PYF Dark Enlightenment Thinker

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divabot: Jun 17, 2015; A polite little mouse!

Some sneer culturist is being terribly unpleasant. I note the upvoting comment from Fluttershy, author of the much-upvoted Effects of Castration on the Life Expectancy of Contemporary Men. I expect someone is bored enough to troll the ruins of LW with a sock farm.

edit: PUA for philosophers by Phil Goetz, who used to be one of the less silly LWers. (tl;dr �i�ek's wife is hottt therefore be more like �i�ek. Of course, this is probably the only way to sell �i�ek to LW.) This was promoted to the front page.

divabot has a new favorite as of 13:00 on Sep 3, 2015

# ? Sep 3, 2015 12:51

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# ? May 9, 2024 03:30

Helsing: Aug 23, 2003; DON'T POST IN THE ELECTION THREAD UNLESS YOU JOE BIDEN

Have any NRx thinkers actually developed a theory for why Enlightenment values caught on and have been so successful? According to neo-reactionaries why is 'the Cathedral' so dominant within society and how did it originally achieve this dominance? Is there some particular historical moment that is seen as the fall from grace that they are 'reactionary' toward?

Also, following from that question, do any of them ever actually address the fact that they claim to be anti-progressive but many of their prominent members seem to think that technological progress will be the key to their success?

# ? Sep 3, 2015 17:41

Cingulate: Oct 23, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

Helsing posted:

Have any NRx thinkers actually developed a theory for why Enlightenment values caught on and have been so successful? According to neo-reactionaries why is 'the Cathedral' so dominant within society and how did it originally achieve this dominance? Is there some particular historical moment that is seen as the fall from grace that they are 'reactionary' toward?

Also, following from that question, do any of them ever actually address the fact that they claim to be anti-progressive but many of their prominent members seem to think that technological progress will be the key to their success?

Pick a few:

- social "progress" entails social degeneration
- anything post-Victorian is bad
- "Enlightenment" "values", aren't
- those who dress up as enlightened these days are truly anti science (denying Race Reality!)
- ideology
- CULTURAL MARXISM

...

- CULTURAL MARXISM

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:00

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

The notion of "progressive" values doesn't always encompass technology. For example in the Victorian era industrial revolution, technology was a great excuse for why the White race should take over the world.

Most Nrx ideas explain progressive (i.e. Leftist) values as happening for two main reasons: one is the idea that the undesirables/immigrants/poors are outbreeding the upper classes. These untermenschen, it is assumed, all love progressivism because it's tied into affirmative action and the welfare state and white guilt.

The other supposed prong of the rise of progressivism is THE JOOOOOOOZ who dominate academia and the media, and thus exile and browbeat the noble racists out of the public sphere.

Pretty much every variation of Nrx narrative on this issue is that THE JOOOOOS are the puppetmasters who use the mud people to destroy the white race.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:04

Cingulate: Oct 23, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

neonnoodle posted:

The other supposed prong of the rise of progressivism is THE JOOOOOOOZ who dominate academia and the media, and thus exile and browbeat the noble racists out of the public sphere.

Pretty much every variation of Nrx narrative on this issue is that THE JOOOOOS are the puppetmasters who use the mud people to destroy the white race.

I think you're confused. Moldbug is Jewish. Moldbug wants Steve Jobs (Syrian/honorary Jew) or Sergej Brin to literally rule the US. Sure, there are also antisemitic neoreactionaries, but then, show me a place where no anti-semites breathe and I see a place without oxygen.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:23

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

divabot posted:

Some sneer culturist is being terribly unpleasant. I note the upvoting comment from Fluttershy, author of the much-upvoted Effects of Castration on the Life Expectancy of Contemporary Men. I expect someone is bored enough to troll the ruins of LW with a sock farm.

edit: PUA for philosophers by Phil Goetz, who used to be one of the less silly LWers. (tl;dr �i�ek's wife is hottt therefore be more like �i�ek. Of course, this is probably the only way to sell �i�ek to LW.) This was promoted to the front page.

I once made a joke to a friend that analytics angry at continentals tended to sound like Nice Guys. "Why do the masses go after obscurantist French scribblers instead of rigorous logical guys like me?"

It's kind of fun to be proven right.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:41

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

Helsing posted:

Have any NRx thinkers actually developed a theory for why Enlightenment values caught on and have been so successful? According to neo-reactionaries why is 'the Cathedral' so dominant within society and how did it originally achieve this dominance? Is there some particular historical moment that is seen as the fall from grace that they are 'reactionary' toward?

Also, following from that question, do any of them ever actually address the fact that they claim to be anti-progressive but many of their prominent members seem to think that technological progress will be the key to their success?

A magical space god made up of evil mind viruses took over the world. We call this god "Cthulhu" and he always swims left.

On a completely unrelated note, progressivists are so dumb for uncritically accepting the whig theory of history.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:45

Cingulate: Oct 23, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

The Vosgian Beast posted:

I once made a joke to a friend that analytics angry at continentals tended to sound like Nice Guys. "Why do the masses go after obscurantist French scribblers instead of rigorous logical guys like me?"

It's kind of fun to be proven right.

This analogy is perfect in every which way.

You can fill out the blanks with a detached scrawny smoking French guy in all black and one girl on his left, one on his right knee. Or with fat sweating intense Zizek and his harem of 17 year old slavic women, cuter than Putin's gymnast. And then imagine Aurini behind them, trembling lips, he just accidentally swallowed his cigar, his only thought: "Sarkeesjewssssss! My dick is made out of logic, burning logic"

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:47

Cingulate: Oct 23, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

The Vosgian Beast posted:

We call this god "Cthulhu" and he always swims left.

I know (hope) this is an echo chamber for the following, but I just want to scream it whenever I see that "always left" line: yes, he does. Thankfully; because that sentence is equivalent to "human empathy and rationality slowly increase with time, and Lecky's circle slowly grows with time".

# ? Sep 3, 2015 19:51

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

Cingulate posted:

I think you're confused. Moldbug is Jewish. Moldbug wants Steve Jobs (Syrian/honorary Jew) or Sergej Brin to literally rule the US. Sure, there are also antisemitic neoreactionaries, but then, show me a place where no anti-semites breathe and I see a place without oxygen.

I think the conspiratorial idea-pattern of some kind of gnomic elite manipulating the levers of public opinion and various other unconnected environments, especially if money is involved, is inevitably going to look like an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory even if it is being promoted by Orthodox Jews.

What I want to know is: The forces of cultural Marxism that they describe seem to be superior to their own ideologies on every axis. They have won the day and, by their own accounts, are making steady headways on remaining areas of resistance... the forces of consumer capitalism and godless Communism tagged up to put Adolf Elizabeth and his little buddies Tojo and Benito through a hundred tables during WorldWarMania 2. Why not join the winning side?

# ? Sep 3, 2015 20:16

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

Nessus posted:

I think the conspiratorial idea-pattern of some kind of gnomic elite manipulating the levers of public opinion and various other unconnected environments, especially if money is involved, is inevitably going to look like an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory even if it is being promoted by Orthodox Jews.

What I want to know is: The forces of cultural Marxism that they describe seem to be superior to their own ideologies on every axis. They have won the day and, by their own accounts, are making steady headways on remaining areas of resistance... the forces of consumer capitalism and godless Communism tagged up to put Adolf Elizabeth and his little buddies Tojo and Benito through a hundred tables during WorldWarMania 2. Why not join the winning side?

They just assume it will perish under its contradictions.

Ask the Marxists how well THAT assumption goes, Dark Enlightenment.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 20:29

I AM GRANDO: Aug 20, 2006

Helsing posted:

Have any NRx thinkers actually developed a theory for why Enlightenment values caught on and have been so successful? According to neo-reactionaries why is 'the Cathedral' so dominant within society and how did it originally achieve this dominance? Is there some particular historical moment that is seen as the fall from grace that they are 'reactionary' toward?

Also, following from that question, do any of them ever actually address the fact that they claim to be anti-progressive but many of their prominent members seem to think that technological progress will be the key to their success?

I don't know that I'd call them thinkers, personally.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 20:42

Curvature of Earth: Sep 9, 2011; Projected cost of
invading Canada:
$900

Jack Gladney posted:

I don't know that I'd call them thinkers, personally.

They're definitely thinking, it's just their thoughts are atrocious.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 20:56

Toph Bei Fong: Feb 29, 2008

divabot posted:

edit: PUA for philosophers by Phil Goetz, who used to be one of the less silly LWers. (tl;dr �i�ek's wife is hottt therefore be more like �i�ek. Of course, this is probably the only way to sell �i�ek to LW.) This was promoted to the front page.

quote:

People I expect to be acceptably rigorous:

Sam Harris (atheistic morality & philosophy): .58, 7 books in 12 years.

Top of the list. Perfect.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:08

Cingulate: Oct 23, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

Nessus posted:

I think the conspiratorial idea-pattern of some kind of gnomic elite manipulating the levers of public opinion and various other unconnected environments, especially if money is involved, is inevitably going to look like an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory even if it is being promoted by Orthodox Jews.

What I want to know is: The forces of cultural Marxism that they describe seem to be superior to their own ideologies on every axis. They have won the day and, by their own accounts, are making steady headways on remaining areas of resistance... the forces of consumer capitalism and godless Communism tagged up to put Adolf Elizabeth and his little buddies Tojo and Benito through a hundred tables during WorldWarMania 2. Why not join the winning side?

As has been posted in I think this thread before: a core tenant of fascism is that the enemies are simultaneously too strong and too weak.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:14

divabot: Jun 17, 2015; A polite little mouse!

The Vosgian Beast posted:

I once made a joke to a friend that analytics angry at continentals tended to sound like Nice Guys. "Why do the masses go after obscurantist French scribblers instead of rigorous logical guys like me?"

It's kind of fun to be proven right.

oh dear goodness may I please quote that elsewhere

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:32

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

divabot posted:

oh dear goodness may I please quote that elsewhere

Go right ahead.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:33

Darth Walrus: Feb 13, 2012

While we're talking about white self-taught dudes posting endless :words:

of weird racist philosophy, let's pour one out for the demise of Time Cube.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:38

MizPiz: May 29, 2013; by Athanatos

Darth Walrus posted:

While we're talking about white self-taught dudes posting endless of weird racist philosophy, let's pour one out for the demise of Time Cube.

N-no. How could they let this happen? :qq:

# ? Sep 3, 2015 21:45

divabot: Jun 17, 2015; A polite little mouse!

MizPiz posted:

N-no. How could they let this happen?

Gene Ray likely died five years ago and the hosting finally expired. (His other domains disappeared through July and August.) The domain is up for auction; RW is considering bidding, but there's that tawdry �financially responsible behaviour with nonprofit resources that have been entrusted to you and no 'for the lulz' probably doesn't count� thing.

# ? Sep 3, 2015 22:14

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

Gene Ray was more likable than most of these people, because no one took him seriously

# ? Sep 3, 2015 22:21

Assepoester: Jul 18, 2004; Can't post for 10 years!; Melman v2

http://popehat.com/2015/09/02/satire-vs-potentially-defamatory-factual-statements-an-illustration/

# ? Sep 4, 2015 10:24

I AM GRANDO: Aug 20, 2006

If he was raping them, why would they wait for him?

# ? Sep 4, 2015 15:06

BornAPoorBlkChild: Sep 24, 2012

Came across this dipshit by accident

http://www.elocutioner.com/

enjoy!

quote:

Smartest Person In The Room

If I�m not the smartest person in the room then I�m probably in the wrong room. It�s all about ego.

I tested in the top half of the top one percent in intelligence for this country. I�ve had a long career in a very intellectually demanding field of software where I�ve worked with some extremely intelligent people, at which many were smarter than me. I am smart. Very smart. I�ve seen smart up close. And I can tell you that being smart in one thing doesn�t automatically mean you�re smart in any another. I often found that my otherwise brilliant friends were completely uneducated or mis-educated about politics and held nonsensical and completely disprovable beliefs, but still argued them for years without moderating their positions one bit. From personal experience it seems arrogance strongly corresponds with intelligence.

I�m sure there have been volumes written about the subject, but I suspect it comes from always being the smartest and fastest academically so the ego gets tied up in that. And humility is hard. I went through a painful ego-destroying ordeal in my mid-20�s. It was �humiliating.� But because I decided to sanely put my own long term interests of intellectually growing over the short term displeasure I came out way, way ahead on the deal. I had a much better idea of who I really was afterwards. I guess I �found� myself, to an extent (but that�s an ongoing journey). I only wish it had happened earlier in life. My friend compared it to what he went through in boot camp � they completely psychologically and physically tore people down to the foundation and built them back up.

Wisdom comes from honestly applying intelligence to analyze information. Ego distorts the perception of the information and warps the analysis to fit the ego. If you can�t see the world for what it is and you can�t admit uncomfortable facts then you�re always going to be confused or deluded. And since most of the information presented is filtered or is analysis or spin, or just plain incorrect, the process gets that much more difficult. That�s why it�s important to understand the agenda of the source of the information. If you can correct for any bias you�ll be closer to the objective truth. That�s why trust is important, why it�s hard to build and easy to lose. Trusted sources are extremely valuable, but should continually be verified as well.

Our society as a whole, and the media in particular, place too much emphasis on apparent intelligence and not nearly enough on wisdom and truth. History matters. Honesty matters. Facts matter. This is why learning common debating techniques matters � you�ll be better able to see the frauds and phonies a mile away. Straw man. Deflection. Ad hominem. Appeal to authority. Equivocation. Etc. Ideas stand or fall on their own, and when you can�t attack or defend the idea you attack or defend the person espousing the idea. What is said may be less important to how it is said. Understanding the difference between rhetoric and dialectic is important as well. Are you arguing the facts or appealing to emotion?

So, outside of work, statistically I�m almost always the smartest person in the room. I would much rather be in a room full of people wiser than myself. Given the typical arrogance of people at my IQ level I�m far more likely to learn something important if I am the smartest. It�s all about ego. Or lack of it.

# ? Sep 4, 2015 16:32

Toph Bei Fong: Feb 29, 2008

Race Realists posted:

Came across this dipshit by accident

http://www.elocutioner.com/

quote:
I tested in the top half of the top one percent in intelligence for this country.

According to my (quick, non-scientific) calculations, there are at least 1,594,500 people as smart as him in this country! Worldwide, there are about 35,000,000!

:wow:

# ? Sep 4, 2015 17:14

Woolie Wool: Jun 2, 2006

How can he talk about some experience making him more humble when everyone can see what a puffed-up braggart he is?

# ? Sep 4, 2015 17:18

Hate Fibration: Apr 8, 2013; FLÃSHYN!

Race Realists posted:

So, outside of work, statistically I�m almost always the smartest person in the room. I would much rather be in a room full of people wiser than myself. Given the typical arrogance of people at my IQ level I�m far more likely to learn something important if I am the smartest. It�s all about ego. Or lack of it.

Whelp

# ? Sep 4, 2015 18:11

I AM GRANDO: Aug 20, 2006

The intellectually demanding field of software

# ? Sep 4, 2015 18:13

Hate Fibration: Apr 8, 2013; FLÃSHYN!

Jack Gladney posted:

The intellectually demanding field of software

Why, specifically, do programmers massively overestimate their intelligence so much? Is it just because Silicon Valley blows sweaty chunks and makes programmers think they're intellectual rockstars?

"I do javascript front-end development. I am clearly an intellectual giant."

# ? Sep 4, 2015 18:24

DStecks: Feb 6, 2012

Hate Fibration posted:

Why, specifically, do programmers massively overestimate their intelligence so much? Is it just because Silicon Valley blows sweaty chunks and makes programmers think they're intellectual rockstars?

"I do javascript front-end development. I am clearly an intellectual giant."

It's because there's this perception out there that programming is this mystical art that you need to be a next-level intelligence to understand, when it's not really different from any kind of mechanical repair or electrical work. This perception attracts people who see themselves as intelligent, and they have no incentive to refute this perception.

It also doesn't help that programming education is often very limited unless you're prepared to self-teach or take post-secondary education for it, and involves vernacular and concepts that don't have easy analogues outside the world of computers. Half the difficulty of learning to code is just getting through the front door, but once you basically understand what programming is, then anyone who's at all mechanically inclined can do it. Programs are just machines made of words.

# ? Sep 4, 2015 18:38

Woolie Wool: Jun 2, 2006

It's basically a product of the gigantic IT/dot-com boom from the 1990s. A lot of programmers seem to live in this fantasy land where it's still 1997 and IT is going to revolutionize everything and computer experts will be the most valuable people in the entire economy.

It didn't turn out that way.

# ? Sep 4, 2015 18:57

Hate Fibration: Apr 8, 2013; FLÃSHYN!

DStecks posted:

It's because there's this perception out there that programming is this mystical art that you need to be a next-level intelligence to understand, when it's not really different from any kind of mechanical repair or electrical work. This perception attracts people who see themselves as intelligent, and they have no incentive to refute this perception.

This was something that I always found hard to understand. And I think, in part, is it's because I taught myself to code when I was really young. And the reason I stopped is because a lot of coding is pretty mechanical and dull. Also I was infuriated by what I saw as a preponderance of pointless abstraction(funny how things like that turn out, I'm in pure math now.)

But I've also always been under the impression that programming gets more interesting and more intellectually demanding as you dig deeper? Sort of like the difference between being a mechanic and being an engineer? Would it be inaccurate to assume that there are very different types of programmers that do work that requires very different levels of ability?

quote:

It also doesn't help that programming education is often very limited unless you're prepared to self-teach or take post-secondary education for it, and involves vernacular and concepts that don't have easy analogues outside the world of computers. Half the difficulty of learning to code is just getting through the front door, but once you basically understand what programming is, then anyone who's at all mechanically inclined can do it. Programs are just machines made of words.

Yeah. A really good example of this is Minecraft actually. Minecraft has this stuff in it called redstone, and you can make logic gates out of it. And a lot of kids make fairly elaborate machines with them, and they don't understand that they're actually coding.

# ? Sep 4, 2015 19:08

Heresiarch: Oct 6, 2005; Literature is not exhaustible, for the sufficient and simple reason that no single book is. A book is not an isolated being: it is a relationship, an axis of innumerable relationships.

Race Realists posted:

Came across this dipshit by accident

http://www.elocutioner.com/

enjoy!

quote:

And I can tell you that being smart in one thing doesn�t automatically mean you�re smart in any another.

Except, you know, in this one case.

I tested as being some kind of Nobel Laureate level supergenius as a teenager and thankfully nobody ever told me until I was well into my 30's and was already well familiar with my ability to be a complete dumbass who makes terrible life decisions and fucks poo poo up constantly. I consider myself to be strong evidence that these tests are completely meaningless.

Hate Fibration posted:

Why, specifically, do programmers massively overestimate their intelligence so much? Is it just because Silicon Valley blows sweaty chunks and makes programmers think they're intellectual rockstars?

"I do javascript front-end development. I am clearly an intellectual giant."

In one of the bitcoin threads:

fmguru posted:

its him, its that guy, the libertarian nerd who figures that if he taught himself apache configuration and php then hes a certified supergenius and doing something like running a billion dollar currency exchange should be a piece of cake to a world bestriding intellectual colossus like himself

# ? Sep 4, 2015 19:35

MizPiz: May 29, 2013; by Athanatos

Woolie Wool posted:

It's basically a product of the gigantic IT/dot-com boom from the 1990s. A lot of programmers seem to live in this fantasy land where it's still 1997 and IT is going to revolutionize everything and computer experts will be the most valuable people in the entire economy.

It didn't turn out that way.

Can't wait for it to not turn out that way again.

# ? Sep 4, 2015 20:39

raminasi: Jan 25, 2005; a last drink with no ice

Hate Fibration posted:

But I've also always been under the impression that programming gets more interesting and more intellectually demanding as you dig deeper? Sort of like the difference between being a mechanic and being an engineer? Would it be inaccurate to assume that there are very different types of programmers that do work that requires very different levels of ability?

It can. The real question is whether any particular task at hand actually requires that greater degree of intellectual engagement. Complicated theoretical problems are more fun to work on than boring business applications, so some (most?) devs have a tendency to subconsciously treat the latter as though they're the former.

# ? Sep 5, 2015 11:04

divabot: Jun 17, 2015; A polite little mouse!

Hate Fibration posted:

Yeah. A really good example of this is Minecraft actually. Minecraft has this stuff in it called redstone, and you can make logic gates out of it. And a lot of kids make fairly elaborate machines with them, and they don't understand that they're actually coding.

Marco Rubio actually said something smart in public along these lines recently. Minecraft isn't the best example, Scratch would be better, but Minecraft is popular and well-known. So now I want presidential candidates to mention Scratch, which small children take to like ducks to water.

The field pays mediocre coders unusually well for the ability required. So obviously the free market has told programmers personally that they are sooper-geniuses and should rewrite society.

# ? Sep 5, 2015 11:45

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

Check this poo poo out

http://immortality-roadmap.com/IMMORTEN.pdf

It was proofread by a Dark Enlightenment guy, it's semi-relevant dammit.

# ? Sep 6, 2015 18:21

Woolie Wool: Jun 2, 2006

I like how it's a "roadmap". Human aging and death are not a massively complex tangle of different processes, many of which are completely unavoidable aspects of being made of cells and existing in our universe, but just a software bug or an incomplete feature. Immortality coming in Transhumanism v1.7.12, SVN build 3789.

I'm imagining some dipshit transhumanist in the future disabling biological processes that stop cell division and cause tissue aging, going "there I fixed aging :downs:

", and then all the mothers in the experiment die because the embryos turn into gigantic masses of cancer instead of immortal superbabies.

E: yeah, that's right--to do such drastic genetic modifications you don't experiment on healthy nerdbro volunteers, you experiment on women and make them pregnant with your frankenbabies.

Woolie Wool has a new favorite as of 18:49 on Sep 6, 2015

# ? Sep 6, 2015 18:41