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Cingulate posted:If what the contemporary reaction is afraid of is no longer e.g. a violent uprising of the proletariat, the massacre of bankers, and the beginning of a classless, nationless, godless age, but just that some chubby dude with a creepy foot fetish doesn't feel welcome to post on Twitter anymore, that should be a cause for concern on the left. It seems we missed a critical window somewhen between 1900 and 1990. I would definitely say reactionaries no longer fear violent uprising, but instead they fear that a violent uprising would be unnecessary. Where once they feared an army of undesirables showing up at their doorstep to take their poo poo and redistribute their wealth at gunpoint, they now fear a world where their neighbors, friends, and family willingly hand over everything to those that need it more and call them assholes for not doing it too. Put simply, the fears of the neoreactionary movement are irrelevance, that no one will care if they go Galt and gently caress off to an island somewhere
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Oct 24, 2015 19:42
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Cingulate posted:Well you won't see me putting up a defense of Randianism and Tea Party-style libertarianism any time soon. Yup, that is pretty clear and never implied otherwise. The only point I was making is that it's usage in modern discourse is very much divorced from its historical roots. It's basically saying: "These different people with a totally different philosophy used the same term." It is correct but not really pertinent. Not to mention that modern day libertarians have much, much less institutional and philosophical connections to the people you mention than the Soviets have with Marx which was my example. Pener Kropoopkin posted:Bioware has been putting lovely romance storylines into their games as far back as Baldur's Gate, long before "Cultural Marxism" was ever conceived by reactionary nerds. That said that game had a larger female fanbase than many other traditional RPGs (or at least a more vocally self identified one) and that was in part due to the more prominent romance/relationship elements. It was also a reason why there was a certain controversy about Anomen being the only male romanceable character and who was, let's say, not universally beloved by the fanbase. Not to say that there were also a ssubset of creepsters but you have that for practically any bit of media. Munin has a new favorite as of 20:07 on Oct 24, 2015 |
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Oct 24, 2015 20:01
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Cingulate posted:The philosophy of libertarianism - not Ayn Rand, but e.g. Nozick, Hayek, whatever - is a direct and radical consequence of classical liberalism, and very much about freedom in at least one philosophically justifiable sense. And in all honesty, we don't need to make up or exaggerate libertarian beliefs. They do a fine job of that themselves: I can't believe Murray Rothbard is a deathist posted:the parent should not have a legal obligation to feed, clothe, or educate his children, since such obligations would entail positive acts coerced upon the parent and depriving the parent of his rights. The parent therefore may not murder or mutilate his child, and the law properly outlaws a parent from doing so. But the parent should have the legal right not to feed the child, i.e., to allow it to die. The law, therefore, may not properly compel the parent to feed a child or to keep it alive. ...should a parent have the right to allow a deformed baby to die (e.g., by not feeding it)? The answer is of course yes, following a fortiori from the larger right to allow any baby, whether deformed or not, to die. Of course, the proper libertarian paradise will feature, not just free baby markets, but also free child porn markets:   Listen, once we privatize consent, the free market will reach equilibrium and we'll all possess optimal freedom. Curvature of Earth has a new favorite as of 22:42 on Oct 24, 2015 |
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Oct 24, 2015 22:01
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It would certainly increase the street value of a stolen white infant such as Ric Flair.
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Oct 24, 2015 22:13
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Libertarianism my rights are greater than yours
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Oct 24, 2015 22:18
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Curvature of Earth posted:Of course, the proper libertarian paradise will feature, not just free baby markets, but also free child porn markets: ah, I see you're getting properly into the "delineate the ephebotarians" assignment (you poor bastard)
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Oct 25, 2015 12:26
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Merdifex posted:Actually, Mass Effect 3 is bad because of Cultural Marxism. quote:In short, it is for role-playing the ideal masculine character who must confront difficult situations that brings out the best of his masculine virtues.
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Oct 25, 2015 13:57
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DarklyDreaming posted:I would definitely say reactionaries no longer fear violent uprising, but instead they fear that a violent uprising would be unnecessary. Where once they feared an army of undesirables showing up at their doorstep to take their poo poo and redistribute their wealth at gunpoint, they now fear a world where their neighbors, friends, and family willingly hand over everything to those that need it more and call them assholes for not doing it too. Put simply, the fears of the neoreactionary movement are irrelevance, that no one will care if they go Galt and gently caress off to an island somewhere Where PC society = a society which disapproves of n-wording your way through your justification for why you don't hire black people, thought crimes = laws against hate speech as you have in European countries, and gulags = prison camps for reactionaries and suspected reactionaries in Siberia with mortality rates approaching that of a concentration camp.
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Oct 25, 2015 14:45
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Cingulate posted:My honest impression is rather that they somehow feel there is a direct path from PC society > thought crimes > gulags. The Vosgian Beast posted:Randall Munroe author of XKCD is an evil thought police abuser Relevant
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Oct 25, 2015 15:14
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Kunster posted:Part of the telling offs involved making Hydra a good guy organization, as in "Yeah we're The Nazis all but in name" org. And then having Black Widow's Roma origins whitewashed. And the whole thing with killing off the concept of Wasp and clearing up Ant Man's legacy to the point of making sure she wasn't a meaningful character. wasp's only meaningful contribution to ant-man was the time an artist hosed up reading a script and drew hank as hitting her, thus shackling him with that poo poo for forever
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Oct 25, 2015 15:45
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Bioware has been putting lovely romance storylines into their games as far back as Baldur's Gate, long before "Cultural Marxism" was ever conceived by reactionary nerds.
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Oct 25, 2015 16:40
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U.T. Raptor posted:Bioware games have pretty much always had romances, but they started really emphasizing them after Dragon Age because that game drew in a lot of the tumblr crowd for some reason. That's largely how we got the dumpster fire that was Dragon Age 2.
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Oct 25, 2015 18:33
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Some explain to me what "Crimethink" is, because these articles are pretty funny. http://atavisionary.com/the-kite-runner/ 'Neo'-reactionary posted:To generalize Muslim culture in Afghanistan as if it were a world wide issue for every group of people is inaccurate and absurd. This is as much crimethink as I dared to inject into the situation, but I think the point was taken and will be considered by the student. In my head, I thought facetiously that the human rights issue he should write about is forcing young children in schools across the country to read and write about progressive propaganda
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Oct 25, 2015 18:42
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Has anyone yet written a long-form article about basically how the nerd culture that's latched onto J.R.R. Tolkien's works (including many of the Dark Enlightenment) is, embraces, and represents basically everything Tolkien hated in life?
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Oct 25, 2015 18:45
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Woolie Wool posted:Has anyone yet written a long-form article about basically how the nerd culture that's latched onto J.R.R. Tolkien's works (including many of the Dark Enlightenment) is, embraces, and represents basically everything Tolkien hated in life? not that I know of, but tell Parsons to do it.
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Oct 25, 2015 18:51
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Woolie Wool posted:Has anyone yet written a long-form article about basically how the nerd culture that's latched onto J.R.R. Tolkien's works (including many of the Dark Enlightenment) is, embraces, and represents basically everything Tolkien hated in life? I don't need to write a long-form article: Tolkien and his contemporaries wrote about an idealized medieval Europe to escape the mid-20th century world because there were Nazis in it. Dark Enlightment people write about an idealized medieval Europe to escape the modern world because it kills Nazis.
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Oct 25, 2015 19:01
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I could see the value of a long-form article because it wasn't just Nazis they were trying to escape, but literally every other movement and activity that Dark Enlightenment idealizes. Runaway capitalism, non-Nazi fascists, industrialization specifically the industrialization of war, futurists, military monarchs, etc were all things specifically pointed to as absolute evils in early twentieth century romanticism because it was all inspired by WW1 and its immediate aftermath.
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Oct 25, 2015 19:43
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Twerkteam Pizza posted:Some explain to me what "Crimethink" is, because these articles are pretty funny. The act of thinking something progressives don't like. Calling it crimethink instantly puts the reactionary on the moral highground because he declares himself prosecuted before anything happens. It's a classic tactic. See also "99% of you won't be brave enough to share this horribly racist article on facebook!!!!!"
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Oct 25, 2015 19:44
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Twerkteam Pizza posted:Some explain to me what "Crimethink" is, because these articles are pretty funny. Isaac Asimov wrote an essay on 1984 basically saying: This is Orwell being pissed off at Stalin and his life. If we are constantly guarding against 1984 happening, to the exclusion of what's actually going on, bad poo poo will hit us in the rear end. Terrible Opinions posted:I could see the value of a long-form article because it wasn't just Nazis they were trying to escape, but literally every other movement and activity that Dark Enlightenment idealizes. Runaway capitalism, non-Nazi fascists, industrialization specifically the industrialization of war, futurists, military monarchs, etc were all things specifically pointed to as absolute evils in early twentieth century romanticism because it was all inspired by WW1 and its immediate aftermath. Nessus has a new favorite as of 20:35 on Oct 25, 2015 |
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Oct 25, 2015 20:33
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Whatever Tolkien has articulated in his reflections, the story itself is deeply reactionary.
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Oct 25, 2015 20:56
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Nessus posted:It's a term out of 1984 referring to "bad thoughts" in the book's fictional clipped "Newspeak." These dudes love quoting 1984.
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Oct 25, 2015 21:23
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Terrible Opinions posted:I could see the value of a long-form article because it wasn't just Nazis they were trying to escape, but literally every other movement and activity that Dark Enlightenment idealizes. Runaway capitalism, non-Nazi fascists, industrialization specifically the industrialization of war, futurists, military monarchs, etc were all things specifically pointed to as absolute evils in early twentieth century romanticism because it was all inspired by WW1 and its immediate aftermath. All of these things have some beginning in romatic utopianism of the authoritarians, especially the imagined past of a harmonious social body without class tension(remember where 'holism' comes from), idyllic communities free of want, and childlike people blissfully unaware of their inferiority to the elite. I think the autocritique of Simarillion tries to deal with this, or at least some of the assumptions surrounding the Aryanisms of the elves. Poor reading can just exacerbate these tendencies in LOTR trilogy. David Brin has written on this: http://www.salon.com/2002/12/17/tolkien_brin/ HUNDU THE BEAST GOD has a new favorite as of 21:38 on Oct 25, 2015 |
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Oct 25, 2015 21:31
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:All of these things have some beginning in romatic utopianism of the authoritarians, especially the imagined past of a harmonious social body without class tension(remember where 'holism' comes from), idyllic communities free of want, and childlike people blissfully unaware of their inferiority to the elite. This article isn't entirely wrong, or even mostly wrong, but it does kind of resort to easy "us vs them" categories way too easily.
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Oct 25, 2015 22:28
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Onmi posted:Yes but the majority of those people with access to a twitter and tumblr account use to draw or write or masturbate to high anime drawings of Kyle and Stan loving. It's why you see some jumping through 100 hoops to go "No no they're actually using this to attack people who are against PC culture" That was a literal thing that happened after the first episode. Race Realists posted:
BravestOfTheLamps posted:Yeah, this is pretty much equivalent to those GG conspiracy charts. "This person doesn't agree with me, they must be a GG nazi misogynist". I'm sure it's terrible that people were mean to you in that thread, but I think you've gotta face reality instead of hiding yourself from it. Onmi posted:Okay no, I'm actually jumping in and stopping this one. That's not what Sad Puppies was about and that's definitely not what Rabid Puppies was about. Onmi posted:See you can call it that but when you want to be an SF or Fantasy writer you get told over and over "The hugos are the most important thing, the most grand prize for you." So learning that, no, they aren't and no, it actually doesn't matter how good you are as a writer, it just matters how good a friend you are with everyone else. Kinda heartbreaking a little. I mean liberating because you realize "gently caress it, who cares what these people think?" But if you idolized that stuff growing up it can hurt if you made that your job. Onmi posted:
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Oct 25, 2015 22:39
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He certainly has a point of view and isn't charitable to Tolkien, but I forgive that when a lot of these elements are commonly glossed over especially when defending Tolkien from lesser fantasy works. Or downplaying to what extent his influence has created these troublesome assumptions.
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD has a new favorite as of 22:42 on Oct 25, 2015 |
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Oct 25, 2015 22:39
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:He certainly has a point of view and isn't charitable to Tolkien, but I forgive that when a lot of these elements are commonly glossed over especially when defending Tolkien from lesser fantasy works. Or downplaying to what extent his influence has created these troublesome assumptions. Sure, that's fair. I will say most reactionaries are more Saruman than anything.
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Oct 25, 2015 22:44
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Cingulate posted:Whatever Tolkien has articulated in his reflections, the story itself is deeply reactionary. The Vosgian Beast posted:Sure, that's fair.
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Oct 25, 2015 22:53
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Nessus posted:It's a term out of 1984 referring to "bad thoughts" in the book's fictional clipped "Newspeak." These dudes love quoting 1984. I want a script like the one that follows every mention of Donald Trump's name with a quote from Donald Trump, except that every time one of these guys uses a word from 1984 it follows it with "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism, as I understand it."
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Oct 25, 2015 23:04
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The art and works of beings aligned with evil in Tolkien's works, I think, displays many of the aesthetics that neoreactionaries like to indulge in--it's loud, it's unsubtle, it's pompous, it's huge and tries to overshadow and loom over everything around it, but it's also superficial, crude, and lacking in actual beauty or artistic value. The description of Melkor's counter-themes during the Ainundalë (Tolkien's creation myth; basically God and the angels create the world with music but Lucifer, not yet fully fallen, is jealous of God and tries to gently caress everything up) sounds like a very unfavorable description of the sorts of music nerds like to listen to (loud, bombastic, repetitive, trying to drown out Eru's own themes by being bigger and more impressive sounding). I just feel like, for all his faults, Tolkien would have seen nerd fascists for what they are and despised them even more than they worship him. On the other hand the Ainundalë is basically about how Melkor really just wanted to have a bit of the 
Woolie Wool has a new favorite as of 23:14 on Oct 25, 2015 |
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Oct 25, 2015 23:09
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I agree Tolkien would have probably been none too pleased with Dark Enlightenment people and would have likely told them to hie themselves to Mass, but I think if we're going to go deep on him we ought to move it to the Middle-earth thread over in the book barn.
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Oct 25, 2015 23:15
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Out of Scott's last 4 real posts, 2 were good and the other two I didn't read because they were too long.  Nessus posted:Certainly, although the context of what the reaction is aimed at is very different. To be fair of course, seeing your mates die in the trenches is as nothing compared to the agony of the friend zone.....
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Oct 25, 2015 23:34
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The Vosgian Beast posted:Sure, that's fair. Mencius Moldbug posted:For I am to Carlyle, as Saruman to Morgoth. Enter the true palace of darkness! Join in my iron oath to the Master! Seriously, that's a thing he actually wrote: http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2009/07/carlyle-in-20th-century-fascism-and.html
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Oct 26, 2015 00:06
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Cardboard Box A posted:So was I. So was Bravest. What does any of this stuff mean? Are you ok?
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Oct 26, 2015 00:11
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Silver2195 posted:Seriously, that's a thing he actually wrote: http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2009/07/carlyle-in-20th-century-fascism-and.html NEO-REACTION: We are The DARK ENLIGHTENMENT! We come to subject all of these lesser FOOLS to our RUTHLESS SPACE LOGIC, and DOMINATE THE GALAXY as the STRONGEST RACE! FEAR OUR DEATH TROOPERS OF PURE LOGIC!!!!!! LESS WRONG: I like your insights but ease up Emperor Palpatine. SOME RANDOM TUMBLR PERSON: Uh, that first dude seems evil. THE FIRST TWO PARTIES: What the gently caress is with your mad need to purge all innocent harmless beliefs you groundlessly dub evil, you prig prog puritan????????
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Oct 26, 2015 00:13
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Cingulate posted:Out of Scott's last 4 real posts, 2 were good and the other two I didn't read because they were too long. Nice try Scott's parachute account, but it's the same worthless garbage as always.
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Oct 26, 2015 00:16
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gentle pete posted:What does any of this stuff mean? Are you ok?
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Oct 26, 2015 00:49
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Oct 26, 2015 01:35
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Vox Day, who neoreactionaries would largely agree with (and he has worn the term himself with pride, though he dismissed "Dark Enlightenment" as media hype) being a stupendous cock. The only actual relevance to this thread is (a) neoreactionaries and gamergaters thought this might be a good banner to follow until it blew itself up spectacularly (b) Yudkowsky has told his followers to spam the nominations for the 2016 Hugo for Best Novel because he can so be a huge cock too. For lulz, here's a gamergater on the progress of the culture war.
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Oct 26, 2015 01:37
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MY FUTURE GRANDSON: It must have been a great time to be involved in nerd culture back in the 2010s, grandad! Much better than now! ME 50 YEARS FROM NOW: You might think that Billy, but it was actually a time when people demanded that you take the motives, ideas, and writing of a group of people who called themselves "The Sad Puppies" seriously, just because they had a friend of a friend of a friend who was into them and they didn't feel like telling their friend a movement run by a man who named himself after the voice of God and who said that marital rape didn't exist was pretty loving dumb. MY FUTURE GRANDSON: Maybe I shouldn't have brought you that bourbon.
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Oct 26, 2015 01:47
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divabot posted:For lulz, here's a gamergater on the progress of the culture war. Well, that's the dumbest thing I've read in a while.
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Oct 26, 2015 01:55
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