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Baronjutter posted:This world needs to adopt some sort of paper currency. How would that help? This is ancient history that is being dredged up.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:43
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Baronjutter posted:This world needs to adopt some sort of paper currency. I would like your ancestor to explain we use gold instead of currency in a somber and melodramatic way.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:48
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I think having the option there is a good way to handle it - I'm glad they didn't just roll back the changes. The people complaining about the corpses and heart attacks remind me of a conversation I had with my brother in law. I introduced him to Hearthstone, which has a gag where when you search for opponents a wheel spins that has a bunch of joke options for your opponent like "A starcraft pro" or "a nose and mouth breather" before finally settling on "A worthy opponent". When I talked to him a few weeks later and asked if he'd been playing, he said that he played for a little bit, but he kept on getting "A worthy opponent" so he quit. I guess you do have to keep in mind that those types of folks also play games.
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Aug 22, 2015 04:03
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So I just started playing and in closing and opening the game my entire party got erased. I had to recruit a ton of new guys. Is this normal?
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Aug 22, 2015 04:21
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Fargin Icehole posted:I would like your ancestor to explain we use gold instead of currency in a somber and melodramatic way. "Upon the moldering ruins of fiat currency, we built our noble house of purestrain gold."
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Aug 22, 2015 04:38
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Fargin Icehole posted:I would like your ancestor to explain we use gold instead of currency in a somber and melodramatic way. "We call them bonecoins--a soul-to-soul currency that no mere mortal controls. Women and men, soldiers and outlaws, fools and corpses...they shall all question the fidelity of such a sinister specie."
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Aug 22, 2015 05:04
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Why did they change protection from being a flat number of damage reduction to a percentage based thing? I've always liked the former and hated the latter in games - flat DR makes you change your strategy, and focus on single large hitting attacks, while percentage reduction is uninteresting and doesn't notably change how you play, it just gives the thing more effective HP. Ok there's bleed and blight but those aren't very interesting either
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Aug 22, 2015 21:08
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I'm pretty sure it was to nerf protection on players. It was pretty easy to get a solid amount of protection which made most things really not do any damage ever.
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Aug 22, 2015 21:12
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Boing posted:... flat DR makes you change your strategy, and focus on single large hitting attacks.... Boing posted:Ok there's bleed and blight but those aren't very interesting either
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Aug 23, 2015 07:23
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CommissarMega posted:EDIT: Anyone have that picture of the lone Crusader talking about how great it is travelling with friends? Internet Kraken posted:
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Aug 23, 2015 07:50
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IAmUnaware posted:The default strategy, and the one that was objectively the best prior to Corpse and Hound, is focus on single large hitting attacks (on the front two ranks of monsters). Flat DR doesn't make anyone change anything, and isn't interesting at all. Due to modifier stacking issues, buffed AOE spam has always been the mechanically superior strategy. Flat DR at least theoretically hit AOE attacks harder, although in practice it would have made unoptimized AOEs unusable while only being a minor speedbump for a min/maxed AOE character.
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Aug 23, 2015 14:27
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Awesome, thanks!
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Aug 23, 2015 17:40
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Ah, ancient thread memory time...cyanidewolf posted:Uncertainty dismissed with a single strike! You know, I kinda wish this bug were still around. Just to see if the damm thing left a corpse.
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Aug 23, 2015 18:04
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After the last patch I've picked up the game again - first impression: every new team that I hire has somebody with Curious / Kleptomaniac which triggers more than half of the time. I remember it wasn't that common to trigger, when I last played, but right now it's beyond ridiculous. Second week - still haven't seen an Occultist. Gotten my first Vestal (which isn't really that bothersome, as apparently Crusaders healing is good now). Still, not having Occultist hurts (A / O / BH / BH was my favourite team) Also, my first tutorial when Dismas died 
canis minor fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Aug 23, 2015 |
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Aug 23, 2015 19:43
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Couple impressions after a week of playing: Corpses are a great addition and I don't get why anyone wouldn't want them. It adds a lot of depth to combat, though I do wish that melee enemies were more affected by being pushed into the back rows. Most of them seem completely unaffected, and the few that are can still attack for drat near the same amount of damage as their regular attacks. The way it's set up with ranged enemies is really nice, though. Most of the common / uncommon trinkets are absolutely useless. I didn't realize you could sell them for a long time, so that kind of makes up for it, but it would still be nice to see more useful ones. It seems like the only ones ever worth using are Sun / Moon trinkets and ancestral stuff. There are a few exceptions with neat synergy (especially the ones that really radically change the way you set up your formations or use a class), but it's a cool system that could be a lot more than just extra treasure 90% of the time. The surprise mechanic needs a serious overhaul. It is already bad enough that every single enemy is faster than you and gets to attack first, but shuffling the party up just really makes certain classes almost entirely useless. Even if the Leper got a damage / accuracy buff, he would still be garbage because a surprise attack means he is going to be spending 1-2 turns just moving back into position before he can even attack. Right now, the shuffling means that Hellion, Man-at-Arms, and Bounty Hunter are just flat-out superior to Crusader and Leper in pretty much every way. It really shouldn't ever take more than 1 turn to get your party back in formation after a surprise. The stress system is cool and it feels pretty well-tuned. My only real complaint are with the traps that hit for like 50 stress. There just aren't enough ways to clear it away for things to be hitting for that much. Traps also seem to prioritize characters that are already the most stressed out; maybe I'm just unlucky but they almost always trigger on my highest-stress people, which feels a little cheap. Also certain curios (bookshelves and scrolls come to mind) just seem to be completely weighted towards negative outcomes and it's kind of weird. The backpack space is annoyingly limited. I think increasing item stack sizes would solve this issue, though. You basically have to bring food, torches, and a few shovels with you no matter what, and on a medium or long mission, those take up at least half of your backpack slots. Then you factor in firewood and any items you need to actually loot treasure, and it's a real problem. Hunger is also inconsistent in a way that is massively unfun. Any time I go on a short expedition, I bring 8 food and almost never use more than 4. Sometimes they don't eat at all. But every time I go on a long expedition they chew through food at an insane rate. A few times I've had hunger trigger 2 or 3 rooms in a row. I get that they want it to be kind of random, but it's incredibly infuriating when a long trek goes wrong just because you didn't bring like 30 food with you. The grind to unlock stuff isn't as bad as I thought it would be. Doing random quests just to level up characters has been more than enough. If you wanted to min-max every step of the way, it would be a problem I guess, but it feels fairly balanced. Most of the enemies are great, but a few feel really overpowered for where they show up. The maggots, of all things, are really obnoxious. They almost always hit first, and their grave nibble causes blight, stun, and really frequently gives a disease. It's kind of a bit much, especially with how much some diseases can gimp you. The Giant enemy with a treebranch is also insane. He has a giant pool of HP, high resistance to stun, and his tree smack usually takes 3/4 of a healthbar, or instagibs on a crit. It wouldn't be so bad if he wasn't always accompanied by really annoying backline enemies that need to be taken care of first.
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Aug 23, 2015 20:19
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This game looks absolutely awesome. I'm excited for it to hit PS4.
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Aug 23, 2015 21:16
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Grizzled Patriarch posted:... Consider +spd options on some guys, and look into taking moves with +forward. Also keep in mind that you can have your more mobile guys move backwards, which will push people like the Leper forwards. Only some rare edge cases where you have anyone that isn't in a good spot come turn 2 (stuns, push/pulls, really really bad turn order). Traps can be rough, haven't seen a 50 hit personally. +Scouting can make them almost a non-issue though. The book curios are pretty evenly weighted, but the benefits usually aren't worth the risks. Pile of scrolls you can light to remove a negative quirk, just don't light the pile of books (+100 stress). Limited backpack space is a design feature and changing that means they would need to re-balance all costs outside of a mission. View each mission length with different priority for loot and it should feel better. Avoid all missions involving collect/use 3 things unless you really want the trinket reward. Take note of what heirlooms you want/need. Remember that a slot is going to be worth 1000, 1500, 2000, or 4000 depending on what you stick in there. Early on prioritize max stack value. If you want excessive food take 1 stack per length, this will cover bad luck, camping, and let you use some for healing. Short - Take everything not nailed down. Maybe you'll throw away some mission supplies at the end to grab the last couple things. Medium - Consider setting up buffing camping skills and camping right away. You'll probably be throwing 250gp gems out, but also later on a stack of 1500 gold is better than 1 or 2 500gp gems. Long - Again camping right away is really strong. You can use your second camp with the big food option for a solid heal/stress heal partway through. 250gp gems are right out, and for at least the first half of the dungeon be ready to throw gold away for 500/1000gp gems. Combined with larger quest rewards, you can haul an impressive amount of value out of longer dungeon. Camping buffs mean with a little planning medium dungeons are often easier and more fun than short ones. Disease causing enemies are annoying because it can cost several weeks to clean up. Even the shittiest ones shouldn't stop you from finishing non-boss runs though. New enemies are dangerous because you don't know how to handle them as well as old enemies. Push/pulls to get them in a bad position for their moveset (you might need to target the other enemies) are really strong, as are debuffs.
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Aug 24, 2015 00:10
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Re: melee enemies, those back-row desperation attacks they use all have like 20-30% chance to hit, tops. So it's not useless to shuffle them, it's just a temporary solution. Crusaders have Holy Lance to attack from the back row while maneuvering back into position. Having access to attacks with built in movement is handy in general because sometimes you can also use them to shuffle other party members who are out of position. Keep an eye peeled for +stun% trinkets. Most big enemies like the giant have enough stun resist that they can't reliably be stunned, but not enough stun resist to shrug off boosted stun attacks (obviously, make sure your stun skills are trained up to snuff too.)
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Aug 24, 2015 00:12
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I appreciate the fact that I can already rename my various dungeon dwellers, but I wish I had either 1.More room to work with or, 2. An additional space to give them a nickname. I feel like, by level 2 or 3, my roster is long enough (and filled with enough weirdos) that giving them more recognizable names and nicknames would help make it easier to distinguish between them.
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Aug 24, 2015 02:07
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You don't need much space to name them after your coworkers. I'm looking forward to informing my supervisor tomorrow of his untimely demise by cook pot and tenderizer.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:01
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Cream-of-Plenty posted:I appreciate the fact that I can already rename my various dungeon dwellers, but I wish I had either 1.More room to work with or, 2. An additional space to give them a nickname. I feel like, by level 2 or 3, my roster is long enough (and filled with enough weirdos) that giving them more recognizable names and nicknames would help make it easier to distinguish between them. I've been giving the heroes at or above level 3 Enemy Within style nicknames, usually riffing on their Quirks. It quickly makes their little cards on the roster look weird, though.
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Aug 24, 2015 06:55
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Just to confirm--diseases will not go away on their own, and must be treated by either sending the afflicted to the Sanitarium or by using "cure disease" camping skills, right? It seems like, for the most part, it would make more sense for (a majority of) diseases to go away over time.Crasical posted:I've been giving the heroes at or above level 3 Enemy Within style nicknames, usually riffing on their Quirks. It quickly makes their little cards on the roster look weird, though. Yeah that's basically what I was thinking of, was the nicknames that I gave troopers in EW to help further distinguish them in combat.
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Aug 24, 2015 07:00
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Am I crazy, or are stacks of books super useless and never worth the risk? There's 40% chance you'll get a quirk (as opposed to nothing or a stress trap), and still 1/3 of a chance after that that the quirk will be bad. Torches just give you an extra bad stress trap.
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Aug 24, 2015 11:45
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FourLeaf posted:Am I crazy, or are stacks of books super useless and never worth the risk? There's 40% chance you'll get a quirk (as opposed to nothing or a stress trap), and still 1/3 of a chance after that that the quirk will be bad. Torches just give you an extra bad stress trap. Always skip books, unless you are on a "no heartattack - maximum crazy" run, then by all means, burn all the books.
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Aug 24, 2015 12:43
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Turn off heart attacks and then deliberately drive all your new hires insane, fire all the ones who don't get Abusive. Fight back the tides of darkness by being more even more of a pack of assholes than the cosmic horrors.
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Aug 24, 2015 17:04
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FourLeaf posted:Am I crazy, or are stacks of books super useless and never worth the risk? There's 40% chance you'll get a quirk (as opposed to nothing or a stress trap), and still 1/3 of a chance after that that the quirk will be bad. Torches just give you an extra bad stress trap. Equip +virtue trinkets, burn all the books.
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Aug 24, 2015 22:37
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Crasical posted:Turn off heart attacks and then deliberately drive all your new hires insane, fire all the ones who don't get Abusive. This is kind of what I've been doing. I turned off heart attacks because they were interfering with my suicide runs. I send in 4 new recruits with minimum supplies to get as much treasure and heirlooms as possible. It's shockingly easy to get to 200 stress like that. Though I've been dismissing all of them after they go insane, why are Abusive people worth keeping around?
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Aug 25, 2015 03:12
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FourLeaf posted:This is kind of what I've been doing. I turned off heart attacks because they were interfering with my suicide runs. I send in 4 new recruits with minimum supplies to get as much treasure and heirlooms as possible. It's shockingly easy to get to 200 stress like that. Though I've been dismissing all of them after they go insane, why are Abusive people worth keeping around? while other afflictions will do stuff like skip their turns, refuse healing, or damage or mark themselves, abusives will just stress out the other party members, which doesn't matter if everyone's already afflicted and you have heart attacks toggled off.
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Aug 25, 2015 03:18
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FourLeaf posted:This is kind of what I've been doing. I turned off heart attacks because they were interfering with my suicide runs. I send in 4 new recruits with minimum supplies to get as much treasure and heirlooms as possible. It's shockingly easy to get to 200 stress like that. Though I've been dismissing all of them after they go insane, why are Abusive people worth keeping around? I started playing just before corpses and didn't even realize heart attacks were a recent mechanic. It seemed natural to have the mental resource (sanity) and physical resource (hitpoints) to both cause the end of that character if depleted. Suicide runs were tense but that added to the fun and the lone survivor returning with packs of gold and no party members feels in theme.
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Aug 25, 2015 03:58
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So I stopped playing a couple of months ago, mainly to wait on updates, maybe til the game is finished. Now I'm seeing "game is a mess" articles coming up, and people seem really angry with Red Hook at times. Anything to care about? To be honest I found the game a little easy once you paid attention to using the right supply items on encounters, and just using common sense in party layout, although I usually try to use mobile characters so I can shuffle the ranks if I need to. Will I like/dislike the recent changes? Sounds like there is a lot of them, at least to result in everyone suddenly swearing off Red Hook.
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Aug 25, 2015 04:49
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Maluco Marinero posted:So I stopped playing a couple of months ago, mainly to wait on updates, maybe til the game is finished. Now I'm seeing "game is a mess" articles coming up, and people seem really angry with Red Hook at times. Anything to care about? To be honest I found the game a little easy once you paid attention to using the right supply items on encounters, and just using common sense in party layout, although I usually try to use mobile characters so I can shuffle the ranks if I need to. That depends. Are you married to the "kill the thing in the first row, then kill the next thing when everything moves up, repeat" strategy to the point that you outright refuse to try anything else? If so, you will likely hate the new changes. Otherwise, you'll probably have fun still, possibly even more fun because more strategies and characters are viable than before.
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Aug 25, 2015 04:54
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Maluco Marinero posted:So I stopped playing a couple of months ago, mainly to wait on updates, maybe til the game is finished. Now I'm seeing "game is a mess" articles coming up, and people seem really angry with Red Hook at times. Anything to care about? To be honest I found the game a little easy once you paid attention to using the right supply items on encounters, and just using common sense in party layout, although I usually try to use mobile characters so I can shuffle the ranks if I need to. Roland Jones posted:That depends. Are you married to the "kill the thing in the first row, then kill the next thing when everything moves up, repeat" strategy to the point that you outright refuse to try anything else? If so, you will likely hate the new changes. Otherwise, you'll probably have fun still, possibly even more fun because more strategies and characters are viable than before. And it's worth noting that two of the biggest changes--corpses and heart attacks--have been turned into optional features that can be disabled from the control panel. As somebody else might have already said, while there are more than a handful of dissenters out there, it's likely that they're very outspoken and that this gives the impression of a larger portion of the "community" being upset with the game's direction than the reality. Edit: Personally, while I only spent a little while with the game pre-Hound/Corpse patch, I feel like I really like the current changes. I think things like most diseases could be made temporary (something that would distinguish them more from negative quirks), some of the trinkets could be made a little more appealing, and enemies could stand to be more impacted by being knocked into the wrong rank...but overall, the latest stuff is great and I'm looking forward to the Cove update. Cream-of-Plenty fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Aug 25, 2015 |
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Aug 25, 2015 05:00
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Cream-of-Plenty posted:And it's worth noting that two of the biggest changes--corpses and heart attacks--have been turned into optional features that can be disabled from the control panel. The further I get into this game, the less sense it makes that these are even optional. It's absolutely trivial to keep your people from stressing to death, so I guess that was a concession to allow permanent afflictions? That's cool for gimmick runs, but letting everyone run around at max stress is pretty stupid in a game ostensibly about keeping your mercs from losing their minds. And corpses make basically any party viable; I've been having a ton of fun blight-bombing with my plague docs, hook & slice'n with my bounty hunters, and shoving people around with my occultist. Even if you want to be a knuckle-dragger and just chew through the front line, corpses should only cost you an extra turn or two.
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Aug 25, 2015 05:10
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Zombie Samurai posted:The further I get into this game, the less sense it makes that these are even optional. It's absolutely trivial to keep your people from stressing to death, so I guess that was a concession to allow permanent afflictions?
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Aug 25, 2015 05:14
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I don't think corpses or heart attacks ruin the game, and people are absolutely right when they say corpses actually make certain character classes and attacks more useful. I'm just turning off heart attacks temporarily because I'm trying to grind up as much gold as I can with as little cost as possible. And now I've learned about all-affliction runs w/ Abusive. The game is not a mess, it will be harder for you at first but you'll figure it out. I know I can't wait for the Cove update.
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Aug 25, 2015 05:32
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I wish they had a more clear roadmap for the end of the game as far as features go. It's a little awkward not knowing what the end game is - obviously, Darkest Dungeon is going to be a thing, and they've mentioned that retreating is disabled for a trip into DD, but it's less clear on if the game is going to have any game over criteria at all, win or lose.
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Aug 25, 2015 05:37
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Coolguye posted:I wish they had a more clear roadmap for the end of the game as far as features go. It's a little awkward not knowing what the end game is - obviously, Darkest Dungeon is going to be a thing, and they've mentioned that retreating is disabled for a trip into DD, but it's less clear on if the game is going to have any game over criteria at all, win or lose. My gut tells me that there's going to be an endgame where your minions delve into the Darkest Dungeon and kill the ultimate evil and restore the honor of the Ancestor's family name--possibly with some sort of dark "Monkey's Paw" twist on the outcome.
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Aug 25, 2015 05:46
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I think the people complaining about heart attacks are, at the core of it, hitting on the issue that the late game is a little at odds with the early game design-wise. Everyone feels very expendable early on, but it really does take a long time to level people up and upgrade all of their gear, so losing someone in like a level 5 dungeon is a huge blow compared to some disposable dude fresh off of the cart. Stress is pretty easy to manage for the most part, but there have definitely been runs where my luck just ran out and one dude got slammed by like every single attack and trap and had a heart attack while everyone else was perfectly fine. If that happened on a really high level character with good trinkets I would probably be pretty pissed. So far I haven't ever felt like heart attacks were unfair (I think I've had 3 of them so far, all in no-torch runs where I was pushing my luck a bit to begin with) but I've just started dabbling in the really high-end dungeons so maybe I just haven't seen what all the fuss is about yet.
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Aug 25, 2015 05:47
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The 'Veteran' levels do definitely suffer from middle child syndrome. There isn't the thrill of working with someone new or the disposable feeling of being able to throw them to the wolves just to see what happens, but there is also not the rush of the high end challenge. You feel like you're in a holding pattern to a large extent, and I'm not sure what could be done to fix that, aside from making the entire leveling process go faster (which it probably should).
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Aug 25, 2015 07:23
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FourLeaf posted:I don't think corpses or heart attacks ruin the game, and people are absolutely right when they say corpses actually make certain character classes and attacks more useful. I'm just turning off heart attacks temporarily because I'm trying to grind up as much gold as I can with as little cost as possible. And now I've learned about all-affliction runs w/ Abusive. Nah I reckon the game will be just fine for me. Sounds like the changes won't affect me much because I already actively manage stress and play with a generally more mobile party rather than tanking through it.
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Aug 25, 2015 09:25
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