because there's like 30min of cutscenes at the end of the 2.55 patch quests.
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Aug 23, 2015 05:53
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Failboattootoot posted:These complaints make no sense to me. The stuff you are doing in the 2.x story is very relevant to what happens in heavensward. It isn't wasted content. - Sniff the perfumed chocobo. (also it's great to see all the defenders from the FFXIV thread come in to prove my point about their INTEGRITY OF THE STORY and IF YOU NOT LIKE STORY WHY YOU FF????)
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Aug 23, 2015 06:10
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Kessel posted:- Sniff the perfumed chocobo. More like if you don't enjoy bland theme park mmo questing then why complain about having to do bland theme park questing to get to more bland theme park questing? Rorus Raz posted:Because one shitpile gets you to the new endgame, whereas the other stalls you and furthers the gap between you and your friends. Especially if you want to play one of the new classes. 2.x to 3.0 is maybe 15-20 hours. Why complain about this and not the 50 hours to get from 1-50 or the 50 hours to get from 50-60? Edit: VVVVVVVVVV If you don't want to do quests then why is that tiny rear end level range of quests the problem and not the 2 giant gulfs before and after it? Failboattootoot fucked around with this message at 06:27 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 06:16
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Failboattootoot posted:More like if you don't enjoy bland theme park mmo questing then why complain about having to do bland theme park questing to get to more bland theme park questing? All content is filler if it's not what you wanted to do. Play 3.0 jobs? 1-50 is filler because you aren't playing it yet.
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Aug 23, 2015 06:24
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Failboattootoot posted:More like if you don't enjoy bland theme park mmo questing then why complain about having to do bland theme park questing to get to more bland theme park questing? Failboattootoot posted:Both of these posts apply 100% equally to heavensward content. This is the disconnect I have. People here are mad about having to do some poo poo to get to other poo poo when both shitpiles are identical. Either you like questing in which case the more the better, or you don't, in which case you shouldn't play the game instead of imagining some grass is greener pasture the mean devs won't let you get to. I think part of it is just the principle of the matter. Instead of letting appropriately leveled people jump right into the content, they make them do 100 'go here and fart on a moogle' quests, which then makes them do more moogle farting quests. What would it hurt to allow people to choose to just jump to the cutscene that ends 2.55 or whatever and let them right into Heavensward? I mean having to do 10 hours of loving around just to get to where you can start poo poo in an expansion seems kinda odd to me.
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Aug 23, 2015 06:27
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When I found out that I had to do all the story quests I missed to unlock the new content, I unsubscribed. Two friends did as well. I think that decision really is an issue. I don't see anything to defend about it. I don't know why they would do that.
opulent fountain fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 06:36
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John Dyne posted:I think part of it is just the principle of the matter. Instead of letting appropriately leveled people jump right into the content, they make them do 100 'go here and fart on a moogle' quests, which then makes them do more moogle farting quests. It wouldn't hurt much. One of the two mandatory dungeons is pretty forgettable but the second one's pretty great, particularly if you care at all about the story of the game. All the trials are fun, though the last two can be a pain because it's always random whether the other players are assets or liabilities. Personally I'd keep the group content in with a short cutscene or a short revised questline as a leadup to each bit. Plot like the Doman refugees and their unfamiliarity with stinky horsebirds are harder to fit in but it's not as if the devs haven't done short world-building questlines before.
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Aug 23, 2015 06:37
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Deki posted:Please don't poo poo on FFXIV, you're just going to cause some dipshit to come in and argue loudly about how you're oh so wrong. Oh hey I was right. Go figure.
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Aug 23, 2015 06:55
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Oh hey, 90 new posts in the Wildstar thread. Someone must have mentioned FFXIV again. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Aug 23, 2015 07:04
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Philonius posted:Oh hey, 90 new posts in the Wildstar thread. Someone must have mentioned FFXIV again. At this rate I think it'll be a couple more days of venting in the Safe-Place-to-Hate-FF14(TM) before people start talking about Wildstar again. Either that or Carbine can save us from this inevitable bit of the Wildstar thread cycle by posting something fantastically stupid, but since they seem to have dumped all the F2P conversion info already I figure we won't have that out available to us. Maybe if we're lucky that person who talked about Chodes can come back and rave about how good Wildstar is.
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Aug 23, 2015 07:33
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Says something about the MMO genre when ff14 is so loving horrible and yet so rabidly defended. 150 hours of quests to get your xpac content even after you max level/whatever. Yeah thats a good idea. At least with the 2.5 gcd you can read a book or something
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Aug 23, 2015 07:50
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I'm blaming you for this, Hy_C. Meanwhile I've noticed if you tweet anything negative about Wildstar, some random person will pop into your mentions defending it sooner or later. I've never had that happen bashing any other MMO. The goon fixation on FFXIV here doesn't count.
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Aug 23, 2015 08:09
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Goons love to talk about their favorite MMOs or beta hype. This happens every year then the next big new shiny/lovely MMO is released. Not sure how FFXIV is any different.
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Aug 23, 2015 09:01
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Mayor McCheese posted:Goons love to talk about their favorite MMOs or beta hype. This happens every year then the next big new shiny/lovely MMO is released. Not sure how FFXIV is any different. Goons also love to bash on mmos because they don't know how to socialize with people in a video game.
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Aug 23, 2015 09:51
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wait what
opulent fountain fucked around with this message at 10:32 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 10:03
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I am playing shin megami tensei 4, its really good and you should too instead of arguing about which lovely mmo is better
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Aug 23, 2015 12:14
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The people who defend the gating in FFXIV generally are the ones who steadily completed the story content as it came out so they're underestimating how intimidating the requirement looks to a new or returning player. I'm personally ambivalent about it. I don't really think it differs materially from a requirement to have a certain level or gear score to do new content, but a good chunk of the early Lv.50 story stuff is definitely dull filler.
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Aug 23, 2015 12:35
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ff14 defense force is almost as good as wildstar
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Aug 23, 2015 14:35
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There was a developer stream the other day where they mentioned they plan to do an abridged version of at least some of the main quests in the indeterminate future. I hope this changes everyone's mind and we can all lovingly fellate FF14 together. Thanks for reading my dumb gay post. Wildstar.
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Aug 23, 2015 14:40
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Someone make that raid attunement chart but with the FFXIV story stuff, I want to know how hardcore I have to be to enter Heavensword city or whatever.
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Aug 23, 2015 16:13
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Here you go: http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/playguide/db/quest/?category2=1
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Aug 23, 2015 16:22
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Omnicrom posted:At this rate I think it'll be a couple more days of venting in the Safe-Place-to-Hate-FF14(TM) before people start talking about Wildstar again. I've been playing Wildstar's beta and really there's not a lot to talk about with it. It feels like the same MMO I had the free month to a month or two ago, but now I have unlimited sprint. The daily login rewards have been kinda nice, at least? v  v There's just not a lot to say about the dumb game. Maybe when I get high enough to do the dungeons I can trip report on if those have become any better or not, but there's gently caress all to say about Wildstar right now. Which is pretty telling about the game in general.
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Aug 23, 2015 16:28
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The Chairman posted:I'm personally ambivalent about it. I don't really think it differs materially from a requirement to have a certain level or gear score to do new content, but a good chunk of the early Lv.50 story stuff is definitely dull filler. This is the truth. Up until 2.4, most of the patched in content was being worked on pre-launch, when they thought they might have a mildly successful game ala Final Fantasy XI. As a result, most of 2.1 and 2.2 were rehashes of already designed content, padded with probably the game's weakest filler. 2.3 had filler quests, as well, but it had a lot more spirit to it (doubly so if you talk to NPCs every chance you get). It also had the first story battle that wasn't conceptualized during 1.0. Part of the problem is that a lot of 2.0's plot was written pre-launch, and absolutely no one at SE was expecting FFXIV to be a new mainstream MMO. If you follow FFXIV's timeline, you can see exactly when their budget exploded and post-launch designs started being released. Pretty much everything before that is inexcusable filler, though, and even some of the newer stuff is completely unnecessary to the main plot. They could trim it down to just the main beats, the dungeons, and the bosses, and cut it down to maybe half what it is now. Niton fucked around with this message at 16:54 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 16:52
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God, I hated having to do the elemental bosses to level in FFXIV, they were honestly more frustrating than anything I encountered levelling in Wildstar: 1. Your level was forcefully capped until you finished the fight 2. Bosses had one shot mechanics, or at least nearly so 3. Bosses had short enrage timers, hope your dipshit dps didn't die by standing in fire/being knocked off the stage/etc 4. An overall timer that kicks your party out if you take too long attempting it. gently caress you for not getting it right the first time. 5. You couldn't even consistently just bring in competent people/friends to help you because you had to take whatever loving server you could get at launch.
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Aug 23, 2015 16:59
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The Chairman posted:I'm personally ambivalent about it. I don't really think it differs materially from a requirement to have a certain level or gear score to do new content, but a good chunk of the early Lv.50 story stuff is definitely dull filler. It differs materially in the number of ways you can design pathways to the gate. You can gate the new content by level, and design multiple ways to reach the required level. You can gate by gear score, and design multiple sources of appropriate gear. If you gate the content behind the filler-laden quests, there's only one way past the gate and you'll lose all the people who can't be arsed to wade through the filler. And before the guy who raised the point about bland quests gated behind bland quests comes back to heroically defend the game again, I'll say this. We're criticising the design decision here. While having the content be actually decent instead of boring would make the decision that much more tolerable, it still doesn't excuse the stupidity of the original design decision - especially given that MMO expansions are the perfect time to hit the reset button and help potential returnees to get back into the game.
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Aug 23, 2015 17:28
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Deki posted:God, I hated having to do the elemental bosses to level in FFXIV, they were honestly more frustrating than anything I encountered levelling in Wildstar: I'll get shouted down for being an FFXIV WHITE KNIGHT for this but whatever. What you listed above mostly isn't true. I'll address each of your points: 1) It's capped because they want to preserve some challenge for the fight through duty finder. However, if you enter with a premade, you can have it uncapped (although you forfeit any loot and exp from non boss monsters as a result). 2) Bosses have one shot mechanics if you don't follow the rules, at least for the storyline trials. If you think you should be rewarded for being able to ignore mechanics, I don't think MMOs are for you. 3) No bosses have short enrage timers, unless you intentionally try to brute force fights. 4) Short timers? I didn't know 60-120 minutes was considered short. 5) I don't know what to tell you about this? Do I think they could compress the 2.1-2.55 storyline? Of course (I still think people should be forced to do the trials and dungeons at the very least.). But I do not think that you should get a free level 50 character for buying the expansion. Everyone should have to level a character from 1-50. DarkstarIV fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 17:54
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a harpy posted:When I found out that I had to do all the story quests I missed to unlock the new content, I unsubscribed. Two friends did as well. I think that decision really is an issue. I don't see anything to defend about it. I don't know why they would do that. I love how unlike every game with gear appearance replacement on the market FFXIV decided to lock it behind max level story quests. You're gonna wear a clownsuit while you are leveling and like it, Cupcake.
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Aug 23, 2015 17:55
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Deki posted:God, I hated having to do the elemental bosses to level in FFXIV, they were honestly more frustrating than anything I encountered levelling in Wildstar: 2. Ifrit kills the party if they can't pass a simple DPS check involving no special mechanics whatsoever. It just requires players to hit a thing in the centre of the arena. If they're poorly geared or nobody is paying attention at all, this can kill the party. Titan has a narrow line AoE that knocks players off the arena, which kills them. Easy to dodge and the cast time on it is generous enough unless you've got terrible lag. There is a DPS check like Ifrit's, only this time a non-tank is encased in a rock so they gotta be broken out first. It's not a hard check but the same things that apply to Ifrit apply here. Garuda has a bunch of hard-hitting mechanics that can kill the party, so this one can take time to learn when it's your first time. However, these appear early in the fight and largely involve breaking her line of sight with you. Otherwise, it's a fairly standard encounter of killing stuff that spawns in and not standing in front of Garuda. 3. The only enrages I've heard of are in endgame content, no leveling content. 4. These three trials all have 60 minute timers and none of the fights are meant to last more than several minutes, and that's if the dps is poor, etc. 5. I don't even know what to say to this because plenty of goons got into Excalibur with no issues at launch. This isn't like FFXI where you'd get a random server.
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Aug 23, 2015 18:16
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Heavensward kind of sucks. One of the big features, flying mounts, requires you to unlock aether nodes. The firdt set is easy, go here and click on it. It's the quest based nodes that lock you out until you finish most side quests in an area and storyline quests that lock you out. You basically can't use flying mounts until after they'd be useful. There's no enough overworked content to keep you leveled with story content, even doing every side quest available still keeps you at best 25% shy or more of the level wall. So you get to run dungeons over and over again! Oh and loving moogle. I like FFXIV but there's TONS of bad stuff about the game people tend to gloss over. Also Wildstar is boring 1 to 15 so far.
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Aug 23, 2015 18:23
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Kortel posted:Heavensward kind of sucks. One of the big features, flying mounts, requires you to unlock aether nodes. The firdt set is easy, go here and click on it. It's the quest based nodes that lock you out until you finish most side quests in an area and storyline quests that lock you out. They breadcrumb you back to old zones for a new wave of sidequests every so and then, which is when flying becomes useful. I personally don't mind the way they've gated flying mounts because it gives you a guided experience the first time you go through the zone following the main story. If you don't care for that though and just want the convenience of flying, then yeah it's bad. They really need to make it more apparent which side-quests lead you to aether currents.
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Aug 23, 2015 18:28
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Kortel posted:Heavensward kind of sucks. One of the big features, flying mounts, requires you to unlock aether nodes. The firdt set is easy, go here and click on it. It's the quest based nodes that lock you out until you finish most side quests in an area and storyline quests that lock you out. Seems to be a trend these days, since WoD isn't going to unlock flying until after everyone has quit out of frustration.
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Aug 23, 2015 20:01
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Failboattootoot posted:Both of these posts apply 100% equally to heavensward content. This is the disconnect I have. People here are mad about having to do some poo poo to get to other poo poo when both shitpiles are identical. Either you like questing in which case the more the better, or you don't, in which case you shouldn't play the game instead of imagining some grass is greener pasture the mean devs won't let you get to. Both of them are shitpiles and the endgame stuff is kinda cool, so when you double the shitpiles people don't bother with either of them. MMO players are generally willing to put up with a certain amount of poo poo before they get to the fun stuff, but that amount has been dwindling lately. Also the moogle quests were fine and you're just flat out lying about that second part, hth. I actually did my chores so I could level in heavensward, gonna have to actually be honest about the game to me. 
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Aug 23, 2015 20:08
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Deki posted:God, I hated having to do the elemental bosses to level in FFXIV, they were honestly more frustrating than anything I encountered levelling in Wildstar: you know that old saying about how if you meet an rear end in a top hat in the morning, you met an rear end in a top hat, but if you keep running into assholes every hour of every day, the rear end in a top hat is probably in the mirror yeah those fights are easy, it is you, who are the bad player
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Aug 23, 2015 20:14
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mr. stefan posted:you know that old saying about how if you meet an rear end in a top hat in the morning, you met an rear end in a top hat, but if you keep running into assholes every hour of every day, the rear end in a top hat is probably in the mirror If you meet a player and they tell you the game is bad, that person just doesn't like the game. If you have a whole thread of people that tell you the game is bad, the game is probably bad. Yeah. The game is bad. It is you who are the white knight.
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Aug 23, 2015 20:19
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There's no accounting for taste.
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Aug 23, 2015 20:21
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Saxophone posted:If you meet a player and they tell you the game is bad, that person just doesn't like the game. If you have a whole thread of people that tell you the game is bad, the game is probably bad. maybe both the game and the player are bad 
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Aug 23, 2015 20:22
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Saxophone posted:If you meet a player and they tell you the game is bad, that person just doesn't like the game. If you have a whole thread of people that tell you the game is bad, the game is probably bad. Let me tell you a story about Ifrit, the first fight he's complaining about. When I first started playing at launch, I was a stupid newbie who didn't realize he could leave the story "prison" immediately before the fight. I was playing a dps class which doesn't have the ability to queue as a healer until later on.. but there were three other DPS sitting there waiting, as well. The four of us (3 pure dps with me trying to heal/tank with a pet) 3 shot it, with one of the wipes coming from not knowing what the enrage did. If a fight like that stymies you with a normal group, that fight is not the problem.
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Aug 23, 2015 20:24
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