|
Niddhogg posted:Would be FAR from the first time this happened:
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 03:44 |
|
|
Niddhogg posted:I don't if he had every detail planned out from chapter 1, but I think since he had Sanji's face obscured with two sets of wanted posters he had to have had some purpose. He did: It was funny.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:40
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:Yeah, but he also points out in a reader corner that he ended up changing the character a lot, obviously, and that it wasn't necessarily hyper planning on his part (though Oda is humble). That was just from his collected illustrations and stuff, you see that in Bleach too, like an author drawing character designs that he later uses. It's not necessarily what I'd call forethought, if you get what I'm trying to say. I don't think "some person likes sanji a lot because ______ and has the means to make his wanted poster 'Alive Only'" takes a lot of foresight either.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:41
|
|
|
Jose posted:he was a chef before the shipwreck and the stuff after that was about not wasting any food Huh, I thought he was the cabin boy, not a chef. I really need to reread this series one day but holy poo poo it's so loooong
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:43
|
|
|
He was like 6 or something while he was actively starving on that deserted island with Zeff. He absolutely was not a cook at that point. Also, yeah, he didn't give a poo poo about food other than "that thing you eat to not die" until that experience.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:46
|
|
|
Ryaomon posted:If you think he was planning this all out from the beginning than I don't know what to tell you man, no author plans that far ahead except for the ones who suck and only sell 1 part of their planned 19 part novel series before getting canned. That's silly. Lots of authors plan for stuff from the beginning. There's a range of writing styles ranging from planning everything out before hand to just winging it the whole way. It is however probably true that most authors don't stick with everything as they planned from the start. Of course with a good author you can rarely tell the difference between something planned from the beginning, something originally planed to work differently, and something opportunistic. Which is to say Sanji is actually Joy Boy, having lost his memory and is now wanted by the government.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:49
|
|
|
Niddhogg posted:I don't think "some person likes sanji a lot because ______ and has the means to make his wanted poster 'Alive Only'" takes a lot of foresight either.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:50
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:Oh no I'd agree, I wasn't really paying attention to the argument at hand, just talking about the Boa example and pointing out that it's generally kind of a fine line and hard to tell what was actually planned out with foresight. I'd guess it was something like Brooke where he had a vague idea for a skeleton musician when he wrote Laboon's arc but didn't get to it until years later. If it's not a huge plot point it was probably nothing.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 20:56
|
|
|
Took a bit of a break after polishing off East Blue. Now I'm into the Baroque Works. This is several pages late, but to whoever countered my "Zoro's fights are boring" comment with "He has some cool moments, like Whisky Peak," I actually agree. But I also think Whisky Peak illustrates why most Zoro fights don't do it for me (though it's possible that's also my memory playing tricks on me since I also recalled Zoro being a lot more boring than he's been so far). Basically, there are a couple times in East Blue (and at least one instance I remember very distinctly during Baroque Works) where Zoro simply wins by executing a signature move or technique of some kind. I'm not a huge fan of these since often times he just cuts through an opponent he was previously struggling with because I guess Oda decided the fight should be over. I don't get the same energy reading (or remembering) his fights that I do with the other characters, where there's a struggle but ultimately a clear transfer of dominance from one party to the other. By contrast, Usopp's fights are consistently great because he's always matched against super powerful dudes he needs to out-think and out-maneuver. I can't remember any Usopp fights from my initial read where I ever felt like he won arbitrarily due to being a main character. Regardless, Whisky Peak was great and I completely forgot about Luffy and Zoro just completely chumping Mr. 5 and Ms. Valentine like they were an afterthought. I'm glad I decided to revisit this series before moving ahead because there's so many great little moments and jokes and things I completely forgot about between this reading and the last one.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:09
|
|
|
Bad Seafood posted:Took a bit of a break after polishing off East Blue. Now I'm into the Baroque Works. Yeah most of his fights are very Kubo-esque. They're just arbitrarily over after he decides to use some finisher move.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:17
|
|
|
I like Zoro fights when they're short and samurai-like, like a Kurosawa sort of thing. It's fitting. They should arbitrarily end after a finisher move, it's very samurai movie. For example, the battle with that zombie samurai guy on Thriller Bark was one of my favorites. Usopp's cool, but I was never really a fan of Nami's clima-tact or w/e at all and I hear worrying things about Usopp leaving his cool poo poo behind and using plants or something? I guess as long as they're seed bullets, I like the Kabuto. With the clima-tact it just felt so weird and out of nowhere and I don't think I'll ever lose that feeling, it was just like "Oh, Nami, you're good at navigation and sensing changes in the temperature? Here Usopp randomly made you a superweapon and now you're Storm I guess". I would have preferred going more in the thief theme direction, I don't like a character's main weapon just being something someone else made out of scratch for them. This is similar to my worry that Brook will always stand out like a sore thumb for me, given that it feels like most of his backstory and character growth already happened and he still kind of just feels like a caricature/outsider to the Straw Hats for me and redundant in some ways at best (a perv like Sanji, a swordsman like Zoro, even if he's a fencer). Of course I'm super not caught up, so I can only assume Brook is built on more as a character, and if he's not I suppose I trust in Oda to do poo poo in that direction at some point. All the other characters really just got a lot more molding and compelling backstory in the arcs that introduced them, like Nami and Robin. Brook's just felt too neat, "Hey remember that whale?". Zoro maybe not as much but he's had so many more chapters to be fleshed out as a character and I really liked early One Piece where it was just "Luffy and Zoro up to poo poo" (which is why I loved Impel Down, I really just want Luffy on his own stories sometimes, the size of the crew is getting claustrophobic for me). It's probably just a case of Brook being the newest member, but when the likes of Franky and Chopper joined they were already very well fleshed out and had compelling backstories despite being the newest. Punkin Spunkin fucked around with this message at 21:21 on Sep 25, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:19
|
|
|
Dragonatrix posted:He was like 6 or something while he was actively starving on that deserted island with Zeff. He absolutely was not a cook at that point. Also, yeah, he didn't give a poo poo about food other than "that thing you eat to not die" until that experience. Chef was the wrong word but he was working in a kitchen and probably about the same age as ace/sabo in the flash back
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:27
|
|
|
When was Joy Boy first mentioned in One Piece? The wiki says it was at Fishman Island but I could have sworn it was earlier than that late in the game Maybe it was Skypeia?
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:37
|
|
|
Gyges posted:That's silly. Lots of authors plan for stuff from the beginning. There's a range of writing styles ranging from planning everything out before hand to just winging it the whole way. It is however probably true that most authors don't stick with everything as they planned from the start. Of course with a good author you can rarely tell the difference between something planned from the beginning, something originally planed to work differently, and something opportunistic. Yeah, this is what I wanted to say. Basically, there is a whole gulf between "planned out every detail before chapter 1" and "just wings everything arc to arc". At the very least he had the idea to do something interesting with Sanji at the time of the second wanted poster which is why he obscured his face, although that wasn't too long ago either. It's conceivable that he had something planned out even sooner, possibly even sooner than the original posters, but there is really no way of knowing.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 21:52
|
|
|
Pshhhhaw, Ace owed Luffy that fist through chest save given he wasted so much time ignoring his Captain's "get the gently caress out of here and live, you're the whole point we're here and everyone's dying" order and he still falls for Akainu's trolljob and spends precious time formally bowing before Whitebeard. You just faced down the collected strength of the entire Marines, maybe there's no time for that stuff. Should've kept running bro, the Whitebeard Pirates just decimated themselves and a shitload of people died just so you'd have that one opportunity but noooo you gotta face down Akainu Guess that's just Ace tho
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 22:52
|
|
|
I've always been more of a fan of Zoro's goofy character traits rather than his fights.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 23:06
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:I like Zoro fights when they're short and samurai-like, like a Kurosawa sort of thing. It's fitting. They should arbitrarily end after a finisher move, it's very samurai movie. Zoro's fights should be like a samurai move, whole Usopp's fights should either be a super tense sniper vs. counter-sniper fight or a straight up all out gunfight.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 23:36
|
|
|
Good Usopp fights: Enemy at the Gates, Saving Private Ryan
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 23:47
|
|
|
It comes down to two things. Oda has always had an ending in mind. This means he can add whatever he wants and gauge how it works vs the ending. He might not have planned the supernovas/ worst generation at the start but they either work for or enhance his original vision. The other thing is that he doesn't write himself into ridiculous corners that require bullshit or handwaves to get out of. It makes for a fun adventure that has enjoyable surprises instead of groaning. For the most part. Sabo and that giant kingdom behind Windmill Village get a little tenuous. Compare to Bleach which is obviously made on the fly. Or with Magi which is super tightly planned.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 23:47
|
|
|
magi is really obviously interfered with by editors
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2015 23:52
|
|
|
Niddhogg posted:I don't if he had every detail planned out from chapter 1, but I think since he had Sanji's face obscured with two sets of wanted posters he had to have had some purpose. Would be FAR from the first time Oda had something planned really far back: Please take the time, it would be legitimately really interesting to see any others I haven't encountered before.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 00:23
|
|
|
You know what would be loving nuts? If Kaidou ended up being the Floridian Triangle monster  He did take out Moria's crew after all, I wouldn't put it past him to keep tabs on the dumbest Warlord just to be a dick
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 00:28
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:This is similar to my worry that Brook will always stand out like a sore thumb for me, given that it feels like most of his backstory and character growth already happened and he still kind of just feels like a caricature/outsider to the Straw Hats for me and redundant in some ways at best (a perv like Sanji, a swordsman like Zoro, even if he's a fencer). Of course I'm super not caught up, so I can only assume Brook is built on more as a character, and if he's not I suppose I trust in Oda to do poo poo in that direction at some point. Brook is the cool skeleton pal that makes bone puns, what more do you need?
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 01:46
|
|
|
Broseph Brostar posted:Brook is the cool skeleton pal that makes bone puns, what more do you need? I rewatched the end of Sabaody in the anime the other day and was impressed he took the time to make a  as Kuma came for him. Disappeared just as he was finishing the punchline.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 02:11
|
|
|
He also had the most notable post-timeskip upgrade for whatever it's worth, which really helps to set him apart from Zoro and gives a neat explanation for his music based abilities which I wasn't really a fan of before. The new abilities he showcased on Fishman Island and in his fight against Zeo was easily the most exciting thing about that entire arc to me, and I'm kind of disappointed that we haven't seen much of that since.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 02:17
|
|
|
Broseph Brostar posted:Brook is the cool skeleton pal that makes bone puns, what more do you need?
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 02:41
|
|
|
Brook is the only one to turn down fame and fortune so that he can go pirate with some kids young enough to be his great grand kids. And also go see a whale.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 02:43
|
|
|
Should've made Caribou the new crew member instead of Brook...every ship could use a ship priest right?
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 05:17
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:I like Zoro fights when they're short and samurai-like, like a Kurosawa sort of thing. It's fitting. They should arbitrarily end after a finisher move, it's very samurai movie. Tangentially related, chalk up Zoro and Sanji's hunting competition in Little Garden as another fun thing I totally forgot about. One Piece is so much better than I remember it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 05:32
|
|
|
Parrotine posted:You know what would be loving nuts? Congrats, this is the dumbest theory in the thread since "Kizaru's power is nanomachines".
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 05:35
|
|
|
It totally is but a man can dream. Make my poorly thought-out fan speculation come true Oda 
White Light fucked around with this message at 05:44 on Sep 26, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 05:38
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:I dunno, all the other Strawhats seem to have a deeper and more fleshed out connection to Luffy and each other, whereas like you said Brook is just the cool skeleton pal that makes bone puns and not much else. I guess not every member of the crew can be as multi dimensional as it gets larger though Well like you said he's kinda a mix of Zoro and Sanji. Perverted, but very loyal to Luffy and the crew. Like when he was telling Zeo about his faith in Luffy and that he never has to worry as long as he believes in him, or even the little things like when he tells the samurai kid he only takes orders from Luffy and noone else. I agree he definitely needs more fleshing out as a character, but there is something more substantial there, he's not only skeleton jokes. I hope Oda takes the time to work with him a little, but it feels like the time to do that was Pre-Timeskip and now there's too many things happening for Oda to spend time on an arc just for him. I mean I may be wrong and he might get something like Usopp and Robin got in Water 7, but it just doesn't feel like there's time with the way the stories going. Doubly so when people outside of the crew are taking up lots of the available screentime when there's a period an arc could be comfortably fitted into.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 07:29
|
|
|
Well I'm not caught up so I'm not aware of how crazy the world situation is right now but hopefully there's some opportunity for a "calm belt" in the story so to speak, I mean is the plot's momentum like a runaway avalanche right now or might there be opportunity to slow things down and get into arcs that might be focused on one member of the Strawhats like the old days I'm surging through Fishman Island right now, not sure how many chapters are left in it but it's decent. Better than I expected what with some of the complaints I heard about it. The villains don't particularly thrill me yet (I like the alcoholic and the guy who changes the way he ends his sentences depending on how powerful he's feeling tho) and the setting is just okay but I really liked the Sun Pirates flashback and the connection/filling of blanks back to the Arlong Park arc. Luffy's whole aversion to being cheered or called a hero feels kind of dumb and random though. I'm not going back to check, but you telling me he's never been cheered or called a hero before? Because he didn't seem to care about any of that with any of the multiple islands, villages, and entire countries he's saved. Though jeez, Vander Decken IX is the biggest creepo of a One Piece character since the King of Alabasta, the world of One Piece could really use a Chris Hansen It does feel like Oda's pages are a lot more crowded now though, compared to early One Piece, I like manga with a willingness to explore the beauty of open space (if you know what I'm trying to say? I may not be expressing it right, like Vinland Saga) and not necessarily constantly have dialogue balloons and characters crammed into everything. p.s. stop being such a poser Brook, laughing at Usopp's awesome Robin impersonation like you've even been around the crew enough to get the joke  there was a two year jump practically right after you joined buddy. I'd like him more if Chopper kept draining his resolve by finishing his bone puns before he could drop the punchline That whole praying his spirit out of his body thing is fun though Punkin Spunkin fucked around with this message at 09:29 on Sep 26, 2015 |
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 08:23
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:I'm surging through Fishman Island right now, not sure how many chapters are left in it but it's decent. Better than I expected what with some of the complaints I heard about it. Most of the complaints are based on the fact that Fishman Island was hyped up basically since Arlong Park, and it ended up being just "look how buff we are now".
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 09:35
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:Well I'm not caught up so I'm not aware of how crazy the world situation is right now but hopefully there's some opportunity for a "calm belt" in the story so to speak, I mean is the plot's momentum like a runaway avalanche right now or might there be opportunity to slow things down and get into arcs that might be focused on one member of the Strawhats like the old days Yes it really is kinda of like an avalanche right now. Everything that happens in the next arc you're about to read has basically set in motion really big events and it's really hard to see Oda being able to fit in a Brooke story with all the other poo poo he's going to have immediately address because of what the characters did. There's doesn't seem to be room for a Water 7 type arc where the crew are basically relaxing after the last big adventure and get really lovely news that sets off a chain event where it would warrant Brooke getting an arc and really what would you make it about.For example Usopp's concerns for the ship and his place among the crew were established early on , with the problem gradually increasing as they progressed through the Grand Line. Brooke doesn't really have that going for him.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 10:08
|
|
|
I think Brook awoke his devil fruit and that's the source of his "ghosting" ability. That makes him cool and super strong.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 15:20
|
|
|
It just occurred to me that the introduction of Luffy's vivrecard is only there so we can see it slowly burn away at some point in the future, like  That'll probably be the signal for the Strawhat Armada to assemble for the climactic battle.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 15:21
|
|
|
Gyges posted:Brook is the only one to turn down fame and fortune so that he can go pirate with some kids young enough to be his great grand kids. And also go see a whale. I wouldn't say 'turn down' so much as given up. 'Turning down' implies that he walked away before he got famous, whereas he was already famous from his two-year music tour and then just lost interest.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 15:41
|
|
|
TheFallenEvincar posted:It does feel like Oda's pages are a lot more crowded now though, compared to early One Piece, I like manga with a willingness to explore the beauty of open space Let me tell you about the complex exploration of open space seen in the background of Bleach... kinmik posted:It just occurred to me that the introduction of Luffy's vivrecard is only there so we can see it slowly burn away at some point in the future, like That didn't really make any sense when it happened with Ace. Why did it just start burning when he was in Impell Down? Like, how does it differentiate between the guy being in a prison and chilling out at the bottom of the Moby Dick? Get the poo poo kicked out of him in an island wide fight with Blackbeard, that makes sense to cause your vivre card to react. Do vivre cards magically repair themselves? Like if Ace hadn't given in to the weakest, most obvious, taunting since Marty McFly was called a chicken, would Luffy's bit of the card have unburned itself?
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 15:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 03:44 |
|
|
Gyges posted:Let me tell you about the complex exploration of open space seen in the background of Bleach... Yes, they apparently do. In the chapter with Ace's death, the card (before it burns out completely) is repaired from its original state, presumably because Ace was freed from the scaffold. Sanji also mentions in 490 that the paper gets bigger again when the owner gets better.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2015 16:12
|
|
