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computer parts posted:The key difference is that Obama got significant support from establishment elements, whereas none of them are turning out for Bernie. Sorry, did you miss that Billie Joe Armstrong came out in support of Bernie? Seth McFarlane as well, just last night on his twitter.
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Oct 14, 2015 20:59
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computer parts posted:The key difference is that Obama got significant support from establishment elements, whereas none of them are turning out for Bernie. Agreed. If Sanders manages to do well in the actual voting, though, that may change. Though even then, I don't think that's going to happen.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:00
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Fried Chicken posted:Graham, not Grassley. Grassley is criminal justice, Graham is energy Thanks! I wonder if the historians will say Obama or Carter hosed up the "high school politics" part of Washington more?
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Oct 14, 2015 21:00
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zoux posted:Sorry, did you miss that Billie Joe Armstrong came out in support of Bernie? Seth McFarlane as well, just last night on his twitter. The two of them make up for any number of Teddy Kennedys, it's a wonder that Obama ever managed to win the election without the crucial "Dookie" and "Family Guy" vote. 
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Oct 14, 2015 21:03
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How can it be that the party with the much younger voter base is going to choose a candidate who's older than nearly all Republican challengers? Sanders is even older than Hillary!
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Oct 14, 2015 21:04
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Torrannor posted:How can it be that the party with the much younger voter base is going to choose a candidate who's older than nearly all Republican challengers? Sanders is even older than Hillary! He's One of the Good Ones.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:04
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computer parts posted:The key difference is that Obama got significant support from establishment elements, whereas none of them are turning out for Bernie. Yeah, people always forget he was specifically approached by Kennedy and had their whole machine as the backbone of the operation
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Oct 14, 2015 21:04
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Torrannor posted:How can it be that the party with the much younger voter base is going to choose a candidate who's older than nearly all Republican challengers? Sanders is even older than Hillary! Maybe because like minorities and women, young people don't just vote for a person because they match demographics? The Republicans have had a host of lovely black candidates like Alan Keyes, Herman Cain, and Ben Carson. Not a single one of them attracted many more black people.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:06
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Repeal Obamacare or the children get it!
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Oct 14, 2015 21:06
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euphronius posted:Sanders excites young people who are exactly the same people who don't vote as much. Yeah, but the only excitement that I've seen for Sanders has been from young people and full-on socialists. It's great that they're getting excited about Sanders but lots of those same people were excited about Obama in 08 which translated amazingly well in 10, 12, and 14. Don't get me wrong, I loving love Sanders, what he's doing, and hope he inspires more people to get political for life as opposed to just every 4 years, but an idealist in the white house turns out to loving suck both during mid-term elections and in terms of getting poo poo done with an obstructionist congress.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:07
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Logikv9 posted:Bernie has the enthusiasm of his base but you're not going to beat the widespread appeal of Hillary. You mean her appeal to old people. Old people as in baby boomers.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:07
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If we are going to discuss who won the debate and who will win the election, it is important to remember the tastes, reasoning, and sensibilities of the voters. Too often we focus on the commentary of beltway elites, and discount what the people of middle America will do when confronted with the question. "How will it play in Peoria?" Remember? So I present to you a representative example of the average American Man tries to put out garbage fire by driving over it in a van full of ammunition 
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Oct 14, 2015 21:08
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Jesus Christ. "What? We actually have to give health insurance to our teachers?" 
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Oct 14, 2015 21:08
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Job Truniht posted:You mean her appeal to old people. Old people as in baby boomers. You got anything to back that up?
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Oct 14, 2015 21:09
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Job Truniht posted:You mean her appeal to old people. Old people as in baby boomers. "Save Capitalism from Itself" is pretty much centrist America in a nutshell.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:09
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foobardog posted:Jesus Christ. "What? We actually have to give health insurance to our teachers?" It's more of an example of why tying school funding to property taxes is the stupidest god drat poo poo ever. They county in the article was dirt poor before the ACA ever came to be.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:13
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Trabisnikof posted:"Save Capitalism from Itself" is pretty much centrist America in a nutshell. Yeah. Now admittedly most people think "capitalism = small businesses & entrepreneurs" and if your idea of capitalism immediately leaps to lowly-capitalized firms whose proprietor mainly earns labor-derived self-employment income your capitalism is strangely missing the "capital" part, but still
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Oct 14, 2015 21:14
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foobardog posted:Isn't the excitement of young people part of the reason why Obama won much bigger against McCain, and their disappointment in him part of the reason Romney did better? Yes but that would require the National Dems and the pragmatic voters who back them to try appealing to those young people instead of throwing up their hands in exasperation when they don't come around to the 1990s-way of doing politics.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:14
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How are u posted:It's more of an example of why tying school funding to property taxes is the stupidest god drat poo poo ever. They county in the article was dirt poor before the ACA ever came to be. Shouldn't it be Medicare and thus a state level rather than county level cost then?
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Oct 14, 2015 21:14
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Fried Chicken posted:If we are going to discuss who won the debate and who will win the election, it is important to remember the tastes, reasoning, and sensibilities of the voters. Too often we focus on the commentary of beltway elites, and discount what the people of middle America will do when confronted with the question. "How will it play in Peoria?" Remember? So I present to you a representative example of the average American Farmers are the biggest idiots ever when it comes to safety.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:14
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Rollofthedice posted:You got anything to back that up? What she said last night: "I worked part time minimum wage and managed to pay my way through college and so should you"
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Oct 14, 2015 21:15
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How are u posted:It's more of an example of why tying school funding to property taxes is the stupidest god drat poo poo ever. They county in the article was dirt poor before the ACA ever came to be. Agreed with that too. e: Electric Bugaloo posted:Yes but that would require the National Dems and the pragmatic voters who back them to try appealing to those young people instead of throwing up their hands in exasperation when they don't come around to the 1990s-way of doing politics. This too. foobardog fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Oct 14, 2015 |
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Oct 14, 2015 21:15
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Also she polls way higher with old people
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Oct 14, 2015 21:16
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Job Truniht posted:Also she polls way higher with old people That's what I'm asking for, yes. Something that isn't an extrapolation would be nice.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:16
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Fried Chicken posted:Shouldn't it be Medicare and thus a state level rather than county level cost then? It's due to the requirement, I think, that employers of a certain size provide coverage that they are bitching about. Of course they declined to raise property taxes and instead opted to shutter the schools.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:18
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zen death robot posted:Why are you using quotation marks when that's not what was said at all? Because the thing she actually said doesn't sound nearly as bad!
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Oct 14, 2015 21:18
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zen death robot posted:Why are you using quotation marks when that's not what was said at all? That's exactly what she meant when she brought herself up as an example when asked a question on free tuition.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:19
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In local political news that nobody cares about, I just voted for an out lesbian as Mayor of Salt Lake City by mail!  Sometimes this town isn't completely lovely 
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Oct 14, 2015 21:19
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Job Truniht posted:That's exactly what she meant when she brought herself up as an example when asked a question on free tuition. Oh right, ignore what she said and pretend what I wanted her to say was what she actually said
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Oct 14, 2015 21:20
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SubponticatePoster posted:In local political news that nobody cares about, I just voted for an out lesbian as Mayor of Salt Lake City by mail! This is actually worth mentioning. The Democrats would do great by getting more states to move to mail-in voting. Of course, the lack of a federal election board makes that tougher, and Congress isn't going to do anything about that, but it's exactly the type of local stuff that needs to be worked on.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:21
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GOP last week: "if only minorities had guns, they could defeat armies and prevent genocide!" GOP this week: "Let's take guns away from blacks as they are the main killers"
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Oct 14, 2015 21:22
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Save Capitalism from itself sounds like capitalism has a drinking problem.Fried Chicken posted:GOP last week: "if only minorities had guns, they could defeat armies and prevent genocide!" If you had a serious militant african american movement similar to what you saw with the Black Panther movement openly carrying guns then you'd most certainly hear GOPer's change their tune. Oh wait they did in the 60s with the Black Panthers. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Oct 14, 2015 |
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Oct 14, 2015 21:23
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Why in the ever living gently caress would you ever bring up why college shouldn't be free and the cite that as a reason? Why go on about about small businesses and entrepreneurs or even mention "you can be rich as us" when asked about your own wealth? Nobody here lacks the sincerity in saying social mobility in this country is dead as a door nail. The only people who don't say that poo poo are boomers.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:23
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Fried Chicken posted:If we are going to discuss who won the debate and who will win the election, it is important to remember the tastes, reasoning, and sensibilities of the voters. Too often we focus on the commentary of beltway elites, and discount what the people of middle America will do when confronted with the question. "How will it play in Peoria?" Remember? So I present to you a representative example of the average American Please, PLEASE let me not be the only one who thought this was an onion article just by looking at the title.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:23
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Fried Chicken posted:GOP last week: "if only minorities had guns, they could defeat armies and prevent genocide!" More troubling are the allegations raised about HIllary's prior knowledge of the questions, or as I'm calling it, QuesPrepGate. Does it make Biden's entry more likely?
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Oct 14, 2015 21:24
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zoux posted:I notice that among Bernie supporters, there's the same vein of "My candidate has never failed, nor done bad" that was common among Paulites. It's easy to say about Ron Paul because he never did anything to be wrong about. His stances, sure, but he only got about one bill passed and voted no on everything else.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:24
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Job Truniht posted:Why in the ever living gently caress would you ever bring up why college shouldn't be free and the cite that as a reason? lol stop making poo poo up quote:CLINTON: Well, let me address college affordability, because I have a plan that I think will really zero in on what the problems are. First, all the 40 million Americans who currently have student debt will be able to refinance their debt to a low interest rate. That will save thousands of dollars for people who are now struggling under this cumbersome, burdensome college debt.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:25
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Here's straight up her college tuition policy: Students should never have to borrow to pay for tuition, books, and fees to attend a four-year public college in their state under the New College Compact. Pell Grants are not included in the calculation of no-debt-tuition, so Pell recipients will be able to use their grants fully for living expenses. Students at community college will receive free tuition. Students will do their part by contributing their earnings from working 10 hours a week. Families will do their part by making an affordable and realistic family contribution. The federal government will make a major investment in the New College Compact by providing grants to states that commit to these goals, and by cutting interest rates on loans. States will have to step up and meet their obligation to invest in higher education by maintaining current levels of higher education funding and reinvesting over time. Colleges and universities will be accountable for improving outcomes and controlling costs to ensure that tuition is affordable and that students who invest in college leave with a degree. We will encourage innovators who design imaginative new ways of providing a valuable college education to students—while cracking down on abusive practices that burden students with debt without value. Under Hillary’s plan, if you have student debt, you will be able to refinance your loans at current rates. An estimated 25 million borrowers will receive debt relief, and the typical borrower could save $2,000 over the life of his or her loans. For future undergraduates, the plan will significantly cut interest rates so they reflect the government’s low cost of debt. This could save students hundreds or thousands of dollars over the life of their loans. Everyone will be able to enroll in a simplified, income-based repayment program so that borrowers never have to pay more than 10 percent of what they make. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- That 10 hour job requirement is, imo, pretty clearly a sop to "skin in the game" conservative philosophies.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:27
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If her solution involves the Federal Student Work program and possibly civic service for like 10 to 20 hours a week with Free Tuition and cash in hand i'd say it's a good plan. Expansion of the federal student work program could help a ton.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:28
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Hollismason posted:If her solution involves the Federal Student Work program and possibly civic service for like 10 to 20 hours a week with Free Tuition and cash in hand i'd say it's a good plan. That would actually be great, in my opinion. If more people actually got involved with working in the government, less of them would put stock in the "lazy government workers unconnected with doing anything real or good" view.
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Oct 14, 2015 21:31
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