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Effectronica posted:It's paranoid to assume that all support for gun control is unthinking emotionality manipulated by the Rothschilds and the lizardmen. the hated Jew Bloomberg who the NRA is still running attack ads on saying 'sure he's not running for president or anything BUT WHAT IS HE UP TO?! STOP HIM!' is their go to for that, not Rothschilds.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:01
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various cheeses posted:Gun controllers wanted to ride the emotional wave to pass bullshit laws that wouldn't have helped, using the moral outrage of people like you to punish people who had nothing to do with the event. It broke hard, and I'm glad for it. I'm sorry you're so angry about it, but don't blame me when I committed 0 crimes. oh no how dare i be offended at the deaths of 20+ kids and wanting something, anything, done to prevent it from happening again. gently caress off you sociopathic piece of poo poo
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Oct 13, 2015 04:02
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Tatum Girlparts posted:the hated Jew Bloomberg who the NRA is still running attack ads on saying 'sure he's not running for president or anything BUT WHAT IS HE UP TO?! STOP HIM!' is their go to for that, not Rothschilds. Let's just split the difference and say that all gun control support is due to the ZOG and water fluoridation.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:03
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Raskolnikov38 posted:something, anything, Even if it doesn't work? Why don't you calm down and take a break from this thread?
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Oct 13, 2015 04:06
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Raskolnikov38 posted:oh no how dare i be offended at the deaths of 20+ kids and wanting something, anything, done to prevent it from happening again. Passing laws in a panic is always a stupid idea. It's how we got saddled with things like the Patriot Act.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:06
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various cheeses posted:Even if it doesn't work? Stop getting hysterical about this, you girly-man. I choose logic, not emotion, and so I know that this mass murder was a victory for guns everywhere. Looks like you've got some growing up to do.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:09
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Raskolnikov38 posted:oh no how dare i be offended at the deaths of 20+ kids and wanting something, anything, done to prevent it from happening again. You gave it the old college try. But you ain't got the lobby, hombre.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:10
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Tatum Girlparts posted:the hated Jew Bloomberg who the NRA is still running attack ads on saying 'sure he's not running for president or anything BUT WHAT IS HE UP TO?! STOP HIM!' is their go to for that, not Rothschilds. Bloomberg is bankrolling the major gun astroturf organizations like Moms Demand Action and legislative pushes in other states. He also supports stop-and-frisk laws based on racial profiling, so not exactly the world's best guy.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:10
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Effectronica posted:Stop getting hysterical about this, you girly-man. I choose logic, not emotion, and so I know that this mass murder was a victory for guns everywhere. Looks like you've got some growing up to do. If you have nothing but glib bullshit to add to this thread, take it to the
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Oct 13, 2015 04:12
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various cheeses posted:Bloomberg is bankrolling the major gun astroturf organizations like Moms Demand Action and legislative pushes in other states. He also supports stop-and-frisk laws based on racial profiling, so not exactly the world's best guy.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:13
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Lemming posted:Owning an AR-15 is very dangerous. Anybody suicidal with access to it has a much better chance of successfully killing themselves than if they didn't have access to a gun. This would mean that having a gun in your house makes it much more likely for someone who lives there to kill themselves, so you're also forcing people who aren't you to take a risk, potentially against their wishes. Raskolnikov38 posted:oh no how dare i be offended at the deaths of 20+ kids and wanting something, anything, done to prevent it from happening again.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:15
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Tatum Girlparts posted:the hated Jew Bloomberg who the NRA is still running attack ads on saying 'sure he's not running for president or anything BUT WHAT IS HE UP TO?! STOP HIM!' is their go to for that, not Rothschilds. In fairness, Bloomberg still throws millions at gun control. He got I-594 passed in my state, just to bask in schadenfreude that I can no longer buy guns in a parking lot.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:20
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Dead Reckoning posted:That still doesn't constitute an imminent danger the way that drunk driving or pointing a gun at people does. Unless you're saying there's some sort of affirmative legal duty to suicide-proof your house against potential future suicidal people. I can't really parse you second point; if you had a roommate who didn't like being in the same house as guns, couldn't they always move out? It's not as imminently dangerous but there's a reason the "responsible" method of owning a gun is having it secured inside a safe, so people don't have easy access to it. People not only have children, but also sometimes don't have the luxury of moving. It's also not an argument that the individual should be held liable if someone commits suicide, but an argument that the government has a vested interest in regulating guns to keep people safe because gun owners can't be trusted to be responsible on their own.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:22
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SedanChair posted:In fairness, Bloomberg still throws millions at gun control. He got I-594 passed in my state, just to bask in schadenfreude that I can no longer buy guns in a parking lot. Weird that the ad never mentioned that, it was literally 'yea he's not running for anything BUT THE GODDAMN KIKE IS STILL IN THE SHADOWS LIKE THEY DO" with a totally not creepy 'we have to STOP him, but we can't stop him with ballots, hmmmm' undertone
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Oct 13, 2015 04:22
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SedanChair posted:In fairness, Bloomberg still throws millions at gun control. He got I-594 passed in my state, just to bask in schadenfreude that I can no longer buy guns in a parking lot. I do a lot of gun purchases and sales through Facebook groups, and I always choose a public place like a parking lot or a Park & Ride to do the transaction. I think it's nearly inevitable that we get a patrol car wheeling up at some point. I had a dude function check a shotgun in broad daylight in a Walmart parking lot once. Not everybody exercises the basic discretion of checking out the merchandise while keeping it in the trunk/car. Luckily I'm white so I'll probably get time to explain if the cops show up.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:26
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Dilkington posted:
On first glance it seems to be maybe somewhat effective, firearms related violent crime has kept on steadily decreasing on par with the previous trend in 2013-2014 and that is with the addition of 3 more reported jurisdictions. I'd be cautiously optimistic. It has definitely not, as some critics envisioned, led to more violent crimes. http://www.criminaljustice.ny.gov/crimnet/ojsa/greenbook.pdf
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Oct 13, 2015 04:41
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IAMNOTADOCTOR posted:On first glance it seems to be maybe somewhat effective, firearms related violent crime has kept on steadily decreasing on par with the previous trend in 2013-2014 and that is with the addition of 3 more reported jurisdictions. I'd be cautiously optimistic. It has definitely not, as some critics envisioned, led to more violent crimes. It's almost as if violent crime has been trending down nationwide for twenty years.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:43
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Apparently wanting to do something about regular mass shootings is "emotionality". "But they don't work!" You say? I'll just put the burden of proof on the pro-gun side, because I don't buy "Bu bu but if we enact legislation to stop national tragedies (including the deaths of children), I might be mildly inconvenienced  (and yes having to register your guns is a mild inconvenience you petulant little fucks.)" If you want to make the case that it's pointless fine present your evidence, but that isn't much of a sufficient reason to prevent the enacting of (reversible) legislation.Also gently caress you whoever said that Newtown was a victory for the pro-gun side. Dont worry, the current political climate means your precious masturbatory aids were never at risk. You don't have to worry about the moral implications of supporting gun proliferation. Also snowman crossing should not be allowed to own guns, how exactly is he in any way a responsible gun owner?
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Oct 13, 2015 04:51
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unwantedplatypus posted:If you want to make the case that it's pointless fine present your evidence Also is that fuckin' Dappy in your av?
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Oct 13, 2015 04:53
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Rent-A-Cop posted:Violent crime doesn't seem to correlate at all with gun laws. Nice sentence, too bad it's meaningless without anything backing it up. Also my avatar was given to me, I have no idea who it is to be honest.
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Oct 13, 2015 04:55
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Rent-A-Cop posted:It's almost as if violent crime has been trending down nationwide for twenty years. Agreed, but that's not a very helpful insight when discussing only one state. Can anyone give me the main criticisms of the Harvard Injury Control Research Centers position of firearms and public health? I saw the guy (Hemenway, David. ) speak a while back and he seemed to make sense, but i'm not at all an expert on public health or gun control. Link: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/overall/ Main points: 2. The risks of a gun in the home typically far outweigh the benefits Hemenway, David. Risks and benefits of a gun in the home. American Journal of Lifestyle Medicine 2011; 5:502-511. 3. More guns, more violent death. Miller, Matthew; Azrael, Deborah; Hemenway, David. Firearms and violent death in the United States. In: Webster DW, Vernick JS, eds. Reducing Gun Violence in America Baltimore MD: Johns Hopkins University Press, 2013. 4. Better mental health treatment may help but effective legislation is crucial to reduce gun violence. Brent, David; Miller, Matthew; Loeber, Rolf; Mulvey, Edward P; Birmaher, Boris. Ending the silence on gun violence. Journal of the American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry. 2013; 52:333-38. If anyone needs a fulltext i can probably get them for you. For the gungrabbers, heres a beautifull quote comming from an old professor: "D. Hemenway posted:Instead of it being the mark of a real man that you can shoot somebody at 50 feet and kill them with a gun, the mark of a real man is that you would never do anything like that. . . . The gun is a great equalizer because it makes wimps as dangerous as people who really have skill and bravery and so I’d like to have this notion that anyone using a gun is a wuss. They aren’t anybody to be looked up to. They’re somebody to look down at because they couldn’t defend themselves or couldn’t protect others without using a gun.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:05
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unwantedplatypus posted:Nice sentence, too bad it's meaningless without anything backing it up. IAMNOTADOCTOR posted:Agreed, but that's not a very helpful insight when discussing only one state. Rent-A-Cop fucked around with this message at 05:08 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 05:05
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unwantedplatypus posted:Also snowman crossing should not be allowed to own guns, how exactly is he in any way a responsible gun owner? I'm not a felon, am a United States citizen, and passed a background check? I've taken hunter's safety courses, gun safety courses, and possess a concealed pistol license granted by the state? I store my guns in a heavy-duty safe while not in use, and keep them unloaded. Not that any of that matters, because what really rubs people the wrong way is that instead of rationalizing my support of gun ownership into some sort of principled stance, I've made peace with the fact that it's simply a hobby for me and I'll do what it takes to keep it accessible in spite of the pain and suffering caused by "American Gun Culture." D&D is full of guys who want to make the world a better place. I just want to be able to shoot my AR-15s on the weekend.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:10
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Rent-A-Cop posted:I'm gonna make you a chart! And that's basically what i said in my OP? I literally said it fit the trend already in NY?
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Oct 13, 2015 05:12
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IAMNOTADOCTOR posted:
Thanks for reminding us that gun-control advocates seek a return to rule by the strong and all related barbarism.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:13
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LeJackal posted:
This would be a relevant point except gun owners are overwhelmingly the white men. Not exactly the equalizer you're pretending they are.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:16
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true fact: gun grabbers hate police and looooove violence
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Oct 13, 2015 05:18
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The police as an institution are also violent cowards who should have their access to guns restricted, yes.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:21
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D. Hemenway posted:Instead of it being the mark of a real man that you can shoot somebody at 50 feet and kill them with a gun, the mark of a real man is that you would never do anything like that. . . . The gun is a great equalizer because it makes wimps as dangerous as people who really have skill and bravery and so I’d like to have this notion that anyone using a gun is a wuss. They aren’t anybody to be looked up to. They’re somebody to look down at because they couldn’t defend themselves or couldn’t protect others without using a gun. So the mark of a great man is to be a victim and let others be victimized. Great idea Dave. The gun being the great equalizer is actually the best part of it, because it allows grandma to fight off a home invader, or a literal child to defend his home against burglars. The weak should fear the strong I guess?
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Oct 13, 2015 05:21
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Raskolnikov38 posted:oh no how dare i be offended at the deaths of 20+ kids and wanting something, anything, done to prevent it from happening again. Haven't you realized? No one cares about dead kids.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:22
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Thanks for reminding us that gun-control advocates seek a return to rule by the strong and all related barbarism. [/quote] Multipolar vigilantism, the common carrying of deadly weapons, the rejection of successful modern policy, and worship of centuries-old holy texts written by infallible patriarchs: the definition of progressive development
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Oct 13, 2015 05:24
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various cheeses posted:So the mark of a great man is to be a victim and let others be victimized. Great idea Dave. The gun being the great equalizer is actually the best part of it, because it allows grandma to fight off a home invader, or a literal child to defend his home against burglars. The weak should fear the strong I guess? Or let the strong shoot babies. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2015/06/19/whitehall-officer-involved-shooting.html We can post anecdotes at each other all day long but again gun owners are largely white men who as a group are already the "strongest." Edit: we could also improve the lives of the poor so they don't resort to crime, but I'm guessing you don't actually give a poo poo and are just happy to have more ammo to secure your right to own guns Lemming fucked around with this message at 05:28 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 05:24
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Rent-A-Cop posted:I'm gonna make you a chart! Oh cool so we're just farting into each other's mouths rather than having a discussion of any substance? Snowman Crossing posted:I'm not a felon, am a United States citizen, and passed a background check? I've taken hunter's safety courses, gun safety courses, and possess a concealed pistol license granted by the state? I store my guns in a heavy-duty safe while not in use, and keep them unloaded. Well, you did describe the ultimate satisfaction as a gun owner as being able to legally kill someone so there's that and I think it outweighs everything else. Do you think gun owners should have that attitude? unwantedplatypus fucked around with this message at 05:29 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 05:26
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various cheeses posted:So the mark of a great man is to be a victim and let others be victimized. Great idea Dave. The gun being the great equalizer is actually the best part of it, because it allows grandma to fight off a home invader, or a literal child to defend his home against burglars. The weak should fear the strong I guess? I'm willing to bet kids killing themselves/other kids with guns is much more common than kids using guns to defend themselves, you wanna try and challenge that? So, how about snowman thinking the ultimate payoff of gun owning is killing someone over a play station 4, anyone want to argue that he's a responsible gun owner? unwantedplatypus fucked around with this message at 05:31 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 05:27
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unwantedplatypus posted:Apparently wanting to do something about regular mass shootings is "emotionality". "But they don't work!" You say? I'll just put the burden of proof on the pro-gun side, because I don't buy "Bu bu but if we enact legislation to stop national tragedies (including the deaths of children), I might be mildly inconvenienced So, how would registration have prevented Newtown?
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Oct 13, 2015 05:34
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unwantedplatypus posted:Oh cool so we're just farting into each other's mouths rather than having a discussion of any substance? So I did a quick and dirty scatter graph. Y-axis is violent crime rate according to the UCR. X-axis is a ranking of states by the Open Society Foundation, 1-50 most strict laws to least strict laws. Full disclosure: OSF didn't rate Washington DC so I dropped it in with a 1 ranking considering its gun laws are at least as strict as Massachusetts.  That outlier way down on the bottom right is DC. Edit: Mixed up my axes. Rent-A-Cop fucked around with this message at 05:39 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 05:34
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I don't question Dr. Hemenway's good intentions, but... IAMNOTADOCTOR posted:For the gungrabbers, heres a beautifull quote comming from an old professor: quote:"D. Hemenway posted: Self-defense situations are not contests of skill and bravery- that's a dangerous and irresponsible thing to think. I hope Dr. Hemenway was being facetious. Reductive conceptions of masculinity are a problem. You've probably come across someone arguing against misogynists and employing essentially the same argument (sometimes including gendered insults), or with homophobes- "if you were really heterosexual, you wouldn't be afraid." People who make these kinds of arguments are reinforcing the structures which reproduce the very problems they're trying to fight ~missing the forest for the trees~. Sorry for the digression- everyone's got a pet issue I guess.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:34
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Lemming posted:Or let the strong shoot babies. I'm pretty sure no one considers a cop shooting a dog and hitting a kid an example of a good gun owner. What is it with cops and shooting every dog they see anyways? Actually it would be fantastic if we improved the lives of the poor - something that would actually reduce crime, rather than punish regular law-abiding gun owners and invent possession crimes for them to commit. Why not devote time and money toward the former rather than the latter?
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Oct 13, 2015 05:36
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What, I'm supposed to just let him take my Playstation 4? Presumably one of the purposes for owning a gun is to defend yourself and your property from criminals. Some of the guys in this thread have actually had to do that. Not me-- it's not high on my list of concerns due to my locale. But I think it's righteous for a gun-haver to use his gun to protect himself or his property, sure. Home invasion is a legitimate concern for a bunch of people, and anyone going to a gun shop to get something for the night stand is obviously running that scenario through his/her head.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:38
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various cheeses posted:I'm pretty sure no one considers a cop shooting a dog and hitting a kid an example of a good gun owner. Good thing only good people can own and use guns.
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Oct 13, 2015 05:40
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