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I am not a book posted:Agreed. Ban automobiles in favor of light rail. The argument about car rights when self-driving cars become viable and demonstrably safer than human drivers, on public roads at least, will be a thing to behold.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:10
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dogs named Charlie posted:You may not have the right to commit murder but as of right now people have the right to own an object that can, in the most casual way possible, end lives very quickly and easily. It shouldn't be that way RuanGacho posted:Can someone explain to me the justification for the 2nd in a modern context, I'm trying to figure out if nation states have a right to MAD or not.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:11
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Dead Reckoning posted:Most people wouldn't describe shooting an attacker as "casual." That said, why should it not be that way? Should citizens not be allowed to own dangerous items because of the mere possibility that they will misuse them? If you believe that, you're going to have to cast a much wider net than guns.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:16
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Dead Reckoning posted:Most people wouldn't describe shooting an attacker as "casual." That said, why should it not be that way? Should citizens not be allowed to own dangerous items because of the mere possibility that they will misuse them? If you believe that, you're going to have to cast a much wider net than guns. Yep, it makes sense that we allow citizens to have guns despite the document, horrific effect they have on American life just in case Red Dawn happens.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:17
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Anyone arguing against gun control instantly looks like this in my mind:
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Oct 3, 2015 22:22
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Funky See Funky Do posted:Why do people feel they need a gun to be safe in America. I feel perfectly safe and I don't even have a knife in easy reach. Gun advocates are overwhelmingly racist babies scared of their worst nightmares coming real.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:22
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"Gun control is the same as abortion restrictions" 
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Oct 3, 2015 22:25
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joeburz posted:Gun advocates are overwhelmingly racist babies wishing to play out their call of duty fantasies. You missed a spot.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:28
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joeburz posted:Gun advocates are overwhelmingly racist babies scared of their worst nightmares coming real. What do you mean? I'm sure they have no problem with people living in the black parts of Chicago carrying a gun for self defence. They might actually need it there. Dead Reckoning posted:Should citizens not be allowed to own dangerous items because of the mere possibility that they will misuse them? Dangerous goods should be heavily regulated because a lot of people are loving idiots and some are violent psychos. If people only ever hurt themselves I might have a misanthropic peace with it but they don't.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:30
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Lessail posted:"Gun control is the same as abortion restrictions" You can't kill'em inside but once they're out, blast away!
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Oct 3, 2015 22:35
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It's been forty pages. Can we please talk about anything else? Was the bombing of the MSF hospital not interesting enough to warrant more than three posts? Meanwhile, I'm sure gunchat is changing hearts and minds. Here's an article about how US Special Forces operated in 133 different countries in 2014. I certainly had no idea of the extent of this. quote: A clandestine Special Ops training effort in Libya imploded when militia or “terrorist” forces twice raided its camp, guarded by the Libyan military, and looted large quantities of high-tech American equipment, hundreds of weapons—including Glock pistols and M4 rifles—as well as night vision devices and specialized lasers that can only be seen with such equipment. As a result, the mission was scuttled and the camp was abandoned. It was then reportedly taken over by a militia. Oops! Good thing that's a pretty rare and isolated inci... gently caress. How's that for gun control?
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Oct 3, 2015 22:38
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Just organize the militia You can own guns, but mandatory weekend training plus five hundred hours of community service yearly along with monthly mandatory physical and mental health evaluations to make sure that you are in condition to serve
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Oct 3, 2015 22:38
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Funky See Funky Do posted:Why do people feel they need a gun to be safe in America. I feel perfectly safe and I don't even have a knife in easy reach. I wish I'd kept the link, but a guy who was open carrying was mugged for his gun. They don't prevent gently caress all. Found it: http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5953044
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Oct 3, 2015 22:43
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A Bag of Milk posted:Oops! Good thing that's a pretty rare and isolated inci... gently caress. How's that for gun control?
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Oct 3, 2015 22:45
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A Bag of Milk posted:It's been forty pages. Can we please talk about anything else? Was the bombing of the MSF hospital not interesting enough to warrant more than three posts? Meanwhile, I'm sure gunchat is changing hearts and minds. The 2nd amendment clearly states that militias are allowed to own guns, so I fail to see the problem here. 
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Oct 3, 2015 22:46
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"i need a gun to defend myself because there's a lot of dangerous people out there with guns" is the same as "ugh, if only it weren't for all these other drivers i wouldn't be stuck in traffic"
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Oct 3, 2015 22:47
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Funky See Funky Do posted:What do you mean? I'm sure they have no problem with people living in the black parts of Chicago carrying a gun for self defence. They might actually need it there. I see.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:50
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Popular Thug Drink posted:"i need a gun to defend myself because there's a lot of dangerous people out there with guns" is the same as "ugh, if only it weren't for all these other drivers i wouldn't be stuck in traffic" Except that cars kill less often per use capita.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:56
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Luigi Thirty posted:I see. You're not giving me much to go on but I think you're reading something into that that isn't there.
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Oct 3, 2015 22:58
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Nintendo Kid posted:Except that cars kill less often per use capita. I like this. Every time I see that argument brought out (that cars kill people, too, what are you going to do, ban cars?), I never know how to engage with it on their level because it's just so dumb. So, thanks for giving me a way to engage on that level.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:00
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Funky See Funky Do posted:You're not giving me much to go on but I think you're reading something into that that isn't there. I can hear it though. Loud in my mind. Very high pitch.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:04
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Nintendo Kid posted:Except that cars kill less often per use capita. Now I'm intellectually curious about firearm deaths per round fired for any reason in the USA vs auto deaths per mile traveled. E: also per time used and not fired. mlmp08 fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 23:08
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Nintendo Kid posted:Except that cars kill less often per use capita. Isn't it like 1 death per ~7500 cars and 1 death per ~9000 guns? The numbers are about the same (in total) but there are roughly 50-70 million more guns in the US. mlmp08 posted:Now I'm intellectually curious about firearm deaths per round fired for any reason in the USA vs auto deaths per mile traveled. Probably per mile driven, most guns are just hanging around with a very small % being used daily in any kind of large capacity. I don't know how'd you even come up with a rounds per year per gun per person measurement.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:11
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Luigi Thirty posted:I can hear it though. Loud in my mind. Very high pitch. What exactly can you hear? I was mocking the feelings of people that think like they need a gun to defend themselves from their position of relative safety. I'm not saying a person living in the black parts of Chicago (don't be petulant you know drat well you segregate your cities by race) needs a gun but they're at far more risk than Mr whitey suburbia.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:19
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Funky See Funky Do posted:What exactly can you hear? I was mocking the feelings of people that think like they need a gun to defend themselves from their position of relative safety. I'm not saying a person living in the black parts of Chicago (don't be petulant you know drat well you segregate your cities by race) needs a gun but they're at far more risk than Mr whitey suburbia. Judging by the last gun thread here, owning a gun for personal protection while living in the inner city makes you a white paranoid doomsday prepper because nothing bad ever happens to people living in the ghetto.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:27
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A Bag of Milk posted:It's been forty pages. Can we please talk about anything else? Was the bombing of the MSF hospital not interesting enough to warrant more than three posts? Meanwhile, I'm sure gunchat is changing hearts and minds. I tend to agree. People who wish to continue pursuing it can go to this other thread on the subject, at least until such time as the next gun-related tragedy hits. So probably for a couple of days. 
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Oct 3, 2015 23:28
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raven4267 posted:Judging by the last gun thread here, owning a gun for personal protection while living in the inner city makes you a white paranoid doomsday prepper because nothing bad ever happens to people living in the ghetto. Okay I've never understood this about racist gun retards, if say, you are in a ~black ghetto~ and you get mugged, for being a white person of course, how does a gun help you in an armed robbery? If one reaches for a gun while having a gun pointed at them, they'll either be shot or they won't, and if they aren't shot then the robber was not a threat to begin with. And if someone gets robbed by an armed person, and then after tries to turn the table, they are committing their own crime. What is the point of a weapon in that situation even assuming random victimization? edit: sorry absurd alhazred, NM
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Oct 3, 2015 23:31
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Every time there's a mass murder the same fuckers come out of the woodwork to say 'Oh don't you dare say anything bad about guns or suggest any regulation!'
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Oct 3, 2015 23:32
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Plinkey posted:Isn't it like 1 death per ~7500 cars and 1 death per ~9000 guns? Yeah but if you go by Fps rules and subtract a point for every team kill and suicide those figures go way down
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Oct 3, 2015 23:41
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RuanGacho posted:Can someone explain to me the justification for the 2nd in a modern context, I'm trying to figure out if nation states have a right to MAD or not. Standing armies are a tool used by monarchs to suppress the rights of the populace, and an unacceptable threat to republican values. Therefore, it is important for political reasons that we have militias for the common defense & preservation of law instead of standing armies, and we need to enshrine the right to do that.
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Oct 3, 2015 23:47
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Plinkey posted:Isn't it like 1 death per ~7500 cars and 1 death per ~9000 guns? The numbers are about the same (in total) but there are roughly 50-70 million more guns in the US. Yes, the important part is that vast amounts of guns out there don't get used - they're still in fireable condition or easily restored to that, but they just sit around. Meanwhile a lot more of the passenger car fleet is used, and a lot more often at that. Very few people will have a car and just leave it int he garage for years on end, a lot more do that with a gun, sometimes even unknowingly.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:04
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A Bag of Milk posted:It's been forty pages. Can we please talk about anything else? Was the bombing of the MSF hospital not interesting enough to warrant more than three posts? Meanwhile, I'm sure gunchat is changing hearts and minds. Well, we don't actually know anything about what lead up to the bombing, so there isn't much to talk about. Also, it's not really a political issue.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:05
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Bob Ojeda posted:Standing armies are a tool used by monarchs to suppress the rights of the populace, and an unacceptable threat to republican values. Gee, wonder how that worked out, oh yeah, the last time we tried that, the White House burned down.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:13
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I'm still processing the hospital bombing but every time I can formulate a thought that seems to strike close to my feelings on the matter, a new bit of news comes out that makes me even more depressed an angry.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:23
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Klaus88 posted:Gee, wonder how that worked out, oh yeah, the last time we tried that, the White House burned down. In all honesty, it wasn't an unrealistic concern for republican theorists at the time, or completely unrealistic as a solution, given the examples of the Swiss etc. And in fact in a lot of ways hindsight has kind of proved them right in their concern. There are plenty of examples where exactly what they were afraid of happened - Literally Napoleon, to start with - and the man on horseback problem remains a real thing. It's not like it's uncommon for coups to be lead by military officers even today. At the same time it's also become very clear since that their solution doesn't work and that national defense pretty much demands a standing army. But it wasn't really that crazy at the time.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:23
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Seriously, this is no longer a suggestion. Take gun chat to another thread for now. It's gone on long enough here, it's swamping out all other updates on US politics.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:25
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Seriously, this is no longer a suggestion. Take gun chat to another thread for now. It's gone on long enough here, it's swamping out all other updates on US politics. Sorry I wasn't trying to get into a gun argument I just really like talking about republican theory
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Oct 4, 2015 00:27
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Jagchosis posted:Okay I've never understood this about racist gun retards, if say, you are in a ~black ghetto~ and you get mugged, for being a white person of course, how does a gun help you in an armed robbery? If one reaches for a gun while having a gun pointed at them, they'll either be shot or they won't, and if they aren't shot then the robber was not a threat to begin with. And if someone gets robbed by an armed person, and then after tries to turn the table, they are committing their own crime. What is the point of a weapon in that situation even assuming random victimization? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 4, 2015 00:28
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An anonymous source told People Magazine the shooter's manifesto is all about serving Satan and shooting Christians in the name of Satan. Uh... I'm sure this is actually what it said. I hope we get another round of Satanic panic videotapes out of it.
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Oct 4, 2015 00:33
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Job Truniht posted:Gun control also has a history of being racist- given Reagan, the Black Panthers, and the AWB.  (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 4, 2015 00:39
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