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I've got Cass fixed up to be as unkillable as Blackwall. 5 guard on hit stuff, a masterwork that continually triggers Walking Fortress, and spec'd up through Vanguard for maximum guard generation. But having both of them in a party is pretty much a guarantee of survival.
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Aug 27, 2015 23:56
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eating only apples posted:The final boss in the Descent is really unfun if you're not ranged. My dagger rogue died within seconds every time she got close. I ended up playing Dorian, outrunning the rocks and then reviving everyone since all three other characters died every time no matter how much I micromanaged them. Nine or ten times in a row. It was a battle of attrition more than anything. The same thing happened to me. I couldn't work out if I was approaching the situation wrong or if there was something I was missing. It didn't seem very well done for a boss fight and and an ending.
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Aug 28, 2015 00:06
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At this point my Cassandra is pretty indestructible as well. I fought the Emerald Graves dragon and my main character and Varric died leaving only her and Solas, so I took over Cassandra and realized I could just stand there. Didn't use War Cry or Shout to re-up Guard, didn't have to. I <3 Cassandra. Romancing her was the only reason I went Male Inquisitor.
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Aug 28, 2015 00:14
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The Descent boss fight actually made my knight enchanter drink a health potion!
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Aug 28, 2015 00:29
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I just beat the game for the first time. and I have some questions. why the gently caress did my inquisitor send corypheus into the fade with the orb? that should be in the flesh which was what I was trying to stop for half the game holy poo poo that solas thing came out of no where. I used him in my pt 99% of the time and he has a bunch of questioning dialogue about the orb and coryephus himself. atleast drop some cryptic hints or something bioware gently caress. The only hint I can think of is in the temple of mythal when sorrow says an elf like him? and points at solas.
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Aug 28, 2015 16:15
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If you go back and play through the game with that knowledge it becomes blindingly obvious. Honestly, the ending mission still confuses the gently caress out of me, it's all so rushed and weird. But best as I can tell, when the inquisitor sends Cory physically into the fade he is just ripped to shreds as Cory doesn't have the anchor (mark) like he was supposed to, which is what allowed you to physically walk into the Fade at Adamant.
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Aug 28, 2015 16:22
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Ending spoiler: I always took it as the Inquisitor opened a rift inside of Cory's head and he was basically crushed. And since we killed his dragaon and there are no wardens in the fade, he should be done for. Honestly that ending was satisfyingly brutal, from Cory calling out to his dead gods, to me force pulling the orb out of his hand and crushing his jaw to the fade thing. Loved it.
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Aug 28, 2015 16:28
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Spikeguy posted:Ending spoiler: I always took it as the Inquisitor opened a rift inside of Cory's head and he was basically crushed. And since we killed his dragaon and there are no wardens in the fade, he should be done for. Honestly that ending was satisfyingly brutal, from Cory calling out to his dead gods, to me force pulling the orb out of his hand and crushing his jaw to the fade thing. Loved it. I liked it until I said you want into the fade? here you go and threw him into the breach. it was very satisfying. Also I killed his dragon at adamant. When It lands on the side I though you were meant to fight it so it would fly away and it doesnt. So I killed it twice.
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Aug 28, 2015 16:31
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snergle posted:holy poo poo that solas thing came out of no where. I used him in my pt 99% of the time and he has a bunch of questioning dialogue about the orb and coryephus himself. atleast drop some cryptic hints or something bioware gently caress. The only hint I can think of is in the temple of mythal when sorrow says an elf like him? and points at solas. I felt the same way until I played it again!
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Aug 28, 2015 17:15
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Strenuous Manflurry posted:I felt the same way until I played it again! Since I won't be replaying it for a long time can you throw the hints up in the spoilers? Maybe its something I missed or I took his dialogue to literal / truthful. i love that solas killed flemeth not 5 minutes after her I WILL GIVE THE WORLD THE RECKONING IT DESERVES FOR MYTHAL speech completly subverting the next sequels set up big bad
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Aug 28, 2015 17:23
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snergle posted:Since I won't be replaying it for a long time can you throw the hints up in the spoilers? Maybe its something I missed or I took his dialogue to literal / truthful. It's actually not clear at all what happens in that particular scene. As for hints, many are relatively obscure. The most instructive are follower conversations with Cole. "They sleep, masked in a mirror, hurting, and to wake them...GASP!" From Dalish lore, we "know" that Fen'harel tricked the other elven gods to seal themselves away. If you listen to the companion dialogue with Cole and Solas, you will hear a lot more such hints. Also, Leliana mentions that her agents have found the village that Solas supposedly grew up, only to find it was abandoned centuries ago. And he wears this wolf jawbone necklace. Additionally, he paints wolves on the walls of his room in Skyhold. There's also Solas' personal mission, “All New, Faded for Her”, which is actually an anagram of "Fen'harel, Dread Wolf".
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Aug 28, 2015 18:41
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Torrannor posted:Also, Leliana mentions that her agents have found the village that Solas supposedly grew up, only to find it was abandoned centuries ago. I think that only comes up post-endgame, though I might be wrong. If you're an elf, can you understand what the Nightmare says to Solas?
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Aug 28, 2015 18:50
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Not directly, but if you the player know some things about elven lore and language you can translate. I'm pretty sure there's a video of someone doing just that. Same for the voices during the Well scene if you do it.
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Aug 28, 2015 18:59
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Lotish posted:Not directly, but if you the player know some things about elven lore and language you can translate. I'm pretty sure there's a video of someone doing just that. Same for the voices during the Well scene if you do it. Yeah, it would just be cool if an elven Inquisitor didn't need a translation. Solas insults Sera in elven at one point in their banter ("fenedhis lasa") and some nerds on reddit attempted to work out what it meant. It's a bit of a stretch but If they're right it's hilarious
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Aug 28, 2015 19:44
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eating only apples posted:I think that only comes up post-endgame, though I might be wrong. I don't remember the exact translation but somebody worked it out and what you really need to know is that "Solas" is the Elven word for "Pride" (hence, Temple of Solasan, containing a Pride Demon) and the Nightmare is basically making GBS threads on him going "Pride? Really? Do you feel much to be proud about at this point?"
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Aug 28, 2015 19:50
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^^^^^ I think at one point there is dialogue with Solas himself about texts about Dread Wolf have been incorrectly translated over time and the original text wasn't Betrayer but Pride ^^^^^ There is also elven dialogue between Solas and the elf at the pool in the elven temple where you or Morrigan can drink from that infers the elf knows who Solas is or recognizes him at least. I can't recall the translated text as I watched some good youtube videos explaining them some time ago, but it's definitely worth the watch. The thing about this game, and personally what I love, is that they don't hit you over the head with the information. They don't even somewhat point you in the right direction. But as long as you pay attention over the course of the game, then the post-credit cutscene is like the first domino that was missing that knocks the rest of them over. Various codexes and dialogue build a entire separate backstory to is realized fully only after the fact, which for me is amazing because it makes me want to play the next game even more. BetterToRuleInHell fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Aug 28, 2015 |
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Aug 28, 2015 20:54
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:^^^^^ I think at one point there is dialogue with Solas himself about texts about Dread Wolf have been incorrectly translated over time and the original text wasn't Betrayer but Pride ^^^^^ Rather, the meaning of the word 'harellan'(derived from Fen'Harel) has changed over time - it used to mean 'trickster' or 'rebel', but has come to have a much darker meaning as 'betrayer' or 'traitor'. This change may have happened after the Betrayal when Fen'Harel locked away the other gods - previously he may not have been regarded as quite so evil or dangerous.
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Aug 28, 2015 21:10
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floofyscorp posted:Rather, the meaning of the word 'harellan'(derived from Fen'Harel) has changed over time - it used to mean 'trickster' or 'rebel', but has come to have a much darker meaning as 'betrayer' or 'traitor'. This change may have happened after the Betrayal when Fen'Harel locked away the other gods - previously he may not have been regarded as quite so evil or dangerous. Pay attention to your lore entries as well, and it's pretty explicitly stated that Fen'Harel was originally seen as the god of rebellion, change, and growth. A Loki or Prometheus rather than Satan.
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Aug 28, 2015 21:17
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So question: the games themselves aside, who is your favourite protaganist, the Warden, Hawke, or Inquisitor? Or at least which is your favourite in how you're able to play them. Hawke's still my favourite of the three, even disregarding Inquistion. He just seems to have more personality compared to the other two, though the Warden is slightly hurt in that regard as they weren't voice acted. Even then, he does feel more like an RPG hero rather than a player stand-in, and the party companion interactions he can have feel more organic.
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Aug 28, 2015 21:23
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ApplesandOranges posted:So question: the games themselves aside, who is your favourite protaganist, the Warden, Hawke, or Inquisitor? Or at least which is your favourite in how you're able to play them. I'm on your side, I've played one Warden, one Hawke and two Inquisitors and my Hawke was a real character reflected in her dialogue. For all the roleplaying you can do with the Warden and the Inquisitor, it all comes together in a more meaningful way with Hawke. My Hawke grew as a character in my mind and in the game, and realistically I know that was all down to my head, but I haven't managed to hit the same notes with either of my Inquisitors. The three dialogue moods for Hawke may have been over-simplified but I prefer it to not knowing exactly how my Inquisitor is going to take an innocuous-sounding line of conversation. My warden is still my personal canon (female elf mage) and hit all the right notes, but Hawke takes it for me. For all the poo poo in DAII, Hawke's personality ended up a decent system. Now I regret my Inquisitor choices - elf mage, human rogue - because I want to go dwarf for my next run and have very little interest in playing warrior. Will go archer rogue unless someone can talk me into warrior. I played mage in Origins, II, and my first run of Inquisition, and if I wasn't set on being a dwarf for my third go I'd do mage again. Someone tell me that warrior is fun to play.
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Aug 28, 2015 21:56
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I gotta say I really just enjoyed the hell out of SarcasHawke. Having a goofy personality in that goofy rear end game was great.
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Aug 28, 2015 22:17
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I liked the Human Noble Warden for the connection with the main antagonists, Loghain and Howe, and the arc you can give them. Like for my playthrough the Warden went from happy-go-lucky in the beginning, to burning with vengeance after Howe's betrayal, only caring about killing Howe, resenting being forced to become a Warden, to finding a reason to live when he starts a romance with Morrigan, seeing on his adventure how revenge and obsession can destroy you and the ones you love (Zathrian and the Werewolf Curse, Branka and the Anvil), finding no release when he kills Howe, letting go of his hatred and giving Loghain a second chance as a Warden, the drama with the Dark Ritual, (ironically) accepting his role as a Warden after doing the Dark Ritual and defeating the Archdemon because he now has a family he's sworn to himself to protect, but depressed he can never see them, and then in Witch Hunt when he tracks down Morrigan and enters the Elluvian with her. Hawke has a good story too despite how the game turned out. Like the way I role played Hawke was mirroring Nier, a generally decent guy who will stop at nothing to protect his friends and sister. And the tragedy that he keeps failing to do that as the years go by. And I really liked the ending where Bethany is in the Circle and Hawke sides with the Mages. Like, Hawke and Bethany have spent their whole lives running from the Templars and living in fear. And when Bethany is found and sent to the Circle she's basically a hostage to make Hawke fall in line under Meredith. Now at the end the both of them stop running and face the Templars head on, and despite the odds they prevail and live to tell the tale of how lovely the Circles are. The Inquisitor... there's potential for good storytelling. Like playing as an Elf and romancing Solas for all the drama about the truth of the Ancient Elves. Or trying, and failing, to deny that you're the second coming of Andraste to the unwashed masses who need a symbol to latch onto and give them hope in all the chaos. But they really need to address that the Inquisition has become like Outer Heaven by the end of the game; an army without ties to any nation or ideology but whose power rivals the rest of the world. It's not hard to imagine a Big Boss Inquisitor playthrough given what you can do and what happens. SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Aug 28, 2015 |
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Aug 28, 2015 22:38
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I say Warden, because they are less defined, are not voiced, and have the most options for background choice (i.e., Origins). That makes it feel much more like the character is actually yours, and you have far more dialogue options when the responses don't have to be recorded--meaning you have far more varied ways to express your character's personality, and you fill in your own voice instead of a voice actor struggling to emote but still be neutral enough for everyone. To me, Hawke felt like a very superficial definition of a character, with three very limited options for "THIS IS MY PERSONALITY", not even "this is how I'm reacting to this situation". I could go on about this, but there are things I like about DA2, and Hawke was definitely not one of them. The character never felt cohesive or anything other than flat to me, not to mention every dialogue option felt disconnected from what was actually happening in the game. I found the Inquisitor a significant improvement over Hawke, although it could never top playing Bhelen's even more vicious older brother or a militantly anti-human city elf. eating only apples posted:Now I regret my Inquisitor choices - elf mage, human rogue - because I want to go dwarf for my next run and have very little interest in playing warrior. Will go archer rogue unless someone can talk me into warrior. I played mage in Origins, II, and my first run of Inquisition, and if I wasn't set on being a dwarf for my third go I'd do mage again. Someone tell me that warrior is fun to play.
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Aug 28, 2015 23:10
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ApplesandOranges posted:So question: the games themselves aside, who is your favourite protaganist, the Warden, Hawke, or Inquisitor? Or at least which is your favourite in how you're able to play them. Hawke is also my favorite. I think Hawke benefited from the strongest supporting cast, from the personality chooser, and from interacting with their backstory so much. Consequently that strong backstory is also a great benefit to the Warden's characterization. Hawke strikes a good balance between being their own character and having a lot of concrete concepts as a foundation for the player to build on. Playing him feels really natural. Basically Hawke is awesome and the best executed part of DA2 besides Varric. The Quiz is also cool but so much of them is smoke and mirrors and stuff we never get to see, I think it really hurt the roleplaying aspect for Inquisition.
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Aug 28, 2015 23:59
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I still say the DAO dwarven commoner was my favorite. Seeing him go from living in a hovel with his abusive mother to saving Ferelden and being declared a paragon is the most satisfying arc in the series. I nearly blushed during the Winter Palace segment when those two dwarves mention Paragon Brosca  Playing Hawke as a sarcastic mage who was actively hated by his brother and most of his friends and actively made the worst possible decision at every turn wasn't quite as compelling. eating only apples posted:I'm on your side, I've played one Warden, one Hawke and two Inquisitors and my Hawke was a real character reflected in her dialogue. For all the roleplaying you can do with the Warden and the Inquisitor, it all comes together in a more meaningful way with Hawke. My Hawke grew as a character in my mind and in the game, and realistically I know that was all down to my head, but I haven't managed to hit the same notes with either of my Inquisitors. The three dialogue moods for Hawke may have been over-simplified but I prefer it to not knowing exactly how my Inquisitor is going to take an innocuous-sounding line of conversation. Warrior is probably the funnest it's ever been, which means it's still marginally less fun than playing the other two classes, but it's not, like, DAO warrior bad. At the very least you could see how good Reaver is when not being mishandled by Iron Bull's AI, and I haven't played it but I heard Templar has some pretty good combo setups.
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Aug 29, 2015 01:21
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Wolfsheim posted:I still say the DAO dwarven commoner was my favorite. Seeing him go from living in a hovel with his abusive mother to saving Ferelden and being declared a paragon is the most satisfying arc in the series. I nearly blushed during the Winter Palace segment when those two dwarves mention Paragon Brosca I was a dwarf commoner as well but female. I feel like orgins let me make the character more my own then inquisition and hawke was either for or against mages. I was a warrior in dao a rog in da2 and a warrior again in da:I but i reset a bunch to see all the play styles and I enjoyed being the tank for my pt since the ae for it is dumb. I later respeced into being 2h and using cassandra over a second mage to make it more difficult in hard. All my characters are pro mage pro elf though.
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Aug 29, 2015 01:34
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Despite the cool tidbits of backstory you receive over the course of Inquisition, I feel like the Inquisitor is much more of a blank slate than the other two, I found it quite hard to roleplay as you're given almost no context at the beginning of the game apart from a small text bio. It's very difficult for me to separate the idea of Hawke the character from my (very negative) opinion of the game but as I try I'm honestly not remembering much about the character themselves. Maybe it was because I was playing a diplomatic Hawke which probably contributed to my boredom and frustration. One of these days I'll go back and try out Sarcastic Hawke but the thought of having to interact with any other character in that game just makes me want to play another Aggressive Hawke playthrough so I can constantly tell everyone to go to hell. For me the Warden is best because of the flexibility in the Origins and the wealth of Origin and/or race specific dialogue options. And of course the reason why this was possible with the Warden was the unvoiced protagonist aspect which also contributes to my favouritism as I'm one of those weirdos that really prefers an unvoiced protagonist. All of the origins are weaker or stronger depending on who you ask but a couple of playthroughs stick out in my mind when thinking back on DA:O (I've played the first game an inordinate amount more than the other two): The Human Noble for the context of being a native Fereldan and all the business with Howe - I always found it really easy to go right along with Alistair in his blind hatred of the "villains" as a Human Noble because of course you should, the fucker murdered your family. I loved the interactions you could later have in Awakening with Nathaniel as a Human Noble also. And the Dwarf Noble, which is one of my favourite protagonists in any RPG; both Dwarf origins are excellent at world building and immersing you in Dwarven culture and society, albeit at opposite ends of the spectrum, but the Noble origin has my favourite story. The politicking you can do in the start can be handled in a few different ways and there's a couple weird things like being able to father an illegitimate child and being able to be a raging rear end in a top hat to Gorim. Plus there's so much more weight to the Orzammar portion on the main quest, an aspect which I felt was sorely lacking from other origins. My Dwarf Nobles maybe failed politicians but are ever practical - I always have them tell Morrigan to gently caress right off at the earliest opportunity, never recruit Leliana, slit Zevran's throat, spare Loghain and then Ultimate Sacrifice because really you should have died in the Deep Roads at the start of the game.
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Aug 29, 2015 02:24
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Agreed with everyone who said that the Warden was the most robust and personable PC.
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Aug 29, 2015 02:44
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I can see why people would find Hawke somewhat compelling given his/her backstory and desire to just live a quiet life despite being surrounded by maniacs, but I can't really agree. In most stories where a commoner is forced onto greatness, they reach a point where they have to admit that they aren't just a commoner anymore and start taking the responsibility of a hero. Hawke just doesn't. They continue to think like they once were and never seem to attempt to be proactive in stopping the madness around them before it all starts to erupt. Just going off and taking the orders of actual important people even after they've been proven to be compromised in some fashion. Combine that with the gaggle of screw-ups that Hawke associated with for seven years and I can't see him/her as anything besides a failure of a heroic archetype. As for the Warden, I kind of like the Mage origin as a sort of coming of age story. That and it ties nicely with the trouble at Redcliffe as a source of guilt for him/her.
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Aug 29, 2015 02:58
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Geostomp posted:I can see why people would find Hawke somewhat compelling given his/her backstory and desire to just live a quiet life despite being surrounded by maniacs, but I can't really agree. I like in Inquisition Hawke accepts responsibility for his gently caress-ups like uncovering Red Lyrium and especially releasing Corypheus, and keeps his friends/loved ones away from him so they won't get killed by him as he helps the Inquisition. It's also great storytelling if you leave Hawke in the Fade as it's probably one of the few times he's like a real hero (although I don't leave Hawke behind). SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 03:08 on Aug 29, 2015 |
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Aug 29, 2015 03:05
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SgtSteel91 posted:I like in Inquisition Hawke accepts responsibility for his gently caress-ups like uncovering Red Lyrium and especially releasing Corypheus, and keeps his friends/loved ones away from him so they won't get killed by him as he helps the Inquisition. It's also great storytelling if you leave Hawke in the Fade as it's probably one of the few times he's like a real hero (although I don't leave Hawke behind). doesnt he die either way? the cutscene choice is like pick who you send to their death so I saved hawke because Varric is the best and I assumed he would be super pissed. but at the end it shows the greywardens reforming their ways and coming out of the shadows and it says the ones at weisshupt are pissed off about it and that there is no word from hawke in weisshupt. I read that as he got killed by them
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Aug 29, 2015 06:11
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snergle posted:doesnt he die either way? the cutscene choice is like pick who you send to their death so I saved hawke because Varric is the best and I assumed he would be super pissed. but at the end it shows the greywardens reforming their ways and coming out of the shadows and it says the ones at weisshupt are pissed off about it and that there is no word from hawke in weisshupt. I read that as he got killed by them There's no word coming out of Weisshaupt period, and what I took form the epilogue was either the Wardens in Weisshaupt are fighting each other (that Hawke probably started) or something even worse is happening that the Wardens there are dealing with (that Hakwe probably started). Either way I don't think Hawke is going to die that easily. If only because of the poo poo-storm that would happen if Hawke did get killed of that easily. SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Aug 29, 2015 |
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Aug 29, 2015 06:15
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snergle posted:doesnt he die either way? the cutscene choice is like pick who you send to their death so I saved hawke because Varric is the best and I assumed he would be super pissed. but at the end it shows the greywardens reforming their ways and coming out of the shadows and it says the ones at weisshupt are pissed off about it and that there is no word from hawke in weisshupt. I read that as he got killed by them I imagine the conclusion is so they can cover Hawke one of two ways in DA4: If Hawke isn't in the game, they can just say he's dead either from the Fade or whatever's happening in Weisshaupt. If he is, they can either say, 'Oh, I actually survived the Fade spider guy' or he was just kept busy at Weisshaupt.' It can't be as bad a backpedalling as they did for Leliana. I can't really decide who I like playing more in Inquisition in terms of race. Dwarves are rad and being a Dwarf Artificer is also neat. Qunari are also great, Elves have backstory, and Humans aren't as boring as they were in Origins, although they're still a wee bit bland (man I wish they got that second Origin for the Warrior/Rogue, being a Human Noble for the umpteenth time is boring).
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Aug 29, 2015 06:39
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SgtSteel91 posted:There's no word coming out of Weisshaupt period, and what I took form the epilogue was either the Wardens in Weisshaupt are fighting each other (that Hawke probably started) or something even worse is happening that the Wardens there are dealing with (that Hakwe probably started). Either way I don't think Hawke is going to die that easily. If only because of the poo poo-storm that would happen if Hawke did get killed of that easily. I kinda thought that everything that happens with Hawke is a way to conveniently tie up loose ends so fewer unstoppable badasses are around. It must be annoying accounting for Hawke, Hawke's love interest, Logain, Warden Alistair and the Warden-Commander all running around, so killing them off or having them travel to a faraway land is a pretty good way to do it.
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Aug 29, 2015 06:46
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What is the point of approval? The other games seemed to have some use for it but I've not noticed it in this
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Aug 29, 2015 09:28
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Jose posted:What is the point of approval? The other games seemed to have some use for it but I've not noticed it in this You need it to trigger character sidequests, particularly important if you want to romance somebody. Has there been an agreed upon 'weakest' specialization? Necromancer or something?
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Aug 29, 2015 09:32
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I wish characters would leave if you piss them off enough. I know some of them get angry at you and you can tell them to gently caress off, but I'd like to see some choose to leave regardless of whether you want it or not. I have no idea why Vivienne for example is still here despite me freeing mages and apostates every chance I get.
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Aug 29, 2015 10:31
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Cole and Dorian will, in fact, leave with low approval. Viv and Bull are special cases apparently, in that they'll stick around forever if they join but aren't plot important enough to necessitate their permanency.
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Aug 29, 2015 10:36
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Those two kinda make sense, though. Bull is a Ben-Hassrath operative on a mission to hang out with you and the leader of a professional mercenary band paid by you. Vivienne has more to gain by being a member of a pro-mage Inquisition than being on her own. How would you even make the Iron Bull hate you? Dude is the chillest.
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Aug 29, 2015 11:41
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ApplesandOranges posted:Cole and Dorian will, in fact, leave with low approval. Dorian got mad and left after I punched him but I kind of got the impression that the game always gives you an option to hold onto him even if approval has bottomed out
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Aug 29, 2015 12:36
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