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I can't wait for more Blairites tears, and them encouraging people to vote for Zac, because at least he represents a Sensible Party of Government
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Sep 11, 2015 13:42
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Zephro posted:Michael Foot? A lot of Corbyn's programme is fairly bog-standard post-WW2 social democracy, of the sort still practised in Europe. Nationalise the railways, a state investment bank, rent controls. The most eye-catching lefty stuff is unilateral disarmament and a maximum salary, but the former isn't exactly unheard of (it's SNP policy too) and the latter has been kicking around various left-wing parties for a while. He's definitely a lot further left than almost anyone else with any profile in British politics today. But all this stuff about how he's Vladimir Leon Josef Marx the Undead, is mostly a reflection of how far right the "centre ground" has shifted in the past 30 years. He's not standing on an enormously left-wing platform right now, but his core beliefs are certainly to the left of Foot's - but Foot was always less left-wing than he's made out to be these days. Corbyn is a down the line Bennite, and they were to the left of Foot's leadership.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:43
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Sadie Khan wears a suit so no one will criticise him for being unelectable. It's literally that simple.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:44
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V. Illych L. posted:ah shameful of me to forget. is goldsmith in any way impressive? I can never tell the difference between him and Tristam Hunt.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:46
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V. Illych L. posted:ah shameful of me to forget. is goldsmith in any way impressive? Depends how easily impressed you are. He is at least one of the people warning Tories to not vote for Corbyn in order to 'make Labour unelectable' - perhaps realising that popular anti-establishment leftists have been doing okay of late.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:48
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Oberleutnant posted:Oh wow, I didn't actually know that. Waitrose was always "that expensive shop we can't afford to shop at" when I were a lad. Netto and Kwik Save for us.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:50
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reading his wikipedia entry and the whole expenses thing it looks like he performs really poorly under pressure, which could probably be exploited by a canny opponent. identity politics should also play heavily in khan's favour, what with him being an actual working-class boy running against a bona fide aristocrat
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Sep 11, 2015 13:51
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OvineYeast posted:So I was trying to work out when we last had a Labour leader as left-wing as Corbyn and I think it's 1935 -- George Lansbury, who ironically was also responsible for the newspaper that would become The Sun. Angela Lansbury's grandad, trivia fans.
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Sep 11, 2015 13:55
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Oberleutnant posted:Oh wow, I didn't actually know that. Waitrose was always "that expensive shop we can't afford to shop at" when I were a lad. Netto and Kwik Save for us. John Lewis owns
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Sep 11, 2015 13:57
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When I were a lad we ate coal, none of this fancy "food".
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Sep 11, 2015 13:58
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Malcolm XML posted:John Lewis owns Still better than most large limited companies though.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:01
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Oberleutnant posted:And how would you know that, Comrade? I could have 'liberated' it for the proletariat, you know. Five finger discount and all that. 
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Sep 11, 2015 14:01
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I think there's a moral imperative to make David Cameron bite the curb and jump up and down on his head like a mushy bouncy castle.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:03
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My dad says he wanted to vote for Corbyn but ended up going Cooper/Burnham/Kendall/Corbyn because Polly Toynbee said Corbyn can't win leading a divided party  Wonder how common this is. e: Meanwhile Kendall seemingly pretty chill about losing. quote:Liz Kendall conceded that her campaign had failed and that Jeremy Corbyn – the man expected to be declared the winner on Saturday – had energised a party crying out for change. Jack the Lad fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Sep 11, 2015 |
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Sep 11, 2015 14:09
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polly toynbee is the commentariat person i hate most i think E: most of them just float alongside society being annoying but toynbee actively helped thatcher get elected by splitting the vote in a labour seat and now she wont loving shut up about division in the party as if its the fault of the leftists and not the people threatening division Phoon fucked around with this message at 14:14 on Sep 11, 2015 |
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Sep 11, 2015 14:11
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Oberleutnant posted:Oh wow, I didn't actually know that. Waitrose was always "that expensive shop we can't afford to shop at" when I were a lad. Netto and Kwik Save for us. Waitrose is surprisingly good value. Certainly better quality and often cheaper than the Co-op, for the basics. And yeah, John Lewis is a surprisingly progressive company, for a big brand with a high quality image. It's at least nominally a partnership with employees all being part owners and receiving a formal share of the profits in addition to salary. I don't know if it still does (I think so) but it certainly used to have an employees' country club near where I grew up in Hampshire. The great thing about it was that annual membership cost a day's salary, no matter what your salary was. So a shelf stacker might pay 50 quid for his annual membership but the CEO might pay 5000 or whatever. Surprisingly egalitarian, for a country club. John Lewis is alright in my book. Geokinesis posted:I'm sure this will turn out well for vulnerable children. What on Corbyn's green earth is Cameron loving smoking? UK opposition electorate is poised to elect the most leftist, pro-nationalisation, pro-big-government leader in decades. Cameron: "Clearly this gives me a sweeping mandate for privatisation". What an utter bellend. Also 'closing government buildings, and selling them off to build houses so people can live in them' lol, why sell them first, fuckwit? Keep the ownership of them, let people live in them affordably.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:11
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gently caress me I'm getting twitchy now. Bookies have Corbyn on 1/20 so gently caress knows why but still.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:12
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Ziggy Tzardust posted:Jesus. The Khan victory wasn't even close. It came down to Khan/Jowell on the final round of voting and that ended up as 59/41. Massive blow for the Blairites. I was surprised to see Abbott do so well, I was lead to believe Lammy was going to be 3rd but he was nowhere near! It's also encouraging to see that Khan wins in the final round with just members, which puts to rest arguments about the TROT ENTRYISTS.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:12
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V. Illych L. posted:ah shameful of me to forget. is goldsmith in any way impressive? The Tories seem to think that he can win against Khan (but couldn't have against Jowell).  V. Illych L. posted:identity politics should also play heavily in khan's favour, what with him being an actual working-class boy running against a bona fide aristocrat He's also a Muslim, and class politics seem weak right now while Islamophobia is riding high.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:13
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Malcolm XML posted:John Lewis owns Especially at slashing pension benefits
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Sep 11, 2015 14:13
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Phoon posted:polly toynbee is the commentariat person i hate most i think Her and Rafael Bellend. Both of them speak with the smug condescension that only a loving idiot who's been spoon fed through life could manage.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:13
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biglads posted:Especially at slashing pension benefits Don't ruin it for me  but please do elaborate.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:15
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ThomasPaine posted:gently caress me I'm getting twitchy now. London mayoral candidate nomination results. Corbster gonna crush it!
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Sep 11, 2015 14:15
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Autonomous Monster posted:The Tories seem to think that he can win against Khan (but couldn't have against Jowell). in London, though? i haven't looked properly at the demographics, but there are a ton of Asians in London, aren't there? a lot of those guys, immigrants or children of immigrants, would presumably recognise one of their own. add this to the traditional labour electorate, and emphasise goldsmith's whole "naïve upperclassman" thing and you'd imagine that this is very doable - the White Van Man demographic is hardly going to vote for either Khan or Goldsmith for identity reasons, and you'd imagine that the tories are dependent on that demo if nothing else
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Sep 11, 2015 14:16
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Lord of the Llamas posted:I was surprised to see Abbott do so well, I was lead to believe Lammy was going to be 3rd but he was nowhere near! It's also encouraging to see that Khan wins in the final round with just members, which puts to rest arguments about the TROT ENTRYISTS. I'm happy for Diane too, pity should couldn't have knocked out Jowls but a defeat for Blairism is a win for me. Of course, actually it does suggest that Trot entryists were there because of how well Diane did against our expectations.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:18
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So apparently Nick Clegg passed up on a chance not to raise tuition fees: http://i100.independent.co.uk/artic...own--WJQXsBQkLg
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Sep 11, 2015 14:19
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V. Illych L. posted:ah shameful of me to forget. is goldsmith in any way impressive? His father was basically a fascist, and he became an MP by committing electoral fraud and getting away with it. Whether or not that is "impressive" is up to you.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:19
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V. Illych L. posted:in London, though? i haven't looked properly at the demographics, but there are a ton of Asians in London, aren't there? a lot of those guys, immigrants or children of immigrants, would presumably recognise one of their own. add this to the traditional labour electorate, and emphasise goldsmith's whole "naïve upperclassman" thing and you'd imagine that this is very doable - the White Van Man demographic is hardly going to vote for either Khan or Goldsmith for identity reasons, and you'd imagine that the tories are dependent on that demo if nothing else Yeah, I don't know how that skews it. I'm not inclined to interpret anything optimistically after May, though. 
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Sep 11, 2015 14:20
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To be honest Sadiq doesn't exactly run around waving the shahada so fears of him being a Muslim would fall under the whole 'socialist Kenyan Muslim' school of media histrionics, at least in my opinion. I look forward to taking this back tomorrow when the Daily Heil literally pulls that claim out.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:21
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Oberleutnant posted:Surely that should be more profitable, rather than "effective"? loving wanker. A lot of people like to lie to themselves that the primary motivation of business is something other than profit (usually by ignoring that smart measures like ensuring customer satisfaction, which may on shallow inspection seem to only cost money, have in fact meticulously costed out and been found to result in greater profits)
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Sep 11, 2015 14:22
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OvineYeast posted:So apparently Nick Clegg passed up on a chance not to raise tuition fees: Political genius of the decade right there.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:23
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thespaceinvader posted:Don't ruin it for me I'm on holiday and phone posting so I don't have all the details but they are in the midst of gutting staff pensions. In moving from final salary related pensions to money purchase schemes they are only doing what other funds have been doing for the last 20 years or so.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:25
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biglads posted:Especially at slashing pension benefits  UKMT: if it's not perfect it's terrible
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Sep 11, 2015 14:32
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Looks like the Assisted Dying Bill just got pretty soundly defeated.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:38
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Would you say it died without much assistance?
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Sep 11, 2015 14:43
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Tesseraction posted:Would you say it died without much assistance? horns.aiff
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Sep 11, 2015 14:49
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thespaceinvader posted:What on Corbyn's green earth is Cameron loving smoking? Leaving aside the fact that "breaking the state monopoly" on child protection and prisons (even though we already have some private prisons) is a poo poo idea by any metric and has nothing to do with "insurgent" small businesses and everything to do with serco, G4S, capita et al, it does make some political/electoral sense for the Tories. Assuming that they're going to go all out with the narrative that Corbyn is an extremist Trotskist throwback, the more things and services they sell off, cut and privatise, the easier it is to present Labour as backwards-focused, old-fashioned, and dangerously left-wing/commie for wanting to reverse these policies.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:50
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See when he says 'insurgent' I think of like, the Iraq Insurgency.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:50
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Tesseraction posted:To be honest Sadiq doesn't exactly run around waving the shahada so fears of him being a Muslim would fall under the whole 'socialist Kenyan Muslim' school of media histrionics, at least in my opinion. Exactly. He's one of the good ones.
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Sep 11, 2015 14:51
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Malcolm XML posted:
Not really what he said, more that they are still a large company so getting carried away & saying they "own" just because they are less poo poo than Tesco is a bit much.
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