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Woolie Wool posted:Which mentally ill people are "dangerous"? Are you qualified to judge that? You do realize that the power relationship between society at large and the mentally ill is inherently unequal, right? I don't even give a gently caress about the guns in this case, I care about blanket "mental health screenings" to "weed out" "dangerous people" in general. and blaming them for the twisted, disgusting mindset entire generations of young white people have been acculturated into, not just the mentally ill ones. If this is what we must resort to to coddle "responsible gun owners" (many of which have the exact same sort of ideas and cultural pathologies as an Adam Lanza or a Dylann Roof), why tolerate private gun ownership at all? Literally none of these programs are 'you have x disorder NO GUN FOR YOU' they're almost all 'you have x disorder and the manifestation of that in you is that you're expressing violent thoughts to yourself or others, or some other red flag that already exists as a 'hey maybe keep an eye on this dude' thing, you should not have a gun'. Roof, for example, literally couldn't shut up about murdering black people, I don't care what medical disorder he had, maybe that is enough to say 'yea, no gun, bro'.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:05
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Dead Reckoning posted:Because restricting rights on the basis that people may misuse them rather than punishing those who actually cause harm is no way to run a society. .....cars come to mind. And drinking. And smoking.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:05
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various cheeses posted:He left it for his wife while she was home alone, the slave was recovered by the police. Try not to work yourself up over crimes committed against a man who dared to own a piece of property, thanks.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:06
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Dead Reckoning posted:Because restricting rights on the basis that people may misuse them rather than punishing those who actually cause harm is no way to run a society. in fact it's a great way to run a society, as opposed to believing my right to store volatile chemicals and unstable explosives in my apartment building without training or safety equipment should not be infringed until i actually kill someone because having an ounce of common sense and preventing problems before they happen is communism
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Oct 13, 2015 03:06
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Snowman Crossing posted:i guess if you're a loving pussy and worry about "survival" more than "justice" Or this, saying poo poo like this, where you imagine being able to arbitrate 'justice' with your gun and calling people who disagree 'pussies', that probably means you shouldn't have a gun.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:06
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Tatum Girlparts posted:Or this, saying poo poo like this, where you imagine being able to arbitrate 'justice' with your gun and calling people who disagree 'pussies', that probably means you shouldn't have a gun. Or vote on a single issue for an entire party line. "Well the Republicans are loving me in the rear end with a strap on, but at least they won't take mah guns, despite no evidence of Democrats doing that either."
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Oct 13, 2015 03:08
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Woolie Wool posted:I can't say I have any faith in the "judgment of the common man on the street" in a society built on layer upon layer upon layer of structural prejudice and oppression. i think you misread what i said to make it clear they generally require a level of disorder, as judged by a professional, that you are a risk to yourself and others (which means you probably shouldn't have tools that let you multiply that risk with no real personal benefit), they do not rely on some random guy saying this guy seems nuts
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Oct 13, 2015 03:10
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evilweasel posted:i think you misread what i said That's all nice and good and all, but due to Burwell v. Hobby Lobby won't that mean that you can just convert to Scientology when a mental health professional deems you unfit to buy a gun and then sue the state because it's now your firmly held belief that mental health professionals are literally Hitler?
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Oct 13, 2015 03:14
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Dead Reckoning posted:Because restricting rights on the basis that people may misuse them rather than punishing those who actually cause harm is no way to run a society. owning a firearm is not a right despite what a bunch of old racists may have said centuries ago
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Oct 13, 2015 03:15
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Tatum Girlparts posted:Or this, saying poo poo like this, where you imagine being able to arbitrate 'justice' with your gun and calling people who disagree 'pussies', that probably means you shouldn't have a gun. It was the tired old "oh yeah having a gun is actually more dangerous than not having a gun" as if any of us gun owners give a gently caress. We shoot and clean and fondle horrible death machines all the time, and a momentary lapse in judgment could mean serious injury or death. No poo poo that is more dangerous than playing Mario Kart and hanging anime wall scrolls. But yeah, if a home invader busts in that is your time to shine. That's the payoff, baby. You get to take a stand and finally be like "hey motherfucker, you're not getting my Playstation 4."
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Oct 13, 2015 03:15
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evilweasel posted:banning dui doesn't stop people from driving drunk and punishes them before they hit someone, legalize dui CommieGIR posted:.....cars come to mind. And drinking. And smoking. evilweasel posted:in fact it's a great way to run a society, as opposed to believing my right to store volatile chemicals and unstable explosives in my apartment building without training or safety equipment should not be infringed until i actually kill someone because having an ounce of common sense and preventing problems before they happen is communism Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 03:17
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Woolie Wool posted:For gun collectors, if your primary interest is collecting them and having these machines for their aesthetic qualities, why not collect swords instead? They have much more artistic value since they're frequently made by artisans rather than soulless corporations, they're even more The beauty of freedom is never having to say "instead"
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Oct 13, 2015 03:17
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shaped, they have 6,000 years of history behind them, and they're almost useless for committing crimes with, since they don't work from a distance like a gun and cannot be concealed like a knife.
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A Winner is Jew posted:That's all nice and good and all, but due to Burwell v. Hobby Lobby won't that mean that you can just convert to Scientology when a mental health professional deems you unfit to buy a gun and then sue the state because it's now your firmly held belief that mental health professionals are literally Hitler? Hobby Lobby only applies if your religious views are sufficiently close to Scalia or Alito's.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:17
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CommieGIR posted:Or vote on a single issue for an entire party line. No evidence? Democrats could hardly keep it in their pants after the Newtown shooting. NY passed gun control legislature literally in the middle of the night turning a ton of gun owners in the state into criminals. e: Also Hobby Lobby can Slobby my Knobby tbh
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Oct 13, 2015 03:17
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Snowman Crossing posted:It was the tired old "oh yeah having a gun is actually more dangerous than not having a gun" as if any of us gun owners give a gently caress. We shoot and clean and fondle horrible death machines all the time, and a momentary lapse in judgment could mean serious injury or death. No poo poo that is more dangerous than playing Mario Kart and hanging anime wall scrolls. It's good that sport rifle and pistol shooters, hunters, etc. are represented by this guy. His jokes are so goddamn fresh, and he seems really mentally stable.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:19
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Effectronica posted:It's good that sport rifle and pistol shooters, hunters, etc. are represented by this guy. His jokes are so goddamn fresh, and he seems really mentally stable. I think everyone can agree that you shouldn't have a gun, but I think existing law could cover that. Just collect all your death threats in one place and take them to the judge.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:21
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Snowman Crossing posted:It was the tired old "oh yeah having a gun is actually more dangerous than not having a gun" as if any of us gun owners give a gently caress. We shoot and clean and fondle horrible death machines all the time, and a momentary lapse in judgment could mean serious injury or death. No poo poo that is more dangerous than playing Mario Kart and hanging anime wall scrolls. Snowman Crossing, does it not disturb you that you speak of a violent life or death conflict with another human being as if you look forward to it? Isn't that a little sick? I do not think it is a good thing to talk about the prospect of using a weapon on someone (who may also have a weapon, and who may use his weapon if he sees your weapon) with enthusiasm.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:21
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various cheeses posted:No evidence? Democrats could hardly keep it in their pants after the Newtown shooting. NY passed gun control legislature literally in the middle of the night turning a ton of gun owners in the state into criminals. So tell me, just how much do you believe Obama is coming for your guns?
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Oct 13, 2015 03:22
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various cheeses posted:No evidence? Democrats could hardly keep it in their pants after the Newtown shooting. NY passed gun control legislature literally in the middle of the night turning a ton of gun owners in the state into criminals. By 'in the middle of the night' you mean 'after long public debate'? Also yea, gently caress them for saying Newtown was probably something that shouldn't ever happen again.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:22
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I am a black man from a gun un-friendly city of New York that currently resides in a very gun friendly state of Georgia. I own a shotgun, a couple of rifles, and couple of hand guns that I use for recreational target practice, home defense and concealed carry. I am a progressive that believes the focus of the Democratic party should be about economic equality and access to healthcare and education. I witness first hand how ingrained guns are into the culture of many parts of America and believe it to be a big distraction to focus on laws and policies that have little effect on curbing violence and a disproportionate negative effect on poor people of color. I vote progressive values over my contempt for this irrational issue yet I am aware of many that would rather stay home or vote republican than support gun control efforts.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:23
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SedanChair posted:I think everyone can agree that you shouldn't have a gun, but I think existing law could cover that. Just collect all your death threats in one place and take them to the judge. No one ever won a war by dying for their country- they won it by making some other poor bastard die for his country.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:24
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CommieGIR posted:So tell me, just how much do you believe Obama is coming for your guns? I'm more worried about Kamala Harris.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:26
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The reason I never got into gun control (besides the victimless crime poo poo) was that if you look at gun death amongst white Americans (i.e. people way more likely to be middle class) the national average is actually pretty comparable to Europe. Even though guns are the primary choice for suicide at least among males our overall suicide rate is still a fraction of the rest of the first world. Take a look at the FBI's 2013 UCR and you'll see that white-on-white violence is like 2.0/100k. IIRC Britain is like 0.8/100k so they beat us handily but gently caress being like the UK's legal atmosphere for any reason. Most of Europe falls around that 2.0 number however. Obviously violence amongst poorer demographics in America are waaaay above that 2.0/100k figure and also way above the weighted national average as well. So poverty always seemed like the real culprit, not that the Republicans will ever go in for negative income tax/basic income schemes. Any gun control that does happen in the U.S. I think I can safely say conservatives have no one to blame but themselves for allowing the situations that create political demand for it to continue to exist. And also they're apparently hellbent on running off growing numbers of minority voters with idiots like Trump. DeusExMachinima fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 03:26
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This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!
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Effectronica posted:No one ever won a war by dying for their country- they won it by making some other poor bastard die for his country. This slogan is an immediate tip-off that the speaker (a) doesn't know how war works, (b) doesn't know how battles are won, and (c) is a humongous macho rear end in a top hat.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:27
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various cheeses posted:No evidence? Democrats could hardly keep it in their pants after the Newtown shooting. NY passed gun control legislature literally in the middle of the night turning a ton of gun owners in the state into criminals. Yep we all just came in our pants at the deaths of twenty+ children, thinking "that's it! we finally have the gun lovers where we want them!" go gently caress yourself you piece of poo poo
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Oct 13, 2015 03:29
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Woolie Wool posted:This slogan is an immediate tip-off that the speaker (a) doesn't know how war works, (b) doesn't know how battles are won, and (c) is a humongous macho rear end in a top hat. Really. I must have missed all the parts with tactical martyrdom action in the Anabasis.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:29
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Dead Reckoning posted:I'm more worried about Kamala Harris. Hahahaha ok champ
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Oct 13, 2015 03:30
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Woolie Wool posted:This slogan is an immediate tip-off that the speaker (a) doesn't know how war works, (b) doesn't know how battles are won, and (c) is a humongous macho rear end in a top hat. an accurate summary of Patton or was that 
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Oct 13, 2015 03:30
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Yep we all just came in our pants at the deaths of twenty+ children, thinking "that's it! we finally have the gun lovers where we want them!" We were all a little nervous after that. The event was unprecedented in its barbarity, and we figured there would be some serious legislative consequences. There were limited measures of course, passed in some states. But the Federal initiatives got shut down so hard it made us want to spike the football. Overall it was a pretty historic win for gun rights.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:34
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Tatum Girlparts posted:By 'in the middle of the night' you mean 'after long public debate'? The top line in wikipedia: quote:The New York Secure Ammunition and Firearms Enforcement Act of 2013 commonly known as the NY SAFE Act is a gun regulation law in the state of New York. The law passed by the New York State Legislature on January 15, 2013, in the middle of the night under a "message of necessity", bypassing the state's 3 day required review period and was signed into law by Governor of New York Andrew Cuomo on the next day. They passed it so fast they forgot to carve out an exemption for cops, making it illegal for them to load their guns with more than 7 rounds.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:35
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Snowman Crossing posted:We were all a little nervous after that. The event was unprecedented in its barbarity, and we figured there would be some serious legislative consequences. I'm sure those children were glad to be martyred for firearms.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:36
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Tatum Girlparts posted:Hahahaha ok champ Well, let's see, the single shot exemption went away on the first of the year, the number of handguns on the "approved" roster continues to go down despite no rational basis for this policy, LA banned possession of 10+ round normal capacity magazines that had been grandfathered in under a previous ban, (said previous ban being pitched as a sensible compromise, no one was coming for your magazines, we're just banning the sale of new ones,) and San Francisco banned hollow point ammunition, required guns in the home to be locked at all times, and finally legislated the last gun store in the city out of existence. But hey, I guess I'm paranoid when I talk about creeping incremental restriction.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:39
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I'm at a complete loss as to how people can consider it paranoid to think people who keep talking about how they want to ban all firearms through incremental restrictions want to ban all firearms through incremental restrictions.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:52
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Yep we all just came in our pants at the deaths of twenty+ children, thinking "that's it! we finally have the gun lovers where we want them!" Gun controllers wanted to ride the emotional wave to pass bullshit laws that wouldn't have helped, using the moral outrage of people like you to punish people who had nothing to do with the event. It broke hard, and I'm glad for it. I'm sorry you're so angry about it, but don't blame me when I committed 0 crimes. I honestly wonder what the whole conversation would've looked like if he had burned the school down or used a bomb instead.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:54
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various cheeses posted:Gun controllers wanted to ride the emotional wave to pass bullshit laws that wouldn't have helped, using the moral outrage of people like you to punish people who had nothing to do with the event. It broke hard, and I'm glad for it. I'm sorry you're so angry about it, but don't blame me when I committed 0 crimes. I always wondered, do you also invoke the whole "Well I never owned slaves so what white privilege!?" thing?
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Oct 13, 2015 03:55
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various cheeses posted:No evidence? Democrats could hardly keep it in their pants after the Newtown shooting. NY passed gun control legislature literally in the middle of the night turning a ton of gun owners in the state into criminals. It didn't turn anyone into criminals because you had a year-long grace period to comply with the law. Tatum Girlparts posted:By 'in the middle of the night' you mean 'after long public debate'? http://www.cbsnews.com/news/nys-cuomo-pushing-hard-for-one-of-nations-toughest-gun-laws/ https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/transcript-governor-andrew-m-cuomos-2013-state-state-address New Yorkers first heard about it five days before it was passed in the governor's State of the State address, but it was light on the specifics. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/01/15/new-york-assault-weapons-guns/1835785/ Usually NYS legislation is subject to 3 days of scrutiny after it's introduced. Gov. Cuomo issued a "message of necessity" (a legitimate and not unprecedented procedure) to force a vote. The act was introduced and passed in the same night, then signed the next morning, so by the time it was law, people were just hearing the details. It was surprising. NY was one of the few states that had it's own AWB, so even after sunset of the 94' AWB, any firearm with two of the prohibited features was still illegal to sell or purchase. It wasn't an inspired piece of legislation, but not particularly burdensome on lawful use, since it meant that you could have any one feature so long as it wasn't paired with any other. Honestly, if you had asked me which NY gun law I would have liked repealed, it would've been the prohibition on suppressors (via the blanket ban on Title II items). It's a shame because I do like many parts of the SAFE Act, including the mental health (although the VA has said they won't comply) and UBC provisions. On the bright side, the 7-out-of-10 round limit was struck down, so at the moment you won't commit a felony if you accidentally load 8 instead of 7 (the state is appealing the ruling).
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Oct 13, 2015 03:57
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Tatum Girlparts posted:I always wondered, do you also invoke the whole "Well I never owned slaves so what white privilege!?" thing? If you want to blame a whole race of people for past transgressions, be my guest, but that's pretty hosed up.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:58
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Dead Reckoning posted:Driving a motor vehicle on public roads while impaired puts other people in imminent danger. Owning an AR-15 does not. Pointing an AR-15 at other people does, which is why it's also illegal in most jurisdictions. Owning an AR-15 is very dangerous. Anybody suicidal with access to it has a much better chance of successfully killing themselves than if they didn't have access to a gun. This would mean that having a gun in your house makes it much more likely for someone who lives there to kill themselves, so you're also forcing people who aren't you to take a risk, potentially against their wishes.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:59
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Jarmak posted:I'm at a complete loss as to how people can consider it paranoid to think people who keep talking about how they want to ban all firearms through incremental restrictions want to ban all firearms through incremental restrictions. It's paranoid to assume that all support for gun control is unthinking emotionality manipulated by the Rothschilds and the lizardmen.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:00
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various cheeses posted:If you want to blame a whole race of people for past transgressions, be my guest, but that's pretty hosed up. That's a funny definition of the word "blame".
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Oct 13, 2015 04:01
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