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Shageletic posted:At best the President was incompetent. There are vids of him interacting with his students where he treats them like an enemy. If you're terrible at your job, you need to go. Even if only for the university's ability to draw talented and diverse student applicants. They've already knee capped themselves with the horrible PR regarding their grad subsidies, which especially important for Universities since grad students (along with adjuncts) are basically the only things keeping the teaching mission going. Football, is what matters, not academics.
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Nov 9, 2015 18:55
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Dr. Tough posted:There's even a video of it: What the gently caress is this nonsense.
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Nov 9, 2015 18:55
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stinkles1112 posted:Because in the vast majority of cases where people are talking about setting up safe spaces they're being whiny babies. "whiny babies" worried about "blatant racism" 
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Nov 9, 2015 18:55
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Popular Thug Drink posted:"whiny babies" worried about "blatant racism" oh come on did you even read the whole post
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Nov 9, 2015 18:56
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stinkles1112 posted:Because in the vast majority of cases where people are talking about setting up safe spaces they're being whiny babies. They are complaining about blatant hate speech so...
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Nov 9, 2015 18:56
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euphronius posted:They are complaining about blatant hate speech so... Not in that video from Yale. They're complaining about somebody suggesting that maybe the school shouldn't go overboard in policing offensive Halloween costumes.
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Nov 9, 2015 18:57
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evilweasel posted:Given that he was quoted as denying systematic oppression exists and claiming it's all just a silly thing in their head, it's reasonable to include that. It's a pernicious lie that shouldn't be acceptable for someone in a position of power to make. It sounds strange because it should go without saying: but apparently here, it didn't. To quote from earlier: quote:Some of those students were present at UMKC to meet with Wolfe. In the video, students asked him a question. At first, he responded by telling them “I will give you an answer, and I’m sure it will be a wrong answer.” He did not deny that systematic oppression exists, he simply thinks that the reason systematic oppression still exists is because no matter how many opportunities and legs-up you give to minorities, a large number of them still have the thinking that they are oppressed and are out of reach of those opportunities. That gets into a whole host of issues from income inequality and poverty to the disintegration of the black family, none of which is anything a university president has any authority or power to influence. Now if they think systematic oppression exists on the Mizzou campus, I haven't heard any evidence of such other than lovely pranks and drive-by racial epithets. EDIT: AGAIN, this was a stupid loving answer to a softball question, but you don't change this guy's mind and thinking by demanding that he admit "you're right" as you're kicking him out of office.
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Nov 9, 2015 18:59
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Amergin posted:He did not deny that systematic oppression exists, he simply thinks that the reason systematic oppression still exists is because no matter how many opportunities and legs-up you give to minorities, a large number of them still have the thinking that they are oppressed and are out of reach of those opportunities. ah, amergin's back in the saddle. was wondering if you'd pick the shithead trolling gimmick up again
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Nov 9, 2015 19:00
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The university president has authority over student behavior and is responsible for seeing that students civil rights are protected.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:00
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Amergin posted:To quote from earlier: yeah no both what he said, and what you're claiming, are pernicious lies that should exile people from the public sphere and polite society it's just racism with a polite veneer, "oh blacks aren't inferior naturally, just because they believe they're inferior, making racism actually their fault"
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Nov 9, 2015 19:01
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Wolfe will probably be back selling garbage products, and or at National Review within a week.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:03
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pathetic little tramp posted:It is fair to argue that we can go too far and to the point where we sacrifice freedom of expression in the name of 'safe spaces'. Mizzou isn't so much an example of that, there's been a lot of racist incidents recently and the university's response has been poo poo. If you want an example where the safe spaces are more poorly thought out, you can look at what's happening at Yale where Yale students are demanding the resignation of an associate master because she sent an e-mail decrying the Dean of Students' e-mail about racist halloween costumes as too overbroad and stifling of free expression. While I agree that the Yale protest is poorly thought out and done in a way that guarantees it will backfire, that particular video has a little bit more going in the background. To provide a bit of that background: After recent years when there were people dressing up in blackface or as drunk Mexicans for things like halloween and etc, the Intercultural Affairs Committee sent out this email: http://pastebin.com/TLGSdaTg Which essentially boils down to a suggestion, not a regulation, that people please don't be racist dickheads when selecting a Halloween costume. The associate master to one of the residence halls then sent the following email around, complaining about the previous email: http://pastebin.com/egSQGfgK which included the following bit: quote:Is there no room anymore for a child or young person to be a little bit obnoxious… a little bit inappropriate or provocative or, yes, offensive? Which is pretty tone deaf. I mean, if the original email was about a new rule regulating costumes, sure. But a relatively mild email that boils down to "hey, please think twice before you decide to dress up in blackface" is not something that needs a response. As a result of this second email, some students were doing a silent protest doing chalk drawings in front of the residence hall, when the master of the hall (and husband of the associate master who sent the email) decided to walk in the middle of it and confront the students. That is what sparked the shouting incident. Which is not to say that the students aren't being tone deaf and self defeating. But there is tone deafness on both sides.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:03
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Amergin posted:EDIT: AGAIN, this was a stupid loving answer to a softball question, but you don't change this guy's mind and thinking by demanding that he admit "you're right" as you're kicking him out of office. I think the point of removing him from office is so that his mind & thinking do not continue to make the situation worse, not so that his mind & thinking are changed. A guy who can verbalize that "systematic oppression" quote is not a guy whose mind you are going to change.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:03
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euphronius posted:The university president has authority over student behavior and is responsible for seeing that students civil rights are protected. Which civil rights have been violated, here?
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Nov 9, 2015 19:15
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Wolfe: "This is not the way change should come about." Why not? Because it was wildly effective and rendered you powerless? The strikes are the most interesting part of this to me, especially the football strike. Off the top of my head I can't remember a major D-1 athletic team ever pulling off a labor strike and effectively leveraging their importance to a university like this.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:18
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Amergin posted:Which civil rights have been violated, here? Equal protection clause.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:19
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Rhesus Pieces posted:Wolfe: "This is not the way change should come about." Yeah what a dumb loving quote. It's the power of the people... it's precisely how change should come about. Not some closed doors board meeting of a group of like minded idiots whose only goal is to run damage control and not actually fix the problem.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:20
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It's not a dumb quote, he's reaching out to the people who can stymie these students efforts after he's gone.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:21
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stinkles1112 posted:Because in the vast majority of cases where people are talking about setting up safe spaces they're being whiny babies. way i see it, safe spaces are a way for people to have a conversation and think about things like racism and hate speech, and how it affects people, and you know, to express their own free speech and expression of course, you get plenty of whiny idiots who don't want to have that conversation and frame it as censorship
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Nov 9, 2015 19:23
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Nonsense posted:It's not a dumb quote, he's reaching out to the people who can stymie these students efforts after he's gone. That, uh, that doesn't make it any less dumb. Or rather it just adds a tinge of douche to it as well.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:24
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BonoMan posted:That, uh, that doesn't make it any less dumb. Or rather it just adds a tinge of douche to it as well. That's fair, but he's a creature of George Will, don't underestimate these slime fucks.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:26
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BonoMan posted:That, uh, that doesn't make it any less dumb. Or rather it just adds a tinge of douche to it as well. BREAKING: "Avenge me!!!!" University President cries as he is slain by angry black protestors
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Nov 9, 2015 19:26
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pathetic little tramp posted:It is fair to argue that we can go too far and to the point where we sacrifice freedom of expression in the name of 'safe spaces'. Mizzou isn't so much an example of that, there's been a lot of racist incidents recently and the university's response has been poo poo. If you want an example where the safe spaces are more poorly thought out, you can look at what's happening at Yale where Yale students are demanding the resignation of an associate master because she sent an e-mail decrying the Dean of Students' e-mail about racist halloween costumes as too overbroad and stifling of free expression. This is the text of the Yale email, by the way: quote:“I don’t wish to trivialize genuine concerns about cultural and personal representation, and other challenges to our lived experience in a plural community. I know that many decent people have proposed guidelines on Halloween costumes from a spirit of avoiding hurt and offense. I laud those goals, in theory, as most of us do. But in practice, I wonder if we should reflect more transparently, as a community, on the consequences of an institutional (which is to say: bureaucratic and administrative) exercise of implied control over college students. That's what the students are complaining about in that video. The Yale situation really can't be compared to what's happening at Mizzou, where the students have a legitimate grievance.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:31
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Joementum posted:This is the text of the Yale email, by the way: Yes, but Yale is supposed to be a HOME.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:34
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Amergin posted:Which civil rights have been violated, here? You may be able to get a hostile work environment on that one also on top of euphronius posted:Equal protection clause. I genuinely have no idea how you're defending this behavior. You don't need to apply your racist views onto a school because you're the president. If this was off campus there might be a debate, but this is just deplorable.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:34
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Jerry Manderbilt posted:way i see it, safe spaces are a way for people to have a conversation and think about things like racism and hate speech, and how it affects people, and you know, to express their own free speech and expression This is actually my fundamental problem with so-called safe spaces; the people with the lovely awful opinions don't need a safe space to express themselves, they just loving do it, all over the place and all the time. Waiting for an appropriately "safe" space to be set up before you feel that you can even start having the conversation is hopeless and self-defeating. If "safe space" is being used in the context of being safe from physical violence or persecution, then yeah let's definitely try to make as many places safe-spaces as possible. Let's try to make the whole world a safe space. If "safe space" is being used in the context of excluding loud idiots in order to start having meaningful discussions, then that battle was lost before you even started fighting it, and even if it wasn't it's not the right way to be fighting it anyway.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:35
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Posted this in the fecal swastika thread but honestly I'm kinda surprised college football teams haven't realized just how much financial power they have over college administrations at this point.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:36
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Nelson Mandingo posted:Posted this in the fecal swastika thread but honestly I'm kinda surprised college football teams haven't realized just how much financial power they have over college administrations at this point. I hope they only use this power for good.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:37
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zoux posted:I hope they only use this power for good. With any luck they can at least use it to start getting paid
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Nov 9, 2015 19:37
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Joementum posted:This is the text of the Yale email, by the way: But now the students are calling for her resignation, which seems absurd.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:38
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I kind of wonder if a massed organized college football strike could lead to student financial reforms. Seriously, I think their total revenue topped 4 billion dollars last year.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:41
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:But now the students are calling for her resignation, which seems absurd. Indeed.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:43
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Aliquid posted:Yes, but Yale is supposed to be a HOME. The poo poo coming from the Yale students makes me wonder how anyone can have any sympathy for them: quote:“[I]t’s not a home. It is no longer a safe space for me. And I find that incredibly depressing,” she says. “This was once a space that I was proud to be a part of because of the loving community.” quote:“Who the gently caress hired you?” she asked, arguing that Christakis should “step down” because being master is “not about creating an intellectual space,” but rather “creating a home.” This, along with the calls for resignation, are coming from the tamest email response to Halloween costume suggestions I've ever seen. e: To clarify, I understand the grievance with offensive costumes but the reaction of a opinion is what I'm talking about
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Nov 9, 2015 19:44
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In other news of gross violations of African American students not necessarily on campus. http://thebiglead.com/2015/11/08/videos-show-police-beating-and-tasing-alabama-student-after-responding-to-noise-complaint/
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Nov 9, 2015 19:46
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Veskit posted:I genuinely have no idea how you're defending this behavior. You don't need to apply your racist views onto a school because you're the president. If this was off campus there might be a debate, but this is just deplorable. Because he's not "applying his racist views onto the school," they're punishing racist students when they can (as in, when they know who the student was) and they're implementing mandatory diversity training. People are making Mizzou's faculty sound like the Ferguson PD here. The man has said some stupid poo poo but I haven't seen evidence of a system of racism in the school's administration. If not requiring 10% of the students and faculty be black is racist then everything in this country is racist. stinkles1112 posted:This is actually my fundamental problem with so-called safe spaces; the people with the lovely awful opinions don't need a safe space to express themselves, they just loving do it, all over the place and all the time. Waiting for an appropriately "safe" space to be set up before you feel that you can even start having the conversation is hopeless and self-defeating. This sound applicable to gun-free zones.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:47
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I'm very glad the Yale thing is being ignored so very hard on twitter, allowing Mizzou to keep trending.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:47
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:The poo poo coming from the Yale students makes me wonder how anyone can have any sympathy for them: Do you guys not remember what it was like to be a college student?
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Nov 9, 2015 19:48
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For what it's worth, the Yale stuff is part of an ongoing series of issues on campus and the perceived absence of any response, adequate or not, about the stuff leading up to the Halloween stuff. There's more that goes back further but I'm hesitant to read institutional memory into student activism.
The Warszawa fucked around with this message at 19:51 on Nov 9, 2015 |
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Nov 9, 2015 19:49
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Hollismason posted:I kind of wonder if a massed organized college football strike could lead to student financial reforms. Seriously, I think their total revenue topped 4 billion dollars last year. This is a good idea. Maybe for student loan grievances more specifically? 
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Nov 9, 2015 19:53
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Nelson Mandingo posted:Posted this in the fecal swastika thread but honestly I'm kinda surprised college football teams haven't realized just how much financial power they have over college administrations at this point. To be fair a lot of that power hinges on whether or not the coaches are OK with it. A head coach can very easily break or prevent a strike by threatening the players' athletic scholarships. This action had the full backing of the coaching staff. A strike overriding the wishes of the coaching staff would need near unanimous agreement and solidarity by the players, which is a difficult thing to guarantee with a 100+ player roster.
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Nov 9, 2015 19:54
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