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Mr. Fortitude posted:Zero is a control freak who is willing to destroy his best friend's ideals just so he can use him as an image to the world. A legend. He doesn't want him dead but he absolutely is willing to imprison him and bend him to his will. Big Boss formed MSF after Snake Eater with the full intention of following the will of the Boss. It wasn't until Peace Walker that he rejected her will because he found out either from Strangelove or the Boss AI that she had the intention of giving up being a soldier, which was the betrayal in the eyes of Big Boss. Outer Heaven (as it was called in the ending of Peace Walker) was the true reaction by Big Boss to the betrayal by the Boss.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:18
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To be fair, Quiet and the Skulls are clothed while there is an hour long mission where the camera is almost always focused on Big Boss' naked rear end.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:18
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Buschmaki posted:I think that people can grow and change, and that their views regarding things can also change as well. And you think this game is a demonstration of that fact?
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Sep 8, 2015 21:26
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Chippita posted:Apparently someone found the cut episodes/chapters(62 unique missions) list in the Japanese files. Every one of those titles sounds so loving cool GOD DAMMIT
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Sep 8, 2015 21:27
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Chippita posted:Apparently someone found the cut episodes/chapters(62 unique missions) list in the Japanese files. This looks like the fake mission list that got leaked a long time ago, after the achievements got leaked and a bunch of the real mission names were known. It's a mix of real mission names from that list and made up poo poo. I definitely recognize some of those names from the fake list, especially the epilogue. Also there are some of the real mission names, but in the wrong place. With how barebones even the mission 51 stuff is, I highly doubt there were three more entire chapters planned out enough to show up in the files, but maybe it is legit. Would be a major bummer if *that* much content got cut. If it's real, I'm guessing it was an incredibly early plot outline, because some of those mission placements don't even make sense considering the final product. Grizzled Patriarch fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 21:28
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:Big Boss formed MSF after Snake Eater with the full intention of following the will of the Boss. It wasn't until Peace Walker that he rejected her will because he found out either from Strangelove or the Boss AI that she had the intention of giving up being a soldier, which was the betrayal in the eyes of Big Boss. There's literally no difference between MSF and Outer Heaven, only that MSF didn't resort to using child soldiers at the time. He rejected The Boss because she chose to lay down her weapons as an AI, he didn't reject his interpretation of her will. If he did then EVA and Big Boss at the end of MGS 4 are big fat loving liars. Then again, they're big fat liars anyway with MGS V in the picture. Full Battle Rattle posted:I wonder if Kojima is ever even going to publicly talk about it. I don't think there's even been an interview yet. I dunno, I think OSP makes TPP much more fun honestly. Using what you can find over entering the place already equipped. I think a FOX Engine remake of MG 1 using OSP rules could work, though Outer Heaven would need a drastic redesign and needs to feel like a huge fortress. Maybe even take a page out of the NES Metal Gear 1 and have you start in a jungle around 10 km away from Outer Heaven itself, instead of Snake swimming through a water canal to the tank hanger of Outer Heaven like the MSX version. Chippita posted:Apparently someone found the cut episodes/chapters(62 unique missions) list in the Japanese files. I'm the first one to admit the game feels unfinished, but I think that list is fake. At most, there were probably three planned chapters for the game and the third chapter would be two or three missions long. I'm also pretty sure I've seen that list before the game even came out.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:37
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I know we had sequel talk not too long ago, but even before this game was announced I was asking for an xcom style outer heaven building game where you play as big boss and send squads out to do merc work and keep interlopers out of your base, while hiring or creating custom FOXHOUND weirdos/bosses. The last mission obviously being trying to keep Snake out of your poo poo.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:39
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Discendo Vox posted:And you think this game is a demonstration of that fact? Please, read the thread 😓
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Sep 8, 2015 21:39
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Mr. Fortitude posted:I'm the first one to admit the game feels unfinished, but I think that list is fake. At most, there were probably three planned chapters for the game and the third chapter would be two or three missions long. I'm also pretty sure I've seen that list before the game even came out. I've got the feeling its quite fake as well since missions are out of order (though things could always be renamed/swapped around), but I figured I'd at least pass it on. It looks more like Chapter 1 would have been broken up into 2 chapters, as with chapter 2, if the list was by chance real, giving us a total of 5. As it stands, we end up with what, 40 unique missions? Chippita fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 21:41
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Buschmaki posted:I think Quiet is an allegory for exploitation in general. After Big Boss lights her on fire, burning away her previous life, she only exists as a tool for Skull Face and then as a tool for Big Boss. Skull Face deprives her of her words, and her chance at a normal life. He then strips her of her humanity (the parasites) and symbolically of her clothes, one of the primary things that seperates humans from animals. She only exists as a half-naked tool for revenge. Then she joins up with Big Boss and he and Diamond Digs begin to exploit her, as a tool on the battlefield, as a link to Cipher, and as a sort of scientific curiosity due to her parasites. She falls in love with Big Boss and strips off the marks of exploitation and stands before him naked and pure. But Big Boss remains clothed and guarded during this scene, and her rejection of Big Boss is important to her storyline. As her rejecting her role as a tool to be exploited, even by Big Boss. When she leaves, it's because she has cast aside her desire for revenge (rejecting her role as Skull Face's tool) and rejects Big Boss and her love for him (which only took root when she was in the position of being a tool for Diamond Dogs). Think about it, Quiet is the only human buddy, and buddies are grouped together with weapons and items in your loadout screen. She decides to take her life into her own hands, which is when you also hear her speak for the 1st time as Quiet. I may be reading too much into this, but saying she's just. "Weird sex thing" is dumb. I'm glad at least someone gets this game.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:43
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Intel&Sebastian posted:I know we had sequel talk not too long ago, but even before this game was announced I was asking for an xcom style outer heaven building game where you play as big boss and send squads out to do merc work and keep interlopers out of your base, while hiring or creating custom FOXHOUND weirdos/bosses. So a remake of Metal Gear 1 but from Venom's perspective, as you do Outer Ops which are now playable and then use the funds for the main game which is a Dungeon Keeper/Evil Genius style game where you set up traps for Solid Snake and the objective is to delay Solid Snake with as much traps and tedious backtracking he has to do as possible? I'd definitely play it.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:44
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For real they should remake the original Metal Gear games because I want to see how loving insane MACHINEGUN KID and DIRTY DUCK would be in post-bees MGS boss world.
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Sep 8, 2015 21:54
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HerraS posted:For real they should remake the original Metal Gear games because I want to see how loving insane MACHINEGUN KID and DIRTY DUCK would be in post-bees MGS boss world. In a post MGS V world, they probably wouldn't exist and the only boss fight would be Metal Gear. Though at least the Metal Gear fight would be better than placing C4 in a very specific order on its legs. Probably.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:00
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HerraS posted:For real they should remake the original Metal Gear games because I want to see how loving insane MACHINEGUN KID and DIRTY DUCK would be in post-bees MGS boss world. Wanna fight those NASA ninja's from MG2
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Sep 8, 2015 22:04
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I wasnt really disappointed with the story as much as I was shocked at how straightforward and pushed aside it was, relatively. I hadnt really thought about it as unfinished but that makes sense now. I'm only at the point after eli steals the metal gear but I'm going back to non poopsock mode so I can function again, which means im allowed to spoil it up. I have a feeling a lot of the chapter 2 hate would be cleared up if it was made more obvious that this part is a deluxe game+ But otoh that would probably ratchet up what i assume is a big outcry about the ending of chapter 1...which came out of nowhere.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:04
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I really liked the straightforwardness of the story. You go in expecting this big event that pushed Big Boss over the edge and the game is just "Nah bro he's already an evil monster you just went along with it because it was you playing." I think it's one of the best twists in metal gear. Cause yeah come on Big Boss is constricting everyone from trained soldiers to civilian children into his private nuclear equipped army. It doesn't get more evil than that. Had Skull Face's plan been to create a nation of soldiers everyone would be like WHAT AN EVIL FUCKER.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:09
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Chippita posted:Apparently someone found the cut episodes/chapters(62 unique missions) list in the Japanese files. That list started doing the rounds before release, so it's probably not datamined. http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/718564-metal-gear-solid-v-the-phantom-pain/72266239 The source clearly knew *something* though 
repiv fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 22:10
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Funky Britches posted:Wanna fight those NASA ninja's from MG2 The real reason MGS V sucks is because you can't fulton poisonous zanzibar hamsters back to Mother Base.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:11
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MGSV does not suck.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:15
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Okay so At the start of the NES games the world knows there are two different BB's? And why does realBB help Venom when Venom is being the baddie in MG1?
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Sep 8, 2015 22:18
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randombattle posted:I really liked the straightforwardness of the story. You go in expecting this big event that pushed Big Boss over the edge and the game is just "Nah bro he's already an evil monster you just went along with it because it was you playing." Except we already knew Big Boss would build a nuclear private army. 28 years ago. His logic is fairly just to his cause. He's creating a home for those who know nothing else but the battlefield. You only go nuclear because everyone keeps raiding your loving base for simply existing. You don't exactly hit up a market, bomb it with sleep gas and start extracting civilians. Rumor is, the scene with boss screaming in a seemingly burnt out village in one of the trailers, was supposed to be his great demon scene. Rumor is now that it's something hidden away post 100%, because of the intel tape in GZ which was a MSX data tape reading something along the lines of(or so the internet says): FOUND/VOL.2.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:18
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Intel&Sebastian posted:I have a feeling a lot of the chapter 2 hate would be cleared up if it was made more obvious that this part is a deluxe game+ nah that's what I've felt too. If instead of padding out all the Chapter 2 stuff with repeat missions and stuff, if they would have buried Chapter 2's content within Chapter 1 as like a 40 mission seamless playthrough I think people wouldn't have felt so disappointed. Instead you complete Chapter 1, can't wait to start Chapter 2, and it's barely anything at all and at times leaves you clueless how to progress the story. And that list is 100% fake, come on peeps. One of the last missions is the Metallic Archaea -> Sahelanthropus fight sequence which would mean the game would be barely any different at all. if there were like 30 new make-believe missions after that I would have been like "whoa, we really missed out on a lot"
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Sep 8, 2015 22:18
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Nevermind. Found the answer. Thats.... way more elegant of a retcon than I expected lmao Venom pretends to be BB in MG1 ending and BB takes over for him secretly after that.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:20
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repiv posted:That list started doing the rounds before release, so it's probably not datamined. They didn't know anything. That list has been around ever since the achievement list got leaked, which included basically every major mission name. They took the real names from the achievement list and then plugged in a bunch of made-up names around it so it looked legit. It's absolutely fake, and iirc the dude that made it came out and apologized on deviantart or something.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:24
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Bubba Smith posted:nah that's what I've felt too. If instead of padding out all the Chapter 2 stuff with repeat missions and stuff, if they would have buried Chapter 2's content within Chapter 1 as like a 40 mission seamless playthrough I think people wouldn't have felt so disappointed. Instead you complete Chapter 1, can't wait to start Chapter 2, and it's barely anything at all and at times leaves you clueless how to progress the story. Yeah, I think it would have been better if whatever fanservice continuity stuff got melded into the "main plot" of the game which is killing skullface, but I don't know, the content that tried to reference future stuff was almost all bad. Eli was bad(and no, mission 51 would not have helped), Mantis was bad. Huey was fine, though. The Peace Walker guys came out just fine, I think- they had believable transitions, just the ones made for the fans were awful.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:25
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I would've been happier if certain missions were moved around. The whole Mission 42 (Or was it 43? The Quarantine Platform bit) would've fit better in Chapter 1 as the end of that 'arc' and could have made the player dislike Skull Face and feel more satisfaction for getting revenge on him.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:25
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Speaking of Huey his character weirds me the gently caress out because the 3d actor is obviously killing it but the voice is good ol goofy otacon mgs1 style.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:33
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iGestalt posted:I would've been happier if certain missions were moved around. The whole Mission 42 (Or was it 43? The Quarantine Platform bit) would've fit better in Chapter 1 as the end of that 'arc' and could have made the player dislike Skull Face and feel more satisfaction for getting revenge on him. Yeah. Skull Face was dealt with far too early in the story, everything to do with parasites after he dies feels out of place. Having him get trapped under a thing after you fight someone else in a boss fight felt weak, too. Would have been nice to get a resolution on Eli's escape, too. You'd think they'd probably try and follow that up.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:37
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What does Kiefer yell when you shoot the hand of Jehuty?
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Sep 8, 2015 22:38
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lfield posted:Yeah. Skull Face was dealt with far too early in the story, everything to do with parasites after he dies feels out of place. Having him get trapped under a thing after you fight someone else in a boss fight felt weak, too. The cut 'Mission 51' would've been a partial resolution to that. It's still an incredibly jarring "Welp it left guess it's not our problem now" though.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:39
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Funky Britches posted:What does Kiefer yell when you shoot the hand of Jehuty? HAIBARA! Which is a nonsensical phrase used in Zone of Enders.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:41
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The MG wiki says Kojima was interviewed in one of the guides and says there's no real Skullface boss fight because it'd give the player a sense of something missing and/or loss like a phantom pain lmao Could be bull but its good tasty kojima bull, which i eat like candy.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:43
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I like how Skullface dies. It's a good way to make the player feel empty satisfaction.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:53
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Sharkopath posted:MGSV does not suck. I know. It's a joke. But this would have been the perfect game to fulton poisonous hamsters and the game failed to deliver on that. Intel&Sebastian posted:Okay so The NES games aren't canon. The port of Metal Gear 1 is quite different from the original MSX version and Snake's Revenge is a totally different game from Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake. The NES games also makes out that Big Boss' real name is Vernon CaTaffy too. It's probably what I'll name Venom in replays of this game.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:56
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Yeah, Huey executing Skull Face and then raising his arms in triumph while he screams "REVENGE!" is great for showcasing how meaningless and ridiculous it is. Although the really cool part where Venom and Miller are replaced with GZ era Big Boss and Miller selves loses its poignancy considering the ending twist.
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Sep 8, 2015 22:57
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I've been combing through the game files, so far I've found dialogue of venom snake comforting phantom Paz and asking her if she's seen this (also saying 'Chico wanted to see you'), and a bunch of poo poo like "You're Fired!" from Peace Walker done by Sutherland. They really did have him do a bunch of dialogue they just threw out. God damnit.
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Sep 8, 2015 23:02
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lovely Wizard posted:(also saying 'Chico wanted to see you')
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Sep 8, 2015 23:04
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The world doesn't know there are two BBs in MG1. Venom is secretly in charge of Outer Heaven while the real Big Boss is training Foxhound. The government hires the real Big Boss to send his team to infiltrate Outer Heaven because of rumors that they have gone nuclear, not knowing that the guy in charge of the place is BB's decoy. The plan is to feed Solid Snake bad intel so that he can't actually complete the mission, since he is Foxhound's greenest member. But they underestimate him and he actually ends up killing Venom. It is possible that the real Big Boss *wanted* Venom dead by that point, as well. There are theories ranging from the real BB trying to use Solid to kill Venom, to Venom hijacking the radio at the end of MG1 to trick Solid once he realizes what is happening, to the BB that you've been talking to on the radio all along being an AI, etc. Basically, believe whatever sounds the coolest to you because there is basically zero chance of ever getting an explicit answer.
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Sep 8, 2015 23:04
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Buschmaki posted:I made fun of people posting huge essays on why the story in this game is bad, but I'm doing the same thing but saying it's good. This game has driven me insane. Its a discussion forum. It is ok to do such things.
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Sep 8, 2015 23:06
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lovely Wizard posted:I've been combing through the game files, so far I've found dialogue of venom snake comforting phantom Paz and asking her if she's seen this (also saying 'Chico wanted to see you'), and a bunch of poo poo like "You're Fired!" from Peace Walker done by Sutherland. I don't understand why they have a relatively expensive and high profile actor voice a lot of Venom's lines and then they just don't use them. Like I'd understand not using them for mission 51 or other things that were cut, but why cut lines for stuff that is in the game and would take no effort to point to the voice files? I also strongly suspect he was also supposed to say something during the drive with Skull Face instead of just staring awkwardly at him. The cut content in this game is weird.
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Sep 8, 2015 23:06
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