|
Pure BJJ, man. Awesome crossover with your Muay Thai, no spiritual bullshit, just bending things the wrong way. It's been described to me as "folding your clothes, except there's a person still in them". It's the tits. Maybe go somewhere that does pyjamas and no-pyjamas grappling if you're into the MMA aspects, because there's a lot less chance to grab stuff in no-pyjamas/MMA. Full guard is rad for grappling, but probably awful for MMA, and in BJJ you probably won't train many leg attacks at first, but other than that it's great.
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 20:40
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 21:14 |
|
|
Mongmonghi posted:I have been training Muay Thai for 3 years now but I feel I am a natural grappler when I fight. Neither is "better", try both and do whatever you find most fun. Or do both.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 21:00
|
|
|
Man it feels weird as a white belt to tell another white belt to calm the gently caress down when rolling.Mongmonghi posted:I have been training Muay Thai for 3 years now but I feel I am a natural grappler when I fight. If you really like the grappling aspect of it, go BJJ. If you like moth equally go to an MMA gym.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 21:09
|
|
|
Mongmonghi posted:I am not intrested in the competitive aspect of the arts, I am more into the gymnastics and the arts themselves Kekekela fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Sep 20, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 21:12
|
|
|
Mongmonghi posted:I have been training Muay Thai for 3 years now but I feel I am a natural grappler when I fight. So you wanna punch/kick people while hugging them? If yes do mma, if not do bjj. If maybe go with the gym that has the higher quality.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 21:23
|
|
|
I guess I might have to do BJJ from what I read from you guys, I love the aerobic aspect of Muay thai and our camp is quite hardcore (there are two camps in my neighborhood the one that I go is hardcore the other one goes hardcore only for the guys that want to compete) It's that I am afraid that BJJ will be nice but not so heavy in the aerobic exercise, because Muay thai so far seems quite intesne both as aerobic but as for physical punishment. But I am sure in MMA there will be the usual guys that think they are in cage and they do not train but compete for a title while they are friendly sparring.. So to conclude, is BJJ heavy on the body (calories burning speaking) or due to the nature of grappling you don't train as hard as you would by doing muay thai?
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 21:50
|
|
|
Muay thai is generally more intense for cardiovascular fitness but that doesn't mean BJJ will be easy. Grappling fitness is its own thing. One interesting thing is that as you get more advanced in grappling you can actually use less energy as your skill level increases so you'll have to resist the urge to not push yourself as hard.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2015 22:13
|
|
|
It's different enough I would struggle to compare. Both are good workouts for sure and of your diet is at least somewhat clean, you are going to be on good shape.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 00:32
|
|
|
02-6611-0142-1 posted:So I transition from mount... to a mounted triangle which is just about the most secure position it's possible to be in... then I roll over... I gently caress it up... This is where you've gotta be thinking about compensation instead of just falling into a slippery slope of defeat. Triangle doesn't finish? Armbar or omoplata, your preference. Whether or not you can finish the sub you should at least have the sweep. The biggest real risk is that they manage an escape when you try to lock up your side control at the end. Meanwhile, Mongmonghi consider Judo! Sweet flips and slams, broadens your clinch skillset, fun sport, effective grappling... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TfQ7qhPMH0 A Wry Smile fucked around with this message at 01:27 on Sep 21, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 01:15
|
|
|
ElMaligno posted:Man it feels weird as a white belt to tell another white belt to calm the gently caress down when rolling. Telling people to calm down is important no matter what. If its a white, blue, purple or tangerine belt balling harder than you want them to say something. Don't get hurt, be able to train when you are 60. rjderouin fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Sep 21, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 03:31
|
|
|
Yeah belts shouldn't matter when it comes to personal safety. Today I asked some blue belts to not crush my ribs. So they didn't. Except one who did, and he apologized. Then they all subbed me without needing to crush my ribs.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 04:48
|
|
|
I'm not having trouble finishing the triangle if I roll. My triangle's nothing spectacular but it's so deep by that point that they're pretty hosed. I'm just trying to honour Ryan Hall's advice to never roll over because he reiterates the point three or four times on that DVD. I've also come to really like Marcelo Garcia's philosophy of only going for submissions that leave you in a superior position in the event that they fail. Having said that, you guys aren't wrong, my whole submission-from-closed-guard game is pretty weak. If I can't get dominant grips I tend to just do a technical standup and then attack people based on how they react to it. 02-6611-0142-1 fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Sep 21, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 06:57
|
|
|
That's where I think there might be room for discussion: Marcelo uses and teaches the roll, either as a finish or into an armbar sequence, and also concedes top position while finishing other locked subs, like his guillotine. Not like you have to roll (which is what I think Ryan was opposing), but like a finished sub from bottom is still superior compensation compared to a sub that's just 'almost there' from top, especially in your case where its hurting your ankles to stay there. Seriously though I'm not trying to start an argument, it's just that I've had the same discussion with myself, and it seems like my finishing rates have gone way up since realizing that it's not as black and white as "never willingly concede top position"
A Wry Smile fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Sep 21, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 19:15
|
|
|
Can you give a few examples of submissions/sequences that follow from Marcello's approach? That's the kind of thinking I've been trying to build my white belt game around.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 21:23
|
|
|
Don't make proscriptive rules for yourself. You aren't Ryan Hall or Marcelo Garcia, and you probably aren't the audience they had in mind until you have a lot more experience. You will improve faster working on stuff that makes you lose than you will sticking to the things that make you win, and by following the guidance of your coaches rather than video instructionals.
Mechafunkzilla fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Sep 21, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 23:04
|
|
|
rjderouin posted:Telling people to calm down is important no matter what. If its a white, blue, purple or tangerine belt balling harder than you want them to say something. Don't get hurt, be able to train when you are 60. It also was about conserving your energy and thinking about strategy. Because the kid was very quickly and aggressively changing positions, and aiming for submissions. But me being a passive-aggressive masochistic gently caress I just endured it and defended everything until he was too tired to defend his back and i did a rear naked choke on him. After a bit we rolled a second time and he took slower this time around and it was a much better fight. He did get me on a kimura and he tanked me for the pro-tip  Mechafunkzilla posted:Don't make proscriptive rules for yourself. You aren't Ryan Hall or Marcelo Garcia, and you probably aren't the audience they had in mind until you have a lot more experience. You will improve faster working on stuff that makes you lose than you will sticking to the things that make you win, and by following the guidance of your coaches rather than video instructionals. This is so loving true, I am on a self-ban on doing omoplatas on people and being on the bottom because THAT is what nets me the win most of the time. I am working on my passes, defending using wrist locks and doing submissions from the top.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 23:11
|
|
|
Mechafunkzilla posted:You will improve faster working on stuff that makes you lose than you will sticking to the things that make you win In general, where do you guys think the tipping point is for this? I've been training for several years, and I feel like not everything my coach tells me is easy to work into my game. How I fight when I listen 100% to him is a lot stuffier than how I fight when I stick to my preferred stuff, and tried and true. I wonder if there's a difference between striking and grappling.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2015 23:57
|
|
|
CommonShore posted:Can you give a few examples of submissions/sequences that follow from Marcello's approach? That's the kind of thinking I've been trying to build my white belt game around. First, at white belt you should really just be experimenting with everything and trying to develop your survival instinct, so even if you could perfectly emulate Marcelo's attack patterns, that's not really going to be good for your broader skill development. That said, if I could give advice to myself as a whitebelt it would be to learn to love top halfguard. I used to feel like top half was essentially a setback position- the result of an incomplete pass to side control, or a sloppy mount attempt or whatever. It's actually a really versatile position, especially if you use the back step/reverse half like Marcelo does to maintain bilateral control. You might be able to kick your trapped leg free and complete a pass, you might be able to catch a guillotine or a back take when they try to come up from bottom, tons of possibilities. Marcelo's roll with Eddie Bravo is a great youtube resource for studying his top halfguard game, worth a look at least. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY0PL5RYU8M
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 02:59
|
|
|
A Wry Smile posted:That's where I think there might be room for discussion: Marcelo uses and teaches the roll, either as a finish or into an armbar sequence, and also concedes top position while finishing other locked subs, like his guillotine. Not like you have to roll (which is what I think Ryan was opposing), but like a finished sub from bottom is still superior compensation compared to a sub that's just 'almost there' from top, especially in your case where its hurting your ankles to stay there. Seriously though I'm not trying to start an argument, it's just that I've had the same discussion with myself, and it seems like my finishing rates have gone way up since realizing that it's not as black and white as "never willingly concede top position" Mechafunkzilla posted:Don't make proscriptive rules for yourself. You aren't Ryan Hall or Marcelo Garcia, and you probably aren't the audience they had in mind until you have a lot more experience. You will improve faster working on stuff that makes you lose than you will sticking to the things that make you win, and by following the guidance of your coaches rather than video instructionals. I'm not trying to argue either and I'm glad that you're both trying to help me, but I think I'm in a weird position that not many people get to. I'm a three year blue belt with no A-game, no go-tos, no favourite submissions. I have no submission from mount that I like, and no submission from side control that I like, no favourite sweeps. I've been so passive and reactionary the whole time I've been training that if I want to really step it up and get a tap, I have nothing. I have a huge collection of moves that I can use situationally but I don't have a small core that I'm good at, my game has breadth but no depth. My coach told me to pick one submission from one position and just work on getting to it and finishing it, so I figured I'd start out with the RNC from the back, which is why I've been obsessing over Marcelo. Now that I'm having success at actually tapping people he's told me to try and branch out a bit and build more contingencies into it, and for the last couple of weeks I've been looking at my mount and finding it lacking, which is why I was experimenting with that triangle. There's definitely a time to do sub-optimal things to improve your overall grappling, but I've been working on my B-game for six years and I've only been working on an A-game for six months. That's why I'm kind of obsessing over the flowchart thing right now. Again, I hope I don't come off as hostile and I'm grateful for the advice.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 04:05
|
|
|
Mechafunkzilla posted:Don't make proscriptive rules for yourself. You aren't Ryan Hall or Marcelo Garcia, and you probably aren't the audience they had in mind until you have a lot more experience. You will improve faster working on stuff that makes you lose than you will sticking to the things that make you win, and by following the guidance of your coaches rather than video instructionals. A Wry Smile posted:First, at white belt you should really just be experimenting with everything and trying to develop your survival instinct, so even if you could perfectly emulate Marcelo's attack patterns, that's not really going to be good for your broader skill development. That said, if I could give advice to myself as a whitebelt it would be to learn to love top halfguard. I used to feel like top half was essentially a setback position- the result of an incomplete pass to side control, or a sloppy mount attempt or whatever. It's actually a really versatile position, especially if you use the back step/reverse half like Marcelo does to maintain bilateral control. You might be able to kick your trapped leg free and complete a pass, you might be able to catch a guillotine or a back take when they try to come up from bottom, tons of possibilities. Marcelo's roll with Eddie Bravo is a great youtube resource for studying his top halfguard game, worth a look at least. Well yeah, I've been experimenting and working on that survival instinct. I've found that I really hate working from the bottom, and that I'm quite natural at back riding. So I prefer to look for sweeps, get on top, pass, and work for mount/back. What most often causes me to lose is getting swept and put on my back (and putting my arm in dumb places), so I was just trying to get find a few more attack options which will help me maintain that control and advance my position. I'm not sure what's so radical or proscriptive about that. Really I've been working on arm drags, breaking the guard, defending triangles and armbars, knee slice passes, half guard sweeps, shrimping, and so forth. Usually when I watch tape I'll try to find the name for something basic, and then watch like five more videos on it. The last one I did like that was a weave pass. I'm still working on it. I'm sorry that by expressing interest in that one concept that I gave an impression that I was attempting as a novice to swallow Marcello Garcia's game in one bite. e. thanks for the link.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 04:50
|
|
|
Here is my "keep it simple" gameplan from a few months ago. It's getting a bit more complicated now but I feel like I learned a lot by just mapping it hierarchically.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 05:06
|
|
|
you only play butterfly? thats pretty slick
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 14:32
|
|
|
02-6611-0142-1 posted:Here is my "keep it simple" gameplan from a few months ago. It's getting a bit more complicated now but I feel like I learned a lot by just mapping it hierarchically. I assume you're doing BJJ, but you may wanna look into adding the Short Choke into your game if you wanna put emphasis on the Rear Naked. I've found that sometimes you can't get position for RNC with the dude screwing around with your throat arm, but you can get the position for a Short Choke. Defenestrategy fucked around with this message at 18:28 on Sep 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 18:24
|
|
|
Are there any good videos or infographics that break down basic Muay Thai movements? My technique is progressing, but I have a qualification coming up and I want to devote some time to making sure I really have all the terminology and movements down pat.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 19:12
|
|
|
Mongmonghi posted:I have been training Muay Thai for 3 years now but I feel I am a natural grappler when I fight. BJJ, the rank will provide a fun sense of progression and you can test your skill level by rolling, where as if you're just training mma without fighting you'll never really know where you stand. Plus, the 'jiu-jitsu lifestyle' is fun and rewarding.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 19:32
|
|
|
Rap Record Hoarder posted:Are there any good videos or infographics that break down basic Muay Thai movements? My technique is progressing, but I have a qualification coming up and I want to devote some time to making sure I really have all the terminology and movements down pat. Just ask for a sheet of all the stuff you need to know?
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 19:42
|
|
|
02-6611-0142-1 posted:I'm not trying to argue either and I'm glad that you're both trying to help me, but I think I'm in a weird position that not many people get to. I'm a three year blue belt with no A-game, no go-tos, no favourite submissions. I have no submission from mount that I like, and no submission from side control that I like, no favourite sweeps. I've been so passive and reactionary the whole time I've been training that if I want to really step it up and get a tap, I have nothing. I have a huge collection of moves that I can use situationally but I don't have a small core that I'm good at, my game has breadth but no depth. My coach told me to pick one submission from one position and just work on getting to it and finishing it, so I figured I'd start out with the RNC from the back, which is why I've been obsessing over Marcelo. Now that I'm having success at actually tapping people he's told me to try and branch out a bit and build more contingencies into it, and for the last couple of weeks I've been looking at my mount and finding it lacking, which is why I was experimenting with that triangle. I want to understand, because I'm a little flabbergasted at this. How do you not have a favorite submission? And by favorite, I mean, "one that is even only slightly favored than the others. Even the tiniest bit." What submission have you caught the most on other people? What submission have you caught in tournaments? I believe you, when you say you don't have one, but if you look at the 3 years of rolling you've done, surely to christ there's something that stands out, even if that's only a tiny bit more than the other submissions you have. You don't like leglocks? Ankle locks? Goofy 10th planet stuff? This is definitely going to be an awesome journey you've put yourself on, so don't lose hope.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 20:52
|
|
|
I've no favorite submission but I've only been training a year. Actually, I think I favor the triangle.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 21:03
|
|
|
ICHIBAHN posted:I've no favorite submission but I've only been training a year. Actually, I think I favor the triangle. Boy howdy is there a DVD for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsNtpxKVn5M
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 21:08
|
|
|
Thanks my friend. Been watching a lot of Hall recently (his flexibility exercises & TUF). Like him a lot.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 21:18
|
|
|
Is it that weird to not have a favorite submission?
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 21:28
|
|
|
VulgarandStupid posted:Is it that weird to not have a favorite submission? With something as complex and varied as BJJ, to not have something which is marginally more attractive to you (for whatever reason under the sun) then the countless other techniques, yes. It would be similar to not having a favorite color. Weird, but not Matt Lindland weird.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 22:47
|
|
|
Just started Kickboxing last week. So far its very fun and rewarding!
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 23:19
|
|
|
Watched quite a few Ryan Hall videos. I'll need to seek out more. He has agreed way of explaining things.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 23:23
|
|
|
ICHIBAHN posted:Watched quite a few Ryan Hall videos. I'll need to seek out more. He has agreed way of explaining things. I a great
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2015 23:24
|
|
|
kimbo305 posted:Just ask for a sheet of all the stuff you need to know? I'll give this a shot, but I'm training in Brazil and my Portuguese is not great, hence the search for English language resources.
|
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2015 00:52
|
|
|
kimbo305 posted:In general, where do you guys think the tipping point is for this? I've been training for several years, and I feel like not everything my coach tells me is easy to work into my game. How I fight when I listen 100% to him is a lot stuffier than how I fight when I stick to my preferred stuff, and tried and true. No one has commented on this (and I think I know why) but it's an interesting question. I think there's a point where you've got enough experience to know that some stuff just doesn't fit you, and there's no need to waste more time on it. But there's never a point where you've got a perfect game 100%. So, when you start feeling like there's nothing new to work on, you find the point in your attack trifecta that tends to get used as a set up for the other two, and you challenge yourself to finish with it instead. If you're equally dangerous with all of your attacks, you find a place where you feel like it's an either/or decision, and you try to innovate a third option. Maybe your innovation just doesn't pan out, but the fresh perspective will still add new dimension to your existing game. tldr I strongly believe that there's always something new to learn, and there's only so much we can keep in our heads at once, so there should never be a point where you can't get any better by working whatever you're least familiar with A Wry Smile fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Sep 23, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2015 02:32
|
|
|
Drewjitsu posted:I want to understand, because I'm a little flabbergasted at this. How do you not have a favorite submission? And by favorite, I mean, "one that is even only slightly favored than the others. Even the tiniest bit." Oh I definitely have mild preferences. I try (and finish) darces more than anacondas or guillotines, and I hit lots of triangles from underneath. But I haven't really ironed out my darce enough to consider it a good submission yet, and I kind of hate triangling people from the bottom because I get passed a lot and I can't make it work on people above a certain weight. edit: and obviously I have a few favourites *now*, this was from a few months back before I started enforcing a framework on my grappling. 02-6611-0142-1 fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Sep 23, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2015 02:53
|
|
|
I read on Bullshido that if you train tae kwon do you will blow your knees out. How true is this
|
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2015 18:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 21:14 |
|
|
Smoking Crow posted:I read on Bullshido that if you train tae kwon do you will blow your knees out. How true is this I dunno. Anthony Pettis and Joe Rogan both started TKD at a young age and they never... oh.
|
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2015 18:58
|
|