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Stanley Pain posted:The solution is to not have a half baked "levelling" system in the first place. That poo poo was horrible in RO2, and is/was horrible in the KF games. Have a set amount of "talent points" you can spread out for each class, call it a day. Have an xp/level counter for those people that need that kind of input to enjoy a game about blowing things the gently caress up. The way to appease those kinds of people and still keep the thing Tripwire was going for (gating difficulty modes until you know how to play) would probably be something along these lines. Have an "account" level which only unlocks difficulty modes at certain levels. Depending on the difficulty of the match you're playing, give players a certain amount of talents to pick at the start of the match. Piece of cake.
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Sep 23, 2015 13:23
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Yeah that would be an OK solution. I'm just not really keen on a gating mechanism in a co-op shooter, or shooters in general.
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Sep 23, 2015 13:36
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Cardboard Box A posted:If you're just cutting clips out (linear editing) you can use AVIDemux - http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/ Oh wow divx, I forgot that existed.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:10
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I like the distributable talent point idea. I also wouldn't mind if the XP system was primarily focused on cosmetics. That way, people could be judged correctly: by their appearance.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:19
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I tried one of those perk trainer maps out of curiosity just to see the big deal. Went from lv 22 Firebug to 24 in one wave basically. You can earn 500xp in literally 15 seconds. Anyone who cries about having to level should just play one of those maps for a couple hours and shut up.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:27
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Skoll posted:Anyone who cries about having to level should just play one of those maps for a couple hours and shut up. "Crying" and "Criticizing" are two different words. Personally I'm not bothered by the KF leveling system much but it's still quite an awful game mechanic.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:40
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Speaking of the perk leveling server, I snuck into one last night to quickly test the Nvidia Flex settings or whatever they're called. While I can't run them well enough to leave them on, I now wish I could because holy poo poo the level of gore that it adds.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:42
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Jack Trades posted:"Crying" and "Criticizing" are two different words. I'm fine with it, personally. As much as I hate grind, I still think you can usually tell a decent player by their level sometimes. Yeah, a lot of new people will use trainer maps just to shoot up and still suck but a lot of people, by the time they reach 10-15 at least has an idea how their perk works and how to play it.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:47
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Require More Fire posted:Speaking of the perk leveling server, I snuck into one last night to quickly test the Nvidia Flex settings or whatever they're called. While I can't run them well enough to leave them on, I now wish I could because holy poo poo the level of gore that it adds. See if bumping down Ambient Occlusion (or turning it off) along side turning off Reflections lets you play with it. I found that even with Dual 970s in SLI + max settings @ 1440p required a bit of tweaking to run well. The newest drivers have also helped a lot since they specifically target KF2 + GOREFEST 9000 
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Sep 23, 2015 17:05
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Skoll posted:I tried one of those perk trainer maps out of curiosity just to see the big deal. Went from lv 22 Firebug to 24 in one wave basically. You can earn 500xp in literally 15 seconds. This makes it sound like a lovely system. If you have to use specialized maps or servers that skip over established content, then the content probably isn't very good. The reason Payday 2's originally slow leveling system worked was because of the huge amount of maps and content for it. And even then they changed it to be easier after awhile. KF2's tends to be just as much of a slog as KF1's was. Which was fine back when that was the standard, but things have moved on since then.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:30
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Archonex posted:This makes it sound like a lovely system. If you have to use specialized maps or servers that skip over established content, then the content probably isn't very good. Payday 2 isn't (thankfully) Killing Floor. Apples to oranges. The KF1 system was waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay loving worse than what we have now. I can understand people going, "Oh I'm an adult now, I don't have time to grind 25 levels of bullshit", but most of the complaining seems to be coming from the power gamer perspective of, "zomg give me access to everything now so there is no carrot and I eat through all the games content in a single day." crowd.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:47
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Stanley Pain posted:See if bumping down Ambient Occlusion (or turning it off) along side turning off Reflections lets you play with it. I found that even with Dual 970s in SLI + max settings @ 1440p required a bit of tweaking to run well. The newest drivers have also helped a lot since they specifically target KF2 + GOREFEST 9000 I'll give that a shot, plus I do need to install the new drivers so that may help. Entrails springing out of a popped Bloat is incredibly entertaining.
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Sep 23, 2015 18:11
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Archonex posted:The reason Payday 2's originally slow leveling system worked was because of the huge amount of maps and content for it. And even then they changed it to be easier after awhile. KF2's tends to be just as much of a slog as KF1's was. Which was fine back when that was the standard, but things have moved on since then. It is not even a quarter as bad as the kf1 system was
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Sep 23, 2015 18:14
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Require More Fire posted:I'll give that a shot, plus I do need to install the new drivers so that may help. That new gore system is truly a work of art  I've lost count at the amount of times I've been giggling like a madman because blood n guts were being flung across the level.
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Sep 23, 2015 18:15
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Skoll posted:Payday 2 isn't (thankfully) Killing Floor. Apples to oranges. But the reality is that those of us who play for love of the game are too few to keep a community vibrant and going. Gated content keeps people, on average, playing longer and keeps them more involved. Full stop. This isn't a discussion, it's a fact borne out by the last three generations of games. Folks can lament about this all they want but they're no different from the skullfucks unironically whining about the corruption of the PC master race by consoles. The only way you're getting around this is to have a procedural generation system sophisticated enough to produce acceptable quality content, which is its own big brand of scary. The question is how can you make it rewarding instead of punishing, really. Payday 2 does it well because you get big rewards up to level 85, slowing down to reasonable returns until level 100, with large payoffs for the first 5 prestige levels. Overt reward is basically baked into the game, which is good. KF has always had a problem with its overt rewards seeming almost accidental with how long they take to show up.
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Sep 23, 2015 18:23
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Levelling is NOT content in KF2. There's nothing to "blow through" You're either shooting zeds with bros or not shooting zeds because you're playing another game. If there are actually people out there that can't/won't play this game because it doesn't have some numbers going up there are FAR better games out there to do that in.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:03
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Skoll posted:I'm fine with it, personally. As much as I hate grind, I still think you can usually tell a decent player by their level sometimes. Yeah, a lot of new people will use trainer maps just to shoot up and still suck but a lot of people, by the time they reach 10-15 at least has an idea how their perk works and how to play it. Part of the reason for my low play time in this game is the leveling system. I didn't feel like leveling all my poo poo up to level 6-10ish just to play in Hard and gently caress around from there. After 500ish hours in KF1 and like 200 in the mod? I know the drat game basics and Normal's literally just sleep walking at this point. If I die in normal it's because I did something gimmicky out of boredom. I eventually ended up using the leveling server to level Demo, but I'm still loving around with Commando to get it out of babby's first horde mode. The fact that the solution is, "Go to a leveling map" tells me it's bad game design and should be tweaked.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:03
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Cardboard Box A posted:If you're just cutting clips out (linear editing) you can use AVIDemux - http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/ Thanks, will take a look. Nebiros posted:Part of the reason for my low play time in this game is the leveling system. I didn't feel like leveling all my poo poo up to level 6-10ish just to play in Hard and gently caress around from there. So...don't level to 6 or 10 before jumping into Hard? Setting aside whining from pubshitters about low level perks, they might as well call "Normal" "ninja dog mode" and "Hard" "normal". Hell, just finishing a Hard regular length match should take you from 0 to 1 in a new perk. If anything they need to switch the prioritization of EXP sources to make the secondary/class-specific ones give more exp than "kill poo poo" does. Why, for example, is a medic getting better at healing by killing things instead of healing people? It's retarded.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:19
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I'm cool with the leveling system, people like some sense of progression and it offers some soft balance so even guys having a hard time in normal/hard can find some sweet spot.Nebiros posted:Part of the reason for my low play time in this game is the leveling system. I didn't feel like leveling all my poo poo up to level 6-10ish just to play in Hard and gently caress around from there. Hard isn't that bad with a level 0, suicidal is when you really want to be lvl 10 at least.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:20
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Man, when you guys were talking about the quality of pubbies in suicidal, you weren't kidding. I had one of the most satisfying rounds, even if I died twice, and to be honest this was my fault for being a bit overly aggressive. I actually really like being a berserker against Hans now because if I got a medic backing me up, I can intercept him and block when he goes into melee mode and basically be a stay of execution for the rest of the team. I just have to make sure to keep backing up while he kicks my poo poo in so he'll eventually stop.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:02
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I think I figured out why i die so much as a firebug. It must be because knocking Zeds over draws aggro, and I've started using the Microwave Gun secondary fire a lot to clear some trash around the big guys. So when I hit the big guys with it a little bit they are angry a small fry in a stupid hat tries to knock them over, so they instantly counter with a Chainsaw/Fleshpound Weapon to the face.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:09
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Kikas posted:I think I figured out why i die so much as a firebug. It must be because knocking Zeds over draws aggro, and I've started using the Microwave Gun secondary fire a lot to clear some trash around the big guys. So when I hit the big guys with it a little bit they are angry a small fry in a stupid hat tries to knock them over, so they instantly counter with a Chainsaw/Fleshpound Weapon to the face. I'm pretty sure the fleshpound's arm-weapon is called a grindr.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:29
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Stanley Pain posted:Levelling is NOT content in KF2. So are the people saying that classes play completely differently based upon level and the difficulties have different ramifications on perk choices and such simply ignorant or lying? Because this flies directly in the face of that.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:46
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Colosmicon posted:I'm pretty sure the fleshpound's arm-weapon is called a grindr. Does that mean that the Husk has a tindr on his arm?
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Sep 23, 2015 21:32
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Coolguye posted:When you are talking about what the leveling mechanics bring to the game, it's really, really not apples to oranges at all. I dislike gated content as much as anyone, but the reality of the situation is that if you don't gate content somehow, people blow through what's there in a day and gently caress off. Even something as much a step forward as Left 4 Dead saw its active player base drop off precipitously a couple of months after release, because people finished the campaigns on Normal and said "well I'm done". Co-op shooters are one of my favorite kinds of games and I will play them regardless - gently caress, I still keep l4d2 installed on the off chance someone wants to play again. Pretty much. The only example of a game with no gated content that still gets a lot of people daily is Dota 2, and that's free.
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Sep 23, 2015 21:53
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SymmetryrtemmyS posted:Does that mean that the Husk has a tindr on his arm? yes and yes and I won't listen to anything to the contrary from this moment forth.
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Sep 23, 2015 22:21
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Coolguye posted:So are the people saying that classes play completely differently based upon level and the difficulties have different ramifications on perk choices and such simply ignorant or lying? Because this flies directly in the face of that. Sure perks are content, but leveling up is not content. Is leveling up in a RPG considered content?
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Sep 23, 2015 22:42
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Kikas posted:I think I figured out why i die so much as a firebug. It must be because knocking Zeds over draws aggro, and I've started using the Microwave Gun secondary fire a lot to clear some trash around the big guys. So when I hit the big guys with it a little bit they are angry a small fry in a stupid hat tries to knock them over, so they instantly counter with a Chainsaw/Fleshpound Weapon to the face. Why use the secondary to move small guys around instead of tapping LMB a few times and making half the group explode, causing nice chunk damage to the FP/SC? The explosions also seem to have a high stagger rate, which is nice to keep frontloading damage on.
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Sep 24, 2015 00:09
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Stanley Pain posted:Sure perks are content, but leveling up is not content. Is leveling up in a RPG considered content? Perks have gated choices, you know. And we literally had a discussion about how one choice changes how firebug plays rather drastically about 2 or 3 pages ago. There's more discussions about how various choices make differing sense based on your difficulty level before that. You're flat wrong here, the leveling mechanic is gating content. Hard gating by the perk choices, soft gating by difficulty level. Which, unlike most games, is actually substantially different content due to the behavior and spawning routine changes that zeds undergo.
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Sep 24, 2015 01:02
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Ramsus posted:How is this even a discussion when you can level a perk 0-25 in less than 2 mins on a perk trainer server. this explains why you have a level 20+ commando that doesnt know enoguh to clear trash and unloads clips into 'pounds
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Sep 24, 2015 02:03
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Every 5 levels in a class should get you 1 free one in all the others. 
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Sep 24, 2015 03:08
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God, nothing is more annoying than a level 25 Berserker with no idea on how to block wasting a slot on the team.
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Sep 24, 2015 03:10
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Coolguye posted:Perks have gated choices, you know. And we literally had a discussion about how one choice changes how firebug plays rather drastically about 2 or 3 pages ago. There's more discussions about how various choices make differing sense based on your difficulty level before that. You're flat wrong here, the leveling mechanic is gating content. Hard gating by the perk choices, soft gating by difficulty level. Which, unlike most games, is actually substantially different content due to the behavior and spawning routine changes that zeds undergo. Yeah it's gating content, I never said it wasn't. It's not content in and of itself though. Explain to me what I'm flat out wrong about? I'm kind of confused as to what point you're trying to make. No one is arguing that perks don't change the game. Tacking on silly level gated poo poo is kind of Tripwire's thing and I thought they'd have learned a lesson from RO2/KF1. This is exactly the same as a RPG or a MMO or whatever gating content to your level, except they make sense in that context and not in a co-op. horde mode shooty games. I disagree that there are many people playing this game because it has levels and gated content. People play this game because things blow up in glorious fashion and is fun to play with friends. The fact that there's now like 40+ leveling servers out sorta proves that people don't give a poo poo about the gated content and just want to shoot things with all their stuff unlocked. Stanley Pain fucked around with this message at 12:16 on Sep 24, 2015 |
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Sep 24, 2015 03:16
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Require More Fire posted:Speaking of the perk leveling server, I snuck into one last night to quickly test the Nvidia Flex settings or whatever they're called. While I can't run them well enough to leave them on, I now wish I could because holy poo poo the level of gore that it adds. I have an sli 980 setup on a 4k 40" (3840x2160) monitor, everything maxed including flex and it's a wonderfully gory gameinch for sure. clone on the phone fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Sep 24, 2015 |
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Sep 24, 2015 03:43
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ZearothK posted:God, nothing is more annoying than a level 25 Berserker with no idea on how to block wasting a slot on the team. I'm terrible at parrying so mindsets more extreme than the above are why I don't even bother trying to level them. Oh I can't solo a HoE fleshpound well why am I even playing with fun swords then gosh. Back to commando where people can't notice if I'm missing half my non trash headshots or not on hard-suicidal. I mean, sure I know what a block button is. But that only goes so far when you gently caress up a parry, get a chainsaw to the face when already low on health and the only reaction to this is "Oh, well I guess he should just uninstall then." Section Z fucked around with this message at 05:31 on Sep 24, 2015 |
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Sep 24, 2015 05:29
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Section Z posted:I'm terrible at parrying so mindsets more extreme than the above are why I don't even bother trying to level them. Oh I can't solo a HoE fleshpound well why am I even playing with fun swords then gosh. Back to commando where people can't notice if I'm missing half my non trash headshots or not on hard-suicidal. It takes about 30 or so hours to get to level 25, plenty of time to develop the skills needed for any one class and parrying is one of the core abilities of the 'zerker (see also: level 25 medics who haven't learned to heal teammates or focus on their 'zerker when a big guy shows up), mistakes happen while playing, but given how easy it is to cheat perk levels in KF2 it is very blatant when a level 25 player joins a Hard game and proceeds to play terribly.
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Sep 24, 2015 13:24
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Some screenshots from a goon game last night, showing off the Nvidia Flex stuff as requested: I'm not cleaning this mess up, gently caress all y'all.  Little bit of Bloat on the ceiling, guys  I think I get why Hans is pissed at us.
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Sep 24, 2015 16:38
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Section Z posted:
Eh, I disagree. Parrying, while it can be useful, is nowhere near a "critical skill requirement" for a 'zerk to be viable. Blocking is a different matter, but in that case it's literally just holding a button down when, say, 2 fleshpounds and a scrake (or Hans) are all wailing on you at the exact same time (which is more of a team failure than anything else). If a 'zerk literally does not know how to use the button, well, that's what the votekick option is for. This video has a guy soloing HoE with a crovel, and during it he explains his take on blocking/parrying as "you could be doing damage instead", which I agree with: link
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Sep 24, 2015 16:45
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The solution is to get into mumble, ts, vent, cans with strings attached to them and play with friends  . Multiplayer games in general are magnitudes of order more fun that way.
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Sep 24, 2015 16:51
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Here's a really stupid question I can't seem to find an answer to...I've tried joining the servers in the OP through the console menu, but it doesn't do anything. It just sits there. If I try and set up my own game and open it up, no one ever joins. The second is probably just because I'm a loser, but any idea on why I can't seem to connect to servers directly? I'm behind a VPN but I've disabled that to no accord. Are there settings I need to change or enable somewhere first?
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Sep 24, 2015 16:57
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