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Anime Schoolgirl
Nov 28, 2002

Mr. Fortitude posted:

Guys what if Hideo Kojima joins Valve and makes Half-Life 3 on the FOX Engine that Valve bought?
Alpha Protocol 2: A Hideo Kojima Game

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ShadowMar
Mar 2, 2010

HERE IS A
GRAVEYARD
OF YOU!


I'm happy with most of the game (except mission 45, gently caress that mission) but I still want the 9/11 DLC conspiracies to be true just because it'd be really cool. If it doesn't oh well, I still enjoyed the game a lot for what it was even with all the cut content we missed out on.

edit:

Anime Schoolgirl posted:

Alpha Protocol 2: A Hideo Kojima Game

don't make me think about how happy this would make me :(

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum
How are you even supposed to do 45's "extract all vehicles" objective legit? If you're visible they just shoot you to death and they're on sand dunes so it's impossible to have any cover, and they come in from out of bounds so you can't really get behind them. I got the S rank just spamming missiles at them and used Stealth Camo for the extractions but that can't be the way they meant for you to do it. Is there some way to force drivers out of vehicles I'm unaware of? I tried gas mines and electromagnetic mines and the former does nothing while the latter just stops the vehicle, the guy manning it doesn't get out and can even still spot you.

Backup, Back Down Extreme is also pretty ridiculous, but I just resigned myself to getting the S first and doing it 2-3 more times for the other side objectives. I'm sure they can all be done in a single run but it's madness to contemplate, let alone on Extreme.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



I'm sure there is some crazy way to do it legit, but I totally wouldn't be surprised if they meant for you to do that with Stealth camo. iirc it's an objective that you can't even see the first time you play it, and a lot of the side objectives in other missions make it pretty clear that they expect you to play through them at least twice. I think it's definitely less stressful to just s-rank them first and then work on objectives when you are bored / have nothing better to do.

Like yeah, Backup, Back Down is possible to S-rank with all objectives in 1 run (there are videos on Youtube) but there's no way I'm going to pull my hair out trying to do that. They are designed so that insane tryhard challenge runs and slow, spread-it-out-over-months playthroughs are both viable.

Terminally Bored
Oct 31, 2011

Twenty-five dollars and a six pack to my name

Nakar posted:

How are you even supposed to do 45's "extract all vehicles" objective legit?

I think you have to get your support unit to initiate a sandstorm.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



The tanks can just flat-out see through a sandstorm in that mission, for whatever reason. I had one roll in naturally during my first playthrough and I thought I would use it to my advantage, but vehicles a mile away might as well have had laser-guided rockets.

I'm not sure if vehicles act that way outside of that mission, though - I honestly can't recall ever getting into a firefight with vehicles in a sandstorm anywhere else in the game.

Luceid
Jan 20, 2005

Buy some freaking medicine.
it's really insane how only huey and skull face got the memo that they were characters in an MGS game, but thank god they were there

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

Like yeah, Backup, Back Down is possible to S-rank with all objectives in 1 run (there are videos on Youtube) but there's no way I'm going to pull my hair out trying to do that. They are designed so that insane tryhard challenge runs and slow, spread-it-out-over-months playthroughs are both viable.
Yeah what's interesting is a true ghost run turns Total Stealth, No Kills into No Traces which is 100k points, and since No Traces naturally entails No Kills and No Reflex you're guaranteed an S rank if you ghost a mission no matter how much time it takes you to do it. That's pretty cool.

Ranks can be a bit too forgiving though. I never got anything lower than a B and got an S sometimes on my "first run, just get to the objective, roll with any alerts that happen" tries.

Luceid posted:

it's really insane how only huey and skull face got the memo that they were characters in an MGS game, but thank god they were there
"Such a lust for revenge... WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!?" was in the pantheon of MGS lines from the instant I heard it, I gotta give Horan credit for that one. Skull Face doesn't always quite sound right but when he's on and chewing the scenery proper it's incredible and that line just comes out of nowhere and it's like "Yes, that is a Metal Gear line."

klapman
Aug 27, 2012

this char is good

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

The tanks can just flat-out see through a sandstorm in that mission, for whatever reason. I had one roll in naturally during my first playthrough and I thought I would use it to my advantage, but vehicles a mile away might as well have had laser-guided rockets.

I'm not sure if vehicles act that way outside of that mission, though - I honestly can't recall ever getting into a firefight with vehicles in a sandstorm anywhere else in the game.

I hosed up that mission so many times that they gave me the Lil' Chick hat, which makes you invisible to enemies. The tanks didn't give a gently caress, and since I couldn't return to the ACC from that mission for whatever reason, I just didn't give a gently caress either. Beat that mission with 0 points, and I don't know if i'll ever play it again.

diamond dog
Jul 27, 2010

by merry exmarx
Is it just me or does code talker's voice change when he says "companions to us"? Also maybe when he refers to humans as "hosts" and possibly even every time he says "parasites"... it's hard to tell whether his accent is just inconsistent or if he's being controlled or something. But if he means something different when he says "companions" it changes the implication of everything else he's saying.


dumb speculation but because of this I felt like the story (where it cuts ends) was beginning to transition from revenge as a theme to the broader idea that we're all controlled by cultural narratives.
and when he talks about the vocal cord parasites not having an intelligence or memory in the traditional sense, well there's another tape about superorganisms--it could mean the parasites themselves are simply corporeal platform of these memetic superintelligences or whatever that could even predate humanity? so by trying to wipe out english skullface might be doing more than just fighting globalisation, whether he knows it or not

Vengarr
Jun 17, 2010

Smashed before noon

klapman posted:

I hosed up that mission so many times that they gave me the Lil' Chick hat, which makes you invisible to enemies. The tanks didn't give a gently caress, and since I couldn't return to the ACC from that mission for whatever reason, I just didn't give a gently caress either. Beat that mission with 0 points, and I don't know if i'll ever play it again.

It took me about 30 tries.

Not being able to go back and equip yourself for anti-vehicle combat was bullshit...I was all set for a stealth infiltration and hostage rescue mission, not defending the loving Alamo.

No idea how you're supposed to S-rank it. I eventually spammed artillery strikes until everything died.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



I'm sure the end-game launchers make it a cakewalk, especially if you know what you are walking into in advance. You can probably lay mines before the vehicles even show up and all sorts of poo poo. I think almost everyone gets caught with their pants down and wins via artillery strikes the first time lol.

OnimaruXLR
Sep 15, 2007
Lurklurklurklurklurk
This game's "multiple endings" approach is neat in one way, and kinda frustrating on the other because I'm not sure that I got them all. Nothing gets unlocked by doing deployments, right?

In It For The Tank
Feb 17, 2011

But I've yet to figure out a better way to spend my time.

Nakar posted:

How are you even supposed to do 45's "extract all vehicles" objective legit? If you're visible they just shoot you to death and they're on sand dunes so it's impossible to have any cover, and they come in from out of bounds so you can't really get behind them. I got the S rank just spamming missiles at them and used Stealth Camo for the extractions but that can't be the way they meant for you to do it. Is there some way to force drivers out of vehicles I'm unaware of? I tried gas mines and electromagnetic mines and the former does nothing while the latter just stops the vehicle, the guy manning it doesn't get out and can even still spot you.

The answer is a combination of memorizing the order and location the vehicles appear in and being really loving creative with cover (that is, memorize all of the necessary obstacles and terrain that can block attacks and try to use the vehicle you're trying to extract as cover from the other vehicles as you attach the fulton). On the my first playthrough I had to extract all of them because I straight up didn't have the adequate firepower to actually destroy any of the tanks. I don't want to say how long it took or how many times I died, but I have a really good idea about the spawn patterns and the little ridges and hills that can provide temporary cover while out in the open.

I've since learned, following the loving nightmare that was my first playthrough, that using the Parasite Suit's armour function makes things a lot easier (though not easy by any stretch of the imagination). Despite what the description says , it doesn't affect your rank (only the camo function does, mist and armour are both fine). At the Parasite armour's max level, the vehicles' machine gun chews through it pretty quickly but it will give you enough defense to run straight at a vehicle and extract it, so long as you're minimizing the amount you're being hit (that is, don't let multiple vehicles fire at you at once and be quick). It can even tank rockets, though it will knock you down. Resupplies for it are constantly dropped as long as you're using your rocket ammo to murder the infantry that accompany the vehicles, so keep an eye out for where they are and blow them up when you have a free moment. Quiet can handle the rest.

In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 09:49 on Sep 11, 2015

psychoJ
Feb 24, 2011

Smart and cool, handsome, wealthy and so sexy
So was there any reason why Code Talker warned us about Kaz on the command platform, or was that part of a weird cut sub plot that they forgot to take out?

OnimaruXLR
Sep 15, 2007
Lurklurklurklurklurk

psychoJ posted:

So was there any reason why Code Talker warned us about Kaz on the command platform, or was that part of a weird cut sub plot that they forgot to take out?

I just figured he felt like Kaz was going loopy with revenge lust. Which he was, and then more or less got over thanks to Boss' good example.

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.
So uh, what's actually the deal with the Operation Intrude N313 tape at the very end of the game? I get that it's the codename for MG1's mission, but what's the deal with it being put in a tape player? I'm guessing the camera panning to show an MSX keyboard and what is clearly the blue glow from the MSX startup screen is just a fun easter egg for those who recognize what's happening there, but what's the implications of the tape belting out static? Was that also just a cute MSX nod? Was the whole thing a cute nod to the MSX or was there more to it being a tape belting out screeching static put in by who I assume is meant to be the real Big Boss sending Solid to kill Venom?

That whole bit was like a cool thing that gave me nerd shivers but then made me do a double take and say "wait what does that actually imply" and I haven't come up with an answer I'm confident with.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



I think it is meant to imply that he's talking to Cipher. iirc there is another tape about him making phone calls in between some shipping containers, and as Huey points out in one of his blame-game sessions, Kaz was a "business partner" with Cipher even before GZ. Given he turns on Venom after the ending, it is possible that he was setting up to betray him before the end credit stinger.

It could have also been something that got cut - I still feel like there was meant to be something significant about Kaz' eyes being all hosed up, in coincidentally the same way that Code Talker's / the Skulls' were, but who knows. It never gets mentioned in the game and it is unclear whether he is meant to be blind or what, so it's pure speculation.


Moartoast posted:

So uh, what's actually the deal with the Operation Intrude N313 tape at the very end of the game? I get that it's the codename for MG1's mission, but what's the deal with it being put in a tape player? I'm guessing the camera panning to show an MSX keyboard and what is clearly the blue glow from the MSX startup screen is just a fun easter egg for those who recognize what's happening there, but what's the implications of the tape belting out static? Was that also just a cute MSX nod? Was the whole thing a cute nod to the MSX or was there more to it being a tape belting out screeching static put in by who I assume is meant to be the real Big Boss sending Solid to kill Venom?

That whole bit was like a cool thing that gave me nerd shivers but then made me do a double take and say "wait what does that actually imply" and I haven't come up with an answer I'm confident with.

It was the real Big Boss sending Venom a briefing file on the operation, probably warning him that Solid was on his way. Remember that the government hires the real BB to infiltrate Outer Heaven and find out if the nuke rumors are true - they don't know about Venom. Ostensibly what happens is that the two BBs coordinate to feed Solid - Foxhound's biggest rookie - bad intel so that he doesn't succeed, but he actually ends up defying their expectations and killing Venom. The tape was likely BB giving Venom a heads-up and info on the operation so he could set a trap.

It could also be a call-back to the mysterious MSX tape from GZ - it has no audio on it and only plays static. Some people are theorizing that it was going to have some sort of connection to TPP that ended up getting cut, but who knows.

Grizzled Patriarch fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Sep 11, 2015

SyntheticPolygon
Dec 20, 2013

OnimaruXLR posted:

I just figured he felt like Kaz was going loopy with revenge lust. Which he was, and then more or less got over thanks to Boss' good example.

With that end credit stinger I don't think Kaz actually ever got over his whole revenge thing. He just ended up switching targets is all.

And remember Kaz was the guy who trained the man that ended up killing BB and Venom. So maybe Code Talker was onto something.

VagueRant
May 24, 2012

Moartoast posted:

So uh, what's actually the deal with the Operation Intrude N313 tape at the very end of the game? I get that it's the codename for MG1's mission, but what's the deal with it being put in a tape player? I'm guessing the camera panning to show an MSX keyboard and what is clearly the blue glow from the MSX startup screen is just a fun easter egg for those who recognize what's happening there, but what's the implications of the tape belting out static? Was that also just a cute MSX nod? Was the whole thing a cute nod to the MSX or was there more to it being a tape belting out screeching static put in by who I assume is meant to be the real Big Boss sending Solid to kill Venom?

That whole bit was like a cool thing that gave me nerd shivers but then made me do a double take and say "wait what does that actually imply" and I haven't come up with an answer I'm confident with.
It's kind of impossible to say, I don't think it was particularly well thought out, but I GUESS the most sensible interpretation is Real Big Boss as leader of Foxhound warning Venom Snake that Solid Snake is coming to Outer Heaven.

Sex Tragedy
Jan 28, 2007

father of three with an extra large butt

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

I think it is meant to imply that he's talking to Cipher. iirc there is another tape about him making phone calls in between some shipping containers, and as Huey points out in one of his blame-game sessions, Kaz was a "business partner" with Cipher even before GZ. Given he turns on Venom after the ending, it is possible that he was setting up to betray him before the end credit stinger.

It could have also been something that got cut - I still feel like there was meant to be something significant about Kaz' eyes being all hosed up, in coincidentally the same way that Code Talker's / the Skulls' were, but who knows. It never gets mentioned in the game and it is unclear whether he is meant to be blind or what, so it's pure speculation.


It was the real Big Boss sending Venom a briefing file on the operation, probably warning him that Solid was on his way. Remember that the government hires the real BB to infiltrate Outer Heaven and find out if the nuke rumors are true - they don't know about Venom. Ostensibly what happens is that the two BBs coordinate to feed Solid - Foxhound's biggest rookie - bad intel so that he doesn't succeed, but he actually ends up defying their expectations and killing Venom. The tape was likely BB giving Venom a heads-up and info on the operation so he could set a trap.

It could also be a call-back to the mysterious MSX tape from GZ - it has no audio on it and only plays static. Some people are theorizing that it was going to have some sort of connection to TPP that ended up getting cut, but who knows.

Some theorize big boss is giving venom the same kind of mission to die that the boss got. Then venom decides to give snake the bad intel from the other frequency.

Alexander DeLarge
Dec 20, 2013

Chippita posted:

I'm seriously thinking this whole Kojima leaving Konami rumor is bull poo poo. They have never confirmed it. Just vague answers after vague answers. It even started on April 1st when they removed his name from the executives list. Then they say that they're going to be focusing on mobile games, one of which generated $6 million. Sure, reduced costs paying staff for a bit of profit, but MGS4 pulled in $950 million on a $60 million budget.


I'm with you. Either this is the most epic tale of mismanagement ever, or it's all bullshit.

2012: Ground Zeroes is revealed
2013: Phantom Pain is revealed at GDC+Fox Engine is shown to developers, E3 appearance, rumors of Silent Hill/Hideo Kojima project start popping up
2014: PT development starts, E3 appearance, PT is shown at the Sony Gamescom conference and is released immediately, Silent Hills gets a TGS concept trailer
2015: The Phantom Pain release date announced, E3 trailer, launch trailer+release, game is unfinished

Now, why would they let Kojima work on a project if they're unhappy with the way The Phantom Pain is taking too much time and money (which you would certainly have an idea of back when PT was pitched)? Why would they develop an engine with absolutely no intention of using it for future projects? Most importantly, why would they be unhappy with the budget when Ground Zeroes sold really well and The Phantom Pain is practically guaranteed a profit?

My question is, why would they release Chapter 1 and have Chapter 2 feel unfinished? It's clear they cut a ton of content, so if they were getting the feeling of the game not meeting expectations, why wouldn't they withhold Ground Zeroes and release Ground Zeroes+the hospital+Afghanistan as The Phantom Pain Part 1 and Africa+a finished chapter 2+island epilogue as The Phantom Pain part 2?

They could have achieved their goals and made a lot more money in the process, but they didn't, and that was certainly a viable option.

Alexander DeLarge fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Sep 11, 2015

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

I'm sure the end-game launchers make it a cakewalk, especially if you know what you are walking into in advance. You can probably lay mines before the vehicles even show up and all sorts of poo poo. I think almost everyone gets caught with their pants down and wins via artillery strikes the first time lol.
Yeah the CGM 25 or whatever the multi-missile launcher is and Battle Dress makes S pretty easy, you just have to avoid getting pounded by multiple tank shells. You can lock on to infantry too so you can sort of strafe-dance and lock onto the snipers and take them out in case Quiet isn't doing it. You can also blind-fire it which isn't too hard since several of the approach paths are straight lines. As long as you don't let the APCs that dispense dudes roll up on the palace's front law Quiet shouldn't ever take any damage at all and you're getting constant supply drops.

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

VagueRant posted:

It's kind of impossible to say, I don't think it was particularly well thought out, but I GUESS the most sensible interpretation is Real Big Boss as leader of Foxhound warning Venom Snake that Solid Snake is coming to Outer Heaven.

Sex Tragedy posted:

Some theorize big boss is giving venom the same kind of mission to die that the boss got. Then venom decides to give snake the bad intel from the other frequency.

Ok wow this at least clears up some confusion I was having connecting the dots. Obviously no one knows for sure but I forgot important details like how the real BB was the one sent to Outer Heaven in the first place :downs:.

Don't worry I'm sure it'll all come together more cohesively in the thing the fired dude and his fired team will be allowed to release on 9/11 by the publisher that now actively despises them and their work and their entire artistic medium and it's all a ruse.

we all want it to be a ridiculous counter-intuitive-but-amazing ruse that Kojima somehow convinced everyone to go along with, but come the gently caress on people, that's not how this business works and even Kojima couldn't bend and twist it to do so, especially not just for a clever gotcha

In It For The Tank
Feb 17, 2011

But I've yet to figure out a better way to spend my time.

Sex Tragedy posted:

Some theorize big boss is giving venom the same kind of mission to die that the boss got. Then venom decides to give snake the bad intel from the other frequency.

The best interpretation of the ending that I saw is that Big Boss is giving Venom the order that he needs to die and Venom decides that he'll do it but his final gently caress you to Big Boss will be to reveal himself to Solid Snake, who only sees Big Boss (despite the shrapnel horn and the robot arm and the too-youthful appearance [?]), linking Big Boss to the Outer Heaven Uprising and forcing him to go underground.

I like it the interpretation but I'm not sure it can be defended. Shame we didn't get any of that in the game. I maintain that the game should have had Venom trying to take revenge on Big Boss and that the twist, which works but isn't used effectively in my opinion, should have been used to allow the player to channel their frustration and betrayal at being lied to into hating Big Boss the character. However, because the game just ends immediately after The Truth and there is very little catharsis to be had, people just channeled their frustration and betrayal into hating the game itself.

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum
I suspect the ending is implying that Venom goes rogue and that MG1 is Outer Heaven genuinely getting out of Big Boss's control. Punching the mirror makes the most sense if Venom is upset with Big Boss, although the cut Kiefer line does sort of suggest the opposite (but maybe that's why it was cut). "Big Boss needed Venom to die and Venom said to hell with it and pretended to be Big Boss so Solid would report back that Big Boss runs Outer Heaven" sounds about right.

Though I'm not sure how that wasn't common knowledge because like half of Foxhound should know this. Kaz has his reasons to shut up but he was probably the first guy to go "Oh yeah Solid's definitely right that was the real Big Boss for sure he played us like a drat fiddle or something" once Solid came back and reported. But the concept of "Outer Heaven" wasn't really all that secret and nearly everyone associated with Diamond Dogs would've been aware of it including Eli and you're telling me not one person who was aware that "Big Boss" was running around Mother Base drew a connection between him and the dude building up a nuclear fortress in South Africa with the exact same name? I'm sure Big Boss could go "Well here I clearly am in America running Foxhound so I can't be connected to this particular Outer Heaven" but wouldn't people think he'd be sympathetic or have ties to the men there or anything like that? It's common knowledge among the world's mercenaries that Big Boss is the one responsible for all of that, even if most of them are thinking of Venom instead.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



At the end of the day Kojima isn't happy with MG1 and 2 anymore and has admitted he would have to retcon them both heavily to fit into his vision for the series, so it's probably best that he made TPP the way he wanted even if it conflicts with the "story" laid out in two games that came out before most of TPP's playerbase were born, rather than taking the "Jam Story A into Plot B" route.

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum
I mean it does kinda make sense for MG1/MG2 except for the part where Big Boss is a cyborg in MG2, unless he's actually Venom, which was actually the twist I was kind of hoping for. It'd have been really funny if Venom ended up completely usurping the "true" Big Boss, realizing that as the active manifestation of the Big Boss meme he's the "genuine" Big Boss and the guy manipulating him from the shadows is nothing but a phantom himself. In Kojima's imagined MG1 remake maybe that was the idea, and Venom would proudly declare himself the one and only true Big Boss only for Solid Snake to not get what he's driving at and just assume "Oh poo poo Big Boss played me and is here in Outer Heaven and also for some reason a scarred-up cyborg with a shrapnel horn." Which I'll give Kojima, because Solid is an idiot.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



It would be pretty funny if all the attempts to get back Big Boss' body in 1 and 4 were actually just trying to reclaim the charred corpse of some random MSF dude.

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Welp, I just discovered something stupid and lovely. Stealing emplacements from FOBs does nothing but increase your espionage score. You don't actually get the emplacements. I just noticed when I was like "I'll offset the cost of stealing all of these by selling them!" only to see that I still only had the same 5 I stole from single player. What in the gently caress. :( I guess that explains why literally ONLY unrefined resources show up as FOB owned. Yeesh.

Which begs the question, what actually outfits your FOBs with emplacements? The answer is OUT OF THIN AIR LIKE MOST OF THAT poo poo. Jeez. FOBs are way more hosed than they let on.

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

In It For The Tank posted:

the too-youthful appearance

This is probably not the case, since by all accounts it seems established that Venom really does look like Big Boss to everyone, and only those who know about his life before the surgery know he's not BB.

It's real weird to me that people have found it as frustrating as they do. Like, I get frustrations with the writing and pacing and closure of plot threads, but with the pure fact of Venom being Venom and not Big Boss? Hell, I took it as something of a contrast to MGS2, where Kojima said "screw you, you're not Snake, you're a whiney incessant fan that wants the same poo poo shovelled in your face so you can pretend to be who you aren't", now he says "Yeah, you're not Big Boss, but you've gone on this long playing as him and representing him, so you may as well be, thanks for carrying on the legend". It felt like a thank you as opposed to the gently caress you from many games ago, and yeah it might not be as well thought-out or meaningful or fulfill its intentions as well as the gently caress you (and to be fair, MGS2 was more nuanced than just a dismissive flip-of-the-bird), but I still can't see how it can actively ruin the game/the character for someone.

Honestly, I think it's real cool that I'm running around as a dude named Venom Snake and I'm the one Snake that's not a Big Boss clone but is closer to a doppelganger than any of his actual genetic clones ever are, warts and all. I think all the subtle foreshadowing through Venom's behaviour is neat, too, all I really wish is that they went further with it and had more real BB and some more interaction between the two.

I also made Venom into Mike Dawson for some reason and I was nothing but hyped when I realized I can play as Mike Dawson whenever I want after the real ending, and that he replaces the regular Snake model even in cutscenes. No, I don't know what's wrong with me.

Alexander DeLarge
Dec 20, 2013

DaveKap posted:

Welp, I just discovered something stupid and lovely. Stealing emplacements from FOBs does nothing but increase your espionage score. You don't actually get the emplacements. I just noticed when I was like "I'll offset the cost of stealing all of these by selling them!" only to see that I still only had the same 5 I stole from single player. What in the gently caress. :( I guess that explains why literally ONLY unrefined resources show up as FOB owned. Yeesh.

Which begs the question, what actually outfits your FOBs with emplacements? The answer is OUT OF THIN AIR LIKE MOST OF THAT poo poo. Jeez. FOBs are way more hosed than they let on.

Really? That's hosed. Doesn't justify the GMP cost.

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

It would be pretty funny if all the attempts to get back Big Boss' body in 1 and 4 were actually just trying to reclaim the charred corpse of some random MSF dude.
Also it would make more sense that he shows up seemingly intact in the graveyard scene and then is all "Uh yeah they rebuilt me out of Solidus parts." Because that's some drat fine plastic surgery. It'd be funnier if Big Boss has been perfectly fine the whole time and just kinda hanging out until the last minute, and he dumped Venom's jerky remains in a trash can right outside the cemetery before wheeling Zero in.

Granted it conflicts with the new timeline so it seems the genuine Big Boss was the MG2 guy but having it be Venom both times and then the corpse that everybody wants isn't even Big Boss would've been a pretty amazing twist, especially considering all the Liquid stuff in this game. "Oh yeah in 20 years or whatever you'll try to get Big Boss's remains back by holding the world hostage and that isn't even him, psyche! Your dad always hated you Eli, so much that he had some other guy be his corpse."

Moartoast posted:

Honestly, I think it's real cool that I'm running around as a dude named Venom Snake and I'm the one Snake that's not a Big Boss clone but is closer to a doppelganger than any of his actual genetic clones ever are, warts and all. I think all the subtle foreshadowing through Venom's behaviour is neat, too, all I really wish is that they went further with it and had more real BB and some more interaction between the two.
Yeah I've actually retired Snake and just use my avatar now, it makes cutscene replays even funnier and the best part is they're not even technically wrong because they could've just not done the surgery and for all most of the people in the game know Big Boss is a skinny old black guy.

Nakar fucked around with this message at 10:49 on Sep 11, 2015

In It For The Tank
Feb 17, 2011

But I've yet to figure out a better way to spend my time.

Moartoast posted:

This is probably not the case, since by all accounts it seems established that Venom really does look like Big Boss to everyone, and only those who know about his life before the surgery know he's not BB.

I mean that, if the ending cutscene is supposed to take place in 1995, Venom still looks like his 1984 self rather than what Big Boss should look like in his 60s (trenchcoat, grey hair, etc.) Perhaps chalk it up to the failing of plastic surgery but it's still weird that he hasn't aged at all (and that Solid Snake was still able to confuse the two despite the fact that Venom, at that point, must look completely different to Big Boss).

Alexander DeLarge
Dec 20, 2013

Alexander DeLarge posted:

I'm with you. Either this is the most epic tale of mismanagement ever, or it's all bullshit.

2012: Ground Zeroes is revealed
2013: Phantom Pain is revealed at GDC+Fox Engine is shown to developers, E3 appearance, rumors of Silent Hill/Hideo Kojima project start popping up
2014: PT development starts, E3 appearance, PT is shown at the Sony Gamescom conference and is released immediately, Silent Hills gets a TGS concept trailer
2015: The Phantom Pain release date announced, E3 trailer, launch trailer+release, game is unfinished

Now, why would they let Kojima work on a project if they're unhappy with the way The Phantom Pain is taking too much time and money (which you would certainly have an idea of back when PT was pitched)? Why would they develop an engine with absolutely no intention of using it for future projects? Most importantly, why would they be unhappy with the budget when Ground Zeroes sold really well and The Phantom Pain is practically guaranteed a profit?

My question is, why would they release Chapter 1 and have Chapter 2 feel unfinished? It's clear they cut a ton of content, so if they were getting the feeling of the game not meeting expectations, why wouldn't they withhold Ground Zeroes and release Ground Zeroes+the hospital+Afghanistan as The Phantom Pain Part 1 and Africa+a finished chapter 2+island epilogue as The Phantom Pain part 2?

They could have achieved their goals and made a lot more money in the process, but they didn't, and that was certainly a viable option.

Oh yeah, I forgot to add "Hey, we're getting really unhappy with the budget of The Phantom Pain, but go ahead and start development on the playable teaser that will reveal that you're working on another game after this one".

Remember, by the time that PT started development, the majority of The Phantom Pain's development was nearing completion, so when was this "falling out" supposed to take place? Either this whole thing is truly an emotional response, or it defies all logic.

BurnBlackJay
May 31, 2011

by Lowtax
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8w95xIdH4o&t=41s

wise advice thanks zero

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

Alexander DeLarge posted:

Oh yeah, I forgot to add "Hey, we're getting really unhappy with the budget of The Phantom Pain, but go ahead and start development on the playable teaser that will reveal that you're working on another game after this one".

Remember, by the time that PT started development, the majority of The Phantom Pain's development was nearing completion, so when was this "falling out" supposed to take place? Either this whole thing is truly an emotional response, or it defies all logic.

You don't actively sabotage your own share in the market (literally and figuratively) as hard as Konami did if you're just playing along with a ruse your valued artist wants to do. It absolutely has been a tale of unprofessional petty grudges and mismanagement, PT and SIlent Hills starting to be a thing and suddenly stopping happened because it was released before Konami finally snapped for whatever reason they did.

If it weren't for the very real facts of the moves Konami has been making elsewhere, there might be some credibility to it being all a Kojima rug-pull, but as it stands, Konami's getting more bank from a legal loophole that lets them exploit addictive personalities, Kojima's games cost too much time and money to make and their returns aren't reliable enough to be needed anymore with the totes-not-gambling money Konami's making loads of. Konami's also been very petty in the past towards other people, Kojima's just the loudest one you've heard about, with good reason no doubt, but everything is absolutely as it seems when it comes to Konami's grudge and the termination and purging of Kojima from their business.

We all want there to be one last surprise from Kojima or for it all to be a bonkers conspiracy to drum up publicity in the most absurd way anyone's ever done, but reality comes crashing down on that if you aren't extremely selective with your fact checking.

In It For The Tank
Feb 17, 2011

But I've yet to figure out a better way to spend my time.
Imagine if the address on Big Boss' new passport said Silent Hill. Now that would be a sequel hook.

Nakar
Sep 2, 2002

Ultima Ratio Regum

In It For The Tank posted:

Imagine if the address on Big Boss' new passport said Silent Hill. Now that would be a sequel hook.
Silent Hills features Big Boss Mode as an unlockable. It's the same game, but now you know CQC and can just chokeslam and punch combo the denizens of nightmare.

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Good Lord Fisher!
Jul 14, 2006

Groovy!

Just imagine James busting out a 5-hit CQC combo on Maria. Lmao.

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