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That Works posted:It's just that it lays on the abuse of its characters pretty thick in a few places that get to be a bit much. I get what Captain Invictus means. This last chapter was to explain a past element at least but yeah the previous couple chapters of the club just getting poo poo on over and over seemed too over the top. There's already plenty of adversity to overcome without piling on some seemingly hamfisted "BAD EVENTS" on top of it. Yeah, that band teacher is comically evil; I'm just sort of mentally treating her and her student/faculty followers more like a force of nature than actual people. Besides, even if it's super unrealistic I still enjoy the inevitable payoff when the protagonist and their friends triumph over adversity. It's the same principle behind something like Great Teacher Onizuka, where some of the students are super evil/mean but you ultimately end up with some sort of emotional catharsis.
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Sep 28, 2015 20:26
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That Works posted:It's just that it lays on the abuse of its characters pretty thick in a few places that get to be a bit much. I get what Captain Invictus means. This last chapter was to explain a past element at least but yeah the previous couple chapters of the club just getting poo poo on over and over seemed too over the top. There's already plenty of adversity to overcome without piling on some seemingly hamfisted "BAD EVENTS" on top of it. its manipulation of emotional highs and lows to create crushing triumph when everything turns out good, thats like storytelling 101 the cool thing about shiori is that much like life it also doesn't decide set points or arcs to have highs and lows, everything flows up and down throughout the entire chapter. This chapter was super heartwarming but also reinforced what was lost in the past that can be regained in the future. the band teacher is just a super driven career woman so lol if you think of it as cartoonish evil. shes actively and maliciously going after anything she thinks of as a threat for the constant growth and expansion of her personal realm, but it is for the interest of the students in the end. super human behaviour. Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Sep 28, 2015 |
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Sep 28, 2015 20:26
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Captain Invictus posted:I never said anything about that, I was saying that the focus on repeatedly beating Shiori and co down was getting tiring. death to olds
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Sep 28, 2015 20:29
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I haven't read it yet but I love a good emotional rollercoaster.
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Sep 28, 2015 20:32
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Sharkopath posted:its manipulation of emotional highs and lows to create crushing triumph when everything turns out good, thats like storytelling 101 Also lol if you think the band teacher isn't the high school equivalent of a supervillain with the poo poo she does. Like do you read Assassination Classroom and think "yes, the principal definitely has a sound reasoning for his teaching practices, yes"
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Sep 28, 2015 20:33
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Chas McGill posted:I haven't read it yet but I love a good emotional rollercoaster. Yeah that's what it is straight up, its a story about triumph and realizing your own self expression no matter how old you are or how unlikely you are to succeed, and also about just going for it even when life gets you down, as a consequence success isn't immediate and the characters efforts to disturb the status quo are opposed by others but in the end everything turns out alright. If you're incredibly emotionally upset that humans can be cruel to other humans than you should stay away though.
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Sep 28, 2015 20:34
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you're kinda dense sharky
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Sep 28, 2015 20:35
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Captain Invictus posted:There's balance in the highs and lows, and too many lows too often makes for unfun reading, is all. It's why I said as long as it doesn't focus too hard on that it'll be great. They've already got quite an uphill battle, no need to lay on multiple more chapters of beating down right now. she runs her club very strictly with an eye towards constant improvement and sabotages a club that is directly competing with hers for attention and funding, its super cruel but shes not cobra commander.
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Sep 28, 2015 20:36
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Captain Invictus posted:you're kinda dense sharky actually discuss the comic or dont post at me at all.
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Sep 28, 2015 20:37
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Calling it cartoonish evil or pointless cruelty ignores the comic itself, because it depicts a world where events have consequences. The teacher is harsh and brutal but as a direct result of her domineering personality her club has advanced so far in such a short time, and her overreactions to shiori's light music escapades are a mode of behaviour supported by that. In the latest chapter the tragedy isn't random, besides illuminating why she's a self imposed outcast at school, something already established in previous chapters, the actual provocation for the events was another girl who was scared and angry at her own loss of position and acting without a level head she did something stupid and when the totality of her action settled inside she denied it, that's very human. The issue was brought about because of the actions of the characters involved, and didn't materialize out of nothing, it was a natural progression of their eventual goal.
Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Sep 28, 2015 |
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Sep 28, 2015 20:59
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Why does the author hate Prince so much
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Sep 28, 2015 21:01
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DoubleDonut posted:Why does the author hate Prince so much It's gonna be so dope when he comes back.
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Sep 28, 2015 21:02
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It's also really dumb to say that the point of all art is pure entertainment, a lot of art is designed to illuminate aspects of life or just express emotion. Appreciation and enjoyment by an outside audience is something often considered by an artist, but a lot of work is personal and treating it like that cheapens the whole medium.
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Sep 28, 2015 21:04
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Sharkopath posted:It's also really dumb to say that the point of all art is pure entertainment, a lot of art is designed to illuminate aspects of life or just express emotion. Appreciation and enjoyment by an outside audience is something often considered by an artist, but a lot of work is personal and treating it like that cheapens the whole medium. This is what makes the medium of the graphic novel so novel itfp, imho, tbqh. The expression of a good author is rather intimate, yet the successful ones usually carry a universal message that appeals to a wide range of overlapping interests. manga about badminton, shogi, flower arranging, or the breeding of stock animals are capable of inspiring businessmen and musicians. Deep down, a truly artistic work can be appreciated for both its complexity, and its simplicity. True art cannot be compressed into a pithy and compact capsule to be later decompressed because of the innate ornateness of the artifact. Then there's manga devoid of nutrition or artistic merit, yet are also enjoyable. Much like the guilty pleasure of junk food, booze, and skipping work. There are also manga which are both entertaining and informative. Recently, I've found a lot of enjoyment reading manga based on the work of surgeons (because Monster warped me for life). Waiting for a good manga to update is liek watching in wait for a pot to boil
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Sep 28, 2015 21:51
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Sharkopath posted:she runs her club very strictly with an eye towards constant improvement and sabotages a club that is directly competing with hers for attention and funding, its super cruel but shes not cobra commander. Speaking of the brass club: I'll be very surprised if trumpet girl doesn't end up joining Shiori's club.
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Sep 28, 2015 22:00
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^^^ Yeah, I see this happening and it sort of upsetting the balance of power between the band and the light music club, since that trumpet girl is their first seat (I think)Sharkopath posted:Calling it cartoonish evil or pointless cruelty ignores the comic itself, because it depicts a world where events have consequences. The teacher is harsh and brutal but as a direct result of her domineering personality her club has advanced so far in such a short time, and her overreactions to shiori's light music escapades are a mode of behaviour supported by that. In the latest chapter the tragedy isn't random, besides illuminating why she's a self imposed outcast at school, something already established in previous chapters, the actual provocation for the events was another girl who was scared and angry at her own loss of position and acting without a level head she did something stupid and when the totality of her action settled inside she denied it, that's very human. The issue was brought about because of the actions of the characters involved, and didn't materialize out of nothing, it was a natural progression of their eventual goal. Eh, yeah, it's true that it's "human," but it's "bad human." While most people will occasionally lash out at others or do mean things (or have prejudices, etc), only lovely people make a concerted long-term effort to gently caress other people over. Most people do not think "argh I want to ruin this person just for interfering with my success even though they have not directly wronged me." Besides, it's really obvious the author is trying to make the band lady look like an outright villain, what with all the literally villainous facial expressions. (As a caveat, many children will behave downright maliciously despite not being bad people, but the only adults who do are definitely either bad or mentally ill.)
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Sep 28, 2015 22:29
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Normal people act against the universal self-interest all the time, real people can be petty and selfish as all get out. To maintain a belief that people can only be good evil or mentally ill is quite sheltered. Her facial expressions aren't also just to say she's an evil villain, they're emphasizing her duplicitous nature and contrast with her regular smiles. Shes able to escape consequences for her actions because she's cultivated an external image of innocence and she protects it actively. People are complicated and their motivations and histories become complicated too. She sees her students as means to improve the whole club and has little qualms about dropping what she sees as dead weight but otherwise seems to care deeply about their their growth. She's a hard teacher and a terror to anybody she sees as getting in her way, but she's not evil. The negative events surrounding the light music club also serve an important reinforcing purpose, its highlighting their newfound purpose and sense of resilience. Beforehand all of the characters would have folded to the pressure of others like they were before. Even in the face of adversity now though they are continuing with their newfound sense of expression and actively seeking to enlighten other people in the same situation as they were. To see it only as tragedy that should be replaced with more happy times is silly. Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Sep 29, 2015 |
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Sep 29, 2015 00:02
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Sharkopath posted:Normal people act against the universal self-interest all the time, real people can be petty and selfish as all get out. To maintain a belief that people can only be good evil or mentally ill is quite sheltered. Her facial expressions aren't also just to say she's an evil villain, they're emphasizing her duplicitous nature and contrast with her regular smiles. Shes able to escape consequences for her actions because she's cultivated an external image of innocence and she protects it actively. Quite true, Mayoi. Just like the caveat to surgery manga is that the scalpel seeking blood needs victims to cut and paste back together. If there's something I dislike more than the death of a comic relief, it's the conclusion to an epic manga. Here's Hiramoto Akira's Me and the Devil Blues, to illustrate the curse of 27 (an allusion to an author with a deadline). Gosh, I was actually taken aback by the awkward translation of that Jimi manga. I hope everyone else is reading a better translation, or otherwise 日本語で読む, and all of that rot.
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Sep 29, 2015 00:23
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The important thing to know about manga scanlation is that 50% of it is poo poo, 49% of it is still poo poo but edited to be readable (but still mistranslated), and 1% is good but the translator stopped and the series hasn't been updated for years.
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Sep 29, 2015 00:34
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Sharkopath posted:Normal people act against the universal self-interest all the time, real people can be petty and selfish as all get out. To maintain a belief that people can only be good evil or mentally ill is quite sheltered. Her facial expressions aren't also just to say she's an evil villain, they're emphasizing her duplicitous nature and contrast with her regular smiles. Shes able to escape consequences for her actions because she's cultivated an external image of innocence and she protects it actively. Um, as I mentioned pretty explicitly in my post normal people do mean/petty/selfish things all the time and pretty much everyone has some prejudices (if not outright bigotry). But most adults do not think things along the lines of "I want to hurt other people because they are interfering with my success," and the ones who do are definitely lovely people. Regardless, the intent of the author is pretty obviously to portray her as a generic "bad person" who more or less exists only as an obstacle for the protagonist to overcome (though I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up being "redeemed" at some point). What you're saying is like someone pointing at a Captain Planet villain and saying "well, they have their own motivations and circumstances, and when you think about it everyone has littered at some point." While it's true that in real life people always have their own circumstances and are very rarely "evil", that doesn't apply to fiction like this. Either way, I'm fine with the negative events in the manga; it was another poster who didn't like them. And I don't think they've had to face anything too extraordinary; so far it's just been the principal being resistant to creating their club and the band teacher loving up their room.
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Sep 29, 2015 03:59
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drat, Freesia is really good. And a million times more coherent than Matsumoto Jiro's other works.
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Sep 29, 2015 08:27
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RatHat posted:drat, Freesia is really good. And a million times more coherent than Matsumoto Jiro's other works.
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Sep 29, 2015 09:28
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RatHat posted:drat, Freesia is really good. And a million times more coherent than Matsumoto Jiro's other works. It's more a traditional story, in a sense, yeah.
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Sep 29, 2015 10:21
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See you in Eden An 3-chapters short story done by the author of Eternal Sabbath and Cesare. The art is a bit rough so possibly early in her career. It follows the life of a student in an art school, her efforts in finding art she like, her doubts and regrets, the pressure in the environment, in the teachers and peers, and in the reality that outside is rare to find a real work with art studies, etc. My first impression was " just passable". It doesn't have time to really expand on the issues or the characters. But in the end it makes a good still picture of a situation, a mood, in a very natural way. Good old coming-of-age bitterness. Given the theme, it's possibly semi-autobiographical?
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Sep 29, 2015 14:38
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Sharkopath posted:its manipulation of emotional highs and lows to create crushing triumph when everything turns out good, thats like storytelling 101
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Sep 30, 2015 10:34
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Sometimes Mellow Fanservice done right. Ok, ok, I will give you the good stuff. A single volume with 8 stories, mostly little possible romances and sudden spark between man and woman, or some upbeat short story. From the author of "Is Reiroukan Still Alive?". Great drawing, very sensual women. It seems the author knows his forté is the drawing, and sometimes the dialogue is almost mute. From the eight stories, I would say five are good, so overall decent but it could have been better.
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Sep 30, 2015 10:49
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Undercurrent With the first pages, this started as the typical realist seinen manga, a boring real story of a totally mundane character in our boring real world. Exactly, it's about a woman whose husband went missing and she has to go on in her life while working in family business. But the truth is that I found it pretty gripping, a story that is being opened bit a bit to mystery of the disappearance and what it really hides the two main characters in their past. It express clearly and in a unpretentious way how horrible is this kind of situation, as she doesn't know if he left her for another woman, or he killed himself in a far away place, or he escaped outside the country, or had an freak accident, or what, so she has no closure at all. Looking at her mechanically gaze to newspaper suicide articles, and doubting about if she truly understood her couple is painful. But it isn't only full of angst, it has too a few humor moments that gives a needed levity and some SoL touches, and the plot advances eventually, with a decent resolution.
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Sep 30, 2015 19:27
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I completely forgot that they were making a Dorohedoro Caiman figure. I also did not know it would be 15 inches tall, holy poo poo. http://www.anime-export.com/product/27934 Or that it'd be $200. But drat, it's pretty. 
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Oct 2, 2015 16:19
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NASA What is this. The stories are straightforward and there is not big twists nor super-dramatic scenes. It's like the author isn't Naoki Urasawa! Of course, being done in 1988, it seems the quirks which later would dominate his output weren't present in this single volume of short stories. The drawing also lacks his personal style, it's more in line of what was used at the end of the eighties in the seinen circles. The first story is about some amateurs trying to do send a person to space. It ends strangely without any kind of resolution, it's like they were the first two chapters of a manga of that theme, one that Urasawa could never finish, so it put it here in this compilation. The impression I have of the rest of the short stories is that... well, this isn't his strong point. Or maybe it's because this is a early work, but I found most of them are unremarkable. They are mostly quirky and readable, but nothing to recommend over other dozen of short stories. In special sometimes he tries to be funny but he didn't seem to have born as comedian.
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Oct 2, 2015 17:24
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Turin Turambar posted:Sometimes Mellow Turin Turambar posted:Undercurrent These look cool. Adding them to my to-reads. I've been reading a couple chapters of Bartender every night lately and although it's not earth shatteringly good, it's relaxing and satisfying, like a glass of 10yr old Aberlour. I bounced off the anime, despite being a lover of mundane stories, but I'm somehow 40 chapters into this. As Yang Wenli said, alcohol is humanity's friend.
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Oct 3, 2015 03:07
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Captain Invictus posted:I completely forgot that they were making a Dorohedoro Caiman figure. I also did not know it would be 15 inches tall, holy poo poo. Oh man, it even includes Gyoza.
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Oct 3, 2015 03:11
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Chas McGill posted:These look cool. Adding them to my to-reads. I like Bartender also. It's not awesome but its a nice easy read and the manga is interesting a majority of the time.
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Oct 3, 2015 03:11
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IShallRiseAgain posted:Oh man, it even includes Gyoza. Gyoza AND gyoza-holding chopsticks hand!
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Oct 3, 2015 04:02
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In seinen news, it seems the Crime & Punishment based manga is already finished and translated. Maybe I will start it next week. Have anyone read it?
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Oct 3, 2015 08:36
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Turin Turambar posted:In seinen news, it seems the Crime & Punishment based manga is already finished and translated. Maybe I will start it next week. apparently I was enjoying it. TheFallenEvincar posted:p.s. to whoever recommended Crime and Punishment, hot pick, it's really awesome so far.
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Oct 3, 2015 08:41
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Koohii Jikan - (Coffee Time) From the author of Undercurrent, single volume of short stories. The first impression is that it isn't as good as Undercurrent, not every author has a strong grasp in how make short stories tick, as the page limit is hard. In this case, I feel that maybe the author Tetsuya Toyoda would be more comfortable doing half the stories with twice the pages, instead of doing so many, as there are 17 short stories. I think he is a bit too subtle for doing really short stories, you need more oomph to reach the readers in just 12 pages. That said he isn't bad or mediocre here, there are several that are decent and two or three that are good. NASA's Urasawa was worse, for example. In some panels the drawing style really blends with Hiroki Endo's in my mind. Are we sure they haven't worked together? Because drat. Actually, I think Toyoda does better faces, or at least more variety of them and they feel a bit more natural. The common theme of the stories is coffee, as the title suggests, but that's the theory, honestly in most of the stories it isn't a real thing, it's just that the author thought it would be fun to have some kind of common element in all of them and put it there. There is at least some variety in here. Some are bittersweet moments, others are more funny, others are slightly surreal.
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Oct 4, 2015 11:27
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Have anyone read 'The World is Mine'? Opinions?
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Oct 4, 2015 11:57
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I tried to read it but found it really hard to follow.
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Oct 4, 2015 11:58
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Turin Turambar posted:Have anyone read 'The World is Mine'? Opinions? I love the character designs (striking a fine balance between exaggeration & realism), I thought the ending was perfect, and it is my favorite manga period (maybe until someone completely scanlates Kiichi!!).
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Oct 4, 2015 15:19
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Turin Turambar posted:In seinen news, it seems the Crime & Punishment based manga is already finished and translated. Maybe I will start it next week. It was very good
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Oct 4, 2015 16:30
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