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I figured that it was based on rugby, now i'll have to get into it
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Sep 7, 2015 22:22
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Man they really, really want people to get into the Stormystorm stormingstormers. Even the staunchest AoS zealot talk about how exciting AoS will be once other races are put in but there hasn't been anything on the release timeline but the most bland turd in a pile of poo poo. Has the Khorne army even seen anything since the starter box came out?
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Sep 7, 2015 22:27
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Has the Khorne army even seen anything since the starter box came out? The $2,000 skullfort and $30 skullfort rules pamphlet.
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Sep 7, 2015 22:33
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Silhouette posted:I figured that it was based on rugby, now i'll have to get into it Asides from the usual awkward jokes, I found the miniwargaming league vids to be really good way of seeing how the game plays: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OO9Wey6mfU
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Sep 7, 2015 22:41
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Man they really, really want people to get into the Stormystorm stormingstormers. Even the staunchest AoS zealot talk about how exciting AoS will be once other races are put in but there hasn't been anything on the release timeline but the most bland turd in a pile of poo poo. Has the Khorne army even seen anything since the starter box came out? i feel like they dug themselves into a hole on this one. any release that isn't something entirely new would mean confirming the rumors that everything from fantasy is getting squatted and the idiots who didn't stop buying gw things after the end times would definitely stop at that point.
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Sep 7, 2015 22:43
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Man they really, really want people to get into the Stormystorm stormingstormers. Even the staunchest AoS zealot talk about how exciting AoS will be once other races are put in but there hasn't been anything on the release timeline but the most bland turd in a pile of poo poo. Has the Khorne army even seen anything since the starter box came out? They got one week of releases with one big box of square-arsed horned-helmeted muscledudes.
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Sep 7, 2015 22:52
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Man they really, really want people to get into the Stormystorm stormingstormers. Even the staunchest AoS zealot talk about how exciting AoS will be once other races are put in but there hasn't been anything on the release timeline but the most bland turd in a pile of poo poo. Has the Khorne army even seen anything since the starter box came out? There was also talk about some fire dwarf mercenary guys (Red Slayers?) but no sign of them, I guess GW skimped on the ur-gold.
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Sep 7, 2015 22:53
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I can see why they think the robot angel badasses are what the kids will think is the coolest thing ever but you can really sense the desperation.
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Sep 7, 2015 22:56
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Saint Drogo posted:There was also talk about some fire dwarf mercenary guys (Red Slayers?) but no sign of them, I guess GW skimped on the ur-gold.  FYRESLAYERS fighting for ur-gold, but who knows what the gently caress.The Khorne dudes got shirtless cannibal barbarians with square butts and then they got what are basically chaos warriors with dumb fist-shields or something.
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Sep 7, 2015 23:00
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All the other armies are gonna get squatted. It's just Sigmarines and Khorne dudes now!
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Sep 7, 2015 23:56
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Before I start, I am no GW fanboy by any stretch of the imagination. In fact I haven't bought a single GW model in about 3 years. I became disheartened with 8th edition fantasy and stopped wargaming completely. I got quite excited by AOS simply because it was something new, and I probably at some point in the last two months have represented every point of view vigorously expressed in this forum. I was angry, frustrated and bewildered by what GW had done. Not so much to the setting, which I wasn't especially enamoured with, it hadn't really changed for 30 years, but what they did to the rules. I have been following discussions and my opinion has gradually been changing. Now I am not hear to tell you that AOS is a complete ruleset or that GW did a great job with the launch. Very amateurish in my view. But the view that this is only a narrative game, or that it isn't a tournament game is completely wrong. Most importantly, and I mean this having played fantasy for 20 years, this is the most balanced fantasy game GW has made. Sound ridiculous? Let me explain. Firstly, the idea that this is only for casual gamers is a nonsense. It is certainly great for the casual gamer because of its simplicity, and there is no thick rulebook to consume, but it doesn't mean it is only for them. Already there have been very successful AOS tournaments, and comp systems have been devised with ease. In fact it is much easier to comp than the previous game because it has far less unnecessary complexity, and there are far less variables to correct for. This makes it more tailored for tournament play not less. Also there are a plethora of scenarios which are the staple of tournaments. Warmachine which is the most tournament orientated game, is entirely scenario based. The idea that scenarios are for fluffy players is simply untrue. Finally, AOS and balance. To me the armies in AOS are the most balanced with each other than in the history of warhammer fantasy since I started playing it. If you thought previous editions were balanced you obviously dont remember the dark elf and daemon lists of recent times, the undead army of 5th edition and the heavy comp that had to accompany every recent fantasy tournament to achieve some semblance of fairness. The tomb king army used to get more points to spend it was that much weaker. Now every army feels potent and effective which is a credit to the work on the warscrolls. As a side criticism to this, people have spoken about the lack of versatility of armies now. It is certainly true that there are less armour and weapon options for example, but look at the army selection options. We are hearing more and more people saying that now everything in their army is viable, and the overarching factions of order, destruction etc mean you can add units from different armies. I think players have more freedom than they ever had previously. What AOS really lacks is an army design structure. This is GW's basic failing. But it is easy to rectify and in 2 months we already have comp systems not to mention one leaked by GW themselves to one of their stores. I have even seen a points system. Before you moan that the game is still unbalanced and the points aren't accurate. I welcome you to every GW game. This has been a long running issue in fantasy and 40k. GW are terrible at pointing and playtesting, hence the unbalanced armies. In 40k the eldar and necron factions are ridiculously unbalanced and they have a points system and army selection system that is very complex. So in summary, there is no reason whatsoever to believe that AOS cannot be effective for competitive play, it has done already, and have an army selection system that works, several have already, and finally give you a wide variety of effective unit options. It can be any game you want it to be.
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Sep 8, 2015 00:02
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I think we've seen that one already
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Sep 8, 2015 00:06
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Thirsty Dog posted:I think we've seen that one already Sorry, they all just sort of blur together. It's like people lined up to buy pineapples at the market and then ended up just going on a mescaline bender because reasons. I'm genuinely sort of wondering if any of this is going to have an effect on GW any time soon, because I can't imagine any of the leadership giving this less than the year-long campaign that I imagine they've plotted. And the side note for me is how long I have to pick up GW models on ebay before the price goes up because they go to GW Store only and then finally discontinued.
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Sep 8, 2015 00:11
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Silhouette posted:I figured that it was based on rugby, now i'll have to get into it Well they do carry the ball but its five players aside, the pitch is hockey sized/shaped, the ball is fired along the centre line to start and after scoring and you can even go behind the goals. The way the guards work as well - they get to move as part of a slam action and a bonus to that slam if they moved It feels very hockey to me and I'm certain its intentional
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Sep 8, 2015 01:01
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So nobody would object if I converted my models to have cybersticks and laserskates? 
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Sep 8, 2015 01:43
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When I see posts like this it really makes me wonder if any other companies outside of GW has a fanbase like they do. Like I can't picture any other company have reps literally saying they hate their existing fans and they purposely made those fans existing hundreds of dollars of product embarrassing to use or broken so other people won't want to associate with them and then end up with those same fans agree this is a good thing
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Sep 8, 2015 01:50
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Dr. VooDoo posted:When I see posts like this it really makes me wonder if any other companies outside of GW has a fanbase like they do. Like I can't picture any other company have reps literally saying they hate their existing fans and they purposely made those fans existing hundreds of dollars of product embarrassing to use or broken so other people won't want to associate with them and then end up with those same fans agree this is a good thing Palladium.
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Sep 8, 2015 02:20
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Dr. VooDoo posted:When I see posts like this it really makes me wonder if any other companies outside of GW has a fanbase like they do. Like I can't picture any other company have reps literally saying they hate their existing fans and they purposely made those fans existing hundreds of dollars of product embarrassing to use or broken so other people won't want to associate with them and then end up with those same fans agree this is a good thing Nintendo.
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Sep 8, 2015 02:34
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Dr. VooDoo posted:When I see posts like this it really makes me wonder if any other companies outside of GW has a fanbase like they do. Like I can't picture any other company have reps literally saying they hate their existing fans and they purposely made those fans existing hundreds of dollars of product embarrassing to use or broken so other people won't want to associate with them and then end up with those same fans agree this is a good thing Planned obsolescence is the hallmark of the video games industry.
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Sep 8, 2015 02:52
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To be fair, I hated most vocal customers back when I worked in the games industry because they were generally awful people
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Sep 8, 2015 04:04
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Silhouette posted:So nobody would object if I converted my models to have cybersticks and laserskates? Pretty sure anyone objecting to that would be in the wrong no matter what game you were playing.
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Sep 8, 2015 05:10
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AOS is completely unbound, right? There's no rules about army composition? Could...could you put Sigmarines and Bloodguys in the same army? 
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Sep 8, 2015 06:18
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von Metternich posted:AOS is completely unbound, right? There's no rules about army composition? "Just bring whatever models you think look cool man, we're all about having fun here at Age of Sigmar!"
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Sep 8, 2015 06:33
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*my face turns purple with barely contained rage as I mark down your army theme score for playing sigmarines + bloodguys together*
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Sep 8, 2015 06:40
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In previous editions of Warhammer Fantasy (and indeed in many wargames) there was the concept of 'chaff', a small unit that have very little combat ability and are generally included in a list just to get in the way of opposing units and die. Typically used to block movement or force overruns in unfavorable directions. Ideally very cheap in points cost and the more maneuverable the better. It's derived from the concept of the inedible stem of a grain crop: to separate the wheat from the chaff is an old concept about finding good in a pile of rubbish for example, and has also been historically referred to as anything aircraft drop to confuse radar detection. Either interpretation works in this setting, as chaff has traditionally been used in Warhammer to cause target priority problems, interfere with lines of sight, firing or charge lanes, and provide some kind of cheap tarpit to hold up the enemy while the better units in your force do the trick. Let's check out how to best make use of chaff in AoS, and be sure to check out our other tactics articles as well by clicking here. In AoS Now that there are no points in Warhammer: Age of Sigmar, some seem to believe that the time of chaff has passed us by and we no longer have use for these weak misdirection units, but I disagree strongly. If you're playing with a points-derived comp system such as SDK or Pool (both of which can have lists written in this excellent tool on http://www.scrollbuilder.com/) then there certainly still exist value disparities between units and you can take grots or gnoblars without as much pain from your list. However, I still believe there is value to your chaff even if you are using wound counts as a balancing factor or sticking to the core rules and using model count alone. "Why would anybody pick peasants over knights, or regular skeletons over grave guard?" is a question I imagine many of you asked yourselves once the game first came out. It stands to reason that taking more heroes and elite units than your opponent will make you more combat effective, and if you each take 20 models then the player with the elite units is more likely to win. In a straight dice rolling, statistically driven mash up in the middle, sure, but there is much more to the game than that if you know how to tactically use your toys. There is still value in using chaff (though if you want your chaff to be made of minotaurs, then I suppose you could do that too) but the tactic still can be effective. your designated chaff unit has the purpose of being somewhat of a distraction, and dying in a way that your opponent has to do something they would rather not have to kill them. Previously, you could have put two small units of skinks, for example, and had one flee from the charge leaving the other to die, angled in a way that the block would have its flank exposed. Since flee reactions are now limited, and units can much more easily 'multi-charge', don;t think that you won't lose both small units in this scenario. Some might think this means chaff is out, but it's still certainly in - you just need to adapt your use of it. Chaff can still work as a tarpit if you use it in the old fashion (a deep unit of skaven slaves, for example) but you can also change things a bit in Age of Sigmar to make use of the new rules. An optimal chaff unit in this new ruleset seems to look like a big wall of bodies, perhaps spread thin and wide. arranging like a net, the opponent loses the ability to move around them. In AoS, you cannot come within 3 inches of an enemy model in the movement phase so a relatively small unit in a broad arrangement effectively blocks the movement of anything that can't fly, and almost forces a charge out of the unit if it wants to move past your screen. There currently is no overrun mechanism, so if the enemy does come into combat with your chaff and destroys them outright or through battleshock, you still know basically where they are going to end up and can plan your subsequent movement phase accordingly, either to charge them or move past them to the artillery piece in the back, for instance. If by some miracle your chaff does survive the round (mystic shield + inspiring presence and some terrain for cover saves is one way to increase the odds of this happening), you have effectively locked them in place for the next turn and chaff is doing the job it did in previous editions of WHFB. Alternatively, you can have your chaff unit retreat instead of piling in if it has the ability, or simply move from combat in your subsequent movement phase, rearranging the unit into a broad net and playing the same coy game again the following turn. Considering that you don't know who will have the next turn at any given point in the game, this can be a great way to stymie your opponent's advance and keep him or her from maneuvering the way that they want. If you have a set of wizards or a cannon tossing out big damage and need to keep them defended, chaff is still a really useful tool even without a comp system, as long as you can play it right. As we see new battlescrolls emerge and new battleplan scenarios unveiled, we may find yet even more reasons to love and use chaff in our games, and I'm excited for the new tactical possibilities that will accompany it. How have you found chaff to fare in Age of Sigmar? Do you have any tips to share or other tactics you have explored? Let us know!
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Sep 8, 2015 08:19
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Silhouette posted:So nobody would object if I converted my models to have cybersticks and laserskates? No. But Dreadball is basically SPEEDBALL 2 BRUTAL DELUXE: SPACE ALIEN EDITION. I'd say go more Jai Alai or Tron than Space Hockey. I need people to play it with so I have a reason to assemble my Space Dorfs and Skaven.
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Sep 8, 2015 08:37
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Theres another managers meeting today, ostensibly for christmas sales training but my brother in law thinks there may be a strongly worded direction from up high regarding the sales of AOS. IE 'Sell it, its brilliant why arent you selling it!!!!' I imagine there wont be anyone brave enough to say 'Because its not very good.'
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Sep 8, 2015 08:55
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Captain Rufus posted:No. But Dreadball is basically SPEEDBALL 2 BRUTAL DELUXE: SPACE ALIEN EDITION. I'd say go more Jai Alai or Tron than Space Hockey. Seems more like space lacrosse to me. Mixed with hockey.
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Sep 8, 2015 08:55
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I've played a few games of Dreadball and it just didn't click with me the way Bloodbowl did. I can't quite put my finger on it, but it feels almost overly designed. It's fair and balanced and the randomness is toned down, but I felt it lacked character because of it. Maybe GW just gave me brain damage.
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Sep 8, 2015 09:39
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IMO it has more character, again because of the sudden twists you can get - hail marys are more exciting, it just feels more like sports to me, whereas blood bowl feels like a brawling sim
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Sep 8, 2015 09:54
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dammit, I'm gonna have to get Dreadball while it's £42 aren't I Makes me happy I didn't get the set from a guy earlier in the year at a bring-and-buy for 50, I wouldn't have had time to play it anyway.
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Sep 8, 2015 10:14
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Phoon posted:IMO it has more character, again because of the sudden twists you can get - hail marys are more exciting, it just feels more like sports to me, whereas blood bowl feels like a brawling sim So much like real sports vs. American football.
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Sep 8, 2015 10:15
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Drone posted:So much like real sports vs. American football. "Welcome back to Trench Warfare the sport! We've seen some blistering play here today, as the teams have advance five whole yards, nearly a record for a half. We look like we're about to see another play - nope, the coach has just called another timeout. See you after half an hour of us talking drivel and wall to wall adverts!" Dreadball is fun, not stopping to reset at all throws you the first time, when you realize you scored a point, but now are completely out of position for the next play!
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Sep 8, 2015 10:29
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Plus the whole thing of not scrapping your team because too many guys died in your first game.
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Sep 8, 2015 11:10
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Alright then, just ordered the Dreadball box set after watching that MWG video. The video, although titled "Learner's League" didn't really tell you how the game is played but from the dice rolls I think I can pick it up. Seems much faster than BB as many have said. Time will tell if any of my group will be converted though, so I'm basically buying it as a 'store copy' kind of thing so we can just jump in and play a game now and then. One of the guys in the group has been talking about setting up a BB league so it'll be interesting to see a back to back comparison. Will nostalgia and clunky play win over the modern game with smoother play?
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Sep 8, 2015 11:19
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krushgroove posted:Alright then, just ordered the Dreadball box set after watching that MWG video. The video, although titled "Learner's League" didn't really tell you how the game is played but from the dice rolls I think I can pick it up. Seems much faster than BB as many have said. Time will tell if any of my group will be converted though, so I'm basically buying it as a 'store copy' kind of thing so we can just jump in and play a game now and then. One of the guys in the group has been talking about setting up a BB league so it'll be interesting to see a back to back comparison. Will nostalgia and clunky play win over the modern game with smoother play? Beasts of War have a "Dreadball Academy" Series that goes through the rules. http://www.manticgames.com/games/dreadball/dreadball-academy.html
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Sep 8, 2015 12:14
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here's how dreadball is played: You have five actions each rush, you can split them amongst your players however you like. The basic actions are move, slam, steal, throw. The basic reactions to these are dodge and slamback (and catch for throws) Theres three types of players. Strikers throw, catch, steal, dodge. Guards slam and slamback. Jacks can do everything, but not as well as the others. Contest resolution is based on rolling several dice against a relevant score for your player and comparing the number of successes to your opponent, with circumstances and player type adding or removing dice. The more successes you get the more effective the action/reaction and you can get immediate free moves, do major damage etc as a result Big successes and especially extra moves are a big deal
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Sep 8, 2015 12:24
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So, basically, the game is designed around setting up big, spectacular events? I'm totally down for that, especially in a sports game.
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Sep 8, 2015 12:26
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Phoon posted:here's how dreadball is played: You also have special action cards that you can play that allow for cool poo poo.
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Sep 8, 2015 12:42
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There are also Keepers, which are Guards upgraded by experience when playing a season, MVPs, and giant MVPs that take up three hexes, but none of that is neeced for basic Dreadball. Also the Refbot reference app is free, as are the basic rules, you just need a Mantic Digital account.
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Sep 8, 2015 13:22
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