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Transmetropolitan posted:Playing with the sultanates there is just ~wrong~ you haters of sacred bovines Vijay is also too easy, Orissa or death
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Sep 18, 2015 01:16
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Delhi, Jaunpur, Bengal, Bahmanis, and Vij are all fairly equally matched as the strongest powers in India. Orissa close second tier, with Gujarat and Mewar. Don't let any of the big ~5 get too strong, and also try and contain the lovely coring cost Rajputs (they take Aristocratic so +100% if not beaten down early) and Central Indian states. Neither of those start with much development but if allowed to grow they will spread their cancer cores and make India even more expensive, and it already is going to cost tons to core.
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Sep 18, 2015 01:30
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Pellisworth posted:Delhi, Jaunpur, Bengal, Bahmanis, and Vij are all fairly equally matched as the strongest powers in India. Orissa close second tier, with Gujarat and Mewar. Don't forget the Rajput Indian Sultanates that manage to succumb to Hindi Zealots and become another toxic tag.
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Sep 18, 2015 01:40
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Transmetropolitan posted:Playing with the sultanates there is just ~wrong~ you haters of sacred bovines The only Indian nation I've played is Nepal. How do you get to become Sikh? I always see it has one religious center in the game, and it is a different province each time. Sikh with Holy War would be... Sikh.
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Sep 18, 2015 01:52
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Node posted:The only Indian nation I've played is Nepal. How do you get to become Sikh? I always see it has one religious center in the game, and it is a different province each time. Sikh with Holy War would be... Sikh. Someone correct me if I'm wrong I've only done Sikh once, but it's kinda similar to the Reformation but for Hindus. A small number of provinces will flip to Sikh to represent the travels and preaching of Guru Nanak, the founder of Sikhism. If you're Hindu, you can flip to Sikh in the religion menu like you would a Catholic going Protestant/Reformed, or it can happen by revolt. There is a predefined succession of Gurus who give bonuses, you can check the event file (or if someone is really curious I'll dig it out in a bit). So for a few decades you'll have a set bonus in addition to your normal religion bonuses, then it will switch based on the historical Guru.
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Sep 18, 2015 02:03
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Has anyone ever done hardcore math to figure out if it is better to control 100% of the provinces in a Trade Company node or if it is better to own 33%-50% and protectorate the rest so they get that sweet +% to good produced, which you then whisk away to your home node?
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Sep 18, 2015 02:04
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I went ahead and looked at the Sikh text files, here are the various bonuses: 1499 - 1539 (Guru Nanak, founder of Sikhism) - Sikhism center of religion pops up sometime in this time frame to represent founding of Sikhism, must be Hindu with neighboring Muslim province or vice versa, 360 month MTTH (x0.4 in Doaba province). CoR does NOT convert like Reformation. 1539 - 1552 (Guru Angad) -5% Tech cost 1552 - 1574 (Guru Amar Das) +2% Missionary Strength, -2 RR 1574 - 1581 (Guru Ram Das) -10% Stability Cost 1581 - 1606 (Guru Arjan) -5% Diplomatic Tech Cost 1606 - 1644 (Guru Hargobind) +5% Discipline 1644-1661 (Guru Har Rai) +1 Diplomatic Reputation 1661 - 1665 (Guru Har Krishan) -1 Diplomatic Relations (yes, a penalty, minus one relations slot) 1665 - 1675 (Guru Tegh Baradur) +4 Tolerance of Heretics 1675 - 1708 (Guru Gobind Singh) +5% Discipline, +20% Religious Unity 1708 (Guru Granth Sahib) +1 Stability, ends Gurus Bort Bortles posted:Has anyone ever done hardcore math to figure out if it is better to control 100% of the provinces in a Trade Company node or if it is better to own 33%-50% and protectorate the rest so they get that sweet +% to good produced, which you then whisk away to your home node? Well, if you have the trade power to dominate the node, probably better just to grab the major centers and rake in the bonus dough. If you need trade power, feed your companies.
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Sep 18, 2015 02:16
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Pellisworth posted:I went ahead and looked at the Sikh text files, here are the various bonuses: Uh So you have to play the game for 50 years and hope the game picks one of your provinces to be able to convert? That's irritating. You can conquer the province and convert that way, I guess.
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Sep 18, 2015 02:20
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Anyone know why Catholic rebels have randomly started popping up in provinces of mine that have -5% revolt risk while I have 100% religious unity? It is really infuriating and seems to be happening for no good reason.Pellisworth posted:Well, if you have the trade power to dominate the node, probably better just to grab the major centers and rake in the bonus dough. If you need trade power, feed your companies. AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 02:32
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Node posted:Uh No big deal. I waited until 1500 and I was able to convert, and all my Hindu provinces were Sikh in less than 8 years. Manually, but no probs. dead gay comedy forums fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 02:34
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Node posted:Uh Nah you can just switch by decision via the religion menu if you're Hindu, pretty sure. Most of the Indian nations have Heathen Tolerance and/or Religious Unity NIs, so it's pretty painless to switch religions even by forcing revolts. My Bahmanis playthrough I racked up all their unique event modifiers (Muslim-only) and force-converted myself by inciting revolts from Shia -> Hindu -> Sikh -> back to Shia to rack up all the permanent religious modifiers. It's easy to do that kind of religious fuckery in India and SE Asia. Bort Bortles posted:Anyone know why Catholic rebels have randomly started popping up in provinces of mine that have -5% revolt risk while I have 100% religious unity? It is really infuriating and seems to be happening for no good reason. Well Mutapa has a ton of Gold income which I don't think is going to be modified by foreign trade companies? So maybe better to own that directly. But for some nodes if you can just hold the important trade provinces and have some light ships doing their thang, it's probably better to leave a good chunk of it native.
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Sep 18, 2015 02:41
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What are good ways to lower relations with the pope enough to Declare Statute in Restraint of Appeals? I'm playing Sweden and can't get any worthwhile pope influence before I go Protestant anyways. I'm sitting at +25 for same religion right now and insulting him won't reduce relations all the way to -50 on its own. He doesn't like me nearly enough to ally me so I can't get an alliance and then break it.
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Sep 18, 2015 03:28
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Bort Bortles posted:Has anyone ever done hardcore math to figure out if it is better to control 100% of the provinces in a Trade Company node or if it is better to own 33%-50% and protectorate the rest so they get that sweet +% to good produced, which you then whisk away to your home node? Odobenidae posted:Someone recently posted on r/eu4 where as the Hansa they took nearly every center of trade in the world and had managed to explode the trade mechanics giving him ungodly amounts of wealth. It had something to do with the goods produced modifier that increases when there's a merchant republic trading in the area. Aha! I found it. He's got 38 merchants but he could have gotten more if he'd had multiple CNs in a colonial region. https://imgur.com/a/5QEby It's also worth noting that you don't get the bonus to goods produced if they're your subject, vassal, protectorate or otherwise. Morzhovyye fucked around with this message at 03:43 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 03:40
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Pellisworth posted:Well Mutapa has a ton of Gold income which I don't think is going to be modified by foreign trade companies? So maybe better to own that directly. But for some nodes if you can just hold the important trade provinces and have some light ships doing their thang, it's probably better to leave a good chunk of it native. This. Mutapa's gold is pretty useless to you since it doesn't flow into the trade system. Probably better to just conquer them. Or at the very least keep them bottled up, and then attack them periodically to extort huge sums of cash.
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Sep 18, 2015 03:42
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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The take-home lesson of all of this is that Goods Produced modifiers are awesome. They are multiplicative with Production and Trade, a +10% Goods Produced is way betters than Production or Trade Efficiency usually. Edit: in the normal case of you owning most of the territory, Goods Produced is objectively the best economic stat. If you're talking min/maxing Trade Companies or "conquer only the trade nodes as Merchant Republic," you're generating a ton of bonus Goods Produced in your unowned provinces.
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Sep 18, 2015 03:44
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LLSix posted:What are good ways to lower relations with the pope enough to Declare Statute in Restraint of Appeals? I'm playing Sweden and can't get any worthwhile pope influence before I go Protestant anyways. I'm sitting at +25 for same religion right now and insulting him won't reduce relations all the way to -50 on its own. He doesn't like me nearly enough to ally me so I can't get an alliance and then break it. You could ally one of the Papal State's rivals for '-25 Allied to Rival.' Other than that I'm not sure there's any other way to intentionally lower relations outside of rivaling or alliance breaking.
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Sep 18, 2015 03:56
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Deutsch Nozzle posted:You could ally one of the Papal State's rivals for '-25 Allied to Rival.' Other than that I'm not sure there's any other way to intentionally lower relations outside of rivaling or alliance breaking. DoW? Eat that stab hit  (I'm sorry, I know I'm being of no use right now)
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Sep 18, 2015 04:06
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Major Isoor posted:DoW? Eat that stab hit I am at -2 stab right now from losing my king in the middle of my independance war. Min stab is -3 right? Could do a no CB war. I wonder how long it would take to get a white peace when neither of us can reach the other...
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Sep 18, 2015 04:08
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LLSix posted:I am at -2 stab right now from losing my king in the middle of my independance war. Min stab is -3 right? Could do a no CB war. I wonder how long it would take to get a white peace when neither of us can reach the other... Yea -3 is the lowest so if you're at -2 already you can only go down 1 more. Just save up some admin points then DoW them, enact SiRoA, then buy your stab back up to 0.
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Sep 18, 2015 04:25
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If Milan is allied to France, and I fight Milan in a different war and peace them out, will they join France in a defensive war if they have a truce with me?
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Sep 18, 2015 04:34
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Pellisworth posted:Nah you can just switch by decision via the religion menu if you're Hindu, pretty sure. Most of the Indian nations have Heathen Tolerance and/or Religious Unity NIs, so it's pretty painless to switch religions even by forcing revolts. My Bahmanis playthrough I racked up all their unique event modifiers (Muslim-only) and force-converted myself by inciting revolts from Shia -> Hindu -> Sikh -> back to Shia to rack up all the permanent religious modifiers. It's easy to do that kind of religious fuckery in India and SE Asia. I'm confused. I mean, the game picks ONE province in the entire world to become Sikh, right? And only that nation has the option to switch, or does every nation in India have the option to switch even though none of their provinces have it? Bort Bortles posted:If Milan is allied to France, and I fight Milan in a different war and peace them out, will they join France in a defensive war if they have a truce with me? Yes, truces don't apply to answering the call to arms as a defender.
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Sep 18, 2015 04:37
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Node posted:Yes, truces don't apply to answering the call to arms as a defender.
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Sep 18, 2015 05:11
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Node posted:I'm confused. I mean, the game picks ONE province in the entire world to become Sikh, right? And only that nation has the option to switch, or does every nation in India have the option to switch even though none of their provinces have it? I should double check (someone correct me if I'm wrong), but once Sikhism exists (event has created a CoR) you can convert from Hinduism by decision in the religion tab, just like converting from Catholicism to Protestant/Reformed. Sikhism will convert a handful of scattered provinces but it doesn't spread unless someone converts, which the AI never does. That's one of the reasons players like Sikhism, you're the only player of that religion excepting the unlikely event of a Sikh zealot rebellion. It's like the Reformation except for Hinduism and a lot weaker.
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Sep 18, 2015 06:09
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Man, France is almost a pushover now. I day one DOWd them as England and won, even though it ran me out of manpower. That would never happen in any of the previous versions. The one night in Paris achievement is a lot easier than it used to be.
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Sep 18, 2015 07:02
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Pellisworth posted:The take-home lesson of all of this is that Goods Produced modifiers are awesome. They are multiplicative with Production and Trade, a +10% Goods Produced is way betters than Production or Trade Efficiency usually. It also gives you more gold income ~Mutapan master race~
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Sep 18, 2015 08:36
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I am a bit worried what revanchism will do to lucky nations, I feel they should be cut out from this mechanic. France and the Ottos can already recover from early losses because they are lucky, giving them yet and other fall back seems pretty boring. And we all know how annoying SEA games are when Ming doesn't collapse, revanchism will make this less likely too. Guess we'll see how it plays.
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Sep 18, 2015 08:46
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Yeah I'm typically on board with all of their updates but this is one I never thought the game needed. It seems like it will add a degree of tedium with no boost in fun.
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Sep 18, 2015 08:52
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What if it's scaled to relative development lost instead of warscore? You can annex half a 2PM for 20-30 warscore easy but that could be over half their total development, whereas a total victory over Italy might see you take a handful of northern provinces.
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Sep 18, 2015 11:44
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We can't really say how it will affect the game until we actually see it, however, it does seem like a strange addition. At least when I lose a war I won't be so quick to restart if this means it will give me a quick way to comeback. What I'm looking forward to the most are the names that exclaves will get, now we will be seeing Austrian Netherlands or Spanish Morocco and that just makes me a little too excited.
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Sep 18, 2015 14:26
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Playing as Ethiopia, there is this event that has a pretty good chance of firing in the first years of the game where you can choose the Emperor's wife Helen to become a level 3 diplomatic advisor for half the cost. However, this is Ethiopia in 1450-1470 so your income after lowering army and fort maintenance is still below 2 ducats per month, and she costs something like 3.5 per month. So even after implementing Ethiopia's most massive austerity plan you still can't pay for your wife and end up taking massive loans and dying in the gutter. Anyone else think that event should be changed?
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Sep 18, 2015 15:19
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Mystic_Shadow posted:Playing as Ethiopia, there is this event that has a pretty good chance of firing in the first years of the game where you can choose the Emperor's wife Helen to become a level 3 diplomatic advisor for half the cost. However, this is Ethiopia in 1450-1470 so your income after lowering army and fort maintenance is still below 2 ducats per month, and she costs something like 3.5 per month. So even after implementing Ethiopia's most massive austerity plan you still can't pay for your wife and end up taking massive loans and dying in the gutter. I remember playing Ethiopia and getting that, imo it should just give Ethiopia a diplomatic reputation buff until your king dies or whatever. Ethiopia has some really cool events though, really sucked that there was no event for taking Alexandria. After getting events where the Mamelukes would be a dick to the Coptics in Alexandria, it'd be cool to get a small buff for taking back Alexandria and teaching those Muslims to mess with Coptics.
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Sep 18, 2015 15:27
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I dont think they would need Revanchism if every war was not a war to the death. If I could take England's continental holdings as France without needing to invade the island, or take Negroponte from Venice without needing to invade the island, thus in both cases likely utterly destroying my opponent -sapping them of manpower and funds- then we would not need revanchism. edit: and if I could knock allies out of a war without utterly annihilating their armies and sacking their capital, that would help too. The "you cant 100% someone until all of their allies are knocked out or 5 years is past" could use a tweak, because if it was tweaked, there would be less of a reason for Revanchism. This feature more often than not causes me to have to 100% my opponent even if I dont need/want to, and go gently caress up two or three other countries that should be able to look at the war and say to their ally "sorry bud, you're hosed and we cant save you". Also my cynical side is saying that Revanchism is another multiplayer-centric feature and the rest of us will have to live with it. AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 15:56 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 15:52
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Node posted:Granada. I wrote a wall of text (that nobody replied to If it makes you feel better, I didn't reply to it but I've been feverishly trying to recreate it your run. Dev Diary posted:We're also planning to add an achievements browser in-game that lets you see which achievements you qualify for in the particular game you are playing, and what trigger conditions you need to satisfy to unlock them. No more wiki-browsing and guesswork required! Re: Revanchism, I think it's more of a benefit for the player. I've definitely had games where I miscalculated and get caught in a death spiral of getting all hosed up in a war, which lets rebels and disasters start to happen that I don't have the men to deal with, and then the AI takes advantaged of my weakened state to start another war, which undoes all my progress against internal problems, which causes them to get worse, which causes the AI to declare war on me in my weakened state, this will happen pretty easily to the AI because their terrible money management means that one of them is more or less guaranteed to spawn Revolutionary Rebels who will give all Europe a CB against them which will cause them to be bankrupted by another war which will cause Revolutionary Rebels to spawn... I guess since most players in this thread consider the Revolutionary Republic a buff to shoot for, they snap it up before it happens to the AI. Acute Grill fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 15:53
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) a couple pages ago on how to do it.
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Bort Bortles posted:If I could take England's continental holdings as France without needing to invade the island Huh? You can do that.
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Sep 18, 2015 16:39
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Gort posted:Huh? You can do that.
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Sep 18, 2015 16:46
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I do hope they scale Revanchism so it's less beneficial to larger empire than smaller ones. Maybe make it so losing provinces that are not of your culture or at least in your culture group only gives 25-50% Revanchism compared to same culture provinces.
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Sep 18, 2015 16:50
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Bort Bortles posted:Bad example then; I tried a couple times in a previous patch and could not. What couldn't you do, exactly? If you declare war on England for Normandy and then occupy it, eventually they have to give it to you - length of war modifiers will tick down, war score modifiers for occupying the war target will tick up, and after a bit of time you'll be able to claim it in a peace deal. I don't think this is patch-dependent, either - it's always been this way in EU4, I think.
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Sep 18, 2015 16:51
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Gort posted:What couldn't you do, exactly? If you declare war on England for Normandy and then occupy it, eventually they have to give it to you - length of war modifiers will tick down, war score modifiers for occupying the war target will tick up, and after a bit of time you'll be able to claim it in a peace deal. edit:  Even if I add 10% from warscore from battles or something and another 24% from ticking warscore England would not accept that deal. AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 17:00
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I still like the idea of being able to declare limited wars, where once you achieve your specified (limited) objectives, the AI opponent and allies would be much more willing to negotiate a peace rather than everyone involved fighting an existential all-or-nothing war. It would be very expensive (or impossible) to take things other than your limited demands, in exchange for AI willingness to end a war short of near-100%'ing everyone involved.
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Sep 18, 2015 17:17
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Bort Bortles posted:I occupied the 4 (Normady, Caux, Gascone, Labourd) English continental holdings that I could reach (could not get access to get to Calais) and could not take all 4 in the peace deal. There just isnt enough warscore even with a full ticking warscore bonus, to take all 4 in the peace deal. Oh, we're on the same page now. I thought you meant you couldn't get them to give up anything at all. I don't have a problem with you needing two wars in total to kick the English off the continent. It's not like the Hundred Years War was one uninterrupted century-long period of hostilities.
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Sep 18, 2015 17:27
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