UKMT: Mao Money Mao Problems

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LemonDrizzle: Mar 28, 2012; neoliberal shithead

big scary monsters posted:

My first degree would have felt like much better value if I hadn't had to pay for it. Or better still if, like my second degree, I'd been paid to do it. Post-graduate degrees are really expensive and the funding available isn't sufficient, if you're serious about getting more people from poorer backgrounds into the upper echelons of academia and technical professions, ensuring that they aren't put off pursuing their studies to the highest levels because of the crippling costs involved (both actual outlay and opportunity cost) would be a good start.

Assuming you're talking about PhDs here (never heard of anyone being paid to do a master's), I don't think that the stipends are so low as to exclude poorer people, or that the opportunity costs of not going directly into the private sector are so high as to make further study completely unattractive unless you're solely motivated by money. And if money's your main motivation, you probably shouldn't be doing a PhD anyway.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:17

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 18:24

Coohoolin: Aug 5, 2012; Oor Coohoolie.

My wee brother is a boring gently caress and I'm more concerned with getting him to socialise more and learn to have responsible fun than anything.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:19

Zombywuf: Mar 29, 2008

TACD posted:

http://arstechnica.co.uk/tech-policy/2015/11/snoopers-charter-uk-govt-can-demand-backdoors-give-prison-sentences-for-disclosing-them/

Well, pack it in everyone. Justice was nice while it lasted, but it's secret courts, secret evidence and strictly no talking about it from here on out.

Pfff, it's worse than that.

Section 145 posted:

(1) In giving effect to a bulk equipment interference warrant, the person to whom
it is addressed (�the implementing authority�) may (in addition to acting
alone) act through, or together with, such other persons as the implementing
authority may require (whether under subsection (2) or otherwise) to provide
the authority with assistance in giving effect to the warrant.

(2) For the purpose of requiring any person to provide assistance in relation to a
bulk equipment interference warrant, the implementing authority may�

(a) serve a copy of the warrant on any person who the implementing
authority considers may be able to provide such assistance, or

(b) make arrangements for the service of a copy of the warrant on any such
person.

So, having been given a Bulk Equipment Interference warrant (which is a warrant to create botnets for spying on foreigners), an authority can simply wave it at anyone they like and make that person help with the authority's hacking.

So apparently to catch terrorists we need to be able to press gang people into the secret police.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:24

OvineYeast: Jul 16, 2007; Freiheit ist immer Freiheit der Andersdenkenden

LemonDrizzle posted:

Assuming you're talking about PhDs here (never heard of anyone being paid to do a master's), I don't think that the stipends are so low as to exclude poorer people, or that the opportunity costs of not going directly into the private sector are so high as to make further study completely unattractive unless you're solely motivated by money. And if money's your main motivation, you probably shouldn't be doing a PhD anyway.

I was paid (a moderate stipend) to do a Master's (in the humanities, no less!).

I think Master's funding is the bottleneck, actually. A lot of PhD programmes require a Master's degree, but funding for those is nigh-on unobtainable - moreso now than when I got funding. PhD funding is easier, but it still doesn't provide nearly enough money for things like travel expenses to conferences, which are really necessary if you want to actually pursue an academic career.

OvineYeast fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Nov 6, 2015

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:25

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

Cerv posted:

I will install filtering on any devices in our household, or mobile devices I give the kids. And monitor for any evidence of tampering or attempts to bypass. This is a fool proof plan that means my children won't be exposed to porn as there are not other chances for them to be on the Internet.

(Joking I have no kids)

This is utterly ridiculous. Of course they will have access to the internet in other ways, but they're less likely to go round their mates house to watch brazillian fart porn than they are in their own bedroom.

The point of monitoring and supervising your childrens internet habits is not to completely block access to these things, its to teach them what is and what isn't safe. You teach them that people on the internet are quite often not who they say they are, that things on there are there for life and to be very careful with who you disclose information to. Filtering and blocks helps you do this, because when you find out that Jayden has been trying to access pornhub for the last two weeks you can have a chat with him about it.

With todays lifestyle, you absolutely cannot ignore what kids are getting up to online, and frankly its not only harmful, its verging on neglectful.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:27

Rush Limbo: Sep 5, 2005; its with a full house

Coohoolin posted:

My wee brother is a boring gently caress and I'm more concerned with getting him to socialise more and learn to have responsible fun than anything.

Well that's also the case. Thinking back to my own teenage years, I remember that an outside observer might have thought people were more sexually active than we were because people would brag and straight up lie whereas we never even got close to anything like that.

Maybe that was just me, though. The others could have been telling the truth.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:28

big scary monsters: Sep 2, 2011; -~Ｓｋｕｌｌｗａｖｅ~-

LemonDrizzle posted:

Assuming you're talking about PhDs here (never heard of anyone being paid to do a master's), I don't think that the stipends are so low as to exclude poorer people, or that the opportunity costs of not going directly into the private sector are so high as to make further study completely unattractive unless you're solely motivated by money. And if money's your main motivation, you probably shouldn't be doing a PhD anyway.

I got a stipend and fees paid to do my master's actually, but I wasn't talking about the level of stipend. I was saying that the number of funded places is too low. As OvineYeast says, a master's course is often almost a requirement for further study, but there are very few funded places, they can cost �8-10k plus living expenses, and there is no student loan available (the exception is an undergraduate master's, but that means you have to stay at the same place you did your undergrad and the choice of courses is limited). At PhD level the funding situation is somewhat better because a lot more PhDs get research council funding as part of a specific project, but it's still not great and has fallen in recent years.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:35

baka kaba: Jul 19, 2003; PLEASE ASK ME, THE SELF-PROFESSED NO #1 PAUL CATTERMOLE FAN IN THE SOMETHING AWFUL S-CLUB 7 MEGATHREAD, TO NAME A SINGLE SONG BY HIS EXCELLENT NU-METAL SIDE PROJECT, SKUA, AND IF I CAN'T PLEASE TELL ME TO
EAT SHIT

Quote-Unquote posted:

If you are too stupid or lazy to spend literally five minutes googling or asking someone about how to implement web filtering for phones and computers then you are far too lazy and/or stupid to be capable of raising children, which is a way more difficult, time-consuming and patience-testing task than reading a paragraph or two recommending web filters and clicking a couple of links. This has nothing to do with being 'technically-minded', you're not installing and managing a corporate-level firewall like I was; if you're capable of looking at things on the internet you're capable of doing this. If you're capable of getting Angry Birds from the app store and played a level or two then you've done something more complicated than installing a parental filter on a phone.

Not paying attention to your child's internet habits is neglectful, simple as that. There's no excuse.

You're assuming everyone's technically aware enough to realise that content filtering is a thing, what it's called, and how to find out more information about it. Some people barely know how to use a mouse, at their office jobs. And installing Popular Game through The App Thingy is way less intimidating than researching and installing a security system and then verifying that you've done everything right and that thing you don't understand at all is working and protecting your kids who know a lot more about this than you do

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:48

Ms Adequate: Oct 30, 2011; Baby even when I'm dead and gone
You will always be my only one, my only one
When the night is calling
No matter who I become
You will always be my only one, my only one, my only one
When the night is calling

OvineYeast posted:

I was paid (a moderate stipend) to do a Master's (in the humanities, no less!).

I think Master's funding is the bottleneck, actually. A lot of PhD programmes require a Master's degree, but funding for those is nigh-on unobtainable - moreso now than when I got funding. PhD funding is easier, but it still doesn't provide nearly enough money for things like travel expenses to conferences, which are really necessary if you want to actually pursue an academic career.

Yeah, if my health hadn't imploded, I would almost certainly have planned to go into academia as a career, but I had a lot of trouble finding the funding for my Master's and ended up with a pretty sizable bank loan to do it. Fortunately after some cajoling and back-and-forth with my doctor they were willing to accept there was no way I'd be paying the thing off due to aforementioned health, so I ended up getting it on the cheap, but thinking about it since I would have had to take some time away from academics to do a normie job just to pay the bugger off. And, honestly, who knows where that would have landed me a few years down the road? For me personally that may have been okay but for a society looking for trained academics, maybe not so much.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:51

Quote-Unquote: Oct 22, 2002

baka kaba posted:

You're assuming everyone's technically aware enough to realise that content filtering is a thing, what it's called, and how to find out more information about it. Some people barely know how to use a mouse, at their office jobs. And installing Popular Game through The App Thingy is way less intimidating than researching and installing a security system and then verifying that you've done everything right and that thing you don't understand at all is working and protecting your kids who know a lot more about this than you do

Pretty sure that every single person that's ever heard of the internet is aware that there is porn on it, and those capable of rubbing two brain cells together would ask the question "hey, is there a way to make sure my kids can't see this?". And there was plenty of stuff in the media about the legal requirement for ISPs to filter content. And ISPs are legally required to ask you if you want to filter content when you take out a contract with them.

Jesus christ people it's 2015, even people who Are Not Good At Computers know that the internet is full of poo poo that kids shouldn't be exposed to and it's their job to ask the question "how do I keep my kids safe?" instead of "ban this sick filth, think of what it might do to my children (not that I'd notice because I'm clearly too lazy to bother raising them!)"

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:55

GEORGE W BUSHI: Jul 1, 2012

Tory Minister filibusters bill to provide cheap cancer drugs as his own backbenchers yell at him for being a twat.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:58

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

I again feel it very pertinent to point out that taking away one's ability to be self sufficient (raise your own kids) and then selling the same capability back to you (childcare, ban this sick filth) in a shittier format is rule 1 of capitalism.

The solution is full communism, literally, people can't raise their kids because they have to work full time to make their kids not starve.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:58

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

Quote-Unquote posted:

Pretty sure that every single person that's ever heard of the internet is aware that there is porn on it, and those capable of rubbing two brain cells together would ask the question "hey, is there a way to make sure my kids can't see this?". And there was plenty of stuff in the media about the legal requirement for ISPs to filter content. And ISPs are legally required to ask you if you want to filter content when you take out a contract with them.

Jesus christ people it's 2015, even people who Are Not Good At Computers know that the internet is full of poo poo that kids shouldn't be exposed to and it's their job to ask the question "how do I keep my kids safe?" instead of "ban this sick filth, think of what it might do to my children (not that I'd notice because I'm clearly too lazy to bother raising them!)"

check your privilege

# ? Nov 6, 2015 17:59

crispix: Mar 28, 2015; Grand-Maman m'a raconté
_{(Les éditions des amitiés franco-québécoises)}

Hello, dear

Cerv posted:

Don't think Coohoolin is even a student.

Why was he at a student demo? What even is he, anyway?

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:01

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

crispix posted:

Why was he at a student demo? What even is he, anyway?

an international swiss socialist anarchist agitator

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:05

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

JFairfax posted:

check your privilege

crispix posted:

What even is he, anyway?

Aberdeenish.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:10

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

JFairfax posted:

an international swiss socialist anarchist agitator

You forgot nationalist and womaniser.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:10

Quote-Unquote: Oct 22, 2002

When man first discovered fire, some humans were too stupid to figure out how it worked so they let their kids play with it unsupervised, and those children promptly burned to death. In response to this tragedy, some people suggested that it should be the responsibility of parents to make sure their children aren't setting fire to stuff in an unsafe manner. "What's the point in even attempting to get children to not play with fire? They'll just go round Ugg's cave and play with fire there!" cried the others.

Thankfully one of these groups of people died out pretty goddamn quickly.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:14

Gonzo McFee: Jun 19, 2010

Some tories have decided we're not like America enough and have started adapting filibustering.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/fury-parliament-tory-minister-forces-6782577

quote:

A top Tory has sparked fury by killing off a law to give cancer patients life-saving drugs for as little as 5p.

MPs revolted in the Commons today as Health Minister Alistair Burt spoke for half an hour despite howls from Tory, Labour and SNP backbenchers.

They tried three times to hold a vote but they failed and the clock reached 2.30pm, ending the debate and shelving the Bill.

The Labour MP behind the law told the Mirror it showed 'the worst of our politics'.

In heated exchanges Mr Burt said he was right to take his time and accused MPs of 'shroud-waving' - exploiting a death or tragedy to hog the spotlight.

He snapped: "Oh, shroud-waving, thank you very much, that's all we need" - prompting shouts of 'shocking!'.

But he said sorry after Labour MP George Howarth fumed: "Would you not think in the context of this Bill that the term shroud waving was at the very least inappropriate?"

He told MPs: "I certainly did myself a disservice with a silly and offhand remark. I entirely accept that and that's not like me, I apologise."

It is the second week in a row that a backbench Bill has run out of time after a bid to give carers free parking was fatally stalled by a Tory's 90-minute speech .

This week's was the Off-Patent Drugs Bill by Labour MP Nick Thomas-Symonds, who claimed it would save patients' lives and millions of pounds in NHS cash .

Passing a vote today would have cleared the law's first big hurdle and sent it to the Commons committee stage. Instead it is set to lie dormant.

The law would allow doctors to prescribe old, cheap drugs for uses other than why they were invented.

Despite being backed by experts it was opposed by the Tory government , which said doctors can already prescribe old drugs under the current law.

But charities say the law means doctors are 'anxious' to prescribe drugs without an official licence.

The new law would have relaxed licensing on Bisphosphonates, which were used for years to strengthen bones but have now been shown to cut breast cancer deaths.

The patent on the drug has now expired, meaning it can be produced by any drug company for just 5p.

Also covered would be Tamoxifen, a drug used to treat breast cancer but now shown to have preventive powers too.

Mr Thomas-Symonds said it could have also helped patients with Parkinson's and multiple sclerosis (MS).

He told the Mirror: "MPs of all parties spoke with one voice today in support of my Bill, and the Minister did not present any convincing reasons at all for his opposition to it.

"This is a simple, cross-party Bill that is supported by health charities and the medical profession. It would have benefited patients, making cheap drugs available for a number of conditions like breast cancer, Parkinson's and MS.

"I don�t see what harm there would have been for the Government to allow it to proceed to Committee Stage.

"That would have given Ministers plenty of time to explain why they oppose my Bill and to examine this important issue.

"I attempted to put the question to the House so that MPs who had stayed to debate the issue on behalf of constituents could express their views in a vote, yet the Minister continued to talk the Bill out.�

"In a way, this showed the best and worst of our politics.

"On one hand, I�m pleased that MPs of all major parties put party politics aside to argue for a common sense, compassionate solution to a problem that affects our constituents.

"But then despite the overwhelming view of those present, we are denied a vote by a Minister determined to talk the Bill out."

MS Society chief executive Michelle Mitchell said: "The Government needs to stop dragging its heels on this crucial issue and start taking action.

"It has missed two opportunities to pave the way for cheap, promising drugs that could make such a difference to the lives of so many people with MS."

MPs raced through their debate today to stop the Bill running out of time and Mr Burt stood up at the despatch box at 2.03pm, giving himself 27 minutes.

But he said bluntly: "I will talk until half past two and I make that very clear."

MP after MP shouted at the Tory minister to let the Bill clear its first hurdle and pass through to a committee.

Labour backbencher Paul Flynn said: "He's taken this stand which is cruel and unfair according to what the industry is telling him to maximise their profits and put patients last."

Tory Christopher Chope - famous for long speeches himself - was cheered as he told his own minister to let the Bill through and use 'oodles and oodles of time' later on.

And the SNP's Patrick Grady accused Mr Burt of an 'outrageous abuse of the Parliamentary system'.

Mr Burt promised to take MPs' passionate opinions on board but said: "The government doesn't support the Bill, still doesn't support the Bill. And I will defend that position.

"No sensible government would seek to resist people's access to drugs in any way and the reason for resisting is the government believes there is another pathway.

"It is not always the case that something brought forward by a charity and advocated passionately by colleagues is always the answer.

"It's not disgraceful - it's the right answer."

oval office.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:15

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

Quote-Unquote posted:

When man first discovered fire, some humans were too stupid to figure out how it worked so they let their kids play with it unsupervised, and those children promptly burned to death. In response to this tragedy, some people suggested that it should be the responsibility of parents to make sure their children aren't setting fire to stuff in an unsafe manner. "What's the point in even attempting to get children to not play with fire? They'll just go round Ugg's cave and play with fire there!" cried the others.

Thankfully one of these groups of people died out pretty goddamn quickly.

firewalls are a little bit less intuitive than actual fire

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:18

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

It's really simple: if you're unable to understand and mitigate the risks of allowing your young children unfettered access to the Internet then you're a bad parent.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:19

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

then I think we all have bad parents ITT

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:21

LemonDrizzle: Mar 28, 2012; neoliberal shithead

big scary monsters posted:

I got a stipend and fees paid to do my master's actually, but I wasn't talking about the level of stipend. I was saying that the number of funded places is too low. As OvineYeast says, a master's course is often almost a requirement for further study, but there are very few funded places, they can cost �8-10k plus living expenses, and there is no student loan available (the exception is an undergraduate master's, but that means you have to stay at the same place you did your undergrad and the choice of courses is limited). At PhD level the funding situation is somewhat better because a lot more PhDs get research council funding as part of a specific project, but it's still not great and has fallen in recent years.

Well, I would say that at least in the technical subjects an undergraduate master's is the standard route into a PhD, and they're heavily pushed as the default option for any STEM student wanting to make a career in the field they've studied. It'd certainly be better if there were more opportunities available to re-enter higher education and get support for a master's, but there is a well-established route for getting into academia that avoids all the problems you mentioned.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:21

Quote-Unquote: Oct 22, 2002

JFairfax posted:

firewalls are a little bit less intuitive than actual fire

yeah see, the moral of the story was that sensible people that died out, hence why we're still having this argument tens of thousands of years later.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:22

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

JFairfax posted:

then I think we all have bad parents ITT

My parents don't fulfil that criteria.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:22

Quote-Unquote: Oct 22, 2002

Pissflaps posted:

My parents don't fulfil that criteria.

Mine neither. They did crazy things like 'monitor my internet activity' and 'have the computer in a room where I wasn't guaranteed absolute privacy'. Until I was about 16, anyway, then they didn't really care if I was having an occasional wank because they'd taught me about sex and love, and how to be safe, and knew that I was in a sexual relationship with someone.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:25

Ragnar Gunvald: May 13, 2015; Cool and good.

Guavanaut posted:

AirVPN seems to come up a few times in the thread. iPredator has a good pro-privacy service, but iirc is limited to Sweden as the breakout point. AirVPN looks like it has breakouts in multiple countries and they'll give you a full OpenVPN config if you want to be fancy and install it on your router to secure your whole network or whatev.

e: ^^^ It's pretty cool that people are even talking about that kind of thing casually now.

That's fantastic, thanks!

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:27

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

loving hell, you squares.

to be fair I think when I was a teenager Max Hardcore had yet to be invented.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:27

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

JFairfax posted:

firewalls are a little bit less intuitive than actual fire

Its literally a yes or no button when you first use a device on a bt connection.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:27

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Quote-Unquote posted:

they'd taught me about sex and love, and how to be safe, and knew that I was in a sexual relationship with someone.

I didn't really get any of that. I never asked and I think everyone was a bit embarrassed to explain it to me. Except for a helpful book when I was about eight or so with anatomical diagrams and a description of how sex worked.

Though I guess being raised with no male contact sort of made it all even out in the end. Worst I ended up with was a mild dislike of men.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:29

Gonzo McFee: Jun 19, 2010

Bring back Eurotrash for sexual education.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:29

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

my parents got me to set up all the computers and internet poo poo when I was a kid, I am sure there are plenty of parents who are similarly not that tech savvy and get their kids to do it.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:29

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

Gonzo McFee posted:

Bring back Eurotrash for sexual education.

this guy gets it

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:30

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

JFairfax posted:

my parents got me to set up all the computers and internet poo poo when I was a kid, I am sure there are plenty of parents who are similarly not that tech savvy and get their kids to do it.

Rubbish. The parents of today were the kids you are describing now. Further to that, its far easier to do now than it was back then too. People who are between 25 and 35 today are really the only generation that had such open access to the internet with parents who were not tech savvy enough to even want to get involved.

# ? Nov 6, 2015 18:31