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Irony Be My Shield posted:I can fully believe the Doctor just talks to himself when no-one else is around. Does he tell himself to google it?
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Oct 11, 2015 09:06
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squarerandom posted:Dude just calls the Doctor out for treating O'Donnell like a test subject, that he only cares about saving clara because she's close to him. His answer is that he's saving Clara, not himself. That's not what he said. He said that now it's getting close to him, because if Clara dies, next up is the Doctor himself. O'Donnell was a test subject, to see if she would instead die in that order. Clara was a test subject for a different purpose: to see if the Doctor could actually save anyone. If he could, he knew he could save himself. The guy thought that the Doctor just cared about himself, and not about Clara at all. It made sense from his perspective. Chokes McGee posted:Also because of this episode I've now learned how to swear in ASL. Thanks, Cass! BSL. British Sign Language. It's a completely separate language from ASL. Not just dialects, completely different languages. Every country basically has its own sign language (although they often share a bunch of basic signs).
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Oct 11, 2015 09:15
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I like that the Doctor's amp was made by Magpie Electronics.
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Oct 11, 2015 09:19
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SirSamVimes posted:Does he tell himself to google it? He just hangs out with the creepy thing on the bed from Listen when nobody's looking.
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Oct 11, 2015 09:21
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I can fully believe the Doctor just talks to himself when no-one else is around. I did laugh when he tries to get the attention of his "ghost" and says,"Finally, somebody worth talking to!" Ms Boods posted:I like that the Doctor's amp was made by Magpie Electronics. Yeah that was a nice little touch 
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Oct 11, 2015 09:45
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Oh, I don't like the Conquered People Chaps, it feels a bit like a Douglas Adams joke that didn't go anywhere
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Oct 11, 2015 09:53
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Oh, I don't like the Conquered People Chaps, it feels a bit like a Douglas Adams joke that didn't go anywhere Thankfully he was very quickly killed.
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Oct 11, 2015 10:04
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The conquered people guy was too much like David Walliams at the start of the God Complex and not enough like David Walliams towards the end of the God Complex
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Oct 11, 2015 10:07
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aksxZTPx7PU
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Oct 11, 2015 10:29
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2house2fly posted:I was expecting the cold open to go somewhere, but its only purpose was to be called back to, it was fun but had no purpose in the episode. The whole concept had no purpose in the episode really, apart from to point out that the Doctor gave himself the idea in an infinite loop with no starting point. But if they're not going anywhere with it, why bother to point it out? The characters just shrug and the episode ends. It was weird. The only problem I have with Moffat using it is that it usually doesn't mean anything except that it's time for something convoluted to happen to return to the status quo rather than trying to do something interesting with it.
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Oct 11, 2015 10:41
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Moffat didn't write the episode, and given that the story does feature a causal loop there's no real reason to think that he put it in
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Oct 11, 2015 11:08
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Oh, I don't like the Conquered People Chaps, it feels a bit like a Douglas Adams joke that didn't go anywhere I think that joke lasted exactly as long as it needed to. It's funny, but doesn't have much legs without clever writing to keep it up. And even if they had that, it just would've taken away from the story. I could see their planet being a fun backdrop for a comedic story, though, maybe starring the Sontarans. This was still a solid episode, but maybe not as good as the last one. Like someone said earlier, it feels like we're missing a couple scenes. Not crucial ones, we're not missing any vital information, just scenes needed to space out the story beats or make better use of the 'prop town' setting. I guess it's a good episode to have the only real complaint be 'we needed more of it'.
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Oct 11, 2015 11:14
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I thought the second episode would answer why Cass didn't let Lunn into the ship but it didn't. Any thoughts? Was it simply precaution because she needs him as a translator?
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Oct 11, 2015 11:18
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saucerman posted:I thought the second episode would answer why Cass didn't let Lunn into the ship but it didn't. Any thoughts? Was it simply precaution because she needs him as a translator? It was as straightforward as she loved him and wanted to protect him because she sensed something was wrong with the thing. Not a strong enough feeling to stop herself from going in, or any of the other crew, but when it came to him (somebody she loved) it got all her alarm bells ringing, even if she couldn't articulate why beyond,"It's dangerous."
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Oct 11, 2015 11:43
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I liked the Doctor's comment about his current regeneration being 'a bit of a clerical error' hence his apprehension about his own death.
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Oct 11, 2015 11:54
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Overnights: 4.38 million and a 21.5% share, which is good; but still just beaten slightly by Casualty, which is not. Keep it there and Moffat's likely back in the "the job's yours as long as you want it" zone.
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Oct 11, 2015 13:08
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Ms Boods posted:Golly, Paul Kaye is unrecognisable when he's clean and tidy. Back to last week, this, but I assumed Paul Kaye was the corporate "I'm off out to get the power cell" guy when you said this. I didn't realise until today that he was actually Alien Funeral Man, which makes more sense.
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Oct 11, 2015 13:35
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My read on the episode. It's an old-fashioned morality tale. If anyone's seen Toby Whithouse's version of Being Human, you'd probably get the sense that he's gaga for this kind of thing. Hell, that show's probably got the most moral possible take on vampires I've seen on television -- there's no such thing as a "good" vampire. You fall back into the murderous habits, you're a monster, and you die. End of. I think if we ever saw him as a Doctor Who showrunner (yes please) we'd get into a What Happened On Dust situation. Anyway, my point is that he's got a very strong sense of morality to his work. His version of the Doctor is inherently dangerous and difficult, and his companions are compromised by their decisions to overlook his behaviours. I think that's why his villains tend to be parasites -- he sees the Doctor as a corrupter figure, just like the Fisher King. And as Clara becomes more like the Doctor, she becomes more willing to play with the lives of strangers -- she sends that one guy off to his probable death, then proceeds to crack wise with the woman who clearly loves him. No wonder Cass basically ignores her and fucks off. Clara doesn't given a gently caress. So the Bootstrap Paradox stuff. It's the Doctor talking straight to the audience so that we know beforehand what's going on. It's clever, actually, a little mini-paradox in itself. We're told that the episode is going to involve this kind of mechanic before it happens, so we know what the Doctor's going to do before he does it -- but only because he's already told us. Cute. But that means that we know that the Doctor could have saved O'Donnell. No-one saw her hologram until after she died in the past. He could have made her a hologram too. Or saved her and sent her back into the TARDIS. There's no proof that she had to die, outside the Doctor's mind establishing that as a pattern that he felt needed to be fulfilled. The Doctor accuses the Fisher King of meddling with the patterns of life and death, but isn't this what the Doctor's done here? He killed her in order to send a message to himself -- hell, he did it just to see that he was doing that. He effectively let her die on a whim. And then he has the balls to lecture the dude who loved her about how he'd throw the universe out of joint for Clara. But gently caress that dead girl, the one he could have saved. She was only his biggest fan. Edit -- oh, btw, I loving loved this, which probably isn't clear from the above. Open Source Idiom fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Oct 11, 2015 |
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Oct 11, 2015 14:22
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I can fully believe the Doctor just talks to himself when no-one else is around. Sit right down and I'll tell you about a wonderful little story called
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Oct 11, 2015 14:36
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Open Source Idiom posted:So the Bootstrap Paradox stuff. It's the Doctor talking straight to the audience so that we know beforehand what's going on. It's clever, actually, a little mini-paradox in itself. We're told that the episode is going to involve this kind of mechanic before it happens, so we know what the Doctor's going to do before he does it -- but only because he's already told us. Cute. Well, it could also be the Doctor explaining the concept to Clara after the fact. Which would also bring it into the same sort of paradox-masking as the Doctor uses with his ghost; it recontextualizes the incident in question, causing it to make internal sense, but the question is only buried, not answered. MotherFUCK this one's complicated.
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Oct 11, 2015 14:41
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Open Source Idiom posted:But that means that we know that the Doctor could have saved O'Donnell. No-one saw her hologram until after she died in the past. He could have made her a hologram too. Or saved her and sent her back into the TARDIS. There's no proof that she had to die, outside the Doctor's mind establishing that as a pattern that he felt needed to be fulfilled. The Doctor accuses the Fisher King of meddling with the patterns of life and death, but isn't this what the Doctor's done here? He killed her in order to send a message to himself -- hell, he did it just to see that he was doing that. He effectively let her die on a whim. The Doctor and the other dude watched her die, though. That's pretty final. No one ever saw the Doctor's or Clara's dead body. He is also lying when he talks to the Fisher King. In reality, he's doing exactly what he is supposed to do. Maybe he messed with the universe in some other reality, but it's not the one we see. Also, the Doctor's fans have to die. I think Missy made that abundantly clear. 
And More fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Oct 11, 2015 |
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Oct 11, 2015 15:04
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My biggest issue was with O'Donnell's death. It was so hacky. Unknown baddie sneaks up behind her, slow turn, gets shot with an alien space gun. Fast forward to the Doctor finding her dying, no blood, somehow surviving space gun for a minute. To me that whole sequence screamed setup. As in the doctor set it up so she looks like she's dying and she knows she has to act like shes dying from being shot by the Fisher King. Somehow they decided that was a well shot death scene.
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Oct 11, 2015 15:09
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Fil5000 posted:The conquered people guy was too much like David Walliams at the start of the God Complex and not enough like Not that I don't agree with you, but just tidying things a bit.
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Oct 11, 2015 15:14
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Open Source Idiom posted:What Happened On Dust The alternative death of the Third Doctor...?
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Oct 11, 2015 15:23
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Ms Boods posted:I like that the Doctor's amp was made by Magpie Electronics. Oh yeah I googled it and wow I wonder how many easter egg call backs this show has had that I've missed. Who knew The Idiot's Latern was so influential in later eps haha! I love how Capaldi's doctor doesn't dominate the scene. 10 and 11 would be jumping around mugging the camera. Here you have a smaller doctor leaning in watching the monitor from the side like everyone else. He also doesn't explain or talk about his every motive. When that dude called him out for maybe sacrificing Mcdonnell he doesn't really say much in return. He is smarter and thinks deeper than he lets on. Eleven here would go on a small rant about being clever.
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Oct 11, 2015 15:32
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The_Doctor posted:The alternative death of the Third Doctor...? Yeah. It's probably one of the best things to ever happen to the series. Shame the proposed sequel, Beneath The Planet Of The Spiders, never happened. We were robbed. But yeah, on that note, I can't help but think that, given the absolutely heartlessness that's increasingly characterised the Doctor, a similarly aggressive take could be quite interesting / cathartic. I feel like the show's gotten to the point where it's become very comfortable with itself, and could do with something a bit radical to shake things up. I'm not proposing that we see a companion shoot the Doctor in the hearts, or anything like that, but this era of the show's yet to produce anything as considered or self-concious, despite being around for a decade (and thus having suitable time to reflect on itself). Perhaps this will be something for the second wilderness years. I'm kind of excited at the idea, honestly.
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Oct 11, 2015 15:44
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Open Source Idiom posted:Yeah. It's probably one of the best things to ever happen to the series. Shame the proposed sequel, Beneath The Planet Of The Spiders, never happened. We were robbed.
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Oct 11, 2015 16:27
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Flapping buttcheeks
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Oct 11, 2015 16:55
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That wouldn't happen, given that the show is called "Doctor Who" and he is the main character.
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Oct 11, 2015 16:55
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cargohills posted:That wouldn't happen, given that the show is called "Doctor Who" and he is the main character.
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Oct 11, 2015 16:59
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cargohills posted:That wouldn't happen, given that the show is called "Doctor Who" and he is the main character. I dunno man, Taggart ran for about as long without Taggart as it did with him. It's not unprecedented.
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Oct 11, 2015 16:59
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That's because the actor died. He didn't get shot onscreen and then the TV show just went on.
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Oct 11, 2015 17:03
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It would be cool if Taggart regenerated.
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Oct 11, 2015 17:16
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The answer is no-one would ever dare try it because then it would upset The Queen. She looks disgruntled on a normal day, do you want to deal with her when she's actually angry? 
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Oct 11, 2015 17:16
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Taggart needed novelisations by Target.
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Oct 11, 2015 17:24
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cargohills posted:That's because the actor died. He didn't get shot onscreen and then the TV show just went on. The character DID die as well though. They didn't pull a Corrie and never mention them again, or recast him or anything else. It was absolutely because McManus died but they killed off the title character too. Edit: I'm totally reaching here, Taggart is all I could think of for a show that carried on without the title character. Fil5000 fucked around with this message at 17:42 on Oct 11, 2015 |
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Oct 11, 2015 17:31
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Jerusalem posted:The 4th Wall Breaking was a little bit much for me, but otherwise that was a thoroughly enjoyable episode and a nice follow-up to the first part. That was my favourite part. I thought Peter nailed it, I could watch that all day. I was going to ask if that happened often, but going by the replies in this thread, obviously not. That was some good direction! The_Doctor posted:That was alright. I like a quiet thoughtful story like that. The Fisher King looked really good. Such a great suit, I thought. Peter Serafinowicz seemed a bit 'soft' for the voice in my head but I'm not sure how much horrifying it needed to be for the target audience. Jerusalem posted:Before the Flood gifs I did such a brilliant digitally painted prop to go in this scene and it didn't show up  There's a couple of shots of the hearse at the base covered in morning frost which I thought were really, really nice. That was quite a sight at 6am. 
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Oct 11, 2015 17:54
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echoplex posted:That was my favourite part. I thought Peter nailed it, I could watch that all day. I was going to ask if that happened often, but going by the replies in this thread, obviously not. That was some good direction! Peter 'Darth Maul' Serafinowicz?
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Oct 11, 2015 17:57
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echoplex posted:That was my favourite part. I thought Peter nailed it, I could watch that all day. I was going to ask if that happened often, but going by the replies in this thread, obviously not. That was some good direction! Yeah, I agree, the opening monologue is great, even if it breaks the fourth wall. That hearse shot is gorgeous.
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Oct 11, 2015 17:58
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Dabir posted:Peter 'Darth Maul' Serafinowicz? Peter "Darth Chef" Serafinowicz Or "Duane Benzie", take your pick
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Oct 11, 2015 18:06
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